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Comments on news posted 2011-12-29 14:39:30: For more than a year we've noted that with the exception of markets that have signed franchise obligations (New York, Washington DC, Philadelphia), Verizon's fiber to the home FiOS build is essentially over. ..

page: 1 · 2 · 3 · next


JasonOD

@comcast.net

FIOS was never going to be pofitable for most.....

of their customer footprint. How could it be, even DSL over existing copper isn't profitable or even available in all areas. Whether or not they had to 'give up FIOS' as part of the LTE deal with cableco's, VZ didn't give up anything they hadn't already planned.

Os

join:2011-01-26
US
Reviews:
·Comcast

2 recommendations

Not VZ, but someone else?

Fiber is the future. And short-sighted money grabs are what the legacy telcos and cablecos have sought out.

While DOCSIS 3.0 is very capable, I think the market will be there for FTTH and if Verizon/AT&T/Comcast aren't interested in bringing it, they run the risk of being displaced out of the market by someone else.

Companies have done this for years. Think short-term, lose long-term. This is why always being pressured by Wall Street has sunk a lot of companies. They want to milk existing industries for all they're worth, but never invest in what's new. Imagine if Sears got into discounting, Kodak into digital photography, Blockbuster came up with streaming first. Companies that have been deemed irrelevant by a changing world could have embedded themselves for future generations.

The only difference is that telcos and cablecos have the advantage of government largely colluding to protect them. That's why some of these things are so alarming in this industry.


JRW2
R.I.P. Mom, Brian, Ziggy, Max and Zen.
Premium
join:2004-12-20
La La Land
kudos:5
Reviews:
·Optimum Online

Dumb move, it will cost them.

The original idea to convert the copper to fiber was a bold move, and pure genius. It took someone who thought out farther than five years and could see the savings they were buying to make this decision.
Sadly, the rest of those in charge were not.

Canceling the FIOS roll-outs will cost them in the future, more than it would have had they continued.

LTE may be cheaper now, but it is going to cost them in the near future to stay with broadband trends for more speeds.
--
Politics is a disease, we need a cure!
In constant search for intelligent life on Earth!


FFH5
Premium
join:2002-03-03
Tavistock NJ
kudos:5

Fine print of deal will eventually come out anyway

»Does Verizon Cable Deal Spell Death of FiOS Expansion?
quote:
I'll assume that neither cable operators or Verizon are going to let us see the deal fine print to confirm the Times guess, but the logic fits Verizon's strategy
The details of the deal will eventually come out. Either thru DOJ looking at deal for anti-trust oversight, or because some 3rd party will file a civil anti-trust lawsuit against the deal. Legal discovery results will eventually be made public by court order or will be leaked.
--
The nine most terrifying words in the English language are, I'm from the government and I'm here to help.
»www.politico.com/2012-election/



JRW2
R.I.P. Mom, Brian, Ziggy, Max and Zen.
Premium
join:2004-12-20
La La Land
kudos:5
Reviews:
·Optimum Online

1 recommendation

reply to Os

Re: Not VZ, but someone else?

said by Os:

Fiber is the future.

YEP!

Companies have done this for years. Think short-term, lose long-term. This is why always being pressured by Wall Street has sunk a lot of companies. They want to milk existing industries for all they're worth, but never invest in what's new.

This will cost Verizon more than they hope to save.

BTW, this is the mentality that is KILLING this country...
--
Politics is a disease, we need a cure!
In constant search for intelligent life on Earth!


JRW2
R.I.P. Mom, Brian, Ziggy, Max and Zen.
Premium
join:2004-12-20
La La Land
kudos:5
Reviews:
·Optimum Online
reply to FFH5

Re: Fine print of deal will eventually come out anyway

said by FFH5:

The details of the deal will eventually come out. Either thru DOJ looking at deal for anti-trust oversight, or because some 3rd party will file a civil anti-trust lawsuit against the deal. Legal discovery results will eventually be made public by court order or will be leaked.

By then it may be too late...
--
Politics is a disease, we need a cure!
In constant search for intelligent life on Earth!

voipnpots

join:2011-10-13
USA

Is Comcast on top now?

Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't this mean that Comcast is the only true winner here for the time being? U-verse's technology doesn't compare, and Verizon has stopped building. Other cable companies like Brighthouse, etc. are not nearly as big as the others (at&t, Verizon, Comcast).

Comcast has had the largest chunk of the market for a while, but this move by Verizon makes it definite that Comcast will be #1 for a while (availability/popularity wise).


88615298
Premium
join:2004-07-28
West Tenness

FCC will kill this deal

The FCC will allow Verizon to buy the spectrum and that's it. All of this side deal shit will NOT be allowed.


MovieLover76

join:2009-09-11
kudos:1

1 recommendation

This is all theoretical

The reason FIOS stopped the buildout is simple, their market penetration was too low in existing markets, I'm a lucky one and FIOS is available where I live, and I can tell you this, it's happening but one by one friends and family are switching to FIOS, because they hate the cable companies (Comcast and Cablevision in my area) crappy service, market penetration will increase and it may take a long time years and years before Verizon restarts the deployment but I think it will happen, DOCSIS 3.0 can only go so far, and Verizon above all wants more of customers money, they may settle for a few more LTE customers through cable deals for a few years, but eventually when FIOS market penetration becomes high enough and they are making good money on FIOS, they will continue to deploy to markets that look profitable, Like Boston which never saw a deployment and other places like it.

If your in a rural area though don't expect it even then, I don't think they ever planned to expand there.

Os

join:2011-01-26
US
Reviews:
·Comcast
reply to voipnpots

Re: Is Comcast on top now?

This deal, if we read into it correctly, means that in many suburban/exurban/rural areas, Comcast, Time Warner and BrightHouse have been given exclusive status as a broadband provider. And there's still plenty of major cities where FiOS never got wired to all residences, and some like Baltimore and Boston, who didn't get it at all.

Verizon here offers 3 Mbps DSL max. What incentive does Atlantic Broadband have to ever upgrade the network here? The highest speed tier we have is 15/1.5. While some areas have seen D3 with ABB, we haven't. Think Verizon's lack of interest here is part of the reason why? I do.

big_e

join:2011-03-05
reply to voipnpots
Verizon doesn't want to be in the wireline tv/telephone/internet business anymore. Its not profitable enough. Wireless is the most profitable for Verizon's shareholders with multi-year contracts, high early termination fees and low usage caps.

tmc8080

join:2004-04-24
Brooklyn, NY
Reviews:
·ooma
·Optimum Online
·Verizon FiOS

1 recommendation

shakeout..

There is no guarantee that wireless will be this huge money maker that will be accepted as a 100% replacement for wireline. The only reason why someone might think this is the case is because there is a **POSSIBLE** scheme underway by AT&T and Comcast to NOT develop broadband so that wireless may flourish and companies can reap huge profits from a more "REAL" resource of scarcity (so the theory goes). Afterall, airwaves are more prescious than a virtually limitless swath of fiber optic cables, right?!

Let's see how long that lasts before consumers begin the drumbeat of pushing companies to do better or lose their exclusive duopoly / monopoly status. Wireless is NOT a replacement technology for landline/wireline.

Also, let us not forget these are the same greedy bastards behind trying to shape the internet for special interests like SOPA. With millions of FIOS customers at stake, I doubt Verizon wants to be associated with this kind of corruption in the ISP market.

voipnpots

join:2011-10-13
USA
reply to big_e

Re: Is Comcast on top now?

I wonder if Comcast will be in the wireless phone business someday...

Hopefully not, because I think "Xfinity Wireless" would fail miserably.

chgo_man99

join:2010-01-01
San Jose, CA

US as top wireless dog

The effect of those all politics will be, Europe has advanced wired connections, USA top wireless industry and Asian countries will have both.

In europe hspa+ dc took deployment in most places and caps come as high as 50 gb or even 80 gb. Some places have LTE already with similar enjoyable caps. And often offer fixed installation at homes like clearwire does here with WiMAX.

It will be interesting or not too see how the US will compete in the next few years. Even vdsl in most countries will have more capacity than what u-verse has here.


Bill Neilson
Premium
join:2009-07-08
Arlington, VA

Anyone see the letter that Verizon wrote back

to the NYT?

A Verizon person basically copy/pasted the same 3 lines that Verizon states (it brings more competition, lower prices, etc...) and that was it.

Nothing to back up the claims, nothing. Just the same sentences and that was it.

I honestly believe that Verizon has just given up trying to actually rationalize its decisions to consumers or really anyone outside its stockholders


dvd536
as Mr. Pink as they come
Premium
join:2001-04-27
Phoenix, AZ
kudos:4
reply to Os

Re: Not VZ, but someone else?

said by Os:

While DOCSIS 3.0 is very capable,

I don't see any cable provider even D3 ones offering 35mbps UPLOAD!
--
Oh YES! let me drop everything i'm doing regardless of who it affects to deal with your petty little problem!


verolom

join:2002-03-23
Reston, VA
reply to 88615298

Re: FCC will kill this deal

Yeah?! All of this side deal shit is just that, side deal. The FCC can't force VZ to continue deploying FiOS or even keep offering the service. Without this the cable co's would not sell the spectrum to VZ.


fifty nine

join:2002-09-25
Sussex, NJ
kudos:2
reply to dvd536

Re: Not VZ, but someone else?

said by dvd536:

said by Os:

While DOCSIS 3.0 is very capable,

I don't see any cable provider even D3 ones offering 35mbps UPLOAD!

The average home user doesn't need more than 1Mbps upload, if that much.

power users can get by with 10 or 15Mbps.


fifty nine

join:2002-09-25
Sussex, NJ
kudos:2
reply to 88615298

Re: FCC will kill this deal

said by 88615298:

The FCC will allow Verizon to buy the spectrum and that's it. All of this side deal shit will NOT be allowed.

But the FCC won't force them to expand.

FiOS is way too expensive anyway and is overkill for most home users.

Wilsdom

join:2009-08-06
reply to Os

Re: Is Comcast on top now?

Uncapped 3 Mbps DSL seems more like broadband than Comcast's 512 Kbps equivalent.

Os

join:2011-01-26
US
reply to Bill Neilson

Re: Anyone see the letter that Verizon wrote back

If a corporation says it enough, it must be true!

End result: Higher prices, monopoly power, and bought off politicians. A continuation of the status quo.


Union Buster

@verizon.net

Union killing

The cable deals are designed to kill the union.

Verizon will force the union to walk out again and use the cable companies to keep customers happy. Negotiations are going no where for a new contract. Verizon management could keep up with the work load of repairs and they did little to no installs and that is the real driving force behind the cable deals. Take or leave it I can care less.

Don't ask how I know, I just do.

34764170

join:2007-09-06
Etobicoke, ON

3 recommendations

reply to fifty nine

Re: Not VZ, but someone else?

said by fifty nine:

The average home user doesn't need more than 1Mbps upload, if that much.

power users can get by with 10 or 15Mbps.

and 640k is enough for everyone. Get real corporate shill.


cypherstream
Premium,MVM
join:2004-12-02
Reading, PA
kudos:3

1 recommendation

"This is FIOS, this is SMALL!"

That should be the taglines on the trucks since (in the grand scheme of things) they only cover a very SMALL footprint of the US.

Unless they can come with a more efficient way to deliver via some kind of wireless or magic DSL technology...

My area is a mere 30 minute drive from the closest Fios deployment. So yes, I've seen fios... but sadly will never get it at home. I don't even live in a bad area either.

That's too bad Verizon. Your loss. You could of had many more potential customers. If you build it, they will come. Unfortinately you won't build it. Verizon DSL tops out at 3mbps here. Cable is 50mbps on the top tier, and Comcast a mile away has a 105mbps package.

Seems like Fios is old news.


cypherstream
Premium,MVM
join:2004-12-02
Reading, PA
kudos:3
reply to fifty nine

Re: Not VZ, but someone else?

I guess you never had to upload batches of pictures or home videos to family members on photo / video sharing sites, or heck even facebook.

Today's high res cameras output some pretty sizeable files.

Mr Matt

join:2008-01-29
Eustis, FL
kudos:1
Reviews:
·Millenicom
·Embarq Now Centu..
·Comcast
·CenturyLink

Same old Crappola!

CenturyLink is our local Teleco. They are pitching Prism. All these schemes like U-Verse, FiOS and Prism appear to have the same problem, significant limitations as to the number of simultaneous channels that can be viewed. Prism offers two HD Streams and two SD streams. That sucks if you want to have seven televisions in your home accessing different channels.

I understand that U-Verse and FiOS have similar restrictions as to the number channels that the subscriber can view through one drop at one time. The teleco's attitude seems to be that we are not Burger King so have it our way or blow it out your ass.

The teleco's should have beat CATV at there own game and used RF over Fiber like the cable companies do. A 1GHz system would have given teleco., the ability to carry a bazillion channels plus voice and data. Tell teleco not forget to reserve 1Mhz to 114Mhz for upstream channels over their cable system.


jfleni

@rr.com
reply to MovieLover76

Re: This is all theoretical

Sure, but since Boston is a city in Mass, they could take advantage of the new state "Light Plant" law, start some electric service for the city snowplow yard or something similar, then finance and build a municipal fiber system as part of the "Light Plant." VZ would squawk, but so what.

Result: the biggest city in NE would have the best fiber, and all the economic development, as well a a potful of TV/internet profits, while VZ plays tic-tac-toe on their smartphone keyboards.

John Lenihan

Os

join:2011-01-26
US
Reviews:
·Comcast
reply to Mr Matt

Re: Same old Crappola!

No restrictions to FiOS and what you can do. It's not the garbage that Prism/U-Verse is.

As for Prism, enjoy your new caps. Caps on FTTP with IPTV is the biggest joke of all. You're transmitting TB's of TV over the network but that doesn't count. Only the TV you don't watch from us counts.

BlueC

join:2009-11-26
Minneapolis, MN
kudos:1
Reviews:
·Comcast
·Integra Telecom

1 recommendation

reply to Mr Matt
IPTV isn't the problem. It's the infrastructure. What good is RFoG when you're still dealing with DSL-related distance issues to the customer premise.

Last mile infrastructure is probably the biggest hurdle for Telcos. You cannot compare FiOS to U-verse and especially not Prism. Completely different animal and completely different last mile infrastructure.

RFoG is rather pointless once you have upgraded things. If the telcos pushed more fiber closer to their customers, they should have no issues running IPTV.


fifty nine

join:2002-09-25
Sussex, NJ
kudos:2
reply to cypherstream

Re: Not VZ, but someone else?

said by cypherstream:

I guess you never had to upload batches of pictures or home videos to family members on photo / video sharing sites, or heck even facebook.

Today's high res cameras output some pretty sizeable files.

I do, quite often in fact. Our EOS 5D MkII produces sizable files with its 25 megapixels, as do the other DSLR bodies we use in our studio.

But I doubt that people are uploading hundreds of RAW files from a $2500 camera. Most people are uploading JPEGs from small consumer cameras and smartphones and the last time I uploaded to facebook and photo printing services their app didn't take much time at all. I only have 5Mbps upload. I uploaded low res to print 5x7s and the prints from full, high res files were indistinguishable from those produced with low res uploads.

The average home user needs more download, as the average home user is more of a consumer of content rather than a producer. And with new compression technology even full HD video can be transmitted over low bandwidth connections with little degradation in quality.