Swingerhead
Premium
join:2004-04-06
Richmond, VA | Markup is whatever people will pay
What do you think the markup is on the bean juice from Starbucks? People pay it so the price remains the same. When they leave for greener pastures, deals will be offered. |
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Bob61571
join:2008-08-08
Washington, IL
 ·Verizon Online DSL
 ·DIRECTV
| Metered Billing?
Karl, others,
Please see blog comments by Michael Willner (Insight CEO) on this topic today at
»www.michaelsinsight.com/
Willner does read DSLR , Karl.
(you're listed on his reading list on left side)
And, he tends to be a very common sense guy.
Maybe, some debate possible between the 2 of you?
see Willner's opinions in
2 stories on metered billing.
AT&T
»www.michaelsinsight.com/2009/04/···sts.html
Time-Warner
»www.michaelsinsight.com/2009/04/···hey.html |
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major marco
Res Firma Mitescere Nescit
Premium
join:2003-02-13
Stepford, CA
clubs:
| The sequel is coming to an ISP near you very soon
Don't worry, As we speak, I'm sure TWC et al. are furiously assembling astroturf groups and are otherwise in the process of creating industry think tanks to underscore the myth of bandwidth scarcity. They'll have some stats soon that will appear to the average, dumbfuck Congressional representative as legitimate. And just as Schumer et al. get their cut of campaign re-election funds, TWC will be right back in the business of metering.
--
The Toll
Tracking Lord Stanley
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Shmo
@charter.com
 from:
TKJunkMail 
| Guy got simple facts WRONG
This guy can't even get the simple stuff right (Hanging CMTSs from poles? what is he smoking?). Why should I believe anything he wrote?
How about he come up with simple data like the average amount of data consumers use? Wouldn't that a BASIC and NEEDED FACT for any USAGE argument? |
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Desdinova
join:2003-01-26
Gaithersburg, MD | Hmmm...
The hard data to support metered billing should be EASY to find: it's next to the pot of gold over the rainbow beside the magic wishing unicorn... |
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SSX4life
Premium
join:2004-02-13
 ·RoadRunner Cable
1 edit | Fail train
There is no hard data that they need to charge by the bit / bite / etc.
They are trying to categorize the fact if something is in lean supply they can make changes to the methods of how to regulate it.
For example, lets look at gas / fuel charges by airlines.
If gas was 4 bucks a gallon airlines added additional fees left and right to things and cut corners. What they should have done was make smarter planes that took less fuel (a.k.a. not do what airbus was doing with their A380).
Now that prices have come down, why are the fees still in place?
Companies need to stop shafting their customers, build a smarter business model, and be more fluid. Get with the 21st century and start building better equipment to handle the needs of your customers (data / video / etc. is only going to grow, stop trying to make excuses for not implementing better methods and policies)
Need I also remind you that in the early 90's the US Government gave the companies TONS of money to upgrade their systems and they did jack sh!t with. The last thing these companies need to do is NOT upgrade their systems, let the USA fall even FURTHER behind other countries in development, and charge MORE for having a monopoly over a market.
This whole idea is full of fail. |
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DaveNJ
No Fear
join:1999-09-01
New Jersey | Justification
I am all against meter billing, but if they are going to push it. They should offer a significantly reduce ppu price. Overall I think they as not making any sense for metered, unless the price is alot less. |
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Simba7
join:2003-03-24
Billings, MT
·Bresnan Online
| I have an answer.. It's GREED..
Yep. They're noticing that alot more traffic is going through their pipes and they're looking for a way to profit off of it.
They didn't expect that newer generation technologies would take advantage of the bandwidth people are PAYING for. Instead, they whine about it and on top of the connection speed the customer is paying for, they want to limit the amount transferred.
It's like having a new car, driving it for 500 miles, then having to pay for each additional mile or miles.
--
Bresnan 15M/1M|MyWS[P4HT@4.01GHz,2GB RAM,2x1TB HDDs,WinXP]|WifeWS[P4@2.4GHz,1GB RAM,60GB HDD,WinXP]|Router[2xP3@1GHz,640MB RAM,18GB HDD,Allied Telesyn AT-2560FX,Kingston KNE100TX,2xDigital DE504,Compaq NC3131,iPro/1000DP,Blitz BWI715,Gentoo Linux] |
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axiomatic
join:2006-08-23
Tomball, TX
| Cash grab...
While I appreciate Saul Hansell's efforts to get to the "truth," in this case I'm afraid to say that it is just a cash grab by the ever-greedy and anti-competitive cable companies.
What interests me more is that Saul Hansell even considered that the cable companies plight was altruistic in nature. He apparently see's "moral fiber" where we consumers only see monopolistic greed. |
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battleop
join:2005-09-28
00000
| Misleading costs...
There are more costs than just buying a GigE for $10k/mo. What about the costs of labor, maintainance, and equipment?
I would say that the totals still do not justify metered billing unless it's a High Cap + metered billing. Something like a 300Gb cap and then the metered kicks in. |
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insomniac84
join:2002-01-03
Schererville, IN | reply to Swingerhead
Re: Markup is whatever people will pay
That is the problem. Because of monopolies and duopolies, it's very easy to charge much more than is reasonable. For most people there is nowhere else to go. |
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me1212
join:2008-11-20
Pleasant Hill, MO
 ·VOIPo
| No data?
If the give no data I will not support a phail meter billing system. If it were a real metered bill(PAYG) system I think it would work better ten people would pay for what they use. $10 for a 5m connection and what ever it cost the ISP for a GB of data we would pay 2x that. If 1Gb cost them $0.20 we would pay $0.40, I do not know what it cost I am just using numbers that are easy to double. |
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ISurfTooMuch
join:2007-04-23
Tuscaloosa, AL
| reply to battleop
Re: Misleading costs...
said by battleop :There are more costs than just buying a GigE for $10k/mo. What about the costs of labor, maintainance, and equipment? Agreed, but those costa have been there for years. I'd even argue that they've been reduced or at least held somewhat in check as the companies eliminate local service and consolidate everything in call centers.
So if these costs have always been there, how is this business model, which has worked for years, now suddenly broken? |
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Aozora
join:2008-11-28
·Comcast
1 edit | Here is the money shot!
"The most logical reason for the desire to shift to this overage model remains a fear that Internet TV will erode carrier television revenues. By monetizing third party video delivery by the gigabyte (be it via Netflix or DirecTV's "VOD"), carriers can ensure their relevance in the face of television's evolution. As a perk, consumers pay more money for the same product -- one that consistently costs less to provide."
I can speak that anyone around my age and younger values the Internet a lot more than the television. Only the old people really care about the TV. Out with the old in with the new.
I still think 1 dollar a GB is monstrously outrageous. If it was 10 cents a GB I might say they are just trying to run a nice business model to make extra cash but at their price gouging I can only say that they like to exploit the consumer's ignorance to the max.
Here we go
Money talks
Here comes the money
Money money
Money money
Money money
Money money
Money
Dolla dolla
Dolla dolla
Ching ching
Bling Bling
At the check out
If you ain't talkin' money
Then your talkin' don't matter |
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screavic
Premium
join:2006-08-11
Paron, AR
 ·Verizon Wireless B..
·Alltel Axess
| Most Carriers...
Most carriers saw that it was alright for wireless data to be limited to 5GB and people still obtained it. Why, because these carriers havn't grown to these areas and people need something BESIDES dialup. I have Alltel Axcess, granted I have spent alot of $$ for ways to get a better signal than 1x, I am on a "unlimited but fair" plan. Meaning it's truly unlimited as long as I don't abuse the system by downloading a ton of information every month.
Not only do most wireless carriers limit you to 5gb, they claim they have unlimited internet, and they charge more for MUCH MUCH less.
I thought the wave of wireless "was supposed to be cheaper" because of the lack of line maintenance etc. Of course this would be true if there wasn't a demand for broadband in rural areas. Do I think this government sponsored broadband bill is going to work... NO
Now I wait to be attacked... |
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DarkLogix
join:2008-10-23
Baytown, TX
1 edit | reply to SSX4life
Re: Fail train
delete post please (the image wouldn't post due to where it was hosted) |
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espaeth
Digital Plumber
Premium,MVM
join:2001-04-21
Minneapolis, MN
·voip.ms
·Vitelity VOIP
·Callcentric
·VoiceStick
·ViaTalk
·Comcast
·Embarq
1 edit | Vast difference in colo / wide-area network CapEx and OpEx
Does anybody do investigative journalism anymore?
The operational costs at the head-end where cross-connects are contained to the same building is a vastly different case from operating and maintaining miles of infrastructure.
I highlighted the elements I had direct costs for here:
»Re: I think we are seeing how TWC will try to "educate" people
If the gains were really 2500% (as Karl Bode suggests), you couldn't beat venture capitalists off with a stick if you expressed interest in starting up a new service provider.
I'm not saying there is no profit in the system, but to argue it's 2500% is absurd. If that were the case all of these muni-ISPs wouldn't be having financial troubles. |
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DGLewis
join:2006-03-10
Freehold, NJ
| reply to Shmo
Re: Guy got simple facts WRONG
said by Shmo :
This guy can't even get the simple stuff right (Hanging CMTSs from poles? what is he smoking?). The device he's referring to hanging off a pole (where the "high-capacity fiber cable" switches over to "cable TV... wires") isn't a CMTS, it's an HFC node. Which can be pole-mounted or even hung on the cable strand.
If you're going to call someone an idiot, it's best to not be yourself an idiot. |
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fiberguy
My views are my own.
Premium
join:2005-05-20
| reply to me1212
Re: No data?
The cost to carry a GB of data has to not only factor in the data consumed itself, but also the cost to operate the ENTIRE network.. that means those that talk to you on the phone, the ones who support it, the guys who install and maintain the lines outside, the broken modems, the taxes, power, insurance and other benefits to the employees, etc.
Trying to sit back here and micro analyze the amount to pay based purely on the cost of a transport cost is invalid. That's like trying to say that the cost of the army is just the soldier alone and not the weapons they use, the cost to move the soldier, and all other expenses.
This is a common mistake that just about everyone uses in trying to justify their position.
Still, for those that don't understand what I'm saying, and those extremest that love to sit on their mouse and keyboard clicking REPLY in haste, I never once agreed that $1 over per gb is reasonable either. |
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boogi man
join:2001-11-13
Apo, AE
clubs: | cost
looks like this is the question of the hour day whatever.
what is the actual cost of data transmission and how exactly is it quantified? like most things i'd imagine that the cost is relative to scale. but what is the cost? |
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