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Comments on news posted 2012-09-17 10:44:29: Speaking at an investor conference last week, Verizon stated that customers can expect yet more price hikes for their popular fiber to the home FiOS services. ..

page: 1 · 2 · next
PastTense

join:2011-07-06
united state

If FIOS raises prices, why switch?

If FIOS raises prices, why would people switch from cable to FIOS? People can clearly see lower prices, while all businesses talk about their product being superior. This new strategy will simply result in a low market share for FIOS.
FloridaBoy

join:2009-06-22
Bradenton, FL

Re: If FIOS raises prices, why switch?

It really is unbelieveable. This makes me wonder what he is smokin to think this is a good idea.

seamore
Premium
join:2009-11-02

Re: If FIOS raises prices, why switch?

The things people say to make money.

mikedz4

join:2003-04-14
Weirton, WV

Re: If FIOS raises prices, why switch?

this from the same guy who also said people don't need unlimited data on their cell phones and people like their new share everything plans.
What he forgot to account for is the people who lost unlimited when they upgraded.
tdar

join:2004-04-05
Satellite Beach, FL
kudos:1
said by FloridaBoy:

It really is unbelieveable. This makes me wonder what he is smokin to think this is a good idea.

He's smokin the newly installed Wall Street air they have filled the HQ with. What exactly is a "price up". These people can't even speak English, they think they are so superior to their customers they invent words to try to bs us, as if we are so stupid that we won't know what they are really saying. Maybe it's the fact that the last guy to have his job was paid $9,793,921.00 a year, I'm sure he's getting even more.

Mike
Premium,Mod
join:2000-09-17
Pittsburgh, PA
kudos:1
Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS
As much as I hate to say it... VZ is raising rate at a slower frequency than Comcast.

FiOS also demolishes Comcast in transmission quality, at least in my area.

So I guess the lesson is either cut the cord or bend over and take it .
--
"If something about the human body disgusts you, complain to the manufacturer" - Lenny Bruce
What this country needs is a good five dollar plasma weapon.
elefante72

join:2010-12-03
East Amherst, NY
No surprise. This is business 101. Get traction, raise prices, introduce gaps in preferential pricing. Every beef on this thread is exactly what Verizon wants.

With that said, Verizon sunk a lot of capital into my GPON, and TWC is busy plastering my mailbox w/ $89 deals w/ a whole home DVR for free. When my NO CONTRACT price lock expires in Jan, you bet I will be having a stocking stuffer of either VZ or TWC. They are commodities to me, nothing more.

I think Verizon made a big mistake in running B/GPON's and they know it. They should have run Ethernet optical SW/copper and handled optical at the node level. That way they wouldn't have to keep swapping equipment at the prem, or if they do, just a transceiver/router.

The sooner these yoyos understand they are simple commodities the better. Since I use only a cable card, I just swap it out and reprogram the channels. Now for $10 a month I'm not going to move, but for $30, suck eggs.

BTW - I'm perfectly happy w/ my 25/25. It serves my needs. But alas Verizon is not happy, and who cares about the customer?

I think Verizon got caught flat footed on how quickly the dinosaur cable companies rolled out D3 and ate their DSL and FIOS lunch. As I said they are commodities...Perfectly fungible. So the quants decided that 30% penetration was all they were going to get, so slowly turn up the heat to maximize profits.
jjeffeory

join:2002-12-04
USA

Re: If FIOS raises prices, why switch?

The GPON is the best solution. Get rid of copper completely!

fifty nine

join:2002-09-25
Sussex, NJ
kudos:2
said by PastTense:

If FIOS raises prices, why would people switch from cable to FIOS? People can clearly see lower prices, while all businesses talk about their product being superior. This new strategy will simply result in a low market share for FIOS.

So you can feel extra special because the fiber goes all the way to your home instead of to the node on the street?

sholling
Premium
join:2002-02-13
Hemet, CA
kudos:1
Once you have FiOS installed they cut the copper line and there is no going back to DSL so it's FiOS or cable from one of Verizon's partners in the cable business. Verizon has always had a policy of never competing on price - only on the quality of their services. They expect to charge premium prices for a best of breed service and now that the footprint expansion is over it's time to kick back and rake in the money. I don't mind paying for quality but will cut back on services rather than exceed my budget - I've reached the limit of what I'm willing to pay for TV and internet and will get by with lower speeds and fewer channels once my contract is up.

The price hikes are also the result of a cable/telecom duopoly acting in collusion to bring you higher prices for less service and it's only going to get worse as long as they are allowed to "partner" instead of being encouraged to compete. If there was actual competition cable wouldn't dare cap data and neither would dare raise prices.
--
"Government is the great fiction, through which everybody endeavors to live at the expense of everybody else."
--FREDERIC BASTIAT--

N3OGH
Yo Soy Col. "Bat" Guano
Premium
join:2003-11-11
Philly burbs
kudos:2

Re: If FIOS raises prices, why switch?

I have Fios and I still have 2 copper lines running into my house.....
--
Petty people are disproportionally corrupted by petty power

sholling
Premium
join:2002-02-13
Hemet, CA
kudos:1

Re: If FIOS raises prices, why switch?

It's rare and has been. They let me keep copper phone lines with FiOS TV for a bit but once I went to fios internet and canceled phone service they cut the copper. I asked them not to but they did it anyway. It's SOP to cut the copper.
--
"Government is the great fiction, through which everybody endeavors to live at the expense of everybody else."
--FREDERIC BASTIAT--
Expand your moderator at work
zippoboy7

join:2006-06-18
USA

More rediculus pricing

This makes me glad I locked my 150/65 triple play in for the 2 year price, luckily for me after I dumped HBO the price of my package only went up about $10 a month. Maybe sometime in the next 2 years this guy will lay off his crack pipe and realize these price hikes are just idiotic.

cdru
Go Colts
Premium,MVM
join:2003-05-14
Fort Wayne, IN
kudos:7

Re: More rediculus pricing

said by zippoboy7:

This makes me glad I locked my 150/65 triple play

Rediculus[sic]? Isn't that kind of like complaining about pricing when buying a Ferrari?

Noah Vail
Son made my Avatar
Premium
join:2004-12-10
Lorton, VA
kudos:3
Reviews:
·Bright House

1 recommendation

Before some says "The Value is in Bundles!"

I'd like to offer that there are plenty of folks who buy just broadband. There's no meaningful reason to marginalize us.

That said, I can currently get Vz 130/65 for ~$105 (standalone, no contract) - a reasonable price for that tier.

Maybe we'll settle into a scenario where Cable serves the lowest income brackets and Vz sells to everyone else.
That's not really competition but it's somewhat better than the duopoly-lock that the FCC considers competitive.
--
Campaign contributions influence laws through a process called bribery.
Crookshanks

join:2008-02-04
Binghamton, NY

Re: Before some says "The Value is in Bundles!"

said by Noah Vail:

I'd like to offer that there are plenty of folks who buy just broadband. There's no meaningful reason to marginalize us.

It's a greater ROI from their perspective for the same amount of capital investment. That fiber drop costs them the same amount of money regardless of whether you use it for one service or three. When you use it for multiple services they gain additional revenue that can be used both to maintain/expand the network and keep their investors happy.

Personally, I don't think they should be able to compel bundling (as they are doing with DSL/POTS), but there's no reason why they shouldn't be able to charge more for unbundled services. It sucks, but they have the right to maximize their ROI, the same as any other private enterprise.
JoeSchmoe007
Premium
join:2003-01-19
Brooklyn, NY
Reviews:
·Optimum Online
·Callcentric
·Verizon FiOS

1 edit

It just doesn't make sense.

Why does Verizon think their 15/5 is worth $70 when Cablevision provides 20/2 for $30 (or 50/8 for $45)? I switched from FIOS to OOL 20/2 when my promo expired. I know $30 is OOL promo rate but even their regular rate is much cheaper (I think it is $45 or $50). Plus people report that often OOL gives discounts after promo is over. When I called Verizon FIOS the attitude was "don't let the door hit you on your way out".

danclan

join:2005-11-01
Midlothian, VA

Re: It just doesn't make sense.

I think someone at FiOS just failed business 101....
tanzam75

join:2012-07-19

Re: It just doesn't make sense.

said by danclan:

I think someone at FiOS just failed business 101....

Hardly.

Verizon simply does not want unbundled customers, and they've set their pricing to make sure of that. They charge $70 for 15/5, but just $80 for 15/5 plus TV, and $85 for triple-play. (Note: prices are pre-tax.)

The Cablevision equivalent would be $50 for 20/2, plus another $60 for Optimum Value TV ($65 - $5 bundle discount), plus another $35 for Optimum Voice. New customers can get a triple-play bundle for $90 for a year, but the normal price is $145.

Cablevision is cheaper for: (1) People who want broadband without the bundle (2) People who move frequently and can keep getting new customer discounts (3) People who like to haggle over the phone to get better deals.

But FiOS is cheaper for everyone else. If you buy a bundle, if you've bought a house and will be staying put for 10 years, if you dislike haggling over the phone with Cablevision's sales reps.

Never underestimate how different the average American is from the average DSLReports reader.

danclan

join:2005-11-01
Midlothian, VA

Re: It just doesn't make sense.

I'm not but in the current case of decreasing or no disposable income, Verzion is driving customers away with constant noise of price increases regardless of perceived or real savings.

Every one wants bundled contracted customers, for the simple reason is that they can book that cash flow.
15444104
Premium
join:2012-06-11

Re: It just doesn't make sense.

That is the issue, these brASS tacks that occupy executive offices at these big companies have COMPLETELY lost touch with the market they are serving. Sure there are a few percent of the population whose incomes are rising and those households can spend endlessly on luxuries like high speed internet, while the VAST MAJORITY increasingly cannot.

These CEOs need to get their heads out of the Wall Street Grand Ass and come back to reality.
JoeSchmoe007
Premium
join:2003-01-19
Brooklyn, NY
Reviews:
·Optimum Online
·Callcentric
·Verizon FiOS
said by tanzam75:

said by danclan:

I think someone at FiOS just failed business 101....

Hardly.

Verizon simply does not want unbundled customers, and they've set their pricing to make sure of that. They charge $70 for 15/5, but just $80 for 15/5 plus TV, and $85 for triple-play. (Note: prices are pre-tax.)

The Cablevision equivalent would be $50 for 20/2, plus another $60 for Optimum Value TV ($65 - $5 bundle discount), plus another $35 for Optimum Voice. New customers can get a triple-play bundle for $90 for a year, but the normal price is $145.

Cablevision is cheaper for: (1) People who want broadband without the bundle (2) People who move frequently and can keep getting new customer discounts (3) People who like to haggle over the phone to get better deals.

But FiOS is cheaper for everyone else. If you buy a bundle, if you've bought a house and will be staying put for 10 years, if you dislike haggling over the phone with Cablevision's sales reps.

Never underestimate how different the average American is from the average DSLReports reader.

It needs to be pointed out that Verizon $85 for 3-play is also a promotional price.

williewonk

@173.245.64.x

Re: It just doesn't make sense.

you have to understand on tv weather fios or cable or dish they all pay for the channels per subscriber so they dont make any money on tv they make it on internet and telephone. Thats it.
tanzam75

join:2012-07-19

1 edit
said by JoeSchmoe007:

It needs to be pointed out that Verizon $85 for 3-play is also a promotional price.

What's the real price? I can't find it on Verizon's website. (Cablevision, to their credit, is more up-front about it -- they have a link right under the promo offers.)

If you select "2-Year Contract," they offer you $85 Triple Play for two years. If you select "No Contract," they offer you the same $85 Triple Play, but with a one-year guarantee.

The main difference vs. Cablevision is: you don't have to call up and haggle after one year. Many people hate haggling, hate switching back and forth, and hate having to keep an eye on prices and offers. To do it half as often is quite worthwhile for them.
JoeSchmoe007
Premium
join:2003-01-19
Brooklyn, NY
Reviews:
·Optimum Online
·Callcentric
·Verizon FiOS

Re: It just doesn't make sense.

$85 3-play probably includes at least $25-30 in discounts valid for duration of contract (before taxes).

As far as not having to call up and haggle - not sure what you mean. My price for FIOS internet +Phone went from $50 to $75 (before taxes/fees which is about 10%). I wouldn't call it "slightly more". As a result of my switch to CV my price will now be about $35 total (phone+internet).
tanzam75

join:2012-07-19

Re: It just doesn't make sense.

said by JoeSchmoe007:

$85 3-play probably includes at least $25-30 in discounts valid for duration of contract (before taxes).

As far as not having to call up and haggle - not sure what you mean. My price for FIOS internet +Phone went from $50 to $75 (before taxes/fees which is about 10%). I wouldn't call it "slightly more". As a result of my switch to CV my price will now be about $35 total (phone+internet).

But $75 is the current price for FiOS Internet + Phone. They may have had a $50 price when you signed up, but they do not at present. They just offer $75 -- to you as well as to a new customer. How much more "no-haggling" can you get?

As I stated, Cablevision's non-promotional price is $50 for 20/2 Optimum Online, plus $35 for Optimum Voice. That's $85.

At $75 + 10% tax = $82.50, Verizon is not even "slightly more" -- it is "slightly less."

Now, if there were some other FiOS price that's higher than $75 + tax, then that would change the equation. But if this is the actual price, then you're basically comparing FiOS's actual price to Cablevision's promo price.

I happen to pay the same $35 that you pay -- but I also realize that I'm unusual. 85% of Americans subscribe to pay TV. For them, double-play is Internet + TV, not Internet + phone.
JoeSchmoe007
Premium
join:2003-01-19
Brooklyn, NY
Reviews:
·Optimum Online
·Callcentric
·Verizon FiOS

Re: It just doesn't make sense.

Of course I didn't intend to compare OOL promo rate directly with FIOS regular rate. My original post deals with my specific situation. As a result FIOS lost a customer altogether.

That being said, regular OOL rate is $50 for 20/2 and FIOS is $70 for 15/5 which is still quite a difference ($240/year).
openbox9
Premium
join:2004-01-26
Germany
kudos:2

1 edit
Because it's all about the fiber VZ will continue to ride the FiOS brand until it doesn't work. VZ is simply continuing its premier branding, just as it does with its wireless division. For most consumers, the means of transmission is irrelevant. Important are things like "speed" and cost, as you allude to, but VZ has done a great job of branding FiOS as superior.
Skippy25

join:2000-09-13
Hazelwood, MO

1 recommendation

Re: It just doesn't make sense.

Just like people will pay more for Monster Cable, though their quality is no better than any other typical cable and pay for Bose speakers when any audiophile will tell you they are no better than any other speaker.

It is marketing. Once they have established themselves as being superior quality through marketing the price becomes less relevant to the consumer and they will "hear and see" better quality because they want to. Not because it is really there.

willie wonk

@173.245.64.x
verizon owns very little of verizon wireless it is owned mostly by GTE

aaronwt
Premium
join:2004-11-07
Woodbridge, VA

Re: It just doesn't make sense.

said by willie wonk :

verizon owns very little of verizon wireless it is owned mostly by GTE

?????
Verizon Wireless is 55% owned by Verizon and 45% owned by Vodafone(A British telcom company).

Bottom line though is that Verizon Wireless is a separate company from Verizon Communications.
elray

join:2000-12-16
Santa Monica, CA
Reviews:
·Time Warner Cable
·EarthLink
said by JoeSchmoe007:

Why does Verizon think their 15/5 is worth $70 when Cablevision provides 20/2 for $30 (or 50/5 for $45)?

Why? Because 30% of the population (and likely 90% of this forum) is willing to pay $70/month for they perceive to be a superior product.
Kalphiter

join:2012-06-28
Metuchen, NJ
Just a clarification, it's 50/8 and usually I see 59/8.1
jjeffeory

join:2002-12-04
USA
You're correct. The pricing at that level isn't worth it. It's all about the upsell and branding....

pnh102
Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty
Premium
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD

No Problem

Those of you who have the option of cable or FIOS would probably be able to take advantage of cable's new subscriber rates should this happen... and once those rates expire, FIOS might give you a similar new customer rate. Lather, rinse, repeat every year.

If your spouse or significant other has a different last name than you, then this becomes even easier to do.
--
Romney/Ryan 2012 - Put a couple of mature adults in charge.
tmc8080

join:2004-04-24
Brooklyn, NY
Reviews:
·ooma
·Optimum Online
·Verizon FiOS

1 edit

losing customers

higher prices will equal lost customers. in NY metro 15/2 is not $70 standalone.. it's actually higher (I checked) and for that price they might as well go out of business because they're saying we don't want you as a customer when their nearest competitor offers a price at less than half that (as a new customer for a year) and even off promotion a cable 15mbit tier is upwards of $20 cheaper.. why bother? what's is gonna be next, $100 for 15/2?

gimme a break.. cling to those rate locks while you have them.. because it's likely you will have to switch when the time is up.. verizon doesn't generally extend offers that don't include a rate hike.. for nothing other than time goes by.. you pay more..

Don'cha wish paychecks did that too?
rradina

join:2000-08-08
Chesterfield, MO

Key Phrase

"On the revenue side of the house, we really concentrated this year on getting our price points equivalent to where the rest of the market was,"
Once installed, I thought FIOS was supposed to be cheaper than alternatives. If the maintenance is lower, shouldn't FIOS prices be lower than cable? Is the quality difference sufficient to justify higher prices? Does the average consumer notice the difference? Do they even know what the difference is? If not, why would they pay the same or more vs. a competitor?

Whatever happened to the business with better quality and lower costs gaining market share and forcing competitors to respond or go under? Given the limited footprint and massive capital investment, why wouldn't Verizon want to own as many subscribers in their FIOS areas as possible? Why would they be content settling for their current ROI based on "...price points equivalent to the rest of the market..."? Perhaps the leader is too young to understand paper route economics where delivery expenses are nearly fixed regardless of how many houses get a paper.

•••••••••••••••••••••••••

skeechan
Ai Otsukaholic
Premium
join:2012-01-26
AA169|170
kudos:2

Raise prices...

...that will spur adoption!

wdoa

join:2001-10-16
Spencer, MA

implied collusion with the Cable Cos

It's pretty clear hear that Verizon is signalling to the Cable Cos that they also have the all clear to double down on price hikes. If they both keep jacking up the rates, there really is no alternative except to do without. This is the same company that recently implemented the gougtastic "share everything" pricing scheme on the Wireless side of the house. What we are seeing is the end of the "golden age of the internet" and full service will in the future only be for the 1%. It's a natural progression when you have a system that has at most only 2 providers in the vast majority of the country. You can get screwed by company A or you can get screwed by company B. Your choice.
JoeSchmoe007
Premium
join:2003-01-19
Brooklyn, NY

Re: implied collusion with the Cable Cos

As much as I hate to admit it you may be right.

greedyhurys

@blackberry.net

greed hurts

Companys think riasing prises will do them good in the long run it won't with out giving the customers somthing back like more speed they will lose some customers doing this give us a free upgrade to the n router or give us 20-20 speed greed wil hurt the company

tlylework

@steadfastdns.net

Does anyone remember Long distance costs?

If you remember back in the day it used to cost you an arm and a leg for long distance. It was easy, just don't make the call. I for one am beginning to think curling up to a nice book is looking much better, and cheaper.
jbjetta
Premium
join:2004-07-23
Manassas, VA

1 recommendation

They are just a commodity as its already been stated

I could care less about the packages. For me internet connectivity is a pure commodity as is cable TV. I have two players in my area, comcast and fios. The cheaper of the 2 gets my business, but with the writing on the wall that they no longer want to compete and they pass the thresholds of what I am wiling to pay I will just cut the line. If work doesn't like that, they can pay the 65-70 a month for internet as I wont be.

I just can not justify the costs and really willing to deal without internet and cable completely as I feel the costs should be going down, not up as the cost per Mbit continues continues that trend as newer and faster interfaces and higher density DWDM continues to evolve and the cards are less expensive.
Os

join:2011-01-26
US

How does FiOS Expect to Increase Take Rate?

There's no way they can increase the take rate by raising the prices above Comcast/TWC. FiOS may be a premium product (I certainly believe it is), but the problem is most people don't care. They don't know anything about broadband speeds to warrant the higher Quantum tiers. All they care about is price, and when presented with an option of the cheap Triple Play new offers, why are they going to take Verizon?

It only fuels the fire of my belief that Verizon wants to kill FiOS by raising prices to help their wireless/cable collusion plan, then claim there's no market for fiber so they can get in on the AT&T/CenturyLink suits against community fiber, and destroy its marketability so the government takes it on, giving Verizon a bailout for it.

mech1164
I'll Be Back

join:2001-11-19
Lodi, NJ

Oh well,

I'm sadly a Cablevision captive here (behind ridge line no signal). We were one of the first towns to have FIOS, that is unless you are in an MDU (multiple dwelling unit). I would love to play both of them against each other. If I could afford to move (BTW Thanks Obama for nuthin there). I'd do it in a heartbeat.

Thing is Verizon is of the attitude that "WE WANT OUTTA WIRELINE ASAP". As of now this is just to maintain margin. One hope is that once Google gets the kinks out of it's deployment in KC it will do a National expansion. I know I know, but I can dream can't I?

••••

stevek1949
We're not in Kansas anymore
Premium
join:2002-11-13
Virginia Beach, VA

Not service increase cost, just equipment

Since most subscribers opt for a contract, the service rates are locked in for them. Granted, there are those that opt for no contract pricing. But the equipment rates are not locked in for anyone. I see some equipment price "adjustments" coming our way.

If so, I want a new router to replace my Rev. D Actiontec.

Greg2600

join:2008-05-20
Belleville, NJ

So two wrongs make a right?

Cable overprices, so Verizon says they must follow suit! Hilarious! But they have to find a way to bump up the stock price after all.
VerizonCynic

join:2006-10-25
Lakewood, CA
Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS

1 recommendation

like I said before

Speed, reliability price. Those are the factors. Not "fiber" vs "copper", Vz is selling BS in a bottle. I have had fios for 5 yrs now. I now have only the 15/5 for about 50 mo. Yes I cut the cable. I am on full do it your self VOIP via »obihai.com I will go with whoever has best speed and reliability for the best price. I really dont care who it is or what the cable looks like or even what the router/modem looks like. I am just thankful we have a little bit of competition here in my area. Not much. just a little Maybe this will be my new "dumb pipe" provider? »en.chinatelecom.com.cn/
--
Lakewood Accountability Action Group | »www.LAAG.us | Demanding action and accountability from local government
hszeto

join:2002-06-05

Re: like I said before

said by VerizonCynic:

Speed, reliability price. Those are the factors. Not "fiber" vs "copper", Vz is selling BS in a bottle. I have had fios for 5 yrs now. I now have only the 15/5 for about 50 mo. Yes I cut the cable. I am on full do it your self VOIP via »obihai.com I will go with whoever has best speed and reliability for the best price. I really dont care who it is or what the cable looks like or even what the router/modem looks like. I am just thankful we have a little bit of competition here in my area. Not much. just a little Maybe this will be my new "dumb pipe" provider? »en.chinatelecom.com.cn/

I am no far from you in Long Beach, California and fully agree with you.

Jackarino
YacCity
Premium
join:2006-12-28
Allendale, NJ
kudos:1

Do they want customers?

This is getting a little crazy, isn't the service already expensive enough??

dbmaven
There's no shortage
Premium,Mod
join:1999-10-26
Sty in Sky
kudos:3

(topic offline) dfv

Moderator Action
This entire topic was removed, either temporarily, or permanently.

stated reason was: Cleanup
fiberguy
My views are my own.
Premium
join:2005-05-20
kudos:3

I just want to quote...

... everyone that has ever said "I don't care what it (FiOS) costs, I will pay for it no matter what!"

Me: "That will be short lived.. just wait until they eventually raise the price"..

Jump to today... News Flash! Verizon keeps raising prices of FiOS!

Everyone: "What the hell.. this is pure crap!" bla bla bla..

hahaha.. I love something about this site.. I'm right about 95% of the time!