dslreports logo
site
spacer

spacer
 
    All Forums Hot Topics Gallery
spc

spacer




how-to block ads


view:
topics flat nest 
Comments on news posted 2012-03-05 14:48:17: Verizon's FiOS expansion is on hold with the exception of major city franchise build obligations, though Verizon stated on a recent earnings call that a focus for this year would be to get stubborn DSL users in markets already upgraded to FiOS to swi.. ..

page: 1 · 2 · next

tmc8080

join:2004-04-24
Brooklyn, NY
Reviews:
·ooma
·Optimum Online
·Verizon FiOS

BS

I call BS, it's MORE about raising prices on these stubborn DSL users.. once they "CUT THE COPPER CORD" there is no going back.. they will pull the copper line off the building once and for all! If you ever wanted it back, you'll pay a hefty reinstallation charge of at least $150-$200 for a service tech to do the work.

Once they've got you on FIOS even at some lower tier than 15/2 for a discounted rate, they'll find ways to commit bill creep, with bogus fees and taxes! Their main goal is to get another $20 a month or more out of these customers.. by hook (UPSELL), crook, or surcharges. All about the ROI and flouting copper regulation for QOS.

elefante72

join:2010-12-03
East Amherst, NY

Makes Sense

Copper wireline maint is horrible not to mention loss that companies are suffering in certain areas due to theft. If they are addressing a customer sat problem with a newer modern platform at a reasonable rate then who is to complain.

In my area you cant even order DSL anymore, only FIOS. The only issue I see was that DSL was $29 (DL) a few years ago and would get 6Mbit in my area (you can stream), whereas 15/5 is the lowest now offered in my area and if you just want internet that is pushing $60.

So to even come close to a reasonable DSL package you will need the double play at a minimum net/phone and that is around $75.

Now if I did PAYG voip.ms + DSL I would pay in the $40s, now this is in the $70's which is a good 60-70% more.

So while the technology is glittery better, the costs also skyrocket. I would assume VZ to coerce the users off the platform at a 1:1 cost and maybe provision a new tier to deal w/ the issue. Then they can always upsell on the triple play, and of course if you want the TP you go to 15/5 and can never go back

At least VZ is being smart about this and upgrading as necessary. My pops in San Ant had to deal w/ AT&T raising their tele rates every few months, so that basic was almost pushing $30/month and there was some grounding issue that AT&T didnt want to fix (nor would they). So I moved him to voip.ms, now he spends under $5 and sound is crystal clear over cable (TWC).

As companies milk their copper infra there will become a point that upgrading cost less than leaving and either they sell it off (a la VZ, others) or they upgrade. AT&T is going to have a massive issue w/ uverse on their hands over the next decade. It looks like VZ has found that point. This is also good, because if they upgrade to FIOS then they are less likely to sell off that territory and will eventually upgrade their entire area. I mean you could have Frontier that will never upgrade


sioxmoux2

@sbcglobal.net
786k is the new 14.4. It time to move on to FIOS, its 2012. Not 1987


zoom314

join:2005-11-21
Yermo, CA
Reviews:
·DSL EXTREME
·Time Warner Cable
reply to elefante72
The area where I live will never get FiOS, LTE or sell the area off, the Barstow CA area is quite safe, VZ needs the area, but won't upgrade any out here as there are too few people out here. Me I have DSL Extreme and it's Dry Loop, 3M/768K @ $32.83 a month, so I'm not interested in an expensive service.

raster44

join:2003-09-07
Niagara Falls, NY
Reviews:
·Verizon Online DSL

1 edit

Verizon is a joke!

They have FiOS less than 500 feet from me but I'm out of a central office to the West and they have no plans to convert it to FiOS in the near future. I'm out of luck and stuck with DSL. Cost of their triple pack is $79/month. Hell I pay more for that than Cable and it sucks. Freezes constantly even during live events.

Just watching and everything froze again and can only get the music package. Now some channels are working but sound and video are out of sync.


N3OGH
Yo Soy Col. "Bat" Guano
Premium
join:2003-11-11
Philly burbs
kudos:2
For the longest time my town was split in half by 2 CO's.

Haves (Halves) and Have nots.

I was a have not for a long time...
--
Petty people are disproportionally corrupted by petty power

chgo_man99

join:2010-01-01
San Jose, CA
reply to elefante72

Re: Makes Sense

I think it was in at&t's budget to upgrade most areas to FTTN and later to FTTP as necessary, rather than spending all cost upfront for FTTP.

Anyone can give some confirmed soruced study whether or not, att's plan jump to all they way to FTTP would be cheaper in the long run than going incrementally via FTTN? Also let not forget in new areas they already have FTTP.

So here is analysis of cost of upgrade dealing with cost of putting on VRADs and later replacing last mile with fiber vs fiber all the way down to the premises.

hrickpa

join:2001-06-07
Reading, PA
Reviews:
·Verizon Online DSL

Bad Copper Lines

The Copper lines in the city I live are beyond repair I have DSL 7.1 meg plan last year I had several issues with either very slow to the point that is unusable or sync loss in some areas in the city they have rubber floor mats covering access panels, some covers are missing. Wires tied up with rope. several safety and codes violations. I was told that FIOS would be available by the end of last year. instead they only wired the reading School district with 1gb internet access to all of its buildings (waste of tax money)
Still no FIOS.
I live in Reading, PA (the poorest city in the nation)


vzsux

@optonline.net

Wholesale Lines-VZ B.s

what verizon doesn't tell us, is that in every major city , that there copper network is leased to CLEC companies, that cant be forced off copper. VZ still has to maintain it, once they move there own customers. VZ is such full of shit, most of the 5 borough in NYC doesnt even have fios in every part

NiteSn0w

join:2010-12-24
reply to raster44

Re: Verizon is a joke!

You may have low signal you should probably call your provider and have them send out a tech.

elefante72

join:2010-12-03
East Amherst, NY

1 recommendation

reply to chgo_man99

Re: Makes Sense

Its a matter of investment and customer service. Many people are very happy w/ uverse. My pops tried it out and the line quality was so poor the service suffered. That is the problem w/ copper. So he has 50 year old copper that has some issue between the vrad and him, and at&t isnt going to run a new line, so he goes w/ TWC.

FTTP is 100% more expensive UPFRONT, however over time it will cost less, and TQI is much higher on FIOS than Uverse seeing that att will have to eventually run new lines and replace the vrad w/ GPON. Also bandwidth is potentially an issue and scalability, environmental, and electrical. There is more to the equation than capex, there is opex and infrastructure costs too. Latest vrads are much more energy efficient and smaller than say 2 years ago, and I am sure cheaper. That is the joke network deploy is constantly getting less expensive and my bill does not...

Both AT&T and Verizon are sinking a fortune into LTE so that is defocusing them from building out prem solutions but as the competition wakes up (cable) they will have to respond or they will start losing customers. Cable is pretty much done w/ docsis 3 and that didnt cost squat, so they are in good position.

BiggA

join:2005-11-23
EARTH
reply to raster44

Re: Verizon is a joke!

We had a similar thing years back when the southern CO had DSL, and the northern one did not, although it wasn't 500 feet, it was a couple of miles.

BiggA

join:2005-11-23
EARTH

Dumb users

What dumb users who are in a FIOS area don't have FIOS already? Why would you have an old, slow, primitive form of internet if you can get a 43/35 connection and non re-compressed HD channels over fiber?

travelguy

join:1999-09-03
Santa Fe, NM
said by BiggA:

What dumb users who are in a FIOS area don't have FIOS already? Why would you have an old, slow, primitive form of internet if you can get a 43/35 connection and non re-compressed HD channels over fiber?

My folks for one. They are low income retired, want basic phone service (no LD plan, phone cards work fine), no pay TV (OTA works fine for them), no cell service, and internet fast enough to let them download email and browse the occasional web site.

ATT came through 6 months ago with uVerse and was calling them daily trying to get them to convert. The cheapest uVerse package that came close to being similar to what they currently have would have cost them $20/month more.

BiggA

join:2005-11-23
EARTH
Even my grandparents (my grandfather is 89) have cable internet.

PHONE CARDS? What are they living in the '90s? As much as a I hate U-Verse, triple or quad-play could deal with all of that, but voice is pretty much free these days. GV has free long distance, Skype is 2.2 cents a minute, the Vonage app is free. Time for them to get with the times. And that's assuming their cell phones are Tracfones or the like where they have to pay per minute.


Smith6612
Premium,MVM
join:2008-02-01
North Tonawanda, NY
kudos:24
Reviews:
·Verizon Online DSL
·Frontier Communi..
Well, they may be behind, but it might also be because people are looking for simple things, nothing that requires more than what is needed. I guess DSL covers that base nicely. No router or ONT to deal with.

I have several relatives that have FiOS, and there's no correlation to what they get based on their age. They either get Cable if it's available, FiOS if it's available or DSL if they absolutely must get it. Price isn't really an issue for them as they simply want something fast, as they know that when everyone comes over to visit they will probably bring something to entertain them on the Internet.


CCarson

join:2001-07-22
Redlands, CA
Reviews:
·DSL EXTREME
reply to BiggA
FiOS is available in my area and I don't subscribe. Why? I'm a single-person household. My data needs are met perfectly by 3Mbps DSL. Any slower and I couldn't stream Netflix; but anything faster would be a waste for just me.

So what's dumber: not subscribing to superior technology when it's available, or paying an extra $30 per month for bandwidth I don't even need?

weaver0

join:2004-05-05
Macungie, PA
reply to hrickpa

Re: Bad Copper Lines

My father-in-law lives in Reading and has the same issue.. He's called for service multiple times for line issues and it seems like it's only band-aids. I think he's too far out for reliable service, but what was once a 1.5Mb connection is now about 500kb - with Verizon just throwing their hands up.

If he wasn't in love with DirecTV, he would have jumped ship to Comcast a long time ago

davers

join:2012-03-05
Bobcaygeon, ON

BULL SH!T

copper lines never required maintenance in the past.
why does it require it now? i call bull shit on this one.

its all about money money.

BiggA

join:2005-11-23
EARTH
reply to Smith6612

Re: Dumb users

No matter what you have, you have to have a modem and a router, and the ONT is just a modem that's permanently mounted.

Just because there's one person in a household doesn't mean they should have crappy bandwidth. One person still needs good bandwidth.


amenite
The Soylent - It's People
Premium
join:2002-11-21
Ridgewood, NJ

Ready to bail on DSL

I've been having some serious degradation in my DSL speeds for some time. I'm pretty much ready to replace it all with FIOS at this point rather then battle to get back up to 1.5 Kbps downstream (currently hovering around half that).

I built a HTPC for a friend last year built on the Ceton InfiniTV. I see Ceton is looking to release a new platform this year that could be pretty much exactly what I'm looking for, and it doesn't work with satellite:

»thedigitallifestyle.com/w/index.···-8-apps/

I'll be saving plenty of money each month and will have enough bandwidth left over to allocate for all the family members' banwidth leeching iThings too
--
Time is an abstract concept invented by carbon based life forms to monitor their constant decay.-Thunderclese


Pathfinder
Dazed Confused
Premium
join:2000-03-26
Mount Vernon, NY
Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS
reply to BiggA

Re: Dumb users

3Mps is not crappy bandwidth if it is all you need. I gave up my DSL because of the price increase in my cable bill. Getting RR through Time Warner on a triple play wound up cheaper than my cable alone would have been. Otherwise I would still be very happy with my 3Mps DSL.


Pathfinder
Dazed Confused
Premium
join:2000-03-26
Mount Vernon, NY
reply to davers

Re: BULL SH!T

Copper lines have always required maintenance. Very costly maintenance at that.


DataRiker
Premium
join:2002-05-19
00000
reply to BiggA

Re: Dumb users

said by BiggA:

What dumb users who are in a FIOS area don't have FIOS already?

I think I just throw up in my mouth a little. How much do they pay your to write this stuff?


odddon
but it's a dry heat

join:2009-06-19
Ridgecrest, CA
reply to zoom314

Re: Makes Sense

There could be hope zoom314. »digital395.com/
-
--
--- To have ambition, was my ambition.


Smith6612
Premium,MVM
join:2008-02-01
North Tonawanda, NY
kudos:24
Reviews:
·Verizon Online DSL
·Frontier Communi..

1 recommendation

reply to BiggA

Re: Dumb users

I understand and fully agree, which was why I made my statement. Many of the DSL modems can have their router functions shut off, and even if they do, they often have only one port so users don't connect additional devices to them already. My own experience with the router in a Westell modem from Verizon is that they work, but if you throw torrents at them the modem will load down a little bit.


Madness
Like a flea circus at a dog show

join:2000-01-05
Quincy, MA
kudos:1
I'm still on 3Mb VZDSL. While I'd love FIOS, there's none to be had. Yet, a friend in adjacent Braintree is rocking on it!


norbert26
Premium
join:2010-08-10
Warwick, RI

1 recommendation

reply to CCarson
said by CCarson:

FiOS is available in my area and I don't subscribe. Why? I'm a single-person household. My data needs are met perfectly by 3Mbps DSL. Any slower and I couldn't stream Netflix; but anything faster would be a waste for just me.

So what's dumber: not subscribing to superior technology when it's available, or paying an extra $30 per month for bandwidth I don't even need?

i am in a FiOS market as well. I have the 3 meg DSL and POTS unlimited local. I don't need the 15/5 lowest tier speeds FiOS offers. I can stream netflix fine . With DSL i own my router and modem. I don't want verizon's garbage FiOS routers they force on you and for you to return at the end of service. I don't want an ONT with a battery I am responsible to replace and can't even be found in a local store. I don't want the HOME INVASION of what they call an install. Keep your hands off my computer i don't want verizon installing their bloatware / garbage ware on MY computer. I don't need verizon trampling through my home. I do not pay for or subscribe to commercial infested garbage that is called television as i can't stomach watching 5 minutes of content VS 10 minutes of non related content and pay for "TV service" on top of it PLUS pay for each TV to have a "box" on it to receive channels. i get free HD over the air with antenna which i hardly watch anyways. I don't want the increased cost of FiOS either that goes up after promotions end.

BiggA

join:2005-11-23
EARTH
reply to Madness
You can't get cable? Cable now is most often around 12-15mbps on the lowest tier. Comcast is pretty solid, they have a tier that's reasonably priced (maybe $65 bundled) that's like ~24mbps down. The downside to cable is the uploads aren't that great, although they are a lot better than they were a few years back.

@norbert26: They don't have to install stuff on your computer, and you can use your own router, in a variety of different configurations with or without theirs (although you have to use theirs at some level if you use their STBs. you could go all on your own with cablecard DVR(s) and your own router though). You also have the advantage that if you really want to be annoyed at them installing, Comcast has had to make massive improvements in FIOS areas, and cable is all self-install except for multi-room DVR, which is them screwing a little filter on the main splitter.

All providers have promotional deals. I can only dream of having FIOS access. If I move to the Boston area, one of the criteria (not 100% absolute, but a factor) when picking a place will be the availability of VZ FIOS.


rtfm

join:2005-07-09
Washington, DC
Reviews:
·Mediacom
reply to BiggA
said by BiggA:

What dumb users who are in a FIOS area don't have FIOS already?

Well, call me dumb. I do not want to pay FIO$ price$ for access I don't need.

I also do not pay [through the nose...] for cable/fiber TV; I use an antenna.

I do not want deal with Verizontal's billing disasters for FIOS.

And I refuse to surrender my copper-based, works without any local power, phone.

I have friends who are getting FIOS because they now have no broadband options, but given their repeated, multiday, power outages; we'll swap the toy 7Ah battery for a 75 Ah deep cycle one, and they also have a propane-fueled 10kW generator good for~10 days duration at 8 hours/day. And, need I add, they have more money then I do.

Verizontal dearly hopes that they & all their neighbors will abandon copper, but I know that won't happen...