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Comments on news posted 2013-03-04 10:48:48: Techdirt directs our attention to the fact that one of the companies behind tracking copyright violations for the new six strikes anti-piracy initiative has been falsely flagging video game mods as copyrighted content. ..

page: 1 · 2 · next


buzz_4_20

join:2003-09-20
Limestone, ME
reply to OmagicQ

Re: Its a large download...must be pirated content!

It must be, you're downloading it without paying somebody...

Where's my CUT says everyone.

I MUST SQUEEZE CONSUMERS FOR EVERY RED CENT, NO MATTER THE COST



skeechan
Ai Otsukaholic
Premium
join:2012-01-26
AA169|170
kudos:2
Reviews:
·Clear Wireless
·Cox HSI
·Verizon FiOS

What SHOULD happen...

You pay the $35 and if it turns out you are right, whoever filed the DMCA request pays a $1000 penalty for the false accusation.

In the meantime, how is being accused of a crime not defamation?

If I go about telling someone that you are a child molester you certainly could sue me for the defamation.



Kilroy
Premium,MVM
join:2002-11-21
Saint Paul, MN
reply to cdru

Re: Oh boy...

said by cdru:

said by gatorkram:

I wonder, how much you even have to share, before it becomes a violation, or how much of a download you have to complete.

Technically, anything not covered by fair use and is unauthorized is infringement, so 1 bit.

So, they have two files they are enforcing copyrights for, one has a first bit of 0 and the other has a first bit of 1, so EVERYTHING is a copyright violtion subject to a $35 review if you feel like paying for it.

In reality the more bad press this plan gets the better for consumers.
--
“Progress isn't made by early risers. It's made by lazy men trying to find easier ways to do something.” ¯ Robert A. Heinlein


EmoHobo

join:2010-07-16

2 recommendations

Bleeding us dry.

Guilty until proven innocent, that's the American Way now that Corporations control the country.



Octavean
Premium,MVM
join:2001-03-31
New York, NY
kudos:1

If you're going to do it get it right,

False positives should result in a fine paid TO the falsely accused customer. I don't really care if they implement this CAS but if they are going to do it they need to get it right,....all the time,....or pay for their missteps,.....IMO.

That includes insecure and or hacked wireless networks.



JohnInSJ
Premium
join:2003-09-22
Aptos, CA

contents, not file name...

Does anyone know if the said file actually didn't contain one of the listed items in the DMCA notice? One would expect it's not looking for file names, but rather hashing content and matching hashes against a database.

It's not very hard at all to rename a file "I am not a pirated movie.txt" after all.
--
My place : »www.schettino.us


CXM_Splicer
Looking at the bigger picture
Premium
join:2011-08-11
NYC
kudos:2

1 recommendation

reply to clone

Re: Oh boy...

No, if they hosted a file that would be the equivalent to them giving away property they own. You cannot offer something for free and then claim infringement when someone takes it. They go after 'uploaders' because that's the only ones they can collect sufficient evidence on.



danawhitaker
Space...The Final Frontier
Premium
join:2002-03-02
Urbandale, IA

And this is why...

...my ISP, Mediacom, is a bunch of fools for having a 3 strikes and you're permanently disconnected policy. People stick up for the system, but scenarios like this show how someone could get screwed very easily, and good luck fighting your case with the ISP.
--
You're watching Sports Night on CSC so stick around...


FTWalker

join:2011-03-10
reply to jmn1207

Re: Protests

They might be taking a page from the Nigerian scammers and using the shotgun approach - send out mass quantities (emails/violations), and even if only a small percentage "bites", they're still way ahead monetarily.



Camelot One
Premium,MVM
join:2001-11-21
Greenwood, IN
kudos:2
reply to CXM_Splicer

Re: Oh boy...

said by CXM_Splicer:

No, if they hosted a file that would be the equivalent to them giving away property they own. You cannot offer something for free and then claim infringement when someone takes it. They go after 'uploaders' because that's the only ones they can collect sufficient evidence on.

You are half right. But with the torrent protocols, you are distributing (without permission) the moment you start downloading. So they can seed the file, and still nail you for distribution while you download it.
--
Intel i7-2600k /ASRock P67 Extreme4 /4x 4Gb G.Skill /2x Intel 510 series 250Gb SSD /3x WD20EADS 2TB /2x PNY GTX 260 /Silverstone 850W /Custom water cooler /Antec Twelve-Hundred


aciddrink

join:2000-08-26
reply to Camelot One

Exactly. It's an inherently flawed yet genius system. Throw around an extreme number of letters/notices, whether real or fake. Then sit back and enjoy the money that comes rolling in.


Chubbysumo

join:2009-12-01
Superior, WI
Reviews:
·Charter
reply to gatorkram

said by gatorkram:

Do they host the files themselves like a honeypot, and wait for people to connect, download and share, or do they just randomly look for files with particular names, and then join those swarms, and start collecting IPs, etc.

They hop on a torrent swarm, and then monitor what IP connect, and take a "snapshot" of the IP downloading something. A judge just ruled that their "evidence" is not even admissible in court, since it only shows the suspected criminal downloading a piece of the file(which is covered under creative use), and it does not reasonably identify the downloader, just the subscriber household.

Chubbysumo

join:2009-12-01
Superior, WI
Reviews:
·Charter
reply to skeechan

Re: What SHOULD happen...

said by skeechan:

If I go about telling someone that you are a child molester you certainly could sue me for the defamation.

and that does not remove the stigma that people heard it from someone, even if im not guilty, people will still associate me with it, thus, my life is ruined, and you just have to pay a small defamation lawsuit. I think this system will get sued into the ground, if not thru the ISP(I did not agree to this), but someone will sue the CCI and MarkMonitor for snooping and possibly ask for an injunction. If I was on an ISP that was participating, that would be the first thing I would do if I got one. Sure, I cannot sue my ISP, but I can sue the CCI and Markmonitor, since I never made contracts with them.


BonezX
Basement Dweller
Premium
join:2004-04-13
Canada
kudos:1
reply to gatorkram

Re: Oh boy...

said by gatorkram:

I have always had the feeling, these people have no clue what they are doing..

I asked a question a long time ago, in another post, about how these companies go about figuring out what you are doing, is even infringement.

Do they host the files themselves like a honeypot, and wait for people to connect, download and share, or do they just randomly look for files with particular names, and then join those swarms, and start collecting IPs, etc.

I wonder, how much you even have to share, before it becomes a violation, or how much of a download you have to complete.

So many questions, and so few real answers... I don't see any problems at all from this, oh and I have some water front property you might be interested in...

edit: spelling

the "companies" are working on behalf of the copyright holder, which would allow them to honeypot and mass pull IP addresses. i know it looks seriously dirty to do(considering that you don't get the entire FILE from them, only a part realistically).

and remember, they are acting on behalf of the RIAA/MPAA so they don't have to sign contracts with actual artists to pursue people.


skeechan
Ai Otsukaholic
Premium
join:2012-01-26
AA169|170
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Reviews:
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1 edit
reply to Chubbysumo

Re: What SHOULD happen...

I'd take them to small claims for the $35 bucks plus some aggravation dough...make them send someone to avoid a default $10,000.00 judgement. Annoy the piss out of them while having the lawsuit splash across every nerd site on the Internetz. They love when an ISP gets sued.

Disrupt my service when I didn't do anything, and I'll spend the money necessary to give Cox a headache and I'll let everyone on the planet know about it. Local reporters are always on the lookout for a big guy vs little guy story.

And I have no arbitration agreement with the MAFIAA.



Probitas

@teksavvy.com

Roach Motel

Too bad you can't change providers if you get hit with challenge costs by mistake. As if you have to pay to prove your innocence. Hire a lawyer and sue for rights violations, and make THEM pay. Enough people get hit with those things for no reason and sue often enough, they'll drop it, the costs will be too high.


CXM_Splicer
Looking at the bigger picture
Premium
join:2011-08-11
NYC
kudos:2
reply to Camelot One

Re: Oh boy...

They don't use standard torrent programs specifically because they make blocks available as soon as they are complete. They use custom programs which monitor the trackers and don't share anything.

If Honeypoting were legal, they would be going after the downloaders like that... not the uploaders. They would in fact be the uploaders which is why it doesn't work. If a defense lawyer found out a copyright holder was allowing the material to be given away for free the whole case would be thrown out very quickly.


TechnoGeek

join:2013-01-07
reply to Heh213

Oh no penalty eh...

So what if I file a claim against them with their service provider? Or are business accounts exempt?

Either way, hmm....


TechnoGeek

join:2013-01-07
reply to gaforces

Re: 4 strikes?

Wait, if it's the mod developer's code, can't he technically sue them for infringing upon his distribution rights?

If they host it to catch people, he can hit them with a DMCA claim.


Chubbysumo

join:2009-12-01
Superior, WI
Reviews:
·Charter
reply to skeechan

Re: What SHOULD happen...

said by skeechan:

I'd take them to small claims for the $35 bucks plus some aggravation dough...make them send someone to avoid a default $10,000.00 judgement. Annoy the piss out of them while having the lawsuit splash across every nerd site on the Internetz. They love when an ISP gets sued.

Disrupt my service when I didn't do anything, and I'll spend the money necessary to give Cox a headache and I'll let everyone on the planet know about it. Local reporters are always on the lookout for a big guy vs little guy story.

And I have no arbitration agreement with the MAFIAA.

I think 10000 small claims court cases would be much more troublesome than a single class action suit.


skeechan
Ai Otsukaholic
Premium
join:2012-01-26
AA169|170
kudos:2
Reviews:
·Clear Wireless
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Thing is getting 10000 innocent people and then get them to go to small claims when they have to get to work and do other stuff. That is what the MAFIAA counts on. Accuse everyone, extort from everyone and you get a certain percentage to get scared and pay them the extortion money.



Kai

@teksavvy.com
reply to aciddrink

Re: Oh boy...

I call that... A "Pyramid Lawsuit"!

1 uploader spreads to several, which spreads to more and more... And then they use it as a means to launch charges or lawsuits of the likes to funnel money to themselves.


dra6o0n

join:2011-08-15
Mississauga, ON
Reviews:
·ITalkBB
reply to RWSI

Re: Disconnect

Nope, how corporate sees it is simply numbers, not a symbol or movement.

When a corporation sees profits go down and sees people not going to the movies, instead of thinking "why people aren't going to the movies" they are going to be discussing "How would we gain the income we 'lost'? Maybe scam or charge them for downloading movies?"...


dra6o0n

join:2011-08-15
Mississauga, ON
Reviews:
·ITalkBB
reply to EmoHobo

Re: Bleeding us dry.

Ya think?

At this point the country won't have much of a chance to change for the better, there are too many 'factors' preventing that from happening.

First - The banks.
This factors in a lot on how these 'bankers' and their group of people operate their money laundering schemes.

Second - The government.
This factor is reliant on the loans they take, and the bribes they gain, and the excuses they make.

Third - The corporations.
This factors in the most, but only because of the first two factors above has power. When greed takes hold of someone with power, greed takes hold of groups who interacts with someone who has power.

Simply revolting won't change the world, nay. This is something extremely complex that won't see change, in fact the only result in the end is the extinction of the country, either from a apocalyptic disaster or something in that level of destruction.

Rome ceased to be the greatest nation after it expanded and grew too big, and broke itself apart.

Why do people, like Americans, have to be prideful of their country? Because they've got nothing much else to take pride in. This factors them being unable to give up the illusions they live in.

Granted, no humans want to see reality as reality... The vision we see in the world is how we want to see it, because that's just natural to us.



mikedz4

join:2003-04-14
Weirton, WV
reply to Woody79_00

Re: OTA violations

sad thing is the supreme court ruled vcrs are legal. Whether or not they will classify dvrs as vcrs or the media will challange dvrs next is another question. Also what will happen when people start storing shows "in the cloud"?


JTR

join:2012-05-19
Carbondale, IL
reply to mazhurg

Re: Surprize!

If you are innocent, the $35 is refunded to you. I don't even think the fee goes to the ISP in the first place.



plencnerb
Premium
join:2000-09-25
Carpentersville, IL
kudos:3
reply to serge87

Re: Its a large download...must be pirated content!

Along those lines, how do they verify that what is being downloaded is actually the real thing.

For example, what if I created 300 txt files of popular music songs, had them named artist - song title . mp3, and made them about the right size.

But, in reality, they would not be what the file says they are. As I said, I would start with a text file, make it the right size, and rename it to .mp3.

If I was to do that, and host them, and people started to download them, would I get "flagged" as hosting "copyrighted material", when the files themselves was bogus?

--Brian
--
============================
--Brian Plencner

E-Mail: CoasterBrian72Cancer@gmail.com
Note: Kill Cancer to Reply via e-mail


megarock

join:2001-06-28
Catawissa, MO

Gee...

Looks like it's class action lawsuit time. Anyone who gets a false claim against them should contact attorney firms. They'll sue anyone.


Kamus

join:2011-01-27
El Paso, TX

Where are the douchebags (and/or trolls) now?

Just a couple of days ago the douche-bags were calming that this would NEVER, EVER, EVER, EVER happen. (false positive)

Not only were they wrong, but it took no time at all for them to be wrong.


Kearnstd
Space Elf
Premium
join:2002-01-22
Mullica Hill, NJ
kudos:1
reply to plencnerb

Re: Its a large download...must be pirated content!

said by plencnerb:

Along those lines, how do they verify that what is being downloaded is actually the real thing.

For example, what if I created 300 txt files of popular music songs, had them named artist - song title . mp3, and made them about the right size.

But, in reality, they would not be what the file says they are. As I said, I would start with a text file, make it the right size, and rename it to .mp3.

If I was to do that, and host them, and people started to download them, would I get "flagged" as hosting "copyrighted material", when the files themselves was bogus?

--Brian

Possibly yes. if the hash happened to be close enough to the database I bet the automatic system would fire off a DMCA notice to your ISP.

the DMCA has zero human oversight. Which is why false positives happen. NASA had part of a news conference on Livestream cut off once. They showed video of the curiosity landing and that triggered an automatic copyright system(because some news source also had that same video.)
--
[65 Arcanist]Filan(High Elf) Zone: Broadband Reports