| Little guys leading the way for smaller population areas Isn't the real question, "How do so many small and medium sized telcos manage to bring all-fiber to their customers, while the big boys seem to have such a hard time doing it for their smaller metro area customers?" |
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openbox9Premium
join:2004-01-26
japan
kudos:2 | The big boys don't have a problem doing it, they're just doing it slowly. The real question is how accurate is a survey of estimations in achieving this 20% savings? |
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| fiber is costly to install and digging is not easy fiber is costly to install and digging is not easy |
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 G35
@wideopenwest.com | reply to openbox9
Re: Little guys leading the way for smaller population areas Easy... Pass it on to the customer, 30% and make more! |
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Reviews:
 ·AT&T U-Verse
| reply to Bob61571
It is a good thought, but what would the costs be to go thru my subdivision of around 2k homes and for the most part total buried plant, i.e. electric, CATV, and telephone. The expenses would be very high to dig up back yards, either open cut or bore existing streets, if permits for such can be obtained. I suspect that the cost per foot in my subdivision for just the trenching would be in excess of $10 - $15 per foot, especially since there is almost solid rock (limestone) 6 inches under the grass. |
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| reply to CAST SUCKS
Re: fiber is costly to install and digging is not easy when you factor in that it won't have to be replaced for 50 years there is savings |
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| reply to Bob61571
Re: Little guys leading the way for smaller population areas It's easier to paint one house than it is the entire neighborhood. |
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 LinklistPremium
join:2002-03-03
Williamstown, NJ
kudos:5 | reply to openbox9
said by openbox9:The big boys don't have a problem doing it, they're just doing it slowly. The real question is how accurate is a survey of estimations in achieving this 20% savings?
This news item can explain why telcos go slow on new and upgraded infrastructure - the cost and the low payback.
»www.theregister.co.uk/2013/04/04···ex_fail/ |
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| reply to hey hey hey
Re: fiber is costly to install and digging is not easy Spoken like a true sales monkey. I hear this pitch all the time. If you just spend X on my product today it will save you in the long run. That's the new sales pitch when they find out X is 10 times your budget and they are trying to save the sale.
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I do not, have not, and will not work for AT&T/Comcast/Verizon/Charter or similar sized company. |
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| exactly, so saving 20% on opex, how long does it take to pay off the capex? Especially is what people claim is true and the cost of fiber is falling at an exponential rate... If I can wait a year and get it for less money, does that make the most sense.....
fixing my old car is a lot less expensive than buying a new one! |
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| "Especially is what people claim is true and the cost of fiber is falling at an exponential rate"
There are a lot of us out there that would love to find where the cost of deploying fiber is falling a an "exponential rate" because we would love to jump on this bandwagon.
It still costs $2-5 per foot to deploy and I've not seen a drastic drop in pricing.
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I do not, have not, and will not work for AT&T/Comcast/Verizon/Charter or similar sized company. |
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| Costs And if they end up having to maintain both copper and fiber, their costs can increase by more than 20%. People are unbelievably stubborn about upgrading. They are happy with what they have. |
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| reply to Bob61571
Re: Little guys leading the way for smaller population areas A lot of the little guys don't really have a choice. Many of them operate ADSL2+ or even regular ADSL and have hit a road block for speed. They need to do something because the wireline business is all they have and many would like to expand to the TV market which is difficult to do when you have ADSL2+ or ADSL. Not impossible, but not practical long term. So it is either VDSL or Fiber, and these choose fiber. |
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 tshirtPremium,MVM
join:2004-07-11
Snohomish, WA
kudos:3 | ... "don't have the funds" ... It's amazing how restrictive sensible budgeting can be. |
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 elios
join:2005-11-15
Springfield, MO | reply to prairiesky
Re: fiber is costly to install and digging is not easy thats only true if you fix it once
when your old car(copper) is breaking down every week you might as well get a new one(fiber)
repairing copper at this point is just rearranging the chairs on the Titanic better to rip it all out and replace with fiber like the rest of the developed world |
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elray
join:2000-12-16
Santa Monica, CA | Capital vs. Operating Costs Saving 20% on operating costs doesn't necessarily offset the huge investment necessary to get there.
If customers aren't going to buy the new product - and they don't, as Verizon has proven for 6+ years, it doesn't matter what cost efficiency it yields. |
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| That happens when you price it as pretty much status qua and give pretty much no incentive for making people want to change.
Offer more speed for a better price than what is currently available to a vast majority of their market and people will take it. Because they can and the underlying infrastructure is cheaper so they will probably make more per user than they currently do. But that of course would induce the big "C" word (competition) in their markets and they dont want that, nor do their cable sweet hearts.
Instead, they want to play a game of smoke and mirrors. |
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| Fiber also is not as expensive or hard to install it as people think. This is not the early 90's anymore..
I had fiber ran to my house when I use to run a business out of here from tw telecom (NOT Time Warner) back in early 2000. It's dark now and no one can use it but them so useless now that I don't need but they ran it from the main ring off the road about 1.5 miles and at most bore 8 five foot deep holes and this includes crossing about 60 house driveways, 4 streets and 4 turns...
All done underground near utility power and water... My cost? $0
6 strand fiber.. They ran into no issues. Just wish could activate on someone else now that I don't have them lol (they are a tier 1 provider so expensive and I am not doing the same business)
Anyway the cost issue is only a problem if they use some over priced contractors or don't do it in house. It was also all done in under 2 days after the survey was done might I add... A crew of about 4 did it total. they laid the conduit and after pulled the cable through using a quad bike tied to some string lol
So if this was in early 2000 I would imagine it can be done similar still, heck probably better... The hole cutting a slot for that cable like the other method shows is faster because don't have to wait to bore holes and for a hydraulic hammer to bang through the group but the way mine was done has 0 visible impact on anything, nothing was cut, all digging was done in a yard and grass replaced when done.
Now grant it doing this for 100 houses might not be easy but once the furthest one is done you have your path now and can easily run fiber down the entire street. You only need to hook up when someone orders. |
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| reply to elios
Re: fiber is costly to install and digging is not easy said by elios:thats only true if you fix it once
when your old car(copper) is breaking down every week you might as well get a new one(fiber)
until there are real numbers involved, this statement is just hearsay and an assumption.
hence my statement of; how many years does it take of saved opex to pay off the capex..... if it's 100, then no, it certainly isn't cheaper to buy new, if it's 1, then sure it makes sense. Where in between fiber falls, it isn't clear. |
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| reply to battleop
said by battleop:"Especially is what people claim is true and the cost of fiber is falling at an exponential rate"
There are a lot of us out there that would love to find where the cost of deploying fiber is falling a an "exponential rate" because we would love to jump on this bandwagon.
It still costs $2-5 per foot to deploy and I've not seen a drastic drop in pricing.
as a fixed cost it hasn't dropped huge amounts, someone mentioned Fios started at 4000/home passed and we're now down to under $1000 in the last decade. That being said, on a price per mbit, it's dropped a lot.... not that that means all that much, but it is another metric to examine |
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