me1212
join:2008-11-20
Pleasant Hill, MO | What if a kids doing at the perents don't know?
What then? You know other than telling the parents they suck as perents.
O well, I don't pirate, so I don't cre that much. |
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whiteyonenh
join:2004-08-09
Keene, NH
clubs:
 ·RoadRunner Cable
|  Uhh, who cares about the damn soap?
"The relative cost of stealing a bar of soap from an hotel might be small, but if it came to seven million people nicking the soap each year, which is what we have in the music industry, I'm sure that hotel chain would do something about it." Seriously, if someone nicks a bar of soap, it's no loss to the hotel chain, as they'd have to replace any bars of soap between check-in's anyways. Would you want to use some unknown person's bar of soap? Also, as far as the music industry goes, how do they even know that these people are customers to begin with, who says they'd buy their shitty music anyways? |
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BF69
join:2004-07-28
Camden, TN
| said by whiteyonenh  :"The relative cost of stealing a bar of soap from an hotel might be small, but if it came to seven million people nicking the soap each year, which is what we have in the music industry, I'm sure that hotel chain would do something about it." Seriously, if someone nicks a bar of soap, it's no loss to the hotel chain, as they'd have to replace any bars of soap between check-in's anyways. Would you want to use some unknown person's bar of soap? Also, as far as the music industry goes, how do they even know that these people are customers to begin with, who says they'd buy their shitty music anyways? So your logic is that if you wern't going to buy it you can steal it? Also if the music is so shitty why bother stealing it? Why would you want shitty music even if it's free? If I gave one a plate of dog crap would one eat it because it was free? I would hope not. If somehting is worth having it's worth paying for and if the 99 cetns is going to break one's wallet or one doean't feel it's worth 99 cetns then one doesn't deserve to have that music. it's as simple as that. |
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wifi4milez
Big Russ, 1918 to 2008. Rest in Peace
join:2004-08-07
New York, NY
 ·Verizon FIOS
 ·Sprint Mobile Broa..
·RoadRunner Cable
 ·BroadVoice
| reply to whiteyonenh
said by whiteyonenh :Seriously, if someone nicks a bar of soap, it's no loss to the hotel chain, as they'd have to replace any bars of soap between check-in's anyways. Would you want to use some unknown person's bar of soap? I think he is probably referring to the unopened bars of soap. I guarantee you that the ones you dont use (still wrapped in plastic/paper) are not replaced when you leave. I agree that the analogy isnt the best for the very reasons you describe however.
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Комитет государственной безопасности
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BF69
join:2004-07-28
Camden, TN
| reply to me1212
Re: What if a kids doing at the perents don't know?
said by me1212 :What then? You know other than telling the parents they suck as perents. O well, I don't pirate, so I don't cre that much. well it's called being parent and punishing the child. If you're a parent and your kid is selling drugs and you are unaware of that yeah it's kind of your fault. |
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AstroBoy
join:2008-08-08
Parkville, MD
| 7 million at no cost
"The relative cost of stealing a bar of soap from an hotel might be small, but if it came to seven million people nicking the soap each year, which is what we have in the music industry, I'm sure that hotel chain would do something about it."
If I were to steal 7 million bars of soap it would cost someone alot! But if I steal 7 million mp3 files, what is missing? Nothing. No cost to anyone. No loss to anyone. |
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Pizz
Hi
join:2000-10-27
Astoria, NY
 ·Verizon Online DSL
·RoadRunner Cable
| Wasted resources
On something the RIAA/ISP/Gov't will never be able to stop. Pirates do not use their own PC/ISPs. They use compromised PCs for which they upload said content. They use their Bot's ISP of some unknowning/un-educated PC user, to upload their content. They also use hacked modems, with pre-configured bin files, so its basically piggy backing on a cable network (don't know about DSL but i'll bet you can find one). All this crap is doing, is hurting the law-biding citizen, who basically doesn't pirate, download illegal files etc..
Sadly this pirating/caps thing is all the same. MSOs/ISPs complain about the 1% of it's users gobbling up all the bandwidth, but they allow them to stay on the network. Why? Because thats their reason to raise prices, and give out as little as possible in terms of services (caps) for the price.
The bottom line is, and will always be:
Aslong as there's a market for free/cracked/hacked - applications/games/movies/music. You'll have pirating. Turn the internet off for public view, and your problem will be solved.
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Would you ever allow me to study the phislophy of your spirit.Masiela Luasha> |
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Matt
Take me down to the paradise city
Premium
join:2003-07-20
Jamestown, NC
·North State Commun..
| reply to AstroBoy
Re: 7 million at no cost
said by AstroBoy :If I were to steal 7 million bars of soap it would cost someone alot! But if I steal 7 million mp3 files, what is missing? Nothing. No cost to anyone. No loss to anyone. I'm sorry, but this is not true. If you steal 7 million MP3 files (with the intention of listening to them) you have stolen 7 million songs that you would have had to otherwise purchase to listen to.
The only way that false analogy works is if you download the MP3 files and then immediately delete them without listening to them. |
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BF69
join:2004-07-28
Camden, TN
| reply to AstroBoy
said by AstroBoy :"The relative cost of stealing a bar of soap from an hotel might be small, but if it came to seven million people nicking the soap each year, which is what we have in the music industry, I'm sure that hotel chain would do something about it." If I were to steal 7 million bars of soap it would cost someone alot! But if I steal 7 million mp3 files, what is missing? Nothing. No cost to anyone. No loss to anyone. That logic is dumb. yes yes is just bits so who is losing anything? Ok so if I hack into your online checking account then I'm not actually stealing since I'm just moving bits around.
By the way you'd only steal 7 million MP3s if you though they had value. |
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whiteyonenh
join:2004-08-09
Keene, NH
clubs:
·RoadRunner Cable
| reply to wifi4milez
Re: Uhh, who cares about the damn soap?
said by wifi4milez :I think he is probably referring to the unopened bars of soap. I guarantee you that the ones you dont use (still wrapped in plastic/paper) are not replaced when you leave. I agree that the analogy isnt the best for the very reasons you describe however. Yeah, I'm sure that the unused bars are not normally replaced, but for the open bars of soap, there's no reason to leave them there as they would be thrown out anyways.
And in response to the other poster, no I don't condone stealing, but at the same time, getting more people listening to music can be a good thing, because of the possibility that those people may buy stuff that they otherwise wouldn't have bought. I will admit that i regularly download music, i will also admit that some of the stuff I've downloaded I've later bought. I would not have bought it if I had not heard it beforehand though. |
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Kilroy
Premium,MVM
join:2002-11-21
Ann Arbor, MI
·WOW Internet and C..
| Give people a decent produce for a decent price
That they actually own. What are you buying or stealing when you are talking a digital song? An orderly arrangement of a bunch of 1s and 0s.
Now, if that song has DRM, what are you buying? Nothing, you are renting as long as the person you got the file from wants you to and remains in business.
Explain to me why I should pay $.99 a song. The costs involved (overly simplified) are the creation, production, storage, bandwidth, and administration. Costs that no longer exist in a digital media are packaging, shipping, physical storage, and returns. The storage for a million physical copies, not to include shipping and handing, is much more expensive and extensive than a million copies of a digital copy. What are you getting to justify $.99 a song? Just because that is what it used to cost when you got a physical piece of media that you actually owned and could do what you wanted with is not a rational.
The RIAA needs to adjust their prices and get in line with the digital age. Then they may see purchases go up because people feel they are getting value for them money. Until they start looking within and stop blaming the rest of the world for their problems they will remain clueless.
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When will the people realize that with DRM they aren't purchasing anything? |
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baj475
join:2004-11-02
Chico, CA
·Future Nine Corpor..
1 edit | The music industry's soap metaphor is flawed
It is not the ISPs who have lost the bar of soap so why should they do anything about it?
Why would any ISP willingly terminate a revenue generating customer because the customer took someone else's bar of soap? In fact, it would make sense to sell them a bigger suitcase (faster connection) so they could take even more soap. |
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jmn1207
Premium
join:2000-07-19
Reston, VA
·Verizon FIOS
| RIAA Soap Opera
This ridiculous analogy is similar to the RIAA's wishes to have the ISP's charge each customer a general piracy fee each month. You're paying for the soap anyway, regardless if you decide to use it or not. Some people always take the soap and put them in a big fishbowl at home. Who cares, it's their soap?
The soap has already been paid for with the room. It's my soap and if I want to use it and smell like a tropical coconut, that's my choice.
If I take a bar of soap from my hotel room and nobody catches me, is that considered a clean getaway? |
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NeoandGeo
join:2003-05-10
Harrison, TN | .
They continue to whine, and people will continue to do what they want. Yay. |
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BF69
join:2004-07-28
Camden, TN
| reply to Kilroy
Re: Give people a decent produce for a decent price
said by Kilroy :That they actually own. What are you buying or stealing when you are talking a digital song? An orderly arrangement of a bunch of 1s and 0s. As I said before if I hack into your online bank account I'm not really stealing then since I'm just moving 1s and 0s around. does that sound logical because that's YOUR logic
Now, if that song has DRM, what are you buying? Nothing, you are renting as long as the person you got the file from wants you to and remains in business. moot point since no one sells songs with DRM anymore.
Explain to me why I should pay $.99 a song. Because that's the price they want for it and if you think that's to much you don't have to buy it. That DOES NOT give you a right to steal it. And they don't have to justify anything to you. Those that think 99 cents is too much won't listen to any justification anyways so what's the point?
30 years ago I paid 99 cents for a 45 single. That's $2.50 in today's money and you could only play it on a record player. Now you can get a Mp3 for 99 cents and have it on your computer your Mp3 player and 100 other devices if you have that many. Yet 99 cents is to much a song you may listen to 1000 times which would be 1/10 of 1 cent every time you hear it is too much?
By the way Amazon sell many songs for 89 cents or even 79 cents. Apple just announced they were going to sell older songs for 69 cents. The fact is they could offer songs for 10 cents each and people would still steal music. Some people just think the world should offer them a free ride. |
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AstroBoy
join:2008-08-08
Parkville, MD | reply to Matt
Re: 7 million at no cost
Not true. You assume I would have bought them if I did not download them. Bad assumption. |
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AstroBoy
join:2008-08-08
Parkville, MD | reply to BF69
You are wrong. My checking account would be missing money. I would notice. If I were to download mp3 files, no one would do an inventory and find them missing. No loss. No one would notice. |
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Matt
Take me down to the paradise city
Premium
join:2003-07-20
Jamestown, NC
·North State Commun..
| reply to AstroBoy
said by AstroBoy :Not true. You assume I would have bought them if I did not download them. Bad assumption. If you didn't buy a song, you have no right to listen to it. It's called copyright law. So by downloading it illegally, you have no right to listen to it. So therefore, if you want to listen to it, you must buy it.
It's really a simple concept. |
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BF69
join:2004-07-28
Camden, TN
| reply to AstroBoy
said by AstroBoy :You are wrong. My checking account would be missing money. I would notice. If I were to download mp3 files, no one would do an inventory and find them missing. No loss. No one would notice. Um what MONEY would I have stolen? Are there 10's and 20s and 100s in my wallet that belonged to you? Nope. No REAL money was taken. All I did was move data around. So no, using the music thieves logic I DID NOT steal your money. |
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Matt
Take me down to the paradise city
Premium
join:2003-07-20
Jamestown, NC
·North State Commun..
| reply to AstroBoy
said by AstroBoy :You are wrong. My checking account would be missing money. I would notice. If I were to download mp3 files, no one would do an inventory and find them missing. No loss. No one would notice. You are taking money away from the artist who created the song. Period. They created the song and decided they'd rather sell it than give it away for free. If you download and listen to the song, you have just deprived that artist of a sale, which is theft. Just because you may not like that model, or you may despise the RIAA (I do too), it doesn't justify committing a crime. |
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