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Comments on news posted 2012-02-07 12:34:18: It's fairly amazing to realize that this year was the first time the Superbowl was streamed online, despite the significant spread of faster broadband (DOCSIS 3.0, FTTH). ..

page: 1 · 2 · next


fifty nine

join:2002-09-25
Sussex, NJ
kudos:2

Too much effort for too little reward

Cuban is somewhat right.

Internet streaming takes a lot of horsepower and effort.

Traditional broadcast is much more efficient.

You want to watch the SB for free? Get an antenna. That's what I did.


norbert26
Premium
join:2010-08-10
Warwick, RI

I streamed it

I streamed it but watched on the regular NBC channel for HD. During ads i could jump to the stream which ran behind the broadcast to catch a play. However the stream jittered and stuttered a lot . This cleared up in the very end as everyone ditched the stream. Picture quality was in the abyss as well with only 350k stream i did not try for higher as i had the HD broadcast over the TV. Outcome of the game was a whole different matter .

nonymous
Premium
join:2003-09-08
Glendale, AZ

This is like a once a year big time event. Hard for streamin

Streaming like Netflix or other stuff can be planned for in capacity.
This is a once a year event that if online really worked would get slammed big time. Like quality video from internet to TV. Putting capacity in place for an annual very large event in some ways is harder than capacity for 24/7 use.

stufried
Premium
join:2003-10-13
Amazon leases capacity on its servers for exactly this type of one off usage. You can offload to them.

What I find amazing was the problems they had licensing commercials. "Hey Coca Cola we also want to put your add on our stream feed of the game at no extra charge." Is Coke really going to charge extra to broadcast their commercial? Is there a huge fear that pirates in China are going be selling bootleg DVDs of Clint Eastwood's Chrysler Commercial? I think NBC needs to replace whoever was their negotiator.


ctceo
Premium
join:2001-04-26
South Bend, IN

Planned Scarcity

If they would have had multiple broadcasters, they wouldn't have had that problem. Have Onlive, Hulu, uverse, comcast and a few others and this wouldn't have been an issue.


fifty nine

join:2002-09-25
Sussex, NJ
kudos:2
reply to stufried

Re: This is like a once a year big time event. Hard for streamin

said by stufried:

Amazon leases capacity on its servers for exactly this type of one off usage. You can offload to them.

Amazon can only go so far. What you really need is a good CDN like Akamai or Level 3.


fifty nine

join:2002-09-25
Sussex, NJ
kudos:2
reply to ctceo

Re: Planned Scarcity

It was on Hulu.


jazzy_

join:2004-01-27
Charleston, SC

eh wasn't too bad for me

It streamed fine on Chrome for me. But there was no halftime or famed adverts. Which bittorrent more than made up for. The quality of the stream was pretty good too. Only time it got a bit blurry was when I was downloading the halftime show lol.

nonymous
Premium
join:2003-09-08
Glendale, AZ
reply to nonymous

Re: This is like a once a year big time event. Hard for streamin

I do know about offloading. Thing is the penny pinchers not wanting to pay more. Sure we can do it in house with our everyday servers.

The big sports arenas in Phoenix metro are way overwired for everyday use. I do mean way way over wired. Thing is they do get used more than once a year and have other events, even though the other events usually come no where near hitting capacity.

This Superbowl on the net is more like a Barret Jackson car auction or PIR before the upgrade. Has some infrastructure in place all year then really build out for the event. Then at least through out the year the basic infrastructure is used for other events at times with still the last feet build out. Probably easier now also. Wasn't that long ago running copper the last feet. Bet if still had that job just run a few fiber cables.

Now mix in cheap ass executives at TV and cheap ass and do not want their ads stolen executives. Try to get funding for off loading. Way way easier than the sometimes build out for events at a Barret auction even with basics in place.


buddahbless

join:2005-03-21
Premium
Reviews:
·T-Mobile US
reply to fifty nine

Re: Too much effort for too little reward

I think those on netfilx and hulu would disagree with cuban.. It does not take to much in my opinion ( unless your trying for full HD), it just overall depends on mode of deliver and to what type of device your using. IE a stand alone sony SMP media players for example. I have 2 set up at My mothers house in the far out Chicago burbs in IL where there is no cable access and only DSL via ATT. and guess what they stream crackle to one and netflix on the other on 32' and 40" tvs and they both work fine at the same time even given that the Internet is only at 3mbps and you can still surf the web on another laptops ( note don't try and download a 1.3GB movie torrent at the same time thats over pushing it). Id say if there was a media player that could stream Local free broadcasts the ones your OTA digital converter boxes are suppose to for free ( from any local broadcast station in the US) you would see the tides changing, and a redeveloved intrest in stand alone media players. Id rather purchase a media player ( like roku, netger's, WDs, or Sony) that has access to every local free broadcast across the USA via internet access "were talking 100s of local channels now" than pay for comcast, uverse tv, dish, or direct for channels I never watch.

That Antenna you threw up let me tell you that does not work for crap here In IL and many parts of the country. If you more than 30 miles out of Chicago. The entire switch to digital OTA box, IMHO fails miserably. I know too many people in to many locations that are not served by Uverse or cable and went with that darn digital box in trying to avoid having to pay A satellite provider for basic local stations and I hear nothing but complaints of no signal, heavy distortions, and frozen boxes. Be glad your in Jersey.


Oh_No
Trogglus normalus

join:2011-05-21
Chicago, IL

I watched the NBC Stream - It was pretty good.

I watched the entire superbowl on my 47in TV with the NBC stream.
At first it was grainy. I closed it and reopened it and then it was pretty crisp of a picture.
It also had 4 different camera angles you chould change to.
The only issue was it would not go "full screen" because it had a stats bar on the sides, but that did not matter.
As for lag I would not know as I did not have another live signal to compare it to.

For some reason they did not show the halftime show, but no one missed anything there. Who cares about madonna lip syncing to a song.

I thought the stream was done well.

iansltx

join:2007-02-19
Austin, TX
kudos:2
Reviews:
·Time Warner Cable
·Verizon Online DSL
reply to fifty nine

Re: Too much effort for too little reward

That's not free anymore...you have to pay for the antenna and hope you can get line of sight to your local NBC affiliate

Seriously though, there was no technical reason for the streaming Superbowl experience to be as horrid as it was. The stream actually performed much better on my Kindle Fire than on the laptop that was being used to show the game to myself and a few friends. No halftime show and a couple of crappy adds repeated over and over weren't technical failures...they were business ones.

Speaking of technical stuff, the stream was provided by Level3 if I've heard correctly. They have capacity and to spare for an event like this, large though it may be. They just had to turn it up, which they did after the first few minutes of the game.

iansltx

join:2007-02-19
Austin, TX
kudos:2
reply to fifty nine

Re: This is like a once a year big time event. Hard for streamin

L3 was used this time around AFAIK. L3 + Akamai would've been even better. Throw in some LLNW for good measure

Wilsdom

join:2009-08-06
reply to stufried
"no extra charge" was probably off the table


Smith6612
Premium,MVM
join:2008-02-01
North Tonawanda, NY
kudos:25
Reviews:
·Verizon Online DSL
·Frontier Communi..

4 edits

NBC Goofed up

I know the Superbowl is kind of that once a year, 5 hour event, but I know they goofed up. I was watching the game on a very fast connection at the time in a location where traditional TV was not available. The connection was Gigabit, was testing at Gigabit and I was doing nothing more than 350Kbps to the Superbowl stream. It basically was a let-down since it looked like it was being encoded on a toaster and broadcasted on a farm of toasters.




So, needless to say, the fact that the player went to the same advertisements every few minutes, and the player had ads along the side, I really think they could have done better. Akamai, Amazon, Limelight, whoever have the capacity on demand to get this stuff moving. NBC I don't think footed the bill to make it look like something that wasn't what I used to watch on dial-up (hypothetically).

Anyways, to give NBC a break, these live streaming players are a joke. When they were first starting to take off, you could decide to stream content with a quality of whatever the player determined would work best based on your connection and based on the stream demand, or you could over-ride the often crappy netcode of the player and pick the quality yourself. With the exception of Netflix's player, which allows you to select the quality (but Netflix has nothing to do with this in the first place), none of these players, even those at ESPN3 (who had these options as well) allow you to pick the quality. Even if the servers are having no problems with capacity, you're at the mercy of these crappy players. I miss the days of not being called an idiot by a media player and actually being able to choose a bitrate I knew would please what I wanted to view, even if my connection was not fast enough to handle it.

I will commend them for at least offering up a live, decent looking stream (if you could get the high quality feed...) for free this year. They didn't do that for the Olympics which was a huge disappointment. So that is at least a step in the right direction.


jseymour

join:2009-12-11
Waterford, MI

So A Broadcaster Wasn't Very Good At...

...broadcasting in the 21st Century?

Imagine my surprise.

The entrenched media types (broadcast TV & radio, cable & satellite operators, MPAA, RIAA, etc.) could learn from history, had they a mind to. A long time ago the railroads tried to fend-off the up-and-coming airline industry by refusing to build railroad terminus' adjacent to airports. So now trucks do all of what trains could've done at least some of.

Oops.


elios

join:2005-11-15
Springfield, MO
reply to iansltx

Re: Too much effort for too little reward

sounds like the SAME bullshit they pulled at the Winter Olympics and im betting the same crap they will pull this summer
limited streams day+ delays and TV coverage thats nothing but recaps


fifty nine

join:2002-09-25
Sussex, NJ
kudos:2
reply to buddahbless
You're talking about staggered streaming of pre-recorded events.

This is live streaming of a live event. Big difference.

It's not easy to pull off something the size of the superbowl. It's not cheap either. Your $7/month Netflix subscription probably won't cover all the costs.


RockCake
Premium
join:2005-07-12
Woodbridge, VA

No stream for me...

I watched on TV, but for the heck of it I tried to stream via Chrome, Firefox and (ugh) IE, and couldn't do it, yet Netflix worked just fine.

25139889

join:2011-10-25
Toledo, OH
reply to stufried

Re: This is like a once a year big time event. Hard for streamin

Coke didn't get paid for their ad to start off with. They paid to have it played.

itguy05

join:2005-06-17
Carlisle, PA

All roads lead to Silverlight Debacle

Funny, a site relying on proprietary Microsoft technology (Silverlight) bombing under load.... Who would have thunk?

Hint to NBC - Microsoft does not make reliable software. Nor do they make software that scales well....


espaeth
Digital Plumber
Premium,MVM
join:2001-04-21
Minneapolis, MN
kudos:2
reply to buddahbless

Re: Too much effort for too little reward

said by buddahbless:

I think those on netfilx and hulu would disagree with cuban..

Then they would not be disagreeing with what Cuban has actually said. Take for example his own words in blog posts like this: »blogmaverick.com/2009/01/27/the-···deo-lie/

The argument is not that all Internet video won't work, but rather that simultaneous viewing of live content had a cost structure and technical issues that will prevent it from being a replacement technology for traditional broadcast video.

Just looking at the Netflix numbers, Wired published an article that had a factoid that on any given night only 1.8% of Netflix subscribers stream video on any given night. At the time, Netflix had 16.9 million subscribers, so we're looking at around 300k streaming viewers on an average evening.

If you look at the numbers from Nielson, you have the NFL playoffs (not even the SuperBowl yet) pulling in 57 million live viewers. Even shows like American Idol pull in 18-21 million live viewers.

To use the Internet to deliver simultaneous video to even a few million viewers would be astronomically more expensive than current broadcast video solutions.


88615298
Premium
join:2004-07-28
West Tenness
reply to Smith6612

Re: NBC Goofed up

said by Smith6612:

I know the Superbowl is kind of that once a year, 5 hour event, but I know they goofed up. I was watching the game on a very fast connection at the time in a location where traditional TV was not available. The connection was Gigabit, was testing at Gigabit and I was doing nothing more than 350Kbps to the Superbowl stream. It basically was a let-down since it looked like it was being encoded on a toaster and broadcasted on a farm of toasters.

If you kept it in small mode like that it's no shock that you weren't getting anything much faster. To get it's max speed which tops out at 3.5 Mbps you need to have it fullscreen.

chances14

join:2010-03-03
Michigan
reply to iansltx

Re: Too much effort for too little reward

said by iansltx:

That's not free anymore...you have to pay for the antenna and hope you can get line of sight to your local NBC affiliate

it was free for me using our 15 year old roof mounted antenna lol. and considering that we don't pay for hd with our paid tv, it was an even added bonus to watch it in high def

raythompsontn

join:2001-01-11
Oliver Springs, TN
Reviews:
·Comcast
reply to itguy05

Re: All roads lead to Silverlight Debacle

said by itguy05:

Nor do they make software that scales well....

Really? Ever heard of Server 2008 DataCenter edition? How about Exchange Server? Perhaps SQL Server with a multi-terrabyte database with replication?

I doubt it was Silverlight as the scaling on your desktop is not an issue.


TwighlightLA
Premium
join:2010-07-03
kudos:1
reply to buddahbless

Re: Too much effort for too little reward

said by buddahbless:

I think those on netfilx and hulu would disagree with cuban..

I'm no expert and perhaps I also misunderstand the technology but Netflix is different in several key areas from live streaming of the Super Bowl. Netflix is different because:

1. What it streams is pre-recorded.

2. The demand at any given time on the Netflix servers is miniscule compared to what I would perceive the user demand would be for the Super Bowl. Just too much demand. The "Power" needed to meet the demand is business wise unobtainable for quality streaming.


fifty nine

join:2002-09-25
Sussex, NJ
kudos:2
reply to iansltx

Re: This is like a once a year big time event. Hard for streamin

said by iansltx:

L3 was used this time around AFAIK. L3 + Akamai would've been even better. Throw in some LLNW for good measure

Yeah, probably their origin servers couldn't keep up. I know people who work there... wouldn't surprise me.


FLATLINE

join:2007-02-27
Buffalo, NY
reply to 25139889
Wow dude! Right over your head. Nice!

sonicmerlin

join:2009-05-24
Cleveland, OH
kudos:1
reply to espaeth

Re: Too much effort for too little reward

the stream was provided by level3. you vastly underestimate the capacity of the core networks. Netflix streaming costs are a tiny fraction of their overall costs. licensing is a much bigger cost. it costs less than a penny to stream 1 gb.


dvd536
as Mr. Pink as they come
Premium
join:2001-04-27
Phoenix, AZ
kudos:4
reply to Smith6612

Re: NBC Goofed up

*cough* SILVERLIGHT *cough*

Even the 1.5mbps would be bitstarved in my opinion, thats what these people never get in the legal arena, if you can't do it decent you shouldn't be attempting it. not "well at least they can see the game" mentality. * y a w n *