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Comments on news posted 2013-02-06 09:57:01: Charter Communications stock has surged this week on Wall Street rumors that the company is working on some kind of significant merger or acquisition. ..

page: 1 · 2 · next


Metatron2008
Premium
join:2008-09-02
united state

If anything charter might be BUYING

Not selling. Otherwise this makes no sense..

openbox9
Premium
join:2004-01-26
Germany
kudos:2

How exactly?

said by Karl Bode:

Add to that a consolidation in the number of major cable players, and you've got a recipe for even less competition moving forward.

How exactly does allowing non-competing cable providers merge reduce competition?


Komo Misomo

@apexcovantage.com
AT&T, Verizon, Cox, Comcast, Charter, Time Warner Cable

becomes

Comcast, Charter Warner Cable, Cox

The point being made in terms of overall consolidation resulting in even less competition is not complicated.


bobjohnson
Premium
join:2007-02-03
Orlando, FL
Reviews:
·AT&T U-Verse
·T-Mobile US
reply to Metatron2008

Re: If anything charter might be BUYING

said by Metatron2008:

Not selling. Otherwise this makes no sense..

Charter is not really big, or really good. There are reasons they've been streamlining operations and changing all sorts of things around. It really wouldn't make a difference either way.

ame101

join:2002-05-02
Southington, CT

Not shocked.

Stuff has been up with Charter in CT, would not be shocked.


anon anon

@charter.com
reply to Komo Misomo

Re: How exactly?

said by Komo Misomo :

AT&T, Verizon, Cox, Comcast, Charter, Time Warner Cable

becomes

Comcast, Charter Warner Cable, Cox

The point being made in terms of overall consolidation resulting in even less competition is not complicated.

It's not less competition. For example there are ZERO areas where Charter and Cox compete for customers. And if a merger happens it make sense for these 2 to do it than have Time Warner involved. Cox is privately owned and would not need to ask shareholder permission or accpetance to get bought out or merge with Charter.


Komo Misomo

@sunwave.com.br
Nobody is saying cable operators compete with each other. But AT&T and Verizon's exit from DSL and the further consolidation of cable operators does mean even less competition and higher rates. Anyone arguing otherwise, or denying the problems inherent in just three or four major companies controlling a nationwide market is smoking some very lovely ISP industry employee reefer.


Komo Misomo

@sunwave.com.br
reply to bobjohnson

Re: If anything charter might be BUYING

Yeah I don't see an acquisition or merger with any of the other inattentive, investment-phobic operators resulting in anything good.


jgkolt
Premium
join:2004-02-21
Avon, OH

think smaller

Maybe they are looking to buy(or be sold) by one of the smaller communication companies like windstream, centurytel, etc.

Chubbysumo

join:2009-12-01
Superior, WI
Reviews:
·Charter

good ol stock bumping

I wonder who is selling out their portion of the stock, because charter does not have the assets, or the credibility to even sell themselves right now, so this is nothing more than stock fluffing, and if they do sell, it would probably be a bad thing.


anon anon

@charter.com
reply to Komo Misomo

Re: How exactly?

said by Komo Misomo :

Nobody is saying cable operators compete with each other. But AT&T and Verizon's exit from DSL and the further consolidation of cable operators does mean even less competition and higher rates. Anyone arguing otherwise, or denying the problems inherent in just three or four major companies controlling a nationwide market is smoking some very lovely ISP industry employee reefer.

Once again how would a Cox, Charter merger effect competition? At&t and Verizon are going to do what they do regardless. You're not making much sense. Also and maybe just a coincidence but in most Charter areas the main telco is at&T and same thing goes with Cox. So really this would have zero effect on Verizon either way.

On the TV side a Charter/Cox merger would still be much smaller than Comcast, TW, DirecTv and Dish Network. And be less of an issue for approval than say a Charter/TW merger.


anon anon

@charter.com
reply to Chubbysumo

Re: good ol stock bumping

said by Chubbysumo:

I wonder who is selling out their portion of the stock, because charter does not have the assets, or the credibility to even sell themselves right now, so this is nothing more than stock fluffing, and if they do sell, it would probably be a bad thing.

Why would they need to fluff their stock? Even before this talk came about the stock had been up 30% over the past year.


Komo Misomo

@apexcovantage.com
reply to anon anon

Re: How exactly?

I think you're being intentionally obtuse.

There's about a thousand studies out there highlighting how market consolidation, and/or the reduction in number of overall market gatekeepers reduces competition and harms consumers -- regardless of whether or not Comcast competes with Cox directly.

Read one.


hdman
Flt Rider
Premium
join:2003-11-25
Appleton, WI
Reviews:
·exede by ViaSat

Something needs to happen...

Charter is horrible in my area. Being bought by TWC who covers the area all around us might not be a bad thing at all. Couldn't get worse, thats for sure.....
--
The proper way to break in a Harley: Grab a fist full of throttle, and ride it like you stole it!!!


FFH5
Premium
join:2002-03-03
Tavistock NJ
kudos:5
reply to openbox9

Re: How exactly?

said by openbox9:

said by Karl Bode:

Add to that a consolidation in the number of major cable players, and you've got a recipe for even less competition moving forward.

How exactly does allowing non-competing cable providers merge reduce competition?

True. There is very little over-building in cable areas. Except for WOW and where FIOS TV is available, there is little to no competition at the street level for cable companies.
--
A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves money from the public treasury.

JPL
Premium
join:2007-04-04
Downingtown, PA
kudos:4

1 recommendation

reply to Komo Misomo
said by Komo Misomo :

I think you're being intentionally obtuse.

There's about a thousand studies out there highlighting how market consolidation, and/or the reduction in number of overall market gatekeepers reduces competition and harms consumers -- regardless of whether or not Comcast competes with Cox directly.

Read one.

Maybe I'm obtuse too, because I think you're missing it. Their footprints don't overlap. If I'm in a Charter market, my choices for broadband suppliers doesn't go down because of this merger. They stay exactly the same. If they competed in the same market you would have a point. But they don't. You're not reducing providers in any market if this merger were to happen.


FFH5
Premium
join:2002-03-03
Tavistock NJ
kudos:5
said by JPL:

said by Komo Misomo :

I think you're being intentionally obtuse.

There's about a thousand studies out there highlighting how market consolidation, and/or the reduction in number of overall market gatekeepers reduces competition and harms consumers -- regardless of whether or not Comcast competes with Cox directly.

Read one.

Maybe I'm obtuse too, because I think you're missing it. Their footprints don't overlap. If I'm in a Charter market, my choices for broadband suppliers doesn't go down because of this merger. They stay exactly the same. If they competed in the same market you would have a point. But they don't. You're not reducing providers in any market if this merger were to happen.

I agree with you, but you are missing his point - that being big alone is bad all by itself. It is all part of the philosophy some have that big corporations are all evil and that bigger is more evil.
--
A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves money from the public treasury.


IowaCowboy
Iowa native
Premium
join:2010-10-16
Springfield, MA
kudos:1
Reviews:
·Verizon Broadban..
·Comcast

Good riddance

I think Charter may be on the brink of collapse. A few years ago, Charter had to file chapter 11 bankruptcy and almost ended up in chapter 7 liquidation. I would actually like to see Charter go out of business as I live in an area that is dominated by Charter and Comcast (fortunately I'm on the Comcast side of the Ludlow bridge) and many of the locals who've dealt with both Charter and Comcast say Charter is worse. I'd like to see either Time Warner or Mediacom come to town. Time Warner has better support while Comcast has better technology.
--
I've experienced ImOn (when they were McLeod USA), Mediacom, Comcast, and Time Warner. They are much better than broadcast TV.

I have not and will not cut the cord.


mikesterr

join:2008-04-18
Atco, NJ
reply to anon anon

Re: How exactly?

While I agree they don't directly over lap coverage areas, I seem to remember that each municipality has a specific contract with a particular Cable operator. Periodically those contracts come up for renewal, so in the case of a Cable merger the Townships now have less choices for their particular town. That being said I don't think I have ever heard of a town kicking the incumbent provider out.


Komo Misomo

@sunwave.com.br
reply to FFH5
No, I'm not simply saying that bigger is naturally bad and evil, trolling smart ass.

I'm saying there's an ocean of data showing that consolidation, even if companies don't directly compete, has a direct impact on overall competition, opinion diversity, service quality, customer support. When you combine cable consolidation with Verizon and AT&T's decision to hang up on tens of millions of customers, you run into massive issues. When you consolidate mindlessly customer support always suffers.

I'm glad some of you think that's something people should be cheering about.

We'll see how glib and obtuse some of you are when your only choice is Cox. I swear to god, people on this website love cheerleading against their own best interests.

openbox9
Premium
join:2004-01-26
Germany
kudos:2
reply to Komo Misomo
Your math is inaccurate. As a basic example, take a municipality that has AT&T and Charter as the comfortable duopoly. Then, let Charter be acquired by Cox. Now the comfortable duopoly in that municipality is AT&T and Cox. How did the competitive landscape in the municipality change by an MSO being acquired by another?


TSWYO
Premium
join:2003-05-03
Cheyenne, WY

1 edit
reply to Komo Misomo

Re: If anything charter might be BUYING

Wasnt Charter in the mix for an Optimum West purchase, which is to be announced sometime this month?

»Charter May Buy Cablevision's Western Networks


Komo Misomo

@jillyred.net
reply to openbox9

Re: How exactly?

AT&T leaves the market because they don't want to upgrade DSL.

Charter merges with Cox and Time Warner Cable, creating a national geographical monopoly, no longer feebly checked by a telco competitor that's so powerful, it enjoys regulator capture and elbowing out any future competitors.

The result is....

...not more competition...

but.....


anon anon

@charter.com
reply to Komo Misomo
said by Komo Misomo :

No, I'm not simply saying that bigger is naturally bad and evil, trolling smart ass.

I'm saying there's an ocean of data showing that consolidation, even if companies don't directly compete, has a direct impact on overall competition, opinion diversity, service quality, customer support. When you combine cable consolidation with Verizon and AT&T's decision to hang up on tens of millions of customers, you run into massive issues. When you consolidate mindlessly customer support always suffers.

I'm glad some of you think that's something people should be cheering about.

We'll see how glib and obtuse some of you are when your only choice is Cox. I swear to god, people on this website love cheerleading against their own best interests.

Do I have choice between Charter and Cox now? Nope. Just Charter. A merger between them does not effect this one iota.

Using your logic if say you took Comcast, TWC, Cox, Charter and broke them up into say 25 small regional companies but none of them competed with each other just like they don't now, then your logic says this would be good for customers and result in better service and lower prices. I beg to differ.

This isn't like if DirecTv and DishNetwork were to merge. Then you are reducing competition. Also a combined Charter/Cox would still be half the size of Time Warner Cable and 1/3 the size of Comcast.


anon anon

@charter.com
reply to mikesterr
Charter and Cox would never be in contention for any towns services. Cable companies like to be somewhat regional so they a aren't just go in to one town where they have no other service for hundreds of miles. The nearest Cox area to me is 400 miles away. So Cox would never come here. Now Comcast would because they are in the next county 10 miles away.

All that being say Charter has been here for over a dozen year. before that we had Time Warner for just 2 years before they thought us to unworthy they sold us off to Charter. So I find ironic if they were to merge with Charter and have us again after dumping us.


anon anon

@charter.com
reply to Komo Misomo
said by Komo Misomo :

AT&T leaves the market because they don't want to upgrade DSL.

Charter merges with Cox and Time Warner Cable, creating a national geographical monopoly, no longer feebly checked by a telco competitor that's so powerful, it enjoys regulator capture and elbowing out any future competitors.

The result is....

...not more competition...

but.....

Do you actually believe that?


anon anon

@charter.com
reply to IowaCowboy

Re: Good riddance

They came out of that and their stock is but over 30% in the last year. They have made heavy investments in infrastructure in the last couple of years. They have just recent sign several retrans agreements. Doesn't could like a company abut to fold or be taken over. If you are about to sell yourself you don't make retrans agreements that span several years and cost millions of dollars. Especially if you selling to somone like TWC which already has said agreements so these retrans agreements are not necessary.

As I said Cox is a private company. ZERO stockholders. It would be very easy to sell out to Charter.


DadCooks
Premium
join:2005-02-28
Kennewick, WA

Maybe A Management Change

Maybe the Board has finally realized that the new CEO is a disaster and the real news is he is being dumped (we should be so lucky).
--
DadCooks
(aka Eric)

JPL
Premium
join:2007-04-04
Downingtown, PA
kudos:4
reply to FFH5

Re: How exactly?

said by FFH5:

said by JPL:

said by Komo Misomo :

I think you're being intentionally obtuse.

There's about a thousand studies out there highlighting how market consolidation, and/or the reduction in number of overall market gatekeepers reduces competition and harms consumers -- regardless of whether or not Comcast competes with Cox directly.

Read one.

Maybe I'm obtuse too, because I think you're missing it. Their footprints don't overlap. If I'm in a Charter market, my choices for broadband suppliers doesn't go down because of this merger. They stay exactly the same. If they competed in the same market you would have a point. But they don't. You're not reducing providers in any market if this merger were to happen.

I agree with you, but you are missing his point - that being big alone is bad all by itself. It is all part of the philosophy some have that big corporations are all evil and that bigger is more evil.

I guess I would counter this with - how does this create only 1 company to handle broadband? This isn't exactly like DirecTV merging with Dish, which was attempted back in, IIRC, 2005. There are a number of broadband providers out there. Granted, there aren't a whole lot in any one area, but that's true whether Charter gets bought or not.

Competition only brings down prices if the consumer has a choice. Gas stations in the middle of nowhere can charge you whatever the hell they want. Gas stations that are located on opposing corners, however, tend to be really aggressive with their pricing. Same thing here.

JPL
Premium
join:2007-04-04
Downingtown, PA
kudos:4
reply to mikesterr
said by mikesterr:

While I agree they don't directly over lap coverage areas, I seem to remember that each municipality has a specific contract with a particular Cable operator. Periodically those contracts come up for renewal, so in the case of a Cable merger the Townships now have less choices for their particular town. That being said I don't think I have ever heard of a town kicking the incumbent provider out.

No... this isn't correct at all. A number of years ago, our market was served by a small cable outfit called Suburban Cable. They were the only cable operator in the region because they had the franchise agreement. What happened to Suburban? They got bought out by Comcast. How many cable operators did we have before the buy-out? One. How many did we have AFTER the buy-out? One. You're just changing hands... that's all. Now that doesn't mean that you won't hate the new owners of the cable system in your area. You may. But it does nothing to decrease or increase competition.

Now you can argue that if a town wants to go fishing for a new cable company that this move makes it more difficult. And that would be true, to a point. The point being that I can't think of a single case where that's happened. I'm sure it does, but in this age of TV competition, it's far more likely that a town just opens up their franchising agreements to allow others in.