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| | | | FAQ Revisions | Editors: drake  , birdfeedr , More Fiber , sashwa
Last modified on 2009-10-24 12:40:00
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3.0 Networking·What are the tradeoffs between the various router configurations
·Can I use my wireless or an extra router along with the Verizon provided router?
·Do I have to use the supplied router with Verizon FiOS?
·How do I replace my MoCA-connected Actiontec router and still get VOD
·Can I get an ethernet connection in a room with only coax?
·Can I network/share my FiOS connection?
·Does Verizon business FIOS (Static IP) use subnetting?
·How can I use more than 7 MoCA devices
| | | The following information is for users who have seen the various bridging threads and/or the FAQs about using their own router and wondered which of these various configurations they should choose. References to the Actiontec router apply to all models of the Actiontec and to the Westell 9100EM, unless specified otherwise.
• Options 1 through 3 leave the Actiontec as primary router and the added (user) router as secondary.
• Options 4 through 7 replace the Actiontec with a different primary router. The Actiontec becomes secondary.
• Option 8 sets the user router as primary, and replaces the Actiontec with a NIM-100 for coax LAN data.
Summary:
| Feature \ Option | 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 |
|---|
| Cat5 to ONT | Y | Y | N | N | N | Y | Y | Y
| | Coax to ONT | Y | Y | Y | Y | Y | N | N | N
| | VZ support for configuration | Y | Y | Y | N | N | N | N | N
| | Double NAT'ed | Y | Y | N | N | N | *1 | N | N
| | Small NAT table issue (Actiontec Rev. A-D only) | Y | Y | Y | N | N | N | N | N
| | FiOS-TV (VOD and Guide) supported | Y | Y | Y | N | Y | Y | Y | Y
| | MediaShare software supported | *2 | *2 | Y | na | Y | N | Y | Y
| | Remote access to MR-DVR | Y | Y | Y | na | *3 | *3 | *3 | *3
| | Usable with Actiontec Rev. A-D | Y | Y | Y | Y | Y | Y | Y | Y
| | Usable with Actiontec Rev. E (GEN2) | Y | Y | Y | Y | Y | Y | Y | Y
| | Usable with Westell 9100EM | Y | Y | Y | Y | N | Y | Y | Y |
Notes:
• 1. STBs are double NAT'ed, but not an issue.
• 2. Only for PC's connected directly to the Actiontec.
• 3. An issue currently exists with remote (web) access to the MR-DVR. See this thread for details: »FIOS TV Central website access with Non AT Router?
This FAQ was edited to add option 3. Posts dated 12/28/08 or earlier making references to options 3 through 7 are now referring to options 4 through 8.
Options 1 and 2 can be used with either a coax or cat5 connection to the ONT.
1. Secondary
Simply plug the secondary (user) router into a LAN port on the Actiontec. User router must be configured for a different subnet than the Actiontec. The WAN port on the user router must also be set to use either a static IP address on the Actiontec subnet, or obtain its WAN address via DHCP.
PRO:
• Simplest. VZ recommended solution.
• No configuration changes required in the Actiontec.
• Supported by VZ. i.e. No changes to Actiontec config needed when calling for support.
• No cabling changes.
• Can be used with either a coax or cat5 connection to the ONT.
CON:
• Secondary (user) router is double NAT'ed.
• No VZ support for secondary (user) router.
• Still subject to small NAT table in the Actiontec.
• Any port forwarding will need to be configured on both routers.
2. DMZ
Similar to #1, with secondary router as a DMZ address in the Actiontec. User router must be configured for a different subnet than the Actiontec. The WAN port on the user router must also be set to use either a static IP address on the Actiontec subnet, or obtain its WAN address via DHCP.
PRO:
• Simple config change to create DMZ address for secondary (user) router.
• Eliminates need to configure port forwarding in both routers. Port Forwards are configured in secondary (user) router only.
• No cabling changes.
• Can be used with either a coax or cat5 connection to the ONT.
CON:
• Secondary (user) router is double NAT'ed.
• Still subject to small NAT table in the Actiontec.
Note: One member reports success with a secondary router in the DMZ of the Actiontec, while others report an improvement but not problem resolution. See this thread for more details. »Steam on a router in the Actiontec DMZ
Options 3, 4 and 5 are for users with an existing coax WAN connection between the Actiontec and the ONT.
3. LAN-to-LAN
LAN-to-LAN connection between Actiontec and user router. User router becomes a switch. WAN connection and firewall not used in user router. LAN DHCP server should be disabled in the user router. Instructions are detailed in this FAQ: »Verizon Online FiOS FAQ »Can I use my wireless or an extra router along with the Verizon provided router?
PRO:
• Easy.
• Avoids double-NATing. Port Forwards are configured in the Actiontec only.
• VZ support for Actiontec.
CON:
• Still subject to small NAT table in the Actiontec. Does not apply to the Westell's larger NAT table.
4. Internet Bridge
Bridging the Actiontec passes all WAN traffic through, making the user's router primary. Follow the bridging thread here: »How-to: make ActionTec MI424-WR a network bridge
PRO:
• Bypasses the small NAT table in the Actiontec. NAT limited by primary router, not Actiontec.
• No cabling changes.
CON:
• Moderate difficulty to setup.
• Not supported by VZ. May require a HARD reset of the Actiontec to restore to factory defaults for support.
• Internet only. No VOD or guide data for STBs.
• Switch ports on Actiontec not available as LAN ports.
5. Double Bridge
Bridging the Actiontec (does not apply to the Westell. See #5W) passes all WAN traffic through, making the user's router primary. Another internal bridge passes data from the user's primary router to the coax LAN for STB data. Follow the VOD bridging (applies to Rev. A-D) thread here: »Make your actiontec a bridge with VOD working with REV D
For the Actiontec (GEN2) Rev. E, instructions are here: »Re: MI424WR-GEN2 Rev E Configuration Thread
PRO:
• Bypasses the small NAT table in the Actiontec. NAT limited by primary router, not Actiontec.
• VOD and guide data supported.
• No cabling changes.
CON:
• Moderate difficulty to setup.
• Unsupported by VZ. May require a HARD reset of the Actiontec to restore to factory defaults.
• Not all configuration information saved to config file. Some bridging information lost on a power fail.
• Switch ports on Actiontec not available as LAN ports.
5W. Two Bridge
A variation of the #5 Double Bridge approach is use two separate bridges. This is usable with the Westell, but requires a separate MOCA bridge. This is a combination of option #4 (Internet Bridge) and option #8 (MOCA LAN Bridge).For the MOCA WAN-to-ethernet WAN bridge, use the first part (1-20b) of the instructions here: »Re: MI424WR-GEN2 Rev E Configuration Thread
The above instructions were written for the Actiontec. The instructions for the Westell should be very similar with the exception that the Broadband (coax) and the Broadband (ethernet) interfaces are treated as one.
If someone takes this approach, please put the exact steps you followed, so this FAQ can be updated.
Options 6 and 7 are for users with a cat5 WAN connection to the ONT. These options replace the Actiontec with a different primary router and relegate the Actiontec to servicing only the STBs. Option 8 replaces the Actiontec with a NIM-100 to provide coax LAN data. If you currently have a coax WAN connection and want to switch to a cat5 WAN connection, instructions for switching are here: »Verizon Online FiOS FAQ »Replacing the Actiontec (part 1): Coax to Ethernet
Keep in mind that when using a third-party router, that it must be capable of supporting the high throughput of your FIOS internet connection and if you have FiOS-TV, the additional bandwidth of Video-On-Demand (VOD). Many older routers can not support these higher bandwidth requirements.
6. Primary LAN-to-WAN
Cat5 from ONT to user router. LAN port on user router to WAN port on Actiontec per FAQ here: »Verizon Online FiOS FAQ »Replacing the Actiontec (part 3): WAN-to-LAN keeps Guide and VOD (easier)
PRO:
• Easy. FSC can switch WAN connection from coax to cat5 remotely.
• NAT limited by primary router, not Actiontec.
• VOD and guide data supported.
CON:
• Configuration not supported by VZ. May have to reconnect Actiontec to ONT (via cat5) as primary router for support.
• Does not support media sharing on PCs connected to primary router.
7. Primary LAN-to-LAN
Cat5 from ONT to user router. LAN port on user router to LAN port on Actiontec per FAQ here: »Verizon Online FiOS FAQ »Replacing the Actiontec (part 4): LAN-to-LAN keeps MediaShare DVR
PRO:
• Easy. FSC can switch WAN connection from coax to cat5 remotely.
• NAT limited by primary router, not Actiontec.
• Media sharing PCs connected to primary router supported.
CON:
• Configuration not supported by VZ. May have to reconnect Actiontec to ONT (via cat5) as primary router for support.
8. Primary with MoCA Bridge
In options 6 and 7 above, a NIM-100 can be used to provide the MOCA LAN bridge instead of the Actiontec. The NIM-100 supports MOCA LAN only. It can not be used between a router and the ONT.
PRO:
• Can eliminate Actiontec completely.
• Smaller, simpler device. Less power consumption.
CON:
• No retail outlet for NIM-100. Availability on eBay can be erratic.
• Additional unit to purchase.
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by More Fiber
last modified: 2009-09-17 00:17:05 | | | Most definitely. Using more than one router allows you to put your wireless router's antenna where it will best cover your house or property; allows you to use the printer port; allows you to hard-wire more than 4 ethernet devices into your LAN.
These instructions leave your Actiontec router as primary. Your secondary router will connect LAN-to-LAN to the Actiontec, so it will simply act as a switch. The Actiontec will handle DHCP. All of these steps use your PC connected wired to the routers. Do not connect the secondary router to the Actiontec until instructed below. Here's how:
First, set up the primary router:
1. To start with a simple configuration, reset the Actiontec to its default configuration by pressing the reset button for 10 seconds. Note that this will delete all port forwards and filter rules you may have already established. You may want to make notes of your existing config before resetting to default. The default Actiontec router address is 192.168.1.1. Point your browser to the login page.
2. When reset, the Actiontec will boot up and ask you to set a password. It is suggested it be something different than password or password1. I use 8 characters in an alpha/number mix. Make sure you can connect to the internet. This verifies primary router connectivity.
3. Click on My Network icon, click Network Connections, then Network (Home/Office), then click Settings button. Change the DHCP address range by scrolling down to locate IP Address Distribution. Verify DHCP Server is selected in the dropdown box. Set the Start IP Address to 192.168.1.11, and leave the Ending IP Address at 192.168.1.254. You can use a different start or end address. I selected .11 because I want to have several, but not too many addresses I can use as static addresses. The secondary router will be one of them.
Click Apply, wait for the Actiontec to reconfig, then click Apply again to make it stick.
4. If you intend your secondary router to handle all the wireless connections, you may choose to disable the Actiontec Wireless. This might be the case if, for instance, your secondary router is Wireless-N. Disable Actiontec Wireless by clicking Wireless Settings icon, then click Basic Security Settings. Click item 1. Wireless Radio to Off. Then click Apply, wait for the Actiontec to reconfig, then click Apply.
5. Verify Internet connectivity, then shut off your PC.
Next, set up your router as secondary
6. Unplug your PC's wired connection from the Actiontec LAN port, then plug it into a LAN port on your secondary router. Make sure the secondary router WAN port is not connected to anything. Boot up your PC and the router and log into your secondary router's interface.
7. You should be able to login with a login and a password. If you are unable to, you may have to resort to a hard reset on the secondary router and use the operator's manual to determine the default login and password.
Please note that routers from different manufacturers will vary in their default settings and interface. If your PC is set to get a LAN address automatically, you can determine your IP address by typing "ipconfig /all" (without the quotes) at a command prompt, then press Enter.
You should be able to log in to your secondary router at "http://192.168.1.1" or by using your LAN IP address with .1 as the last octet.
8. Once logged in, ignore the router's Internet settings because the WAN port is not used. You need to change its Network Settings to set the Router IP address to 192.168.1.2 with Subnet mask 255.255.255.0.
9. Also, it's very important to Disable DHCP Server. On my secondary router after I made those changes, I needed to Save Settings.
Finally, connect secondary router to Actiontec
10. Then I connected a patch cable from a LAN port on the Actiontec to a LAN port on the secondary router, and clicked Reboot Now. Instructions for your router may vary.
After the secondary router reboot, reboot your PC. You should be connected to your secondary router and pick up a LAN IP from the Actiontec. Verify internet connectivity.
11. At this point, verify you can log in to the Actiontec at 192.168.1.1, and log in to your secondary router at 192.168.1.2. It will make no difference what router you are physically connected to for administration of both.
12. Any additional changes to primary or secondary routers can be made at this time. Here is where you may set wireless on the secondary router. Any port forwards will be done on the Actiontec. The secondary router WAN port is not connected.
To summarize:
Actiontec is set to serve DHCP addresses from 192.168.1.11 to 192.168.1.254, and your
secondary router has a static network address of 192.168.1.2 and DHCP is disabled.
Both are connected with a patch cable from LAN to LAN.
Straight or crossover cable doesn't matter because the Actiontec is self-sensing.
Some people may still have problems with their network because of known limitations of the Actiontec router up to and including Rev. D. If this is the case for you, consider using your router as primary, with the Actiontec as secondary router. Follow the instructions above using your router in the primary setup section, and using the Actiontec in the secondary setup section.
Review more options described here: »Verizon Online FiOS FAQ »What are the tradeoffs between the various router configurations.
Note: Connecting an Access Point wirelessly to the Actiontec may or may not be possible, depending on the AP, and is outside the scope of this FAQ.
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by bobTeatow edited by More Fiber
last modified: 2009-09-21 16:48:22 | | | If your WAN connection between the ONT and the primary router is coax, you will not find any retail versions of routers available that support the MoCA standard. To use a different primary router, you will need to get the WAN connection switched over to Ethernet, or bridge your primary through the Westell/Actiontec coax WAN.
Since FiOS set-top-boxes rely on the MoCA LAN for guide data, widgets and VOD, most alternative configurations include the Actiontec or Westell in a secondary role for TV service.
The Pros/Cons of a number of possible configurations for connecting your own router are detailed in the FAQ:
»Verizon Online FiOS FAQ »What are the tradeoffs between the various router configurations
Although most FiOS technical support representatives have wide-ranging networking knowledge, you may find Verizon unable to provide support for non-standard installations. Of course, you can post your question in the »Verizon Fiber Optics forum.
Some older routers may not be able to support FiOS' higher speeds. For example, some users have discovered a 16-17 Mbps limit with the Linksys WRT54G using third party firmware.
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by Sizzlechest edited by birdfeedr
last modified: 2009-09-26 13:04:05 | | | The original FAQ entry that was posted here has been expanded to cover a wider variety of configurations. Please refer to the following links:
Replacing the Actiontec (part 1): Coax to Ethernet
Replacing the Actiontec (part 2): Internet only, no TV
Replacing the Actiontec (part 3): WAN-to-LAN keeps Guide and VOD (easier)
Replacing the Actiontec (part 4): LAN-to-LAN keeps MediaShare DVR
With thanks to More Fiber for assistance.
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by birdfeedr edited by sashwa
last modified: 2008-06-26 21:42:42 | | | Q. I have a Tivo, game console or PC that needs an ethernet connection in a room that has only a coax connection. Is there some way I get a remote ethernet connection?
A. To do this, you need to install a MOCA to ethernet bridge.
Click to enlarge
Several MOCA bridges are currently available:
•Motorola NIM-100 - These are sometimes available on Ebay, although the price has recently increased significantly due to scarcity.
•Actiontec ECB2200 - Available new.
•Netgear MCAB1001 - available only in pairs.
•Actiontec MI424-WR router - available used on eBay for about $25.
1) Simple MOCA bridges (NIM-100, ECB2200, MCAB1001)
If you have an unused (working) coax jack connected to your main splitter:
• Connect the MOCA bridge RF-IN jack to the coax jack.
• Connect your ethernet device to the MOCA bridge ethernet jack.
If you have a coax jack with an existing STB:
• Disconnect the coax from the STB.
• Connect the coax jack to a 1x2 splitter. Make sure the splitter is rated 1 GHz to pass all signals to the STB.
• Connect one leg of the splitter to the MOCA bridge RF-IN jack.
• Connect the other leg of the splitter to the STB.
• Connect your ethernet device to the MOCA bridge ethernet jack.
The RF OUT connector on the MOCA bridge can not be used to feed a Verizon STB since it blocks the MOCA signals needed by the STB. If you were to do so, you would lose VOD and guide data on that STB. The RF OUT connector can be used to connect a non-MOCA device, such as a TIVO.
2) Actiontec MI424-WR router as a remote MOCA bridge.
You will need to reconfigure the remote Actiontec, BEFORE you connect it to the coax.
• Perform a hard reset on the Actiontec to restore factory defaults.
• Connect a PC to a LAN port of the Actiontec.
By default,DHCP server should be enabled on the Actiontec, so no need to set a static IP address on the PC.
•Login to the Actiontec at 192.168.1.1
Change the remote Actiontec's LAN IP LAN address:
•Click on MY NETWORK icon at the top
•Click on NETWORK CONNECTIONSon the left menu.
•Click on Network (Home/Office)
•On the IP ADDRESS line, enter an available IP address on the same subnet as your primary router (e.g. 192.168.1.2).
•Click APPLY
The Actiontec will reboot
Disable the remote's coax WAN connection:
•Login to the Actiontec at it's new IP address.
•Click on the MY NETWORK icon at the top.
•Select NETWORK CONNECTIONS from the menu on the left.
•Click on Broadband Connection (coax)
•Click on DISABLE
Disable the remote's DHCP server:
•Click on ADVANCED icon at the top.
•Click yes
•Select IP Address Distribution
•Select Network (Home/Office)
•In the IP ADDRESS DISTRIBUTION pull-down, select DISABLED.
•Click APPLY.
You may or may not want to disable the wireless section in the remote Actiontec. If you leave it enabled, you should set the SSID to the same as your primary router, and set it to use a different channel. This can extend the wireless range of your primary router.
At this point, you connect the remote Actiontec to the coax (you may need a 1Ghz 2x1 splitter).
Note: Option #2 assumes you are already using an Actiontec or Westell as your primary router. If you are using a third party router as your primary router, then you will need two MOCA bridges. Be sure to use a LAN-to-LAN connection between your primary router and the first Actiontec. (See this FAQ for guidelines: »Verizon Online FiOS FAQ »Can I use my wireless or an extra router along with the Verizon provided router?, making specific note of the next-to-last paragraph.) Then follow the Option 2 above for the remote Actiontec.
Having completed #1 or #2, any devices connected to the MOCA bridge, should now be able to get an IP address from the DHCP server in your primary router and connect to the internet.
If you have more than 7 MoCA devices, see the following FAQ:
»Verizon Online FiOS FAQ »How can I use more than 7 MoCA devices
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by More Fiber
last modified: 2009-08-30 10:13:32 | | | Yes, Verizon FiOS Internet Service offers you the ability to create a home network so multiple devices connected to your LAN [Local Area Network] can be connected simultaneously. This requires a Broadband Router (wired or wireless).
Verizon supplies a free wireless broadband router with 4 wired Ethernet ports for your FiOS connection. Current router in widespread use is the Actiontec MI424WR router. Three hardware versions exist, A, C and D. Subscribers in some areas (ex-GTE) are now receiving the Westell 9100EM, and there's a newer Actiontec model (referred to as Rev. E or 2nd Gen) that has recently been released.
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by drake edited by birdfeedr
last modified: 2009-04-01 16:25:56 | | | Be aware that Verizon does not currently establish separate subnets for the static IP range users, even though the address blocks they assign follow subnetting rules. (This issue appears to affect East Coast subscribers as well as at least one recent West Coast subscriber.)
Verizon's absence of subnetting can create routing problems for static customers. Specifically, other users on the same supernet may have difficulty reaching services you are offering. Possible solutions include Verizon correctly deploying their FIOS service, FIOS customers could utilize a transparent firewall, or customers can try IP translations such as 1:1 mappings.
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by firewalls4u edited by birdfeedr
last modified: 2008-12-24 16:12:32 | | | Motorola NIM-100s and other Moca devices such as the first generation Actiontec MI424-WR routers (Rev. A-D) conform to the MoCA 1.0 specification which only allows 7 MoCA devices on a MoCA channel. Fortunately, it is possible to utilize more than 1 MoCA channel.
Normally, MoCA devices such as the NIM-100 are "plug and play". There is nothing to configure. If you have have 7 or fewer Moca devices, you should leave them on the default channel. However, if you have more than 7 MoCA 1.0 devices, you will need to move some of them to a second MoCA channel. Depending on you network requirements, you may need an additional MoCA bridge for the second channel.
Click to enlarge
Changing the MoCA Channel:On the Actiontec:This assumes you are using an additional Actiontec as a MoCA bridge. This should not be attempted if the Actiontec is your primary router. You will lose connectivity to your STBs.
•Click on MY NETWORK icon
•Select NETWORK CONNECTIONS from the menu on the left
•Make sure ADVANCED view is enabled.
•Click on coax
•Select CONFIGURE CONNECTION
•From the channel pull down, select a specific channel. This must be the same channel used by the NIM-100. Westell and Actiontec Rev E routers support MOCA channels not available on the NIM-100.
•Make sure MOCA privacy is enabled.
•In the PASSWORD field, enter a MOCA network encryption password (12-17 numeric characters).
•Click OK
On each NIM-100:
•Connect a PC directly to the NIM-100.
•Do an IPCONFIG /RELEASE and /RENEW on the PC. The PC should assign itself a 169.254.1.x address.
•Browse to »169.254.1.1
You should be presented with the NIM-100 login screen. The password is "entropic" (without quotes).
•Go to the SETUP screen.
Under LAN:
•Be sure config type is C.LINK LOCAL.
Under COAX:
•Select the same channel selected on the Actiontec.
•Select NETWORK SECURITY SETTINGS
•Enter the same MOCA network encryption password (12-17 numeric characters) that you entered on the Actiontec.
•Click APPLY
•Click APPLY on the SETUP screen.
•Reboot the NIM-100.
•Login again
•Check the status screen to verify communication with the Actiontec (or check the coax stats screen on the Actiontec).
Note: Be careful when changing settings on the NIM-100. It is possible to "brick" the NIM-100.
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by More Fiber
last modified: 2009-08-02 22:56:04 |
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