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Comments on news posted 2010-09-15 11:07:28: According to the New York Daily News, Time Warner Cable and Cablevision have agreed to spend $10 million to provide WiFi service in 32 New York City parks in exchange for a ten year franchise extension. ..

page: 1 · 2 · next

Bobcat79
Premium
join:2001-02-04
reply to k1ll3rdr4g0n

Re: Profit in the parks

Neither hot dogs nor bandwidth is free.


talz13

join:2006-03-15
Avon, OH
reply to k1ll3rdr4g0n

said by k1ll3rdr4g0n:

ISP's do NOT pay per amount of data, they pay for the speed of data (assuming they don't have a backbone of some kind).
I thought they only paid for the amount of data, not necessarily the speed.

chimera

join:2009-06-09
Washington, DC
reply to Bobcat79

Those vendors pay the city for the right to sell in the park. TW isn't being charged for this by the city.


NyNexit

join:2009-11-01
Huntington, NY

harsh reality

Why do so many people insist on everything being free on the internet? If you don't want to pay ONE DOLLAR, then conduct your internet related business at home before you leave for the park. DONE, end of story.
Nothing is free, and it shouldn't be. If the cable companies are willing to light up 32 parks, they should at-least recoup their equipment,labor and up-keep investment.
If you don't want to pay a dollar to surf the web in the park on a nice day, then pay $4 for a latte, sit at a tiny wobbly table and get online that way, or go to the library. Better yet get a JOB.
The funny thing is, I'll bet the same people who complain about paying a dollar for Wi-Fi, are the same people with overpriced phones and data plans.
-Sorry had to get that out.



cabana
Department of Adjustments
Premium,Mod
join:2000-07-07
New York, NY
reply to elray

Park - novel idea - how about go there to get away from wireless

sigh ... I like to be as connected as the next person. It is annoying enough when I visit the park to have to seek out places where I am not sitting next to "she who must spill all of her gripes at the top of her lungs" cellphone girl - or "he who must yell at subordinate for not pulling his weight" cellphone man - or "she who must yell at her boyfriend for fill in the blank" cellphone woman.

While you do see laptops now - most people seem to get - parks should be a haven to get away a bit. With wireless I guess that means even more people will be toting all sorts of this and that on their "picnic" blanket.

I look forward to seeing someone perched in a tree with the laptop up there

Yes ... I know this is not the point of the conversation ... and Yes ... I know "bizness" ... is business ... but I am annoyed anyway


majortom1029

join:2006-10-19
Lindenhurst, NY
kudos:1

1 edit

hmm

I know everybody is PRO FIOS around here and bashes the cablecompanies every chance they get but how come this part was left out?

"In addition to WiFi, the cable companies agreed to provide more than $30 million in new upgrades to the city's communications infrastructure and to increase the number of Public, Educational and Government (PEG) Channels available on their systems to 17 from nine.

Time Warner also agreed to set up 40 community broadband access centers in local neighborhoods, while Cablevision agreed to work with the Department of Education to establish media centers in certain public schools.

"

Timewarner and cablevision as part of the deal will help upgrade The cities communications infrastructure for the city government, aand education .


ernstk

join:2001-05-08
Middle Village, NY

Fee waived for TW/CV subscribers

nycwireless.net has the Cable Franchise Media Briefing and it says there on page one (right after the 99 cent bit):
"Fee waived entirely for TW/CV broadband subscribers"
Klaus Ernst NYC


patcat88

join:2002-04-05
Jamaica, NY
kudos:1
reply to majortom1029

Re: hmm

Since thats the typical municipal extortion of cable companies.



Simba7
I Void Warranties

join:2003-03-24
Billings, MT

2 edits
reply to Bobcat79

Re: Profit in the parks

said by Bobcat79:

Neither hot dogs nor bandwidth is free.
I'm sure the ISP's can squeeze at least 1Mbps from their Tb/sec backbone.

..not to mention most ISPs get a discount for getting a huge pipe. What frustrates me is some charge by the byte when they're getting charged by the speed.


CrazyFingers

join:2003-10-01
Columbia, MO

1 edit
reply to chimera

And the hot dog vendors don't give away three free hot dogs per person per month.
Apples to oranges.



jslik
That just happened
Premium
join:2006-03-17
reply to patcat88

Re: hmm

Do you want government run more like a business or not? Shouldn't any property owner at least try to maximize the amount of compensation for use of their property, especially when approached by a multi-billion dollar corporation?
--
If they told you wolverines make good house pets, would you believe them?



fifty nine

join:2002-09-25
Sussex, NJ
kudos:2

said by jslik:

Do you want government run more like a business or not? Shouldn't any property owner at least try to maximize the amount of compensation for use of their property, especially when approached by a multi-billion dollar corporation?
The Government does not own utility easements. Those of us who own real property do.

Therefore you as a private land owner cannot negotiate with utility companies to provide service. It has to be done through the franchising authority. So essentially the Gov't decides how your property is used and you have little to no choice in the matter. Get it?

tmc8080

join:2004-04-24
Brooklyn, NY
Reviews:
·ooma
·Optimum Online
·Verizon FiOS
reply to NyNexit

Re: harsh reality

said by NyNexit:

Why do so many people insist on everything being free on the internet? If you don't want to pay ONE DOLLAR, then conduct your internet related business at home before you leave for the park. DONE, end of story.
Nothing is free, and it shouldn't be. If the cable companies are willing to light up 32 parks, they should at-least recoup their equipment,labor and up-keep investment.
If you don't want to pay a dollar to surf the web in the park on a nice day, then pay $4 for a latte, sit at a tiny wobbly table and get online that way, or go to the library. Better yet get a JOB.
The funny thing is, I'll bet the same people who complain about paying a dollar for Wi-Fi, are the same people with overpriced phones and data plans.
-Sorry had to get that out.
My point earlier wasn't about getting something for free.. it's about the exchange of goods and services in kind. Cablevision and Time Warner haver a LOCK on lots of NON-FIOS deployed regions of NYC for 10 YEARS in exchange for what amounts to chicken feed... no doubt NYC gets to charge some money too as part of the cable-tv bill per "HEAD" in addition, but could have gotten unlimited used in the parks instead of limited usage. Deals of these kinds are called CROSS SUBSIDY whereby neither party has to spend oodles of money to promote one another. The upkeep of WIFI cable-modem hotspots isn't really that expensive once the initial investments are in place. It's usually a bank of about 4-20 wifi endabled cablemodems on 4-10 channels depending upon geogrpahy covered. Nevertheless the wifi deployed is the CHEAPER "G" variety as well so costs are coming down between $20 - $40 per cablemodem/wifi-g combo unit compared with $60 - $300 upto 5 years ago in volumes.

If we look around.. Verizon isn't exactly falling all over themsleves to DOLE-OUT free wifi across NYC any time soon to cannibalize the nascent WIRELESS BROADBAND they charge for.

The notion of giving anything away for free anymore means it must not be good or has this conservative leaning negative connotation of socialism attached to it. Let's face it, Bloomberg woudln't allow that kind of socialism to rear it's head in NYC any time soon-- there always had to be a catch.

We're entering a new cycle in which the big chill in the political climate moves on to invade/infect the ECONOMIC CLIMATE. Started about 2007ish and gearing up for a "Heck of a 2011"


n2jtx

join:2001-01-13
Glen Head, NY
reply to Nick

Re: Probably free for subscribers

Confirmed over at CED magazine. Free to subscribers.

»www.cedmagazine.com/News-Time-Wa···510.aspx
--
I support the right to keep and arm bears.



jslik
That just happened
Premium
join:2006-03-17

1 edit
reply to fifty nine

Re: hmm

What are you talking about? You own the street in front of your house?

Easement: An easement is the right to use the real property of another without possessing it. Easements are helpful for providing pathways across two or more pieces of property.

Public right of way: Public right of way is not restricted by land ownership and grants travel access to all.

And yes, you do negotiate with the provider for service on your property via the franchised service in the ROW.

--
If they told you wolverines make good house pets, would you believe them?



squirrel83
cheers

join:2005-05-02
Honolulu, HI

google free wifi

hasn't google had free wifi in central park for years?



heat84
Bit Torrent Apologist

join:2004-03-11
Fort Lauderdale, FL

1 edit

MAC address Spoofing?

I'm sure you could do that and get as much free usage as you want. Though I guess you'd have to do it every 10 minutes which could get annoying.



WHT

join:2010-03-26
Rosston, TX
kudos:5
reply to Bobcat79

Re: Profit in the parks

said by Bobcat79:

Neither hot dogs nor bandwidth is free.
Nice play on "Animals and proles are free." Thumbs up.

k1ll3rdr4g0n

join:2005-03-19
Homer Glen, IL
reply to Bobcat79

said by Bobcat79:

Neither hot dogs nor bandwidth is free.
Did I say it was? No.
Please reread my post.


FastiBook

join:2003-01-08
Newtown, PA

No thanks!

I prefer real free wifi.

- A
--
LETS GO METS!



tubbynet
reminds me of the danse russe
Premium,MVM
join:2008-01-16
Chandler, AZ
kudos:1
reply to Simba7

Re: Profit in the parks

said by Simba7:

I'm sure the ISP's can squeeze at least 1Mbps from their Tb/sec backbone.
thats quite a bit of a stretch -- considering that if a transit backbone is using something like packet over sonet links, technology only exists for n*oc768 (~40gbps). 40gbe and 100gbe are still in the pipeline and have not been standardized yet.

q.
--
"...if I in my north room dance naked, grotesquely before my mirror waving my shirt round my head and singing softly to myself..."


tubbynet
reminds me of the danse russe
Premium,MVM
join:2008-01-16
Chandler, AZ
kudos:1
reply to k1ll3rdr4g0n

said by k1ll3rdr4g0n:

ISP's do NOT pay per amount of data, they pay for the speed of data (assuming they don't have a backbone of some kind)
if an isp has a backbone -- transit is free, but the peering is not. the transit path simply allows them to carry data where cheap peering is available (or to provide "in house transit" to different nap's in the country).
at the end of the day -- if the destination resides out of the control of the isp's network, then traffic will have to be handed off to another carrier -- sometimes at a cost. depending on the size of the carrier, traffic agreements, load sharing, etc, the peering may be "free" since the two peers will come to an agreement that traffic will be roughly equal and differences split at the end of the quarter/half/year, etc (generally true for tier-1 access). however, if the isp is a residential access network that is not an old lec (i.e. your mso's) and they don't have a significant userbase from which to draw destination traffic from -- they will probably end up paying for throughput in one way or another (something like 95th percentile or so).

q.
--
"...if I in my north room dance naked, grotesquely before my mirror waving my shirt round my head and singing softly to myself..."


Simba7
I Void Warranties

join:2003-03-24
Billings, MT
reply to tubbynet

said by tubbynet:

thats quite a bit of a stretch -- considering that if a transit backbone is using something like packet over sonet links, technology only exists for n*oc768 (~40gbps). 40gbe and 100gbe are still in the pipeline and have not been standardized yet.
I meant multiple redundant backbones. Some of the larger ISP's (or backbone providers) usually have several.

..and that's 40GbE on a single link. We all know that a fiber bundle usually has several tens/hundreds of them.

Also, 40GbE and 100GbE are official. »en.wikipedia.org/wiki/100_Gigabit_Ethernet
--
Bresnan 18M/1M
MyWS[E5200@3.75GHz,4GB RAM,2x1TB HDDs,Win7]
WifeWS[A64@2GHz,2GB RAM,120GB HDD,Win7]
Router[2xP3@1GHz,512MB RAM,18GB HDD,SMC 8432BTA,2xDigital DE504,Compaq NC3131,Intel Pro/1000MT,IBM Gigabit Ethernet-SX,Allied Telesyn AT2560FX,Gentoo Linux]


dvd536
as Mr. Pink as they come
Premium
join:2001-04-27
Phoenix, AZ
kudos:4

30 minutes/month

LOL what a joke!



SSidlov
Other Things On My Mind
Premium
join:2000-03-03
Pompton Lakes, NJ
reply to cabana

Re: Park - novel idea - how about go there to get away from wire

@cabana:

Sigh, this could be true, and everyone can always turn off their devices or put them on silent.

But this is NY the city that never sleeps whose employers are tracking your position and availability with that blackberry or other phone they gave you.

And for the private citizen? ATT et al are screwing you on the data rates, so some more free wifi or more wifi hotspots if you're a TWC/CV/CC customer is a good thing.
--
»www.Warpstock.org



SSidlov
Other Things On My Mind
Premium
join:2000-03-03
Pompton Lakes, NJ
reply to fifty nine

Re: Cable firms pay 5% of gross revenue

Cable TV service does pay franchise fees. And in most home/apts around here that's $50-100 a month once the deals run out. A few years ago an audit showed that TWC applied the fee incorrectly and NYC got an extra $7mill payment.

»www.nyc.gov/html/doitt/html/busi···le.shtml
--
»www.Warpstock.org



SSidlov
Other Things On My Mind
Premium
join:2000-03-03
Pompton Lakes, NJ
reply to jslik

Re: hmm

said by jslik:

Do you want government run more like a business or not?
Hmmm. Do I want to be screwed more soundly by government...... You know anything that they collect from businesses is just passed on to the consumer (you and me) and since they would have greater independent income streams from franchises, and whatever tax (call it what you will) they impose on business, you won't have as much control over budget and spending via the voting process since they can setup each fee, etc for a specific purpose (e.g lottery ticket sales).

So is a good government one that imposes no direct tax on it's citizens but taxes businesses only which then add the additional fees, etc plus 10% (in the old time & materials plus 10% model which today is at least 18% and more likely more) onto the consumer?
--
»www.Warpstock.org


SSidlov
Other Things On My Mind
Premium
join:2000-03-03
Pompton Lakes, NJ
reply to dvd536

Re: 30 minutes/month

said by dvd536:

LOL what a joke!
The service they offer is already 3mb service. And you should take a look at the map of the area it covers across 3 states. »optimum.net/WiFi/Find and 60% of the population in that area? They get it without extra charges.
--
»www.Warpstock.org


tubbynet
reminds me of the danse russe
Premium,MVM
join:2008-01-16
Chandler, AZ
kudos:1
reply to Simba7

Re: Profit in the parks

said by Simba7:

..and that's 40GbE on a single link. We all know that a fiber bundle usually has several tens/hundreds of them.
but the fiber bundle may or may not carry all of the same isp's transit traffic. the issue with having several hundred strands per bundle, is the optics, linecards, chassis, and management to be able to handle all of said terminations. at the current packet over sonet max rate -- thats still a bundle of 25 sets of strands. not saying it doesn't happen -- but thats quite a stretch to say that it *always* happens.

Also, 40GbE and 100GbE are official. »en.wikipedia.org/wiki/100_Gigabit_Ethernet
yes -- as of 17 june 2010. show me a manufacturer that has done more than demo their phy and show me a kit maker that has 40gbe or 100gbe running currently in a box for sale.

q.
--
"...if I in my north room dance naked, grotesquely before my mirror waving my shirt round my head and singing softly to myself..."


jslik
That just happened
Premium
join:2006-03-17
reply to SSidlov

Re: hmm

Your example assumes the savings from reduced/eliminated government fees/charges in a cable franchise would be passed along. Recent history would show that not to be the case in many statewide franchising examples or the elimination of franchise fees for cable modem service.

Cable companies take into effect all charges when setting their price points - so elimination of a particular cost wouldn't necessary mean that the price point drops.
--
If they told you wolverines make good house pets, would you believe them?