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Comments on news posted 2009-02-04 18:24:55: Yesterday we cited an anonymous insider at Charter who informed us that the company would very soon be implementing new caps. ..
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 | | Contact your congressman Dear Representative Baldwin,
I am writing to ask for your help. I currently have Charter Cable Internet Service. I currently enjoy my internet service for watching TV, You Tube Videos, online multimedia and to work from home. My family also uses similar services.
Charter has recently stated they will be implementing monthly data usage CAPS of 100GB of data per month. I currently pay $39.99 per month for my internet service. This new cap is very punitive for our family. I would like you to look into legislation that would make artificial caps illegal.
President Obama has stated that our country needs to expand the availability of broadband service to more Americans to help get our economy moving again. Charter's usage caps serve only to deter people from using emerging video and multimedia services such as Netflix, Apple TV and others. Charter's usage CAPS are self serving as Charter also sells video services via their cable TV offerings which are not subject to any caps. The move to CAP data usage is an unfair business practice that stifles access to alternative media sources.
The average Netflix HD video is between 4-6 GB per 2 hour movie. This would mean I would be limited to 20-25 movies per month before I would reach the Charter imposed cap. With multiple family members who use computers in my household (My three older children, myself and my wife) that would mean we would only be able to watch 4-5 movies each per month. This does not include ANY other activity on the internet.
To put it another way, at 4-5GB per movie the cost just to Charter to is $1.60 to $2 per movie. Netflix must also be paid for their service. This brings the price per movie close to $3-$4 each. Not surprisingly this is very close to what Charter charges for a pay per movie. At this price it is now cheaper to rent a movie from Blockbuster video or another video rental store.
So you now begin to see that the data caps are not about managing Charter's network, but is directly targeted at killing or stifling competition to Charter's services.
As technology becomes more advanced and more services are available from the internet that require significant amounts of bandwidth, we need common sense legislation that prevents incumbent providers from stifling innovation and expansion of the economy.
I urge you to look into this matter. I suggest an amendment to the stimulus bill. This amendment could bar internet providers who accept federal dollars, use public rights of way or eminent domain from imposing any type of artificial usage cap.
The United States needs to lead the world in new technology and emerging internet technologies. We need to encourage expansion of our economy through new broadband internet services. We don't need artificial caps that stifle innovation and economic development.
Sincerely,
moon1234 | |
| |  joetaxpayerI'M Here Till Thursday
join:2001-09-07
Sudbury, MA | Re: Contact your congressman said by moon1234 :
The average Netflix HD video is between 4-6 GB per 2 hour movie.
Moon - is this right? Not debating it, but it actually seems low. TiVo video is anywhere from 4-8GB/hr. And as it has a NetFlix access, I was thinking of signing up, what what good is unlimited NetFlix if it blows away the caps?
I have Comcast and we are on a 250GB cap.
I read your well written letter, and can't help but wonder if NetFlix itself would want in on the action. I can see a family of 4 easily having cap issues. The debate started with "who needs XXX GB except pirates. This one use (legal streaming video) is enough to start a new debate, the cables' impacting these legit uses.
Joe | |
| | | | | Re: Contact your congressman Netflix states on their website that their HD video streaming can use up to 5.5Mbps. The math says:
5500/8 = 687.5Kbps * 60 Seconds = 41.25 MBs/Minutes
41.25 * 120 = 4950 MB
Or 4.95GB per two hour movie. Since bandwidth fluctuates based on different factors I estimated the size of a two hour movie to be between 4-6 GB. | |
| | | | joetaxpayerI'M Here Till Thursday
join:2001-09-07
Sudbury, MA | Re: Contact your congressman said by moon1234 :
Netflix states on their website that their HD video streaming can use up to 5.5Mbps.
Makes sense. All depends on compression, this vs TiVo, or other streaming video providers. Regardless of exact number, your letter hits the mark. Good luck. | |
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| DoubleKDoublek
join:2003-03-04
Beloit, WI Reviews:
 ·Charter
| said by moon1234 :
Dear Representative "********",
I am writing to ask for your help. I currently have Charter Cable Internet Service. I currently enjoy my internet service for watching TV, You Tube Videos, online multimedia and to work from home. My family also uses similar services.
Charter has recently stated they will be implementing monthly data usage CAPS of 100GB of data per month. I currently pay $39.99 per month for my internet service. This new cap is very punitive for our family. I would like you to look into legislation that would make artificial caps illegal.
President Obama has stated that our country needs to expand the availability of broadband service to more Americans to help get our economy moving again. Charter's usage caps serve only to deter people from using emerging video and multimedia services such as Netflix, Apple TV and others. Charter's usage CAPS are self serving as Charter also sells video services via their cable TV offerings which are not subject to any caps. The move to CAP data usage is an unfair business practice that stifles access to alternative media sources.
The average Netflix HD video is between 4-6 GB per 2 hour movie. This would mean I would be limited to 20-25 movies per month before I would reach the Charter imposed cap. With multiple family members who use computers in my household (My three older children, myself and my wife) that would mean we would only be able to watch 4-5 movies each per month. This does not include ANY other activity on the internet.
To put it another way, at 4-5GB per movie the cost just to Charter to is $1.60 to $2 per movie. Netflix must also be paid for their service. This brings the price per movie close to $3-$4 each. Not surprisingly this is very close to what Charter charges for a pay per movie. At this price it is now cheaper to rent a movie from Blockbuster video or another video rental store.
So you now begin to see that the data caps are not about managing Charter's network, but is directly targeted at killing or stifling competition to Charter's services.
As technology becomes more advanced and more services are available from the internet that require significant amounts of bandwidth, we need common sense legislation that prevents incumbent providers from stifling innovation and expansion of the economy.
I urge you to look into this matter. I suggest an amendment to the stimulus bill. This amendment could bar internet providers who accept federal dollars, use public rights of way or eminent domain from imposing any type of artificial usage cap.
The United States needs to lead the world in new technology and emerging internet technologies. We need to encourage expansion of our economy through new broadband internet services. We don't need artificial caps that stifle innovation and economic development.
Sincerely,
Whomever
This letter is a perfect example of how people need to communicate with their respective leaders. The only debate should be in understanding its contents IF you get a chance to talk to these people.
Thanks Moon! I am going to fire this one off with some minor changes myself. Couldn't have said it better or agreed with you any more! | |
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| | Sorry for the double post. Sorry for the double post. | |
| | | | Re: Sorry for the double post. I'm going to be screwed. According to my monthly bandwidth consumption in Tomato, I have consistently used 250-300GB of bandwidth per month since I installed it 18 months ago. Between downloading the 10GB torrents from ETN.fm, xbox live, streaming netflix, internet radio, youtube, and STEAM (each game comes in at about 5GB these days), 100GB won't last me a week! Not to mention my connection is only 5Mb. I already have to wait forever for things to download, and now I'm going to be punished again for going over the limit...thanks charter!
As for the 60 meg tier with no caps - never going to happen in the UP. They can't even get 16 rolled out because of the old infrastructure. Max we have is 10, but that would just get me to my 100GB twice as fast :-( | |
|
 Masque
join:2001-12-04
Auburn, MI | Well, Time For Me To Move On..... I'll take DSL over this. I really don't mind limiting speed....I do mind BS like this. | |
| | | Ask for reduced bill I'm going to be asking for my bill to be reduced since I will now be receiving less service. AT&T is what 150GB cap? And their top tier in my area is $30. Well now charter is 100GB cap which is 2/3 of AT&T so Charters service is now worth $20 a month instead of $40, regardless of speed. Anyone else going to try to have their bill reduced? | |
| | | I'll be cancelling I'll be canceling my Charter cable service and moving to the as of yet uncapped DSL. | |
| | | We the people We need to do something to show that this is unacceptable. Whether we contact our Federal & State Representatives, or take some kind of movement against the companies. This is unacceptable and doing nothing now will only make it more difficult once is completely implemented. | |
| | | Official? As soon as it is official, I will be canceling and going back to AT&T. I will provide the same recommendation to all of my friends and family which seek my technical advise.
I always recommended Charter due to the fact they do not block ports nor restrict Internet usage. However, considering their current fragile state, they must want to accelerate the speed at which they go bankrupt.
The rest of the world is quickly assuming speeds of 100mb both ways but North America always seems to find a way to step backwards in favor of corporate bonuses and politics. | |
| | | Cap American Idol I wonder how much bandwidth the cable shows and phone service take up for the average household. Seems as if there are caps being placed those should be included as well. It all comes down to the same line, and my neighbor's "American Idol" acts as a bottleneck to my downloads. What's fair is fair. | |
| | | cap is bad but Charter can do what it wants I am not in favor of the bandwidth cap but we can't expect the government to come in and tell Charter to stop unless we want to throw away our freedoms and free market capitalism that we all enjoy. Charter wants to cap, let them do it and the consumers can respond. We can go to other ISPs. If the demand is high enough, another player in the HSI space will emerge and start leveraging its "no bandwidth caps" service to gain customers.
The free market will stabilize itself. Then again, there is always Korea and Japan with 50+ megabit for half the price. | |
| | | | Re: cap is bad but Charter can do what it wants Sure we can. Government regulates many aspects of commerce to make sure that corporate greed does not get out of check and harm the consumer or the economy.
Look at the financial mess we are in now. This is a direct result of TOO LITTE REGULATION.
By congress explicitly stating that CAPPING is illegal they will place all americans on a equal footing. Many parts of the country only have one ISP option. It just so happens that in those areas the people pay the most money and suffer the most restrictions.
ISPs have plenty of much more advanced ways to handle usage constraints while they upgrade their networks. CAPS should not be one of them. CAPS only serve to stifle innovation and make a consumer pay more while receiving less. It is time to make this practice illegal.
Make ISPs actually actually put forth an effort to innovate instead of turn the existing plant into a cash cow at the expense of the consumer. | |
| | | | The government can tell them what to do, since it is the government that is allowing them to have the monopoly in the first place. And, it is the government that is permitting their cables to cross the government's right-of-ways.
Charter would not be making the money it is now making if it had developed in a truly free-market system where anyone was allowed to run a cable to people's homes and provide service. Now it is possible they might now allow someone else to try and compete in a market, but that does not change the fact that they grew to their current size under exclusive and anti-competitive monopolies. | |
| | Lazlow
join:2006-08-07
Saint Louis, MO | I wonder if they can come at this along the same lines as they are going after Comcast on its VOIP methods. Essentially these caps are to prevent video competition. So charter using their TV system and capping is effectively the same thing as Comcast throttling and having an isolated VOIP. | |
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| | typical rollover gigs? probably not. when you're well under the limit they keep the difference. that month you exceed? bam! charter hits you for the overage. there oughta be a law. score one for greed.
- js. | |
| | stlpaul
join:2006-11-15
Saint Louis, MO
1 edit | Re: typical said by JackSpratts:rollover gigs? probably not. when you're well under the limit they keep the difference. that month you exceed? bam! charter hits you for the overage. there oughta be a law. score one for greed. - js. rollover would be a good solution. My usenet (easynews) and cell phone (at&t) both do that, and I have more gigs and minutes than I could ever use because I never use the max, but if the occasion arises that I need to use a whole lot (more than the monthly allotment) it's okay because I used under the limit in previous months.
AT&T expires the rolled-over minutes after a year. Easynews actually gives bonus gigs for each year you've been a customer in order to reward the people who haven't switched back and forth. | |
| | | | | Re: typical Which is why you should be using a giganews affiliate that has NO usage caps. | |
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| | Install adblocker First step is install ad blocker and flash blocker. Should cut down on my normal bandwidth. And most internet companies profits.
YouTube, HuLu, NetFlicks: Can't watch them any more.
Myspace and it's overly complex member pages: Gone.
Facebook apps: Gone.
Online software like Google docs, maps for fun, etc.: Gone.
Anything with pictures: Gone.
So now that we are down to plain html text files... I guess it is 1994 all over again. | |
| | | Fight back There's an easy solution if you have a way to monitor your own usage, as Charter does not and will not offer a way for the customer to verify usage (the only place that can even see the usage is the abuse department.) Downgrade to the 5 meg service (it has the same 100GB cap) and make sure every month you get as close to the cap as possible. Try to maintain 95GB every month, especially if you normally don't use all that much. Legal torrents are a very good way to do this. There's plenty of Linux ISO images out there than can be seeded. Not only will you be sticking it to Charter, you'll be helping out the Linux community at the same time! Win-Win!
Maybe if after putting these caps in place they find their income drops and transfer increases they'll pull their heads out of their butts and figure out this is a BAD idea. Then again, maybe I'm just crazy for thinking a corporation will ever do something that doesn't result in massive short term gains and ignore the long term consequences.
One more thing I'm waiting to find out the answer to: What would be the result of a DDoS attack on a customer. It sounds like all it would take to knock someone you dislike off the internet is a small botnet to send a steady (but not crippling) stream of garbage data at them to push them over their cap. A stream of just 2Mbps (easily done with just 15 hijacked computers, most botnets are hundreds of computers) would put them over their 100GB cap in just under 5 days at most and they'd never notice the slight reduction in speed. The more they actually used their connection, the less time it would take.
Along that same line, what's to stop Charter from using the above tactic to bump people into the higher tier for the higher cap? We already know they have absolutely no ethical standards by the fact they're using caps instead of using some of the $billions they've been given by the .gov over the past 10 years or so for broadband expansion.
Also, if you signed up before the caps were put in place, there's a chance they can't change the TOS without breaking contract law. In some states contracts aren't allowed to have clauses that allow one side to change the rules of the contract at will without giving the other side the same power or a way to object to the changes. In those states what Charter is doing is 100% ILLEGAL. Check the contract laws of your state to find out if you're in a state with a hint of uncommon sense. If so, a nice class action lawsuit would put a fast stop to this BS. | |
| | | I will not stand for this. I have Charter and I will definitely be switching. This article claims it's happening THIS month, yet when I call Charter, the employees have no idea what I'm talking about.
I will definitely be switching to Verizon's DSL service and try to convince them to expand FIOS to my area. I will also make sure Charter knows that the capping specifically is the reason I will be switching. | |
| | | Business Class Account I have one question, will switching to a business class account get around the caps? I haven't been able to find out of that is still unlimited and how easy it is to get a business class account in a residential area, any more information about this would be most appreciated as Charter is the only option in my area. | |
| | Lazlow
join:2006-08-07
Saint Louis, MO | Re: Business Class Account For now, there are no caps on the business accounts. I priced a 10/1 line at just over $100/month and the 20/2(available here now only on the business side) at $269 both required a 12 month contract. You would be better off just going to the 60/5 with no cap at $114. | |
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| | More people whining about things they know nothing about... More people whining about things they know nothing about... | |
| | Lazlow
join:2006-08-07
Saint Louis, MO | Re: More people whining about things they know nothing about... Care to expand on that thought? | |
| | | | | Re: More people whining about things they know nothing about... I'm referring to the lolz0r crowd that seems so prevalent on this site. Very few people here understand the costs of being an ISP. Instead they'll whine about policies put in place to protect their provider's investment from abuse. You can't expect to have your cake and eat it too.
Delivered wholesale bandwidth is quite expensive. Why does a T1 or enterprise class cable cost so much? Because that's the cost of providing the service these guys demand for $10/month.
If you don't like your ISP options, zip your lip and start your own ISP as thousands of us across the country have. It's not that easy or cheap. | |
| | | | Lazlow
join:2006-08-07
Saint Louis, MO | Re: More people whining about things they know nothing about... Ok, explain why a lot of countries have 20/20 (some 100/100) available for sub $45/month. And yes, cable did benefit from government money with aid to backbone construction(which is the major reason that the congestion problems are not on the backbone). If you go the population density issue just compare metro areas to metro areas, not the coverage out in BFE. Explain why the upper management went from total remuneration of 40Xemployee pay in the 80s to 4000Xemployee pay now. If those $ had gone back into infrastructure there would be no need for caps. | |
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 Rex
@charter.com |  Send emails, phone calls, letters, change providers.
1. Tell everyone you know to not use charter communications.
2. Post on facebook/myspace/blogs/forums/local newspapers your experience and let all friends know.
3. Cancel any services with Charter. Find alternatives like satellite, phone, DSL, dial-up, FIOS, city wide wi-fi, etc.
4. Contact your state representative or any other political source even if is local. Contact the FCC, BBB, or any other source that you wish.
5. Contact media sources television, radio, newspaper, internet sources, etc. and tell them the unfair practices.
6. Contact CEO of charter, local offices, district managers, etc and tell them your disgust with the company.
7. Sign any petition your can get your hand on.
DO MOST OF THIS and this practice will be halted and halted in the future. Keep technology moving!!!!! | |
| | | Charter Caps Dial-up isn't an alternative to Charter. It's just a little bit better than no internet connection at all. If you switch to a slower broadband service such as DSL you are applying your own caps on your service. You won't come anywhere close to downloading what you could under the caps from whoever. It would take forever. You can't get DSL service if you live more than 18KFT from a Telco central office. It doesn't exist. If it does it is because the Telco has served on outlying area with Digital Carrier similar to what ATT has done with their U-VERSE Service with fiber. The COAX cable has a definite capacity. This is shared with all the carrier's services such as analog and digital TV, internet, and phone services. When it's full you either put in some more COAX, get rid of the analog TV or put in caps. Caps are the easiest and cheapest, more COAX is the most expensive and analog TV would be a political nightmare. If a competitor were to come in for competition, his opening pricing would start at where the existing carrier was charging. In other words there wouldn't be any competitive pricing. It's a no win situation. Hughes Satellite is another option for some. | |
| | | Forget overusage charges... Charter will just disconnect you instead. At least that's what the customer service rep indicated when we called. | |
| | | Contacted Charter I decided to contact charter today - I called their corporate HQ number (can be found at »www.consumerist.com) and was disappointed with what I found out. The limit, as I was told, applied to download/upload combined, and there is no way for the user to monitor their usage through Charter services. Sadly, the guy I talked with wasn't to helpful, so I ended up sending an email to the CEO, Neil Smit. The content of the email can be read below:
Mr. Smit,
I called your corporate offices today (3149650555) and talked with a support specialist about a problem I have with the new Bandwidth Limitations. I was informed by the specialist that my account was being limited to 100gb/month combined up and downstream usage. This, in and of its self, is something I don't like, but I really have no other option than to accept it.
Anyways, my problem occurred when I asked the specialist, "So, how much have I used? And how can I monitor that usage?"
He had to check with someone for that answer, and he called me back within a reasonable amount of time (you can give him a pat on the back for that!). The answer I received is that there is no way for the customer to monitor their bandwidth usage. I suspected this, and am rather upset that a limitation has been placed, yet there is no way for me to know where I fall in that limitation!
Please allow me to present an analogy for metered services. I assume, Mr. Smit, that your car has a gas gauge that you use to know when your tank needs to be filled. I know my truck does! It's a helpful thing -- with the gas gauge, I am able to know when I need to get gas, when I can drive all evening into the sunset, or as in the case of this past summer, when I need to conserve my gas due to gas prices being so high. The gauge is helpful!
In the same way, I have a guage on the back of my home that tells me how much power I'm using. This guage can help me understand when I might need to cut back on my power usage, or when the meter reader has made an error in reading, thus giving me backing to dispute a bill.
My water service is also metered -- I always know how much water I'm using, and if there is a leak somewhere in the line.
What I'm saying is this -- If you are going to start metering service, you need to give your customers access to the meter - we need to see it! Comcast Communications also started metering services, and it wasn't long before people began to demand access to the meter. They, wisely, have created a way for their customers to see how much service they are using, and how much they have remaining on their accounts. Good for them, and I hope that you take a page from their playbook.
This may not seem important to you, but it is for the person who relies on a constant connection - for example - the student who takes virtual courses needs to know whether or not they have enough bandwidth to also enjoy a tv show from Hulu.com or Netflix streaming without having to worry about being disconnected from their classroom the next day due to a lack of bandwidth on their account.
Please consider what I'm saying. I would personally encourage that the limitations be removed - especially if, as your company is saying, they only effect 1% of your customers -- why punish the other 99%?
If the limitations cannot be removed, I feel that you must offer us a way to monitor our usage.
Thank you for hearing me out. I will be forwarding this email to other Charter customers, and to a customer relations blog I frequent (Consumerist.com). | |
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