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Comments on news posted 2009-06-17 08:59:04: Yesterday AT&T and Verizon were hauled before Congress to explain why text messages have jumped 200%, when text messages piggyback on secondary control channels within wireless transmissions, costing carriers virtually nothing. ..
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page: 1 · 2  |
 | | bjack
join:2006-01-30
Reading, MA
1 edit | Re: what a joke.. Bend over? If five dollar a month to send unlimited messages to anybody in the word all day any day with amazing reliability is being bent over, man you are a baby!
The way I see it is that people bitch and moan about little things, but they forget the fact that cell phones have completely changed the world...BECAUSE COMPANIES HAVE SPENT BILLIONS TO INVEST IN TOWERS, EQUIPMENT AND MAN HOURS... to have high quality networks for people to be able to complain about 5 dollars a month.
The way I see it, the money the companies make goes back into making investments into the network to allow for the reliability that if I send a quick message to someone from ANYWHERE that they will get it instantly.
(Moderated: Tip: to continue enjoying the website, try perhaps expressing your point without calling one of its main employees a "dumbass.") | |
| | | | | | | bjack
join:2006-01-30
Reading, MA
| Re: what a joke.. Who do you work for??? That has nothing to do with you. This site has so many cry babies who think everything should be free and complain about spending money. IF YOU DON'T LIKE TO SPEND MONEY THEN DON'T TEXT... MANY UNLIMITED PLANS ARE $10 and by the way, for $5 you can get plenty of texts per month | |
| | | | | | | | | | sonicmerlin
join:2009-05-24
Cleveland, OH
| Re: what a joke.. Well yes, we do complain about spending money when the money is drained from the US economy and simply lines the fat pockets of greedy corporate executives. Why shouldn't we get texting for free when it costs the carriers nothing?
Texting is free in India, a 3rd-world country. Texts cost about 1 cent per text in Pakistan, yet another 3rd-world country.
I can't believe you're defending rich people. It's not like you're making any of the money they're stealing from people like you. | |
| | | | | | jester121
Premium
join:2003-08-09
Lake Zurich, IL
 ·surpasshosting
 ·ViaTalk
| Re: what a joke.. said by sonicmerlin  :Well yes, we do complain about spending money when the money is drained from the US economy and simply lines the fat pockets of greedy corporate executives. Why shouldn't we get texting for free when it costs the carriers nothing? Texting is free in India, a 3rd-world country. Texts cost about 1 cent per text in Pakistan, yet another 3rd-world country. I can't believe you're defending rich people. It's not like you're making any of the money they're stealing from people like you. It's a shame you've been brainwashed into hating the "evil rich" -- what do you think rich people do with all those warehouses full of money? Do you think they spend any of it? Maybe hire people? Buy stuff that was made by people?
If anything else, rich people should be appreciated because they're more likely to buy high end US-made products than Wal-mart crap from China. | |
| | | | | | | sonicmerlin
join:2009-05-24
Cleveland, OH
| Re: what a joke.. Actually a large number of very rich people tends to be very bad for an economy. They in fact don't spend their money, and are focused on increasing their overall wealth. If they make say $100 million in a year, they'll only spend a fraction of that wealth on their daily expenses, storing the rest into an offshore bank account.
Really, until you take a basic economics class you should cease your disgusting fawning over rich people. | |
| | | | | | | | jester121
Premium
join:2003-08-09
Lake Zurich, IL
·surpasshosting
·ViaTalk
| Re: what a joke.. said by sonicmerlin :Really, until you take a basic economics class you should cease your disgusting fawning over rich people. It's so sad to see people filled with hate toward real people they don't even know. I guess it's the last acceptable form of bigotry these days. Throw in an ad hominem attack and try to use intelligent sounding words, and people might believe you.
One big benefit of rich people, especially in the USA, is that they pay a huge share of the taxes that support the bloated, greedy, inefficient government and its economy-crippling social programs. The top 1% of earners pay 40% of all the revenue collected by the IRS. Those evil bastards!
And regardless -- how is people saving their own money (or doing whatever they want to with it) bad for "the economy"? It's bad for socialists who think they know what's best and want to boss everyone else around.
P.S. -- I already know the answer, because I've taken several economics classes and read plenty of good books on the subject. What pamphlets (or manifestos) have you been reading?  | |
| | | | | | | | | farmer1204
join:2009-06-17
Chicago, IL
1 edit | Re: what a joke.. The top 1% also control 40% of the wealth, and that the conservative estimate. More liberal guesses put it at 60-65% with the ability to conceal assets.
I don't think anyone minds people saving their money. However, what does irk some is when capital gains are taxed at 15%, for doing nothing, and people who work hard for their wages are getting taxed at 20,25, or 30%. That's not socialism, its just fair.
Still, I don't know why you hate socialism so much, it saved our country last year. Basically, capitalism failed in 2008, and it was only socialism that was able to pull us of the edge. Besides, everyone thinks they know whats best and wants to boss everyone else around. And thats why we have elections. | |
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Transmaster
Don't Blame Me I Voted For Bill and Opus
join:2001-06-20
Cheyenne, WY
 ·Qwest.net
| said by sonicmerlin :Actually a large number of very rich people tends to be very bad for an economy. They in fact don't spend their money, and are focused on increasing their overall wealth. If they make say $100 million in a year, they'll only spend a fraction of that wealth on their daily expenses, storing the rest into an offshore bank account. Really, until you take a basic economics class you should cease your disgusting fawning over rich people. So where did you get your knowledge of economics, out of a Cracker Jacks box? How do you think these rich people increase their wealth. Money doesn't grow on trees it has to be invested and it is these investments that create jobs. Why don't you apply at the Whitehouse, they could make you the Czar over Rich People. Gee Whizz 
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I am quite sure now that often, very often, in matters concerning religion and politics a man's reasoning powers are not above the monkey's.
- Mark Twain in Eruption | |
| | | | | | | | | sonicmerlin
join:2009-05-24
Cleveland, OH
| Re: what a joke.. Private investment has a very narrow focus and is highly inadequate when it comes to the development of world-bettering technologies, such as renewable energy or stem cell research. I have no problem with investment, but the reality is rich people's goals are to horde as much money as possible. Whenever given the freedom by government to do what they want, rich entrepreneurs and businesses consistently engage in anti-competitive, anti-capitalist behavior to corner markets and maximize their profits. Perhaps you've heard of the "Crystal meetings" held by LCD manufacturers, or the fine EU put on Intel for engaging in anti-competitive behavior?
Rich people are more interested in maximizing their bank accounts, not investing for the betterment of mankind.
Greed is at the forefront of every human personality. I don't favor the poor over the rich. I'm under no delusion that were a poor person to find himself inheriting a fortune, he would not act the same way most rich already do. What I care about is humanity as a whole, and easing the burdens of daily life for *everyone*. This includes providing them with luxuries whenever possible, and preventing a few from hoarding wealth that is ultimately produced by plebeians.
Besides, a company's "profit" is not invested. Executives at cable companies don't bother investing their bonuses into other ventures. Why would they, knowing how profitable their current business is?
So:
Would you have a problem with a law that demanded a company invest any profit above a certain % of their revenue into new ventures or back into their own company? | |
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | sonicmerlin
join:2009-05-24
Cleveland, OH
| Re: what a joke.. I suspected you would respond only to my last paragraph.
You argue that very rich people invest their wealth back into the economy, but are opposed to a proposition that would guarantee that reinvestment. You would prefer we leave it up to the general goodwill of super rich human beings to not simply horde money. Interesting. | |
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | fiberguy
My views are my own.
Premium
join:2005-05-20
| You're heard of the stock market, right?? and you've heard of other places to store money, like CDs, and IRA accounts... right? Who do you think get the benefit of that money while the evil rich fat-cat leaves their money there? .. Since you're an expert on economics, I'd think you're realize that the money they place there IS going back into the economy. You think they place their billions in their mattresses or something?
When that money goes into the banking system, they can lend money to small business that needs to expand.. it goes to the bank to allow people to buy homes.. and so on.. ALL of that is called LIQUIDITY which is what we need.. liquidity is money that is free'd up and allowed to flow through the economy.
You need to look at what an investment is.. and also, simply taking your money and "buying something" isn't an investment.. there IS such thing as TOO much consumption...
No one is hording money.. the OTHER option, as you wish to tear down the classes, is to let the government decide who gets money while making everyone "equal".. no thank you.
To this day, we ALL have the right to get rich.. even you... try it sometime. Instead of spending your time bitching about rich people, why don't you try to get rich yourself.. a little less internet time and more education time, you could probably find your way and become one of those rich people, then be labeled a greedy fat cat... | |
| | | | | | | | | | margaf77
join:2000-12-22
Bayonne, NJ
 ·Optimum Online
 ·Verizon FIOS
·RoadRunner Cable
| said by sonicmerlin :I suspected you would respond only to my last paragraph. You argue that very rich people invest their wealth back into the economy, but are opposed to a proposition that would guarantee that reinvestment. You would prefer we leave it up to the general goodwill of super rich human beings to not simply horde money. Interesting. What really needs to be done is undo what Reagan did for the wealthy in cutting the tax rate on the wealthiest in this country. It did not trickle down at all, what it did was allow the Paris Hiltons of the world to exist. | |
| | | | | | | | | | | fiberguy
My views are my own.
Premium
join:2005-05-20
| Re: what a joke.. Ask yourself.. how much does texting drop your reliance on using your air time minutes? ... when you figure that out, adding up the number of texts you use (which stop you from having to call) then tell me if you think the $20 fee is unreasonable on your overall bill.
And, Sprint has much cheaper text plans.. thank god for competition. | |
| | | | | | | margaf77
join:2000-12-22
Bayonne, NJ
·Optimum Online
·Verizon FIOS
·RoadRunner Cable
| Re: what a joke.. said by fiberguy :Ask yourself.. how much does texting drop your reliance on using your air time minutes? ... when you figure that out, adding up the number of texts you use (which stop you from having to call) then tell me if you think the $20 fee is unreasonable on your overall bill. And, Sprint has much cheaper text plans.. thank god for competition. It doesnt and it saves me nothing. It is unreasonable and a fleecing of the consumer. | |
| | | | | | | | fiberguy
My views are my own.
Premium
join:2005-05-20
| Re: what a joke.. I simply call foul on your post... my comment was infallible. If you send any text messages that save you from making a phone call using any of your air time minutes, that gets your point across, then it is saving you plenty.
As you want to say "It is unreasonable and a fleecing of the consumer." which is SIMPLE to state, how about put some meat behind that comment and explain.. otherwise, I can only see your reply as a baseless rant. | |
| | | | | | | | | margaf77
join:2000-12-22
Bayonne, NJ | Re: what a joke.. ITs all been said already so Im not going to restate the facts for people who just refuse to acknowledge them. | |
| | | | | | | | | | fiberguy
My views are my own.
Premium
join:2005-05-20
| Re: what a joke.. said by margaf77 :ITs all been said already so Im not going to restate the facts for people who just refuse to acknowledge them. .. just as you are now.. pot - meet the black kettle. Sending texts is a form of communication that replaced the need to dial digits, hit send, blab, hit end. All those text messages, if not sent, are likely to result in a phone call instead.
And THAT is a fact... you're just being ingnat. | |
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DannyTank
@co.za
| Well, I use a much better 'plan' that saves me from the whole 20c-per-text problem. StraightTalk is a prepaid offer from Tracfone which gives 1000 minutes, 1000 texts and 30mb data for $30. You could break it down as 2c per minute, 1c per text and free data thrown in, I guess. Works for me. | |
| | | | | djhexer
join:2002-10-07
Sparks, NV
| said by bjack :Who do you work for??? That has nothing to do with you. This site has so many cry babies who think everything should be free and complain about spending money. IF YOU DON'T LIKE TO SPEND MONEY THEN DON'T TEXT... MANY UNLIMITED PLANS ARE $10 and by the way, for $5 you can get plenty of texts per month My question is how could they start charging for something that was free all along?? I remember SMS 1st came out and no one was using it and it was included for FREE on my cell plan (both incoming and outgoing) now they decide hey this is popular let's rip the consumer off by charging 20 cents per msg or 30.00 a month for unlimited
It has nothing to do with trying to get something for nothing. It's about if it was free all along why all of a sudden charge?? I see 5.00 a month is ok but 30???
I can see charging for data because it could hinder a network but SMS does NOT hinder anything??
If they are going to charge that much they could at least improve SMS by assuring the msg does get sent. I had delays of SMS from 2 hrs to 10 hrs. no joke | |
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Sandman5
Premium
join:2002-07-10
Brookline, MO
clubs:
| said by bjack :This site has so many cry babies who think everything should be free and complain about spending money. IF YOU DON'T LIKE TO SPEND MONEY THEN DON'T TEXT. ...and if you don't like "cry babies", then DON'T POST on the site anymore.
You sir, are rude.
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Rule #62: Don't take yourself so damn seriously! | |
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BF69
join:2004-07-28
Camden, TN
| said by bjack :MANY UNLIMITED PLANS ARE $10 and by the way, for $5 you can get plenty of texts per month LINK. because you lie. | |
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crookedtrails
@mindspring.com
| We are not arguing it should be free, but at least closer to what ACTUAL costs for the service are, especially considering these companies are using leased wireless spectrum's that are technically owned by the American people, and as such, we deserve the right to either limit their gauging of American's, or increase competition by opening more spectrum to new networks, either way decreasing their ability to charge what they do. | |
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Jason Levine
Premium
join:2001-07-13
USA
| Verizon Wireless charges $5 extra if you want to upgrade to unlimited texting. Of course, that's $5 per phone, per month. My wife and I considered it and decided that we'd rather spend the $120 a year elsewhere than on texting.
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-Jason Levine
Support a children's charity. Buy a calendar and/or a photo book. Shooting For A Cause | |
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Jason Levine
Premium
join:2001-07-13
USA
1 edit | Re: what a joke.. I just checked Verizon Wireless' website and it looks like you're right. They used to be $5 more per phone per month to add unlimited texting, but I can't find any reference to that now. Instead, it looks like you need to upgrade plans at a cost of $15 per phone per month. If we thought $5/phone/month was too pricey, why the hell would we pay $15? I can think of a lot of things I'd rather do with that $360 per year!
EDIT: They still have the $5 plan but it is for 250 messages now. 500 messages is $10/month, 1500 is $15/month, and 5,000 is $20/month.
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-Jason Levine
Support a children's charity. Buy a calendar and/or a photo book. Shooting For A Cause | |
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See 16 replies to this post | |
| | k1ll3rdr4g0n
join:2005-03-19
Homer Glen, IL
1 edit | said by bjack :Bend over? If five dollar a month to send unlimited messages to anybody in the word all day any day with amazing reliability is being bent over, man you are a baby! The way I see it is that people bitch and moan about little things, but they forget the fact that cell phones have completely changed the world...BECAUSE COMPANIES HAVE SPENT BILLIONS TO INVEST IN TOWERS, EQUIPMENT AND MAN HOURS... to have high quality networks for people to be able to complain about 5 dollars a month. The way I see it, the money the companies make goes back into making investments into the network to allow for the reliability that if I send a quick message to someone from ANYWHERE that they will get it instantly. Have you even used text messaging? My texts are hit or miss, sometimes they go through sometimes they don't. Sometimes a friend gets a text weeks later, sometimes I get a text of theirs weeks later. It is the more unreliable service I have ever used. I don't think any company has a good enough network to be able to sit there and justify $20/month text messaging. The day I can walk in any location and still have full signal - then it would be worth it. | |
| | | 
en102
Canadian, eh?
join:2001-01-26
Valencia, CA | Those billions are spent for cellphones/wireless plans, and that cost should be absorbed and profited on at the basic plan level.
On a flip side... since I can pay --
Canada = Hollywood North | |
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snolsen
join:2004-01-10
Hanford, CA | Still waiting on which carrier has an unlimited text plan for $5. Oh, and it has to be world wide.
Thank you very much for your advance knowledge. | |
| | bjack
join:2006-01-30
Reading, MA | what happened to my comment - are these filtered?? | |
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jwersan
R.I.P. Mom, Brian, Ziggy, and Max.
Premium
join:2004-12-20
Port Jefferson Station, NY
clubs: | Re: what a joke.. Yes. | |
| | | Skippy25
join:2000-09-13
Hazelwood, MO | Yes there is a stupidity filter.
Unfortunately it is not 100% reliable and idiots still get to post here. | |
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mrkevin
Knowledge comes, but wisdom lingers.
Premium
join:2007-08-07
Aurora, ME
clubs: | Re: what a joke.. OMG! thats funny!!!! | |
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jmn1207
Premium
join:2000-07-19
Reston, VA | Re: These aren't the droids you're looking for Isn't there some kind of site rule against having two consecutive posts from users with Yoda as their avatars? Mods?!?  | |
| | | jimbo2150
join:2004-05-10
Youngstown, OH | Re: These aren't the droids you're looking for Actually, I think the third person with a Star Wars avatar should be deleted!
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- "Techie" Jim | |
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SLD
Premium
join:2002-04-17 | Are you and gball brothers? | |
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Matt
Take me down to the paradise city
Premium
join:2003-07-20
Jamestown, NC
·North State Commun..
| Re: These aren't the droids you're looking for said by SLD :Are you and gball brothers? Aren't we all brothers and sisters somewhere down the family tree?  | |
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pnh102
Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty
Premium
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD |  Yawn
If you think SMS pricing is a ripoff, then tell AT&T you want them blocked. Done.
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Blagojevich / Madoff 2012! | |
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See 36 replies to this post | |
FastiBook
join:2003-01-08
Newtown, PA
·Verizon FIOS
| Text. Texting should be a flat unlimited 5 or 10 dollar fee, 5 for individual, 10 for family 3 lines and 12 for family 5 lines.
I am paying 30 dollars a month for data times 2, least they could do is throw in free texting or discounted texting. Jeeze.
- A
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LETS GO METS! | |
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Homer J
Mmmm, Free Goo
join:2000-10-05
Springfield | Re: Text. We pay $30x2 to Sprint for data on both phone and it includes unlimited text messages. | |
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Noah Vail
Premium
join:2004-12-10
Lorton, VA
·RoadRunner Cable
| Re: Text. said by Homer J :We pay $30x2 to Sprint for data on both phone and it includes unlimited text messages. Ditto here. Sprint - $30 Data(no cap), unlimited txt'ng, tethering OK.
They get you on forwarding your calls, though. Hits hard if you use a visual voicemail service.
NV
--
In my perfect religion, a giant hole appears and sucks up all the lousy people.
I call it the Crapture. | |
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Bit
Premium
join:2009-02-19
00000 | Considering 500 messages use about the same amount of data as a 1 minute call, it should be far cheaper than that.
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POKE 65495,1 | |
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DaveNJ
No Fear
join:1999-09-01
New Jersey | same with caller id Caller id costs virtually nothing to provide yet the telcos charge for it. | |
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See 11 replies to this post | |
GenBlood
join:2005-04-14
Nashua, NH
| What a JOKE This is costing them nothing and we get screwed
Forget Congress they don't know nothing 
They are over paid paper pushers and take money
on the side and sell their vote to the highest $$$$
Congress needs reform ... an term limits need to be
put in place An stop this dog and pony show of
bring people in front of you ,,, You should investigate
them and check their books ... forget asking them
most likely they are going to lie anyway | |
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Bit
Premium
join:2009-02-19
00000
·VOIPo
·Cox HSI
1 edit | Wink wink collusion Much like the airlines, these wireless carriers, while not talking directly to each other, continue to hike prices and see what happens. And much like the airlines, when one hikes prices, so do the others. It has the same effect as collusion.
The insane pricing of texting is greed, pure and simple just like the number porting fees.
Yes, AT&T and others are free to put users over a barrel but they should be put on a public PR trial with the FCC doing to them what some state heath services to with tobacco (eg Truth campaign).
Shame these greedy whore telecoms into bringing prices more in line with what it costs to run with a nice margin (instead of obscene margin).
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POKE 65495,1 | |
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See 14 replies to this post | |
FastiBook
join:2003-01-08
Newtown, PA
·Verizon FIOS
| Off topic but related..... Where is iPhone os 3.0? Today is the day iPhone gets MMS functionality, but i cant seem to find anywhere to download it, no software updates aside from some apps that updated for the new os.....
Are they waiting for 9 am pacific time?
By the way, sms doesnt send songs, mms does (dunno who sends songs though, they take far too long). I wonder why they tried to confuse the 2. Lame. Give me my 5 dollar text plan!
- A
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LETS GO METS! | |
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gigahurtz
Premium
join:2001-10-20
Palm Coast, FL
clubs:
·Earthlink Cable Mo..
·VoicePulse
| Re: Off topic but related..... said by FastiBook :Where is iPhone os 3.0? Today is the day iPhone gets MMS functionality, but i cant seem to find anywhere to download it, no software updates aside from some apps that updated for the new os..... Are they waiting for 9 am pacific time? By the way, sms doesnt send songs, mms does (dunno who sends songs though, they take far too long). I wonder why they tried to confuse the 2. Lame. Give me my 5 dollar text plan! - A I have 3.0 installed ...
I was wondering when Apple would release it as well. They will probably release at a random time as there will be a surge of people trying to update. | |
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FastiBook
join:2003-01-08
Newtown, PA | Re: Off topic but related..... It took a while to get it all sorted, but i gotta say 3.0 blows my mind. Worth the hour of non-function from server busy-ness.
- A
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LETS GO METS! | |
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gigahurtz
Premium
join:2001-10-20
Palm Coast, FL
clubs:
·Earthlink Cable Mo..
·VoicePulse
| said by FastiBook :Where is iPhone os 3.0? Today is the day iPhone gets MMS functionality, but i cant seem to find anywhere to download it, no software updates aside from some apps that updated for the new os..... Are they waiting for 9 am pacific time? By the way, sms doesnt send songs, mms does (dunno who sends songs though, they take far too long). I wonder why they tried to confuse the 2. Lame. Give me my 5 dollar text plan! - A On the note of Apple 3.0 software, with the new push notification feature, free SMS applications from the iTunes store could get much more popular and allow for some to cancel their SMS all together (including me). | |
| | | 
Cheese
Premium
join:2003-10-26
Naples, FL
clubs: | Ummm ATT = Faulty | |
| |
funny
@McMaster.CA
| raise text pricing People are failing to grasp that although text messaging itself is a profit center, these carriers don't operate a zero overhead business model. I am sure if all of their employees agreed to work for free their pricing could be much more competitive. Same goes for the billions of dollars in infrastructure, maintenance and tower leases. | |
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gigahurtz
Premium
join:2001-10-20
Palm Coast, FL
clubs:
·Earthlink Cable Mo..
·VoicePulse
1 edit | Re: raise text pricing said by funny :
People are failing to grasp that although text messaging itself is a profit center, these carriers don't operate a zero overhead business model. I am sure if all of their employees agreed to work for free their pricing could be much more competitive. Same goes for the billions of dollars in infrastructure, maintenance and tower leases.
But our monthly plans and ridiculous fees that we pay don't help to cover those expenses right? | |
| | | fiberguy
My views are my own.
Premium
join:2005-05-20
| Re: raise text pricing Those 'monthly fees' are for an allotment of airtime. All those pesky and gouging SMS fees go into the greater scheme of things and help keep those "monthly fees" to a reasonable level.
I'm sure they could go back to $24.99 a month and then 25 cents per minute off peak, and 30 cents peak.. would that be more fair? | |
| | | |
Post Now
@sbcglobal.net | Re: raise text pricing said by fiberguy :would that be more fair? Yes | |
| | | | | fiberguy
My views are my own.
Premium
join:2005-05-20 | Re: raise text pricing We're talking about the rising cost of SMS, and you're saying that raising the cost of over all service is a better way to go?? .. or did you not understand what I was saying? | |
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jmn1207
Premium
join:2000-07-19
Reston, VA
·Verizon FIOS
|  That's Too Much, Take Some Money Back
The price of SMS messaging service is being set by what the market will bear. Since all of the corporations involved essentially know how many resources it takes to provide SMS service, and because there is absolutely no product differentiation, the prices are not being set by individual sales from each company, but by industry-wide statistics. It's not due to some conspiracy or back room talks, the information necessary to create these prices is simple to derive.
This is why the prices are very similar across all major wireless carriers for this service, they are all using industry-wide statistics to create the price model. Because each company believes the other to be rational, while sharing similar goals, it is in none of their best interests to compete on SMS pricing, as this only hurts the bottom line for all parties involved.
This is simply tacit collusion, and there is nothing going on that is not part of the American Dream. I'd love to create and operate my own business where I sold products for an enormous profit if people were willing to pay me for it. There is nothing illegal going on here, it's just a result of having a relatively small number of major corporations with control of a particular market segment and having practically identical products to sell. In this case, SMS service.
I respect the government's interest as they play an integral role in our nation's economy, and they are responding to their constituents concerns, but this investigation will most certainly end up being a waste of time. | |
| | sonicmerlin
join:2009-05-24
Cleveland, OH
| Re: That's Too Much, Take Some Money Back Um...you are aware that collusion of any sort, tacit included, is completely and utterly illegal right?
"Industry wide statistics", huh? Well that's interesting. Industry wide, text messaging is more expensive in the US than anywhere else in the world. In India, a 3rd-world country, it's completely free (except on New Year's or specific holidays where they charge a slight fee to manage network congestion).
Your version of the American Dream is laughable. Your understanding of economics is hilariously inadequate.
The American Dream revolves around a free market where competitors compete on price, cutting into their bottom lines resulting in the benefit of the average consumer. The "market" will bear anything when an oligopoly has control of it. Witness LCD prices and what they were like until the EU fined LCD makers billions for having illegal "crystal meetings" where they met to set artificially high prices for their products. | |
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jmn1207
Premium
join:2000-07-19
Reston, VA
·Verizon FIOS
| Re: That's Too Much, Take Some Money Back There are numerous oligopolies operating within the US. As long as they are not in direct communications and conspiring to set prices, there is nothing illegal about tacit collusion, as indicated by the reference link I provided.
Now, as in your LCD TV example, if it can be found that these wireless carrier conglomerates were conducting meetings and setting prices artificially high, than we are talking about a collusion of a completely different nature, and one that would warrant intervention and prosecution.
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| | | | sonicmerlin
join:2009-05-24
Cleveland, OH | Re: That's Too Much, Take Some Money Back Whether or not there is explicit communication is irrelevant. What matters is that a collusive agreement, however arrived at, can be sustained by the self-interest of the parties involved. | |
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jmn1207
Premium
join:2000-07-19
Reston, VA
·Verizon FIOS
| Re: That's Too Much, Take Some Money Back said by sonicmerlin :Whether or not there is explicit communication is irrelevant. What matters is that a collusive agreement, however arrived at, can be sustained by the self-interest of the parties involved. I'm not going to pretend that laws aren't being skirted because of technicalities, but a non-cooperative collusion developed by the utilization of independent business judgements is not going to be considered unlawful. It's still defined as a type of collusion in most economic models, but legally there is rarely enough proof to warrant anything more than a thorough investigation. | |
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Pizz
Hi
join:2000-10-27
Astoria, NY
·Verizon Online DSL
·RoadRunner Cable
| The American Dream - was for every race/creed/color/sex to come to this wonderful land and live peacefully, without having to worry about the persecution in their countries, in all facets of life.
What we have now turned into is this. A welfare state that cherry-picks which sect, gets help, which don't. Corporate Welfare, is just as bad as regular welfare. The foundation of this country wasn't to have 324324 billion corporations running our everyday lives, and making us a slave to their products. We the people, allowed to this happen over-time, because WE FORGOT THE AMERICAN DREAM.
Text messages/pay per byte billing/high taxes etc.. It's all happening because we the people, have allowed this to happen. Our entire system from the President down to the local gov's are filled with lawyer, corporate scum bags, who would sell their own mothers out for a nickel.
The reason why it's a waste of time, is because lobbyists have controlled our entire political system. Do some senate/house hearings once and awhile to make it seem like they 'care'. But in all reality, its just going to be business as usual.
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The more you talk, the less you listen. | |
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Corona
It's cool, I'm takin it back
Premium
join:2000-03-14
Aubrey, TX
| I just don't understand SMS/MMS is a service I find valuable. As a consumer, I decide to use this service daily. Because I find it valuable, I buy in bulk to maximize my spending dollar.
I pay $30 a month for my wife and I to have unlimited texting. Together, we use between 5000 and 6000 texts per month. That works out to be around half a cent per message. Seems like a good deal to me.
This just seems like common sense. Almost anything in today's market that you buy in a larger quantity usually works out to be a less costly unit price.
If I buy a package of "Big Red" gum at the checkout counter at Target, it costs me 25 cents. If I buy the package of 10 packs of the same gum, at the same store, it works out to be much less per pack.
As the consumer, I decide the price I want to pay based on how much of the product I want to buy at any given time.
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"To be sincere, you don't have to know anything, you just say whatever makes you feel good and spin and smug circles in your tiny fucked up little head, happy as long as you're true to yourself. In other words, Sincerity is bullshit!" -Penn Jillette | |
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jonnyz
Premium
join:2003-03-20
Canfield, OH
clubs:
·Armstrong Zoom In..
| Re: I just don't understand You have a huge flaw here: Wrigley doesn't tell you that regardless of what gum package you buy, you only have 30 days to chew it or it will "expire". If this was how SMS worked, people could buy bundles of 200 msgs for $5 and use them over any time period they see fit if they only sent/received a few texts a month, and heavy users could still buy a large monthly plan so that the cell companies still made a reasonable profit, not hundreds of percent more than the product being offered.
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Join the RC5 team. | |
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Corona
It's cool, I'm takin it back
Premium
join:2000-03-14
Aubrey, TX
| Re: I just don't understand I do like the rollover idea, in fact, I have that on my voice minutes.
I would hope given the popularity of voice rollover minutes with their customers, that AT&T might consider a similar package option with regards to SMS/MMS.
However, I don't believe that any carrier should be mandated to that type of plan by any government agency.
I am guessing AT&T did it because it made sense for them as a business to offer it with voice. No other carriers that I'm aware of offer rollover of any type.
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"To be sincere, you don't have to know anything, you just say whatever makes you feel good and spin and smug circles in your tiny fucked up little head, happy as long as you're true to yourself. In other words, Sincerity is bullshit!" -Penn Jillette | |
| moonpuppy
join:2000-08-21
Glen Burnie, MD
·Verizon Online DSL
| Do lawyers think people are stupid? First off, do not deny the price has not gone up when it has. Seriously, you announced the price hikes yourself so denying them is beyond stupidity.
Now, if you really want to play with numbers, give out how many text messages are sent and how much people actually pay for them. Yes, there will be some thay pay full price but some will not.
Let's use T-Mobile as an example. They have 3 plans for regular phones:
$4.99 for 300 txts ($0.016 per text)
$9.99 for 1000 txts ($0.010 per text)
$14.99 for unlimited
Normally for those without a plan, it is $0.20 per text.
If you sent or received 25 texts per month, you would pay for the $4.99 plan. At 50 texts, you reached the $9.99 plan. Anything over that, you hit the $14.99 plan which would equal at least 75 messages a month.
This is all about selling plans and hoping people do not use them.
If they wanted people to feel ANY pity for them, they should drag out the real numbers of how many are sent or received and how much they actually charged for them. Look at the example of Paige Horne and her 15,000 texts a month. I wonder what her cell phone company thinks of her. | |
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jmn1207
Premium
join:2000-07-19
Reston, VA
·Verizon FIOS
| Re: Do lawyers think people are stupid? I believe the spin on their argument for lower effective pricing is based on the amount of revenues generated from SMS service based on the total number of messages being sent.
Basically, they claim that something like $100 million was made and 200 million SMS messages were sent before, and now they make $500 million while 2 billion messages are being sent. By their reasoning, it only costs the consumer half as much for each SMS message being sent today, as compared to yesteryear.*
*These numbers are not real, I just used them as a convenient example. | |
| | | AstroBoy
join:2008-08-08
Parkville, MD | Re: Do lawyers think people are stupid? I send about 10 messages per month. My cost per message has gone up! | |
| | 
NetAdmin
CCNA
join:2008-05-22
| I text so infrequently that I don't even pay for a plan. I might send 50 text messages a year, so in my case, I would be a moron to pay for an unlimited texting plan.
Its like the phone service at my house. Why pay $30+ for unlimited local and long distance when I end up paying less per month paying by the minute?
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"This is a bus. You know how big a bus is?" | |
| | 
sivran
Long Live The Suite
Premium
join:2003-09-15
Arlington, TX
clubs:
·RoadRunner Cable
| Yes, let's use T-Mo.
Sidekick Prepaid plan:
$1/day for unlimited text, email, web browsing, anything and everything that is not talktime.
Talktime: 15c/min. (ouch)
It's back-asswards from everything else, but it's perfect for me.
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The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no warrants shall issue, but upon profitable cause... | |
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n2jtx
join:2001-01-13
Glen Head, NY
·Optimum Online
| Pay for Protection "The faulty notion that prices for text messaging have risen derives from an unduly narrow interest in the trend of a single pricing option for text messaging services, the pay-per-use option, when the vast majority of AT&T's customers do not choose that option." It was this very notion that caused me to have SMS turned off on my account. I did not use it enough to justify buying a bucket of messages "for price protection" and the few messages I might inadvertently get could easily jack my bill up to unacceptable levels at $.20 for each message sent or received. $.05 was fine and I did send a few messages but stopped when the incessant prices rises kicked in.
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I support the right to keep and arm bears. | |
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realworldsure
@charter.com
| These people make no sense. quote:
Applied to real world bandwidth, sending 2560 songs via 160 byte SMS would cost an estimated $61,356,851.20
How man real world phones can send real world songs over SMS? Last time I checked stuff like this goes via MMS which is clearly not on the "secondary channels" anyway. I guess they can get away with what they want in front of congress. These numbers go down to the cents so it has to be a good real world figure.
On the other hand, if you buy a pack of 500 messages for $5 and send 500 pictures at 200kb each thats 100MB of data for only $5. Using the figures above though, it be about 20 songs @ 5MB each or 20/2560 of the "estimated cost" or $479,350. All that for $5! A discount of $479,345??? This looks like A GREAT DEAL! *Rolls eyes* | |
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notyours
@mycingular.net
| Quit whining and pay for the service you use. SMS cost virtually nothing?
Um yeah..
I guess the tower leases are free,
the spectrum is free,
handset subsidies are free,
antennas are free,
cables running down the tower are free,
equipment at the base of the tower is free,
the T1s servicing the sites are free,
fuel for the backup generator is free,
electricity is free,
the cable to get your call back to the office is free,
the computers in the office to route your call are free,
the T1's to route your call back out are free,
all of the same equipment at the other site is free,
cell site techs work for free,
digital techs (works on the T1s) work for free,
office techs work for free,
vehicles for the field techs are free,
fuel for those vehicles is free,
tools are free,
training for the techs is free,
customer service reps work for free,
your bills are free to print,
postage for your bills is free,
payment processing centers are free.
Try applying your "spare space on a secondary control channel" argument to the airline industry and see if you can get a free ride in a spare seat because the plane was going to fly no matter what you paid for or have not paid for.
It costs a lot of money to build, operate, and maintain this network and it is supported by SMS charges. If the carriers stopped charging for them, the cost to run the network would remain the same so they would have to raise the voice and data rates to make up for the loss. | |
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Hearing should have been refered to as a Pig Party!
The wireless pigs seem to have unlimited greed. Consider that Verizon claims to have Twenty Million Customers. They charge each customer an $0.89 Administrative Charge. That nets them about $17,800,000.00 per month for an undisclosed fee. That works out to $213,600,000.00 per year. If the Wireless pigs can coerce customers into paying $20.00 per month for a text messaging package by charging high fees for individual text messages, they have just hijacked the gravy train.