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Comments on news posted 2012-09-17 08:48:27: Time Warner Cable says they're not worried about Google Fiber and the company's $70 symmetrical 1 Gbps fiber offering, despite the fact the speeds dwarf Time Warner Cable's fastest offering (50 Mbps). ..

jacour
Premium
join:2001-12-11
Matthews, NC

What, me worry?

Meet the Alfred E. Newman of the communications industry.
neufuse

join:2006-12-06
James Creek, PA
Reviews:
·Comcast

it'd be funny if...

google came out and said, we have plans to deploy to all major cities within 10 years or something... see what Verizon, TWC, and Comcast do then... even if google doesn't it'd in the end after saying it, it would still whip them up into an oh crap what do we do frenzy

Chiyo
Save Me Konata-Chan
Premium
join:2003-02-20
Charlotte, NC
kudos:1

Re: it'd be funny if...

Sadly I think she is right. I think we are stuck with what we have and won't be seeing any national fiber deployments anytime soon. I hope I'm wrong but we'll see.
--
That was the wild boar.... Moo!
My podcast: The Banzai Beat »www.banzaibeat.com
elray

join:2000-12-16
Santa Monica, CA
Reviews:
·Time Warner Cable
·EarthLink

1 recommendation

Re: it'd be funny if...

KC will demonstrate, at the expense of Google shareholders and taxpayers, once again, that only a minority population is willing to pay the price for fiber speeds.

Google is not offering a competitive product.

Time Warner has little to worry about unless Google un-bundles its TV tier and substantially lowers prices.
Skippy25

join:2000-09-13
Hazelwood, MO

Re: it'd be funny if...

Please ship me some of what you are smoking as I want to go through life being as delusional as you.

El Quintron
Resident Mouth Breather
Premium
join:2008-04-28
Etobicoke, ON
kudos:4
Reviews:
·TekSavvy Cable
·TekSavvy DSL

Re: it'd be funny if...

said by Skippy25:

Please ship me some of what you are smoking as I want to go through life being as delusional as you.

It's called "shill-weed" and it only grows in corporate boardrooms and PR offices. The stuff is garbage anyways...
--
Support Bacteria -- It's the Only Culture Some People Have
Os

join:2011-01-26
US
Really? How much will 10/1 internet and basic digital cable cost you from TWC? I bet you more than $120 unless you're on a yearly promo.
elray

join:2000-12-16
Santa Monica, CA
Reviews:
·Time Warner Cable
·EarthLink

Re: it'd be funny if...

said by Os:

Really? How much will 10/1 internet and basic digital cable cost you from TWC? I bet you more than $120 unless you're on a yearly promo.

Sorry, but promos are the way of the world. I don't like it either, but we manage to use them year after year to achieve reasonable pricing.

We disconnected basic cable years ago when things went digital, and we haven't looked back since. IF we were to order same, today, we would get "basic digital cable" and 10/1 service for $60/month with a 1-year price guarantee, after which it would more than double if we didn't renegotiate.

I experience similar offerings for Cox and Charter in nearby areas; Comcast is more difficult, always has been, makes U-Verse seem competitive.

We currently pay $30/month for 10/1 with a 1-year price guarantee. We can downgrade to 3/1 for $20/month.

We have a 10Gbit fiber ring six feet from my door that my tax money paid for over a decade now, but neither the Muni nor AT&T will let us access it.
34764170

join:2007-09-06
Etobicoke, ON
said by elray:

Google is not offering a competitive product.

You either smoke some good shit or have some serious mental issues.

El Quintron
Resident Mouth Breather
Premium
join:2008-04-28
Etobicoke, ON
kudos:4
Reviews:
·TekSavvy Cable
·TekSavvy DSL

Re: it'd be funny if...

said by 34764170:

said by elray:

Google is not offering a competitive product.

You either smoke some good shit or have some serious mental issues.

Never one to mince words are ya?
--
Support Bacteria -- It's the Only Culture Some People Have
me1212

join:2008-11-20
Pleasant Hill, MO
You do realize that the so called fibre costs are about what tw charges for 50mb right?
elray

join:2000-12-16
Santa Monica, CA
Reviews:
·Time Warner Cable
·EarthLink

1 recommendation

Re: it'd be funny if...

said by me1212:

You do realize that the so called fibre costs are about what tw charges for 50mb right?

Yes, of course.

Do you realize that most households aren't interested in paying $70/month for broadband?

Most households don't require 50mbit, or 20mbit - they're happy with 3Mbit, so fiber isn't the issue you think it is. Verizon has proven this for years with Fios.

The households I've converted over the past few years are coming from DSL speeds of 80-144kbps (and less!). 3-7M cable (typical offering) blows them away.
Crookshanks

join:2008-02-04
Binghamton, NY

Re: it'd be funny if...

said by elray:

Verizon has proven this for years with Fios.

I think you meant to say DSL?

Concur with the sentiment of your post. Once you get over 3mbit/s it's really gravy to the average user. They don't notice a difference. The only users who might are those who are interested in HD streaming, but the last time I checked that can be accomplished at 5mbit/s on Netflix, so once again, these double digit speeds are unnecessary for most.

What's going to suck is I can see the MSOs eliminating the slower tiers in the future. This is essentially what the wireless carriers are doing with voice plans, and it doesn't require a huge leap of faith to see the same happening with broadband. Offer a crippled product at today's prices (say 1mbit/s for $40/mo), an excessive product that most don't need for much more (50mbit/s for $70/mo), with nothing in between, then roll around naked in the resulting pile of cash like Scrooge McDuck.
elray

join:2000-12-16
Santa Monica, CA
Reviews:
·Time Warner Cable
·EarthLink

1 edit

Re: it'd be funny if...

said by Crookshanks:

said by elray:

Verizon has proven this for years with Fios.

I think you meant to say DSL?

Concur with the sentiment of your post. Once you get over 3mbit/s it's really gravy to the average user. They don't notice a difference. The only users who might are those who are interested in HD streaming, but the last time I checked that can be accomplished at 5mbit/s on Netflix, so once again, these double digit speeds are unnecessary for most.

What's going to suck is I can see the MSOs eliminating the slower tiers in the future. This is essentially what the wireless carriers are doing with voice plans, and it doesn't require a huge leap of faith to see the same happening with broadband. Offer a crippled product at today's prices (say 1mbit/s for $40/mo), an excessive product that most don't need for much more (50mbit/s for $70/mo), with nothing in between, then roll around naked in the resulting pile of cash like Scrooge McDuck.

No, I mean Fios.

Verizon can't achieve much more than 30% penetration with Fios. The super-majority of potential customers aren't willing to pay the premium they charge. This has been consistent for seven years.

Google, EPB, et al, aren't going to achieve any greater subscription levels if they're charging $60-70/month for standalone broadband, in a marketplace where the MSO has a $20-40 option, or the Telco has a decent copper offering.

Not until those higher speeds become useful to Mom.

As for "rolling in cash", I think if you put aside the hyperbole, and instead, examined the annual returns, you would find that profit margins at the large MSOs and telcos isn't that spectacular year to year - and if it is, why don't you own their stock?

skuv

@rr.com
You do realize that price for Google fiber is being supported by free access from KC government to buildings, right?

They aren't offering free building access for TWC to house their equipment.

Or that the price is just a loss leader for promotion?

So technically, it is not a competitive price, if you factor in the costs it would actually take to deliver this.
LucasLee

join:2010-11-26
kudos:1
said by elray:

only a minority population is willing to pay the price for fiber speeds.

today, perhaps.
but it's silly to build infrastructure that will be outdated by tomorrow.

David
I start new work on
Premium,VIP
join:2002-05-30
Granite City, IL
kudos:101
Reviews:
·DIRECTV
·AT&T Midwest
·magicjack.com
·Google Voice
said by Chiyo:

Sadly I think she is right.

I think she's right too.

said by Chiyo:

I think we are stuck with what we have and won't be seeing any national fiber deployments anytime soon. I hope I'm wrong but we'll see.

Agreed, unless you can get investors on board with a decent return on investment, or government paying the full bill, you are very correct.
--
If you have a topic in the direct forum please reply to it or a post of mine, I get a notification when you do this.
Koetting Ford, Granite City, illinois... YOU'RE FIRED!!
Core0000
Premium
join:2008-05-04
Somerset, KY
I agree... if big wigs like her are in charge, we'll probably never see anything truly advancing such as fiber to the home happen... *sighs* I wish NewWaveCommunications hadn't sold to TimeWarner in my area...

alchav

join:2002-05-17
Saint George, UT
Reviews:
·ooma
said by neufuse:

google came out and said, we have plans to deploy to all major cities within 10 years or something... see what Verizon, TWC, and Comcast do then... even if google doesn't it'd in the end after saying it, it would still whip them up into an oh crap what do we do frenzy

Google did say that years ago, and to this day they still don't have a good Plan for Fiber deployment. Verizon is the only one that has a good Fiber Plan, and now they are even going to raise their prices. If you want lots of Fast Bandwidth, Verizon is about the only show in town with good FTTH. Google still doesn't have a Plan for that Last Mile, and all you guys here think just drop the Fiber from the closes Pole! That's not a Plan, that's ugly disaster waiting to happen!

DataRiker
Premium
join:2002-05-19
00000

Re: it'd be funny if...

said by alchav:

Google still doesn't have a Plan for that Last Mile, and all you guys here think just drop the Fiber from the closes Pole! That's not a Plan, that's ugly disaster waiting to happen!

That is precisely what ATT and TimeWarner do now. And I don't see why they would do it any differently for Fiber.
Bhruic

join:2002-11-27
Toronto, ON
kudos:2

Sad

I like how it's not "we can compete on price", or "we can offer a better service". I mean those would be obvious lies, but still, that they don't even bother to try and promote their own services is pretty damning.
elefante72

join:2010-12-03
East Amherst, NY

Re: Sad

Disruption is a biatch. You have to dismiss, because it's light years better--until it really starts hurting. Then you pay off your local congress or legislature to erect artificial barriers.

In my area if you pay more than $100 for a 3-play you are a sucker. TWC just threw me a deal for $89 for a year, a free home DVR and 3 months of pay channels. Of course we have robust competition and I have FIOS. My brother who lives in a TWC-only area pays $160 for the same gig minus the whole home DVR, it would be $200/mo.

TRUE competition in open markets is better for everyone...Of course the weak companies die, but that is what should happen, not kept afloat by government regulation and protection.

I imagine if Google said Baltimore, Buffalo, Boston..I'm here Verizon wouldn't take a dump... I guess VZ doesn't like B's....
axus

join:2001-06-18
Washington, DC
Reviews:
·Comcast
I think she's saying Google is providing service at a loss. Of course the first location will cost more as they learn the business. It's a good question for Google. If they can't break even, it makes no sense to expand.

They only need to break even, to drive down competitor prices and get more people online, viewing ads.
Wilsdom

join:2009-08-06
Yeah, they don't really care about the product at all, just their profits. TW could probably roll out 100/15 for half the cost of Google Fiber, but since there is no pressure they are happy to pile up the money. Now that DSL is giving up in most areas they're actually more likely to degrade service. Rolling back to 5mb/s is probably too shocking and might get government attention, but metering could be a great opportunity

jamaicaplain

@comcast.net

Google Fiber

The important issue of Google Fiber isn't the amount of direct competition it poses to TWC but rather the demonstration of what is possible and what dinosaurs the incumbents are.
milrtime83

join:2009-11-04
Katy, TX

heh

Eighth competitor?? Can he really say that with a straight face?

antdude
A Ninja Ant
Premium,VIP
join:2001-03-25
United State
kudos:4

Come on, Google (and others)!

Spread your fiber and cause some competitions!
tmc8080

join:2004-04-24
Brooklyn, NY
Reviews:
·ooma
·Optimum Online
·Verizon FiOS

these things start small..

yeah, and California's getting hit with the highest gasoline prices in the country.. no wonder they're pushing ethanol, natural gas, electricity and hydrogen..

when the incumbent monopoly & duopolies break the last straw, there will be a reckoning.. and while it's doubtful it will come from google fiber (they've as much as said they won't take it nationally) there are alot of geographies which are very complacent about utilizing 50 year old copper and letting customers suffer from no competition and decades old technology while collecting higher and higher tolls for what services they can provide on antique equipment (some of which is DSL)
oratam

join:2007-12-21
Stockton, NJ
Reviews:
·ViaTalk

heh

I love how people say Google is not going to make money. I wonder how valuable the data will be to advertisers who can not only see where the commercials are being seen as well as well as dictate where the commercials are being shown. With google's advertising background as well as profiles they developed over the internet to tailor ads to the specific customer, they can extend this considerably to the television commercials. That is a premium market that they could charge more to advertisers. I believe the only reason they haven't announced nationwide expansion is to limit the fallout until they establish the foothold. Do see any phone company not opening up the war chest to fight them?

The next part is when they establish how much of a boon and economic growth develops from the fiber. How many companies come to the area to cut down on bandwidth costs. How many startups open up because of it. How many people move to the area. Do you think any politician will not turn down a chance to add that economic growth to his or her proverbial resume.
xenophon

join:2007-09-17

Re: heh

Google will also be able to cross-reference viewing habits with other services, searches, wallet, g+ etc. They could sell data to advertisers that people watching xyz show is also buying these products from G Wallet or is searching xyz things.

They could come up with a method for advertisers to launch a website on the remote (Nexus tablet) when the TV ad appears, allowing viewer to impulse buy directly from tablet using G Wallet. That's far more powerful for advertisers than what trad broadcasters can do.
prairiesky

join:2008-12-08
canada
kudos:2

Re: heh

and you guys are okay/ welcoming this behavior?

I'm sticking by the old adage, if it's too good to be true it probably is.

you have to ask whats being given up if someone is giving you something for less than everyone else.

IowaCowboy
Iowa native
Premium
join:2010-10-16
Springfield, MA
Reviews:
·Verizon Broadban..
·Comcast

I wish we had Time Warner in town

I wish Time Warner would buy the cable system in Springfield, MA and the surrounding communities. I have experience with Comcast (my house) and Time Warner (grandma's house in Maine) and Time Warner is cheaper and they have somewhat better customer service. I would also like to see Charter given the boot in the towns around here they serve. Many of the locals here say that Charter is the Worst of the Worst around here and luckily I at least have Comcast in town where I live. Even the mayor of Chicopee blasted Charter.
--
I wish I still lived in Iowa; Everything there from rent and groceries to Cable TV is much cheaper in Iowa (especially with an overbuilder in town).

binded

@clearwire-wmx.net

google fiber

every single person that post on here about google and the price and so forth every single one of you seem to forget what this whole google fiber is really about

its abobut google getting real numbers about what it REALLY cost as all the phone and cable companys spew grabage details about what the bandwidth cost "aka" why they need to cap your connections
why they can only offer such speeds
why they MUST throddle your connections
what it really cost to install and manage a network the size of a city
what sort of services they can offer over the top

there is many many data numbers that is very very useful to them even if they are losing money although they have stated that they dont plan on losing money like that

this is all very good info for them to collect as it disproves alot of the bull shit that the phone cable companys been claiming

maybe down the road they figure out that they can do this server in every major city across the USA
maybe in to rural areas as well

you people are so short sighted and just talk about all this trash every one else keeps repeating but yet forget what and why google them selfs have said why they are doing this

just so every one remembers verizon didnt get the pricing down on installs till they got bendable fiber

batterup
I Can Not Tell A Lie.
Premium
join:2003-02-06
Netcong, NJ

Re: google fiber

said by binded :

its abobut google getting real numbers about what it REALLY cost as all the phone and cable companys spew grabage details about what the bandwidth cost "aka" why they need to cap your connections

Point of order; Google did not have to buy the mayor a swimming pool. Google is evil and the damned love them.

dbmaven
There's no shortage
Premium,Mod
join:1999-10-26
Sty in Sky
kudos:3

(topic offline) jiop

Moderator Action
This entire topic was removed, either temporarily, or permanently.

stated reason was: Cleanup

DougKeel

@mchsi.com

I recall...

...similar comments about Tampa as GTE, now Verizon, built their first fiber network over TWC. It was said that GTE would get a lot of TWC's bad debt cut-offs and TWC's former (implied "unproductive or problem") employees. The sentiment was the overbuilder would therefore have limited success and eventually go away. As we're all aware with the development of FiOS in the 15 years since, the more products that are offered to consumers (subs), the more viable overbuilds have become.

I will not be surprised if KC is Google's version of TWC's Maitland, a product incubator. I anticipate a Google roll-out of market-wide paid/discounted wireless network access that dents metro cell phone data plans. If so, where will cable/telecom be in another 15 years?

JLMarcoux

@rogers.com

Disruption: the Internet Access Black Swan

Google introduces a new paradigm and the "Kansas City Experiment" as it may be known is a game changer. This can be construed almost as a "Black swan" or an offering that could not exist or even be imagined. Customers will now be asking : Why is a company capable of such speeds at THAT price with NO caps? The mere fact that people may be envious of Kansas City as an Internet High-Speed-Low-Price Heaven is an indication that there are at least customers who discovered the “Black Swan of Internet Access”. Telcos and Cablecos will be faced with tremendous challenges to provide speed(upload and download) and lower prices.

JLMarcoux

@rogers.com

An Inernet Black Swan

Google introduces a new paradigm and the "Kansas City Experiment" as it may be known is a game changer. This can be construed almost as a "Black swan" or an offering that could not exist or even be imagined. Customers will now be asking : Why is a company capable of such speeds at THAT price with NO caps? The mere fact that people may be envious of Kansas City as an Internet High-Speed-Low-Price Heaven is an indication that there are at least customers who discovered the “Black Swan if Internet Access”. Telcos and Cablecos will be faced with tremendous challenges to provide speed(upload and download) and lower prices.