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Comments on news posted 2013-01-07 12:34:13: Netflix has now taken to ranking the nation's top-performing streaming ISPs each month. ..

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Kearnstd
Space Elf
Premium Member
join:2002-01-22
Mullica Hill, NJ

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Re: No benefit

FTTH will allow for more to happen at once over one connection. there is no one service that can swamp a Google 1gig connection yet.

However a bigger pipe means everybody in the house could be watching HD and not lag your gaming or if one only sees computer as a work tool, without lagging the VPN into the office.

jmn1207
Premium Member
join:2000-07-19
Sterling, VA

1 edit

1 recommendation

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Re: What Accounts for the Higher Score?

Has Netflix done anything to make sure the test results are not skewed by the type of content being streamed? A lot of their content is not available in HD, and I doubt these SD programs even approach 2 Mbps in streaming quality. If a bunch of low quality cartoons are being streamed, it might lower the overall results when compared to a higher quality HD action movie.

Clearly the overall results are nearly identical where subscriber numbers are reasonably equal, or at least above a certain threshold, but Google would have a significantly lower number of subscribers. Perhaps if Google had 100,000 subscribers then they too would be around 2 Mbps along with the rest of the crowd, due mostly to the type of content being streamed, and not necessarily the quality of the connection?

Edit: I'm seeing references to much lower MAXIMUM streaming for HD content.

»en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Netflix

"Streaming
Netflix streams HD content using Microsoft VC1AP encoding at a maximum bitrate of between 2600 kbit/s and 3800 kbit/s (depending on the movie).[200] A lower bitrate feed[201] may be supplied if the user's network connection is not capable of handling the maximum bitrate available for the film in question.
Netflix recommends that people stream its movies over a broadband connection with a speed of at least 1.5 megabits per second (1.5 Mbit/s), and that people use an Internet connection of at least 3 megabits per second to get better-looking video on par with a DVD.[202]
Netflix provides users the ability to choose their download rates / quality of video on their site (»account.netflix.com/Vide ··· uality)"

SADFSDFSF
@comcast.net

SADFSDFSF

Anon

WHO CARES!

Who cares about the best rating when movie selection is SUCK!!!!
rradina
join:2000-08-08
Chesterfield, MO

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Re: Nice data, no value however

How does NetFlix work? If they stream the content like cable On-Demand, it may never download the entire movie. I know the Apple TV downloads the whole movie and stores it for the duration of the rental period (which starts as soon as you play but not when you rent). Depending on the link speed, it take Apple TV 30 seconds to a few minutes before it says the movie is ready to watch. Although rare, sometimes it stops half way through the movie and has to buffer more content. When this happens, something goes wrong on the back-end servers as I have tested my HSI connection and it's fine. Generally I have to do something else for a few hours while waiting for it to finish downloading. (I can wait for 10 minutes and get a couple minutes of movie but this is even more frustrating).

As I said, this is rare but I've had it happen in the middle of action scenes and it makes me want to walk over to the Apple TV device, yank out all the wires and throw it into the fireplace. (One time I was really close but I then my brain pressed pause because there might be something in it that explodes resulting in hot coal burns in my carpet!)
rradina

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Re: Do WiFi Routers Have Impact?

Plenty of bandwidth except when more popcorn is requested.

Think about it for a moment. It will come to you. If you don't think WiFi could affect the results...well, I guess you are entitled to your opinion.
rradina

rradina to jmn1207

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Re: What Accounts for the Higher Score?

RE: More Comcast customers using NetFlix than FIOS.

Probably but what if more customers choose naked FIOS (no TV) vs. Comcast and choose Netflix to obtain video content.

One thing is for sure, there are so many variables here that it's difficult to understand what these numbers mean. In another post I questioned whether or not the CPE equipment has any impact. Are most using WiFi which can have various interference problems causing speeds to fall back if the transmission error rate gets too high? What about the players? Are they all created equal? Another poster mentioned they use their Bluray player and complained about a lot of buffering problems.

norbert26
Premium Member
join:2010-08-10
Warwick, RI

norbert26

Premium Member

Don't worry about it Netflix

Why is Netflix so concerned about the Best ISPs ? ISPs in most cases are cable companies that also provide legacy TV service which netflix disrupts. Netflix does NOT provide ISP service. That is the customer / subscribers responsibility to find an ISP and obtain service. Therefore netflix don't worry about how you are delivered to me i will decide if its good enough or not. If its not i will do something about it. Now stop wasting time and money ranking ISPs and add content or something that is productive .
giraffedata
join:2009-07-11
San Jose, CA

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Re: Netflix download

On my device at least, Netflix buffers about a minute in advance and nothing behind. I have always wished for an alternative where I could tell it in the morning what I wanted to watch and it would download it at its leisure during the day for certain, uninterrupted viewing when it is done. Besides letting me know before I start that I'll see the whole movie, this would make it feasible to skip forward and backward as I watch. As it is, I use DVDs by mail when I can because that has those characteristics.

dnoyeB
Ferrous Phallus
join:2000-10-09
Southfield, MI

dnoyeB

Member

Good Politics

This is a long way from Comcast messing around with bandwidth to Netflix. If Netflix is successful at getting people to rank ISP performance based on Netflix speed, they will have achieved their own blow for network neutrality.
BosstonesOwn
join:2002-12-15
Wakefield, MA

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Re: No benefit

Not true ! 10 gig between switch links are sfp+ cables
BosstonesOwn

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Re: WHO CARES!

No , movie selection sucks inside the us! for those of us who spend a lot of time outside the us , the selection is great !
NYGiants0
join:2012-08-31
united state

NYGiants0 to jmn1207

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Re: What Accounts for the Higher Score?

it is megabytes a second not megabits a second, i understand the confusion though

8 megabits = 1 megabyte
Ex: With 24.0 megabits per second you would be able to download 3 megabytes (of video or whatever you want) a second
silbaco
Premium Member
join:2009-08-03
USA

silbaco to Robert

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Re: No benefit

No. 2. is not true. It depends on the provider entirely. I have seen some providers selling download/upload at a 100/1 ratio over fiber.
silbaco

silbaco to norbert26

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Re: Don't worry about it Netflix

It's all about putting pressure on the ISPs. ISPs are not fans of Google. By putting Google first, it makes the other companies look bad despite there being other ftth providers with many times more customers and not making the list at all. Not many people have heard of them, so they would do Netflix no good in their war on ISPs.

These lists do not actually mean anything.
silbaco

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Re: Capt Obvious...

I know a multitude of cooperatives with more subscribers than Google Fiber, and offering ftth. They don't make the list. They don't fit in to the agenda.
big_e
join:2011-03-05

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Re: Don't worry about it Netflix

Quality of the ISP will also affect the quality of the netflix customer's viewing experience. If netflix is constantly rebuffering and has lower bitrates due to congestion at the ISP, guess who the typical non computer tech literate customer is going to blame first... Netflix. Netflix has to track average bitrate performance per ISP, per region to properly plan the expansion and configuration their content distribution net anyways. It doesn't take much effort to create and release a graph of the data they already collected and analyzed for internal use. Steering customers to ISPs that perform well with your product makes good business sense. I as a customer find this data useful to determine if my ISP is actually expanding speeds/capacity or are they letting their network congest and actually lowering speeds. Netflix need not put up and shut up with crappy ISPs. If naming and shaming gets them to clean up their act, so be it.

jmn1207
Premium Member
join:2000-07-19
Sterling, VA

jmn1207 to NYGiants0

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Re: What Accounts for the Higher Score?

Well, Netflix simply uses the acronym "Mbps", and I assumed that they meant megabits per second. The report shows "DEC. AVG SPEED FOR NETFLIX STREAMS (Mbps)". I can't believe they intend for this to mean megabytes per second when pertaining to average streams.

Unless you can find data to support it, I will maintain that this report is showing average megabits per second.
Skippy25
join:2000-09-13
Hazelwood, MO

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Re: No benefit

Fiber eats 10gig as a small snack between brunch and lunch.
Skippy25

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Re: Netflix download

In the beginning, I am pretty new to Netflix, I thought that was what their queuing of movies was for. Turns out, not so much. They just show up on top for you to pick and watch.
NYGiants0
join:2012-08-31
united state

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Re: What Accounts for the Higher Score?

This link explains

»www.abctrick.net/2012/11 ··· ing.html

jmn1207
Premium Member
join:2000-07-19
Sterling, VA

1 edit

jmn1207

Premium Member

I understand megabyte and megabit, this is not new to me. I'm saying that Netflix is using megabits in their report to show the average performance of their streams.

It does not make sense that Sprint, which shows an average of .59 in this month's report, would have an average Netflix stream of nearly 4800 kbps. I'm certain the report is using megabits per second, which would place an average stream at around 600 kbps for Sprint.

Vchat20
Landing is the REAL challenge
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join:2003-09-16
Columbus, OH

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Re: No benefit

said by silbaco:

No. 2. is not true. It depends on the provider entirely. I have seen some providers selling download/upload at a 100/1 ratio over fiber.

They sell those plans, but it is not a technical limitation. The tech is fully symmetrical by design. On the other hand, Cable and DSL are both asymmetrical by design and upload speeds there cannot go much higher than they are now.
bigred1324
join:2009-07-27
Fort Wayne, IN

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Re: Save it

said by FastLearner:

How about they take the money they spend on worthless rankings and spend it on more streaming CONTENT!!

They just announced a deal with Warner Bros. ... »goo.gl/cMdNt

Tony Horton
@sonic.net

Tony Horton

Anon

Pathetic AT&T

Look at how AT&T is consistently at the bottom of both mobile and home speed lists. I wonder if that NSA splice in SF is the cause of AT&T's poor performance.

aaronwt
Premium Member
join:2004-11-07
Woodbridge, VA
Asus RT-AX89

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Re: Do WiFi Routers Have Impact?

said by rradina:

I'm curious if these rankings consider the quality of the link's last ~200 feet. WiFi has to be used by a majority of folks. Does that skew the results?

I don't see how. We are only talking Netflix streaming bitrates. which are very low. Even 802.11g can handle that with no issues.

But personally on my wireless, I have no issues getting 150Mb/s speeds over wireless. Almost as fast as the 155Mb/s I can get over my wired connection to the internet. Netflix streaming bitrates aren't even 5% of that speed.
NoHereNoMo
join:2012-12-06

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Re: What Accounts for the Higher Score?

said by NYGiants0:

it is megabytes a second not megabits a second, i understand the confusion though

There's no confusion. Netflix uses "Mbps" (megabits per second) because that's the standard [notation] used for speed of a communications link. I myself average between 2 and 3 mbps with my FiOS connection when streaming from Netflix, so I can assure you--it is not "megabytes a second". (This has been covered a number of times before, here and elsewhere.)
rradina
join:2000-08-08
Chesterfield, MO

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Re: Do WiFi Routers Have Impact?

Not all WiFi networks are equal. As I said in another post, if more popcorn is needed while watching the movie, WiFi rates could drop through the floor -- perhaps all the way to 1Mbps with a lot of packet loss.
BosstonesOwn
join:2002-12-15
Wakefield, MA

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Re: No benefit

Ahhh I trunk Ports for Multiple of 10 gig on cisco for my storage gear, The core guys here have done it up to 80 gig as long as the switches support it.

Besides how many home users have 10 gig capable gear exactly? And how many ftth sellers have 10 gig ports on their home network gear ? Better yet how many offer a 10 gig option inside the service area ?

0 , in the datacenter 10 gig port are still pretty expensive and doing distance has to be fiber. sfp+ are really only for short interconnects and connecting the hosts to their switch. Incase you missed the sarcasm in the smiley.

aaronwt
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Woodbridge, VA
Asus RT-AX89

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Re: Do WiFi Routers Have Impact?

said by rradina:

Not all WiFi networks are equal. As I said in another post, if more popcorn is needed while watching the movie, WiFi rates could drop through the floor -- perhaps all the way to 1Mbps with a lot of packet loss.

Not on my WiFi network. Of course my 5Ghz devices have no issues, but I've never had a problem with my 2.4Ghz devices either. Although my Microwave nowhere near my 2.4Ghz APs and at least 15 feet from the nearest 2.4Ghz device.
rradina
join:2000-08-08
Chesterfield, MO

rradina

Member

But it does happen. I experience it. Want to beat a dead horse some more?
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