Ignite
Premium,VIP
join:2004-03-18
UK
clubs:
 ·BlueYonder Interne..
 ·Be There
1 edit | Selective Quote
Somewhat selective quote Karl, after that part of the quote comes 'Then stuff like this comes along, he said.' - isn't a good sales pitch if they quote a 2 year life span for the tech.
Ericsson are quite honest about what they're doing and they do admit fibre is the way to go, they also know a lot of companies don't want the CapEx involved, here's a nice bodge to sweat the copper some more.
Can't see it being huge though, bonded ADSL2+ was hardly huge... |
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ITALIAN926
join:2003-08-16
Stratford, CT | Let the phone companies start running trunks of cable.. like 1000 pairs to each sub. LOL.
Sad sad sad. Great idea. |
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Ignite
Premium,VIP
join:2004-03-18
UK
clubs:
·BlueYonder Interne..
·Be There
| said by ITALIAN926  :Let the phone companies start running trunks of cable.. like 1000 pairs to each sub. LOL. Sad sad sad. Great idea. Given the allergy some have to fibre it wouldn't surprise. |
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tschmidt
Premium,MVM
join:2000-11-12
Milford, NH
 ·Hollis Hosting
·Verizon Online DSL
·Fairpoint Communic..
| Why is this news?
VDSL2 has been around for several years. At 1500 feet speed is about 80 Mbps. Spec supports bonding two pairs to double data rate.
BBR article points out AT&T is planning to using pair bonding for U-Verse.
»telephonyonline.com/access/techn···uts_bet/
Vectorized VDSL sounds like a clever marketing term of little substance. 500/6 = 83 Mbps so all this seems to be is using six-pairs instead of two. For individual customers single pair is enough to deliver multiple HDTV channels along with Internet access. However this only works by installing Remote DSLAMs at substantial cost. One has to wonder at wisdom of continued massive investment prolonging life of copper plant vs overbuilding new fiberoptic outside plant optimized for data?
/tom |
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me1212
join:2008-11-20
Pleasant Hill, MO | Cool but 500 meters ain't much.
I can walk that in a few min. |
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hayabusa3303
Over 200 mph
Premium
join:2005-06-29
clubs: | sounds more like a pipe dream to att.
when will people give up on copper? |
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keyboard5684
join:2001-08-01
Youngsville, PA
 ·Teliax VOIP
 ·WestPAnet Inc.
·WestPAnet Inc. CA..
| May as well run ethernet?
300 meters is the "limit" for 100Mbps ethernet so why not just run ethernet if you were going to do something like this?
Problem is, they keep trying to use EXISTING copper/infrastructure when if we are down to 500 or 300 meters, run new cable... or FIBER!
This "technology" is not worth mentioning. I can get 600Mbps if I bond 12 pairs together! Geez.
Here is a link to just a few examples of the technology already there, just nobody cares except in a corporate building or something, not a carrier picking it up...
Patton 12.8 Mbps at 4,500 feet
Or the 155Mbps at 4000ft
Just Google it, there are tons of ways to do this.
The technology exists, just fiber makes more sense. |
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Ignite
Premium,VIP
join:2004-03-18
UK
clubs:
·BlueYonder Interne..
·Be There
| Have to love that the 155Mbps is 'up to' 155Mbps total throughput at 'up to' 4000ft. So long as you have the units near as damnit next to each other you can get 100M one way 55M the other.
The other is 12.5Mbit of DSL rate, and equals a 10Mbit data rate. |
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maartena
Stacked.
Premium
join:2002-05-10
Orange, CA
·RoadRunner Cable
| 6 copper pairs over 500 meters?
Are you kidding me? Most houses only have 2 pairs (for two lines) and 500 meters means you almost have have the CO in your line of sight from the livingroom.
This may be of interest for businesses with a lot of copper pairs for voice lines, that just happen to be NEIGHBORS of the local telco company.
--
"I reject your reality and substitute my own!" |
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me1212
join:2008-11-20
Pleasant Hill, MO | Could they do this via wireless?
Like instead of running all that wire y not out up a tower that has signals that go farther than 500m? |
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keyboard5684
join:2001-08-01
Youngsville, PA
·Teliax VOIP
·WestPAnet Inc.
·WestPAnet Inc. CA..
| reply to Ignite
Re: May as well run ethernet?
Yes, but my point is that you can keep milking the copper as long as you want, the technologies to do so are all over the place. The thing is, the people who own the copper are going to use DSL or run fiber at this point.
I just think these stories of achievements are nothing special, this article is just picking and choosing.
Everything over existing copper is "up to" because you cannot predict the quality of the copper. A T1 for example is run over existing copper, it is just repeated every 4,000 feet. You see the round small tub like things mounted on the telephone poles everywhere. A T1 can be stretched a lot farther, but they want to avoid that up to crap and just make sure it works.
And that is why DSL is so limited, quality of copper and why it has to be designed to scale back when needed. All xDSL modems will scale back when the copper is crappy, it has to or it will not work. A good example is heat, on a hot day your DSL speed may actually drop back because of resistance. |
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csnyder
join:2007-09-10
Grand Rapids, MI
·Comcast Workplace
| Better for in-building DSL
I've stayed at hotels that used DSL over their internal wiring to connect the rooms (rather than wifi or ethernet); I'm assuming that they had a CO-equivalent in the basement. This could be useful for those kinds of situations - office buildings, for instance, are often wired to the hilt with copper for multi-line PBX's. |
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tmc8080
join:2004-04-24
Floral Park, NY
| who would be interested?
well, maybe AT&T is interested.. because running fiber to the home is just about the last thing they want to do for residential customers today in 2009 and beyond.. so they'll look to the mythical creature they call next generation DSL broadband technologies to deliver that magical disneyworld experience of future technologies that underperform and go through a vaporware existence... right next to the " it's a small world exhibit " |
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keyboard5684
join:2001-08-01
Youngsville, PA
·Teliax VOIP
·WestPAnet Inc.
·WestPAnet Inc. CA..
| reply to me1212
Re: Could they do this via wireless?
Fixed wireless? Here are a few.
But the cost is the same all said and done.
Really just run the fiber?
Coax also has more capacity than copper pairs over distance, if anyone likes that idea. |
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keyboard5684
join:2001-08-01
Youngsville, PA
·Teliax VOIP
·WestPAnet Inc.
·WestPAnet Inc. CA..
| reply to csnyder
Re: Better for in-building DSL
The hotels that do this, at least the ones I was able to find out how they accomplished this, made a deal with the phone company or a local ISP.
Hotels really do not have an IT staff usually so they end up hiring an outside company to do it. If they make a deal with a telco, which will do DSL to the rooms, then the telco has to support it instead of the desk clerk. |
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me1212
join:2008-11-20
Pleasant Hill, MO | reply to keyboard5684
Re: Could they do this via wireless?
I know, I'm just saying if they want to use it like that wireless seems better to me. Fiber would work better. But if they want to have no cables to people's houses wireless is the way to go. |
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chronoss2009
join:2008-09-23 | ericcison with a 10GB CAP
muahha bUT ITS SO FAST |
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Sammer
join:2005-12-22
Canonsburg, PA | reply to maartena
Re: 6 copper pairs over 500 meters?
Running those 4 extra pairs is going to be more expensive than fiber. How many pairs will they need to run out to 20,000 meters the approximate limit of one optical fiber? |
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alchav
join:2002-05-17
Palm Desert, CA
·Pacific Bell - SBC
|  reply to hayabusa3303
Re: sounds more like a pipe dream to att.
said by hayabusa3303 :when will people give up on copper? Amen Brother.....Put Wireless in there too, people keep wishing and praying to use old technology or something without wire. Fiber is the only way to go, just give in and let's get on with it! |
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green_ranger
join:2008-12-27
Indianapolis, IN
| AT&T DSL need to get their act together.
I can't even get the advertised 6Mbps down on a dryloop line (only get about 4-4.5 down.
Why don't AT&T invest in providing more DSLAMs in their supported regions so that we can at least get some decent speeds. I'm seriously thinking about returning to cable highspeed which is now at 10-16Mbps down. |
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