NSA Leaker Reveals Himself

"they have a spirited commitment to free speech and the right of political dissent"...!?!

I can understand this guy may be a little young to remember Tiananmen Square.

Hong Kong =/= Mainland China

BULL shit! Hong Kong is RULED by mainland China, and don't let anyone try to convince you otherwise! Their "autonomy" is a charade and has been since 1997.

And I bet you've never been there, have you? Have you even read anything remotely informative about Hong Kong's relationship with the mainland? It is obvious that you have not.

It is Communist Chinese territory now. The British left quite awhile ago.

That is like saying Texas is controlled by Washington. Hong Kong isn't Wuxi. HK is autonomous in most matters other than military. It doesn't even share a court system (which guarantees basic rights such as religious freedom) or currency with the mainland. Mainlanders don't have residency and can't even travel freely to Hong Kong.

You would be wise to educate yourself before you make ignorant comments.

The Chinese (mainland) are probably peeing their pants laughing at the predicament the NSA (US Government) has gotten itself into. I really don't think they'll be doing much of anything to expedite its' resolution. I think they would be equally amused watching Hong Kong twist in the wind while the US pressures them for extradition, at least for a while.

On paper Hong Kong is an autonomous region not subject to all of the whims of the despots in Beijing. In reality, it's about as independent as a Native American reservation, which is to say it's not independent at all.

Gotta love the implied moral equivalence between the actions of our Government and the despots in Beijing, with the whole "hypocritical criticism" snipe. Wake me up when our Government censors search results and blocks access to websites carrying information that is inconvenient to the ruling regime.

and yet the guy really wants to go to Iceland....what a moron.

His choice of the freedom loving PRC wouldn't have anything to do with this, would it?

mainstream news sources are saying that hong kong has a treaty with the US, but china can override it. He basically will have to sell his soul to them and tell the Chinese gov everything he knows about the NSA to get asylum there, at which point he'll be branded a spy.

What's wrong with Iceland? 100% self sufficient in energy. Beautiful. Low crime.

Going okay now since the country was bailed out by the United States and other members of the IMF to the tune of billions (despite having an entire population that if a single US city would rank 58th). Bakersfield has a larger population. Portland with less than twice the population has a GDP nearly 10X as large. Iceland has little to crow about.

Iceland protected Bobby Fischer. Yes that one, who had a beef with the IRS and the US Government in general to say the least, along with violating a UN embargo and US sanctions by playing his rematch with Spassky in Yugoslavia.

He fled from country to country and eventually Japan released him to Iceland. Iceland let him become a citizen.

So they have somewhat of a reputation.

I wouldn't be surprised if HK extradited, so he won't stay there.

Iceland put its bankers in Jail. Thats hw they bailed themselves out.

Jail doesn't pay billions in sovereign debt. It is merely icing on the cake.

You're mocking Iceland? Have you looked at yourself lately, and the country you're MAD to defend?

no I'm saying if he wanted to go to Iceland, get a fucking ticket to Iceland, not Hong Kong. Apparently geography is not this moron's strong suit.

He needed to get out of Dodge fast. There are Direct flights from Hawaii to Hong Kong. In order to get to Iceland, he would most likely have had to fly into the Continental US. How many steps off the plane would he take at say LAX, or even SFO? Apparently, escape planning is not YOUR strong suit.

Guess we better beef up security around the WOPR.....

"I'd piss on a spark plug if I thought it would do any good."

And we'll never see or hear from this guy ever again.

The United States Government doesn't disappear American citizens. Hell, we don't even really disappear terrorists and other enemies, if we did this whole debate about Gitmo would be moot.

Sorry to disappoint you, but the real world doesn't operate as the conspiracy theorists would have you believe.

bahahahahaha....keep telling yourself that buddy.

Our Government can't even keep things like this secret without somebody talking but you think it can disappear American citizens and get away with it? If it's that easy then why can't we put Khalid Sheikh Mohammed on an airplane and arrange for an accident? Sure would solve a lot of problems....

This is the problem with the tin-foil hat conspiracy theorists. They can't apply an iota of common sense. Reminds me of the whack jobs that think the US Navy shot down TWA Flight 800. They never do have a good answer when you ask them how it would be possible to keep such a thing secret when hundreds of people would have had knowledge of it happening.

First of all the government openly admits to operating secret prisons and assassinating US citizens, even ones not suspected of terrorism. And, to go full tin-foil, I'd say this "leak" was arranged by the government to give the illusion of vulnerability, as well as retroactively legitimize the program. Obama can't reveal it himself, since he would look weak and sneaky, but having a "rogue agent" make the revelation allows him to justify the program while looking resolute, as well put some fear into his underlings. Not unusual for "ex-CIA" to do an off-the-books operation, which was well-timed in being a couple of months after the Boston terror attack.

Why is it that the government is the chosen one to "disappear" him? There are billions of dollars of government contracts at stake here and I guarantee you there are more than a few people in these companies that have these contracts that would put their work FAR above the life of this one person.

The spying is a lot smaller than the bigger picture of the direct money for doing the work and the access to the goldmine of information that has the potential to make the contract money seem like peanuts. Google, Facebook, Microsoft, the telcos, they all mine data and they all make billions off of this data and to think the NSA has a system in place that is inferior to these companies collection methods is just ludicrous. Then this system has very in depth access by private contractors and it's ripe for picking of non national security related data. Mr. Snowden said he could tap anyone, that in itself is worth billions of dollars to the people who seek to have an unfair advantage over any business competition and that is the true crime at hand not the ones the government publicly claims to preventing.

Political manipulation, business manipulation, personal manipulation is at the hands of select private contractors in this country and they are making off with the data just like Mr. Snowden did but they don't tell anyone publicly about it.

where is your evidence to the contrary?

People ask for evidence to the contrary of the reasoning, and yet they themselves don't realize that they don't know anything of the matter in these kinds of issues.

It's like wanting proof that the boy cried wolf, but ignorant of the fact that they are living next to a wolf den.

You cannot prove a logical falsehood, so the only thing that can be done is to prove it's opposite, in this case that the U.S. disappears their own citizens. I ask for evidence and get mocked for doing so. That shows exactly how weak the argument is.

Actually, he may be safer this way. If he hadn't come forward, but the government found out who he was, then his disappearance would have gone unnoticed. Now he has become a public figure, so, if something should happen to him, it will be noticed, which means it's less likely that he would be "disappeared" or fall victim to some random "accident".

A pretty shrewd move, I think.

I didn't think of it that way.

Instead of most of us just assuming that we're being constantly wiretapped we have some direct confirmation.

I don't see this guy having much of a future.
The U.S. Government will be looking to make an example of him. Most likely by putting him in jail and branding him a terrorist or traitor.

I'm truly saddened to see what has become of my country.

Our Liberty has be squashed in the name of so called Freedom and Security.

I'm still shocked that this is suddenly news. After all these years, with court cases being thrown out, etc., I guess it takes another whistleblower to really make a buzz in the news?

Interesting to hear from someone claiming to be from the inside of such a machine (intelligence). Doubt such a thing would be dismantled very easily.

I hope the guy can come home without fearing for the well being of himself and those he cares about. Hiding out in HK just seems really shady.

Of course it is shady. He also just outed himself as a Chinese spy by defecting to Chinese territory.

Apparently the previous actual NSA and at&t whistleblowers during the Bush admin weren't enough? What's that all about?

The government tells us that if we aren't doing wrong then we should have no reason to hide.

Well, if the government was not violating our constitutional rights, then why are they suddenly so mad about what Snowden has leaked?

Back in 2008 Obama stated how Whistle blowers need full protection from persecution and prosecution now it appears he is contradicting himself

»www.guardian.co.uk/comme ··· eblowing

For years I was warning my friends and family about programs such as prism and how agencies like the NSA are putting everyone under a massive surveillance grid but everyone thought i was just a crazy cons pricy theorist but guess what? I was right they were wrong but they still act like I am crazy for letting them know I was right lol

yup.. I, too, have been warning friends/family for a few years regarding this.. Frankly, I consider this guy a national hero.. He put the Constitution ahead of unConstitutional laws and "blew the whistle" on this activity. Not to mention destroying his future comfort/safety. I am a 63 year old Conservative, not a Republican or a Democrat, simply an American who is fed up with the criminality that this government has been displaying for quite a few years..

I can believe that 95% of the individuals within the CIA/FBI/NSA/IRS/ETC are genuinely concerned with national security to some degree. I can also believe that 5% have other motives. I am not convinced the organizations have placed proper safeguards on the system to keep that 5% from doing something for a bad reason. Note that I said nothing of party affiliation here, since all parties are quite capable of bad things (not just the Big Two).

I'd feel a bit better if (1) the safeguards are made public, (2) the safeguards are truly reasonable, and (3) the safeguards are such that they wouldn't help a terrorist who knew about them. I admit that (2) and (3) may actually already be there, but without (1) I could never be sure. That is, if they had reasonable guidelines the terrorists couldn't learn to take advantage of they probably wouldn't mind telling everyone about them.

Watch the video. Contractors have access to every private detail of YOUR life. Why? There's also a bit in there where he explains how they can go back in history, cherry pick information, piece them together and ruin you. Essentially they could make George Washington look like a collabrater for the British. I think what he's doing is great and all the "patriots" here are confusing the true intent here with the fact that he is in Hong Kong. What he did has nothing to do with the Chinese government.

Watch the video

»www.nakedcapitalism.com/ ··· dom.html

Any reasonably informed person already knew the extent of surveillance of telephone and internet. This despite prior Gvt officials previously denying the programs existed, or that they have the capability to know from whom and to where calls are made. Sure that and more is why the NSA spends billions on server farms. LOL.
Now various Gvt officials have formally (and presumably with up front clearance) have gone on record acknowledging the surveillance capability of "metadating". President Obama has gone on record saying a) This capability predates my taking the President's office, but despite his words as a Senator critical of such programs, he has not changed anything since becoming President b) He welcomed the opportunity to discuss Prism in public.

Hmm The only real issue I have here is with the prior deliberate lies told by Gvt officials predating the current "revelations". Trust in Gvt can be eroded quickly and lying doesn't help (especially if you are found out) even if the Gvt thinks it is in the interests of citizens long term. When found out it becomes a self feeding issue.
The President's recent candor is refreshing, but in welcoming the opportunity to discuss such issues in public in any future possible trial of the "whistleblower" the head of our Gvt seems to be already giving him a "pass". This would seem to work every which way as it could embolden others to reveal other "sensitive" information which might be "unfortunate" and further Gvt confidence eroding. But if you prosecute this guy (seems likely) could the President be called as a witness to support him based upon his recent public words, or would the President back away from what he has just said? Note Obama has said the Gvt isn't targeting citizens but the records now shows that "millions" of citizens metadata is being recorded. So this means you are not targeted but we are recording ALL info on you.... Hmmmm.
Once Gvt has data it can be used correctly or incorrectly. There would seem to be a growing trust gap here fed by recent other revelations (think IRS) that Gvt officials can and do use databanks incorrectly.

The "leaker" himself knew whom he was doing work for and knew their role upfront and for sure signed official secrets documents. Why did he do this then rat on the programs he agreed to work on? Was he so naive to not understand the type of work the NSA does? Come on.... As I say nothing he has "leaked" is anything that any reasonably informed person didn't understand was happening already. And thinking HK is a refuge when it is 100% controlled by China, a country which controls it's citizens directly and with a heavy hand, is laughable. Sure China might offer him lifetime refuge in return for a load of "info" on the way the NSA works. Now that would be a MAJOR crime in my books and he is setting himself up. More likely if the US Gvt asks for this man's return to the USA HK/China would co-operate as to do anything else would mean a massive disruption between the USA and China with many implications.

In short there is little new here. The leaker is 100% naive, IMHO and is setting himself up for a major fall. But at the same time the prior and current words from our Gvt creates a confusing backdrop for citizens and Gvt needs to be careful how they manage this going fwd to stop the slide in trust of Gvt and NOT encourage Gvt workers to give away far more important data going fwd.

Perhaps it is time for the President to stand up and really discuss the issue in public and maybe he has already started down this road.. Say yes we have these programs, broadly speaking and this is how it works and it enables your elected Gvt to better analyize potential terrorists as they build up to a possible event and it DOES work. Perhaps even detail an arrest or so?? Then to turn the issue over to the public. Your Gvt works for you but is voted into power by you the citizens. Ultimately you can decide whether these programs are fully in your best interests and we the Gvt MUST act in a better way that gives you the citizens full confidence in how our system operates in your best interests. In short for the general public the "cat is out of the bag" and it's almost impossible to put it back. So the issue must be faced forthrightly in order for full confidence in Gvt to be rebuilt. If the current administration misshandles their responses here it could become a maor political issue. We also need to define what reasonable metadata our Gvt is consititutional allowed to gather. And we need to do this sooner, rather than later, so we can all move on feeling our Gvt is doing their job properly and keeping us informed (broadly) and allowing our rights not to be overly eroded. It's all a delicate balance.

Yup, been saying this. You were naïve if you didn't already realize this was going on. They are going to monitor just foreign people in foreign countries when they could monitor their own citizens also.

But as long as people have their Game of Thrones on the telly, nobody cares.

And the Denham's Dentifrice jingle playing in the background... oh - wait - wrong dystopian future.

This is just the NSA checking to see how "asleep" the american sheeple have become.....before moving forward with their plans....

I'm sure Obama has already issued a drone strike order for this 'terrorist'.

[sacrasm]They should lob a hellfire missile at him from a predator, you know, in the middle of HK, into his hotel room!.[/sarcarm]

Snowden is not dumb, he had the resources to know why HK is a good place to head to first.

hollywood needs to get the rights to this one!

He reviles his identity in Hong Kong. Then says he has more info he could have divulged. I bet the Chinese will want to chat with this guy. He will disappear either by the Chinese wanting his info, or a contractor tied to the US.

For the shepple that think the US. doesn't make Americans disappear is drinking the government kool-aid. Plus there are places that "don't exist" that are worse than Gitmo. Have been with the government long enough to know the US. Government as well as others make people disappear all the time. Or pin you for BS and ruin your life to get you out of the picture. They love their scapegoats. All Governments have "The do what I want and get away with it badge".

Call it conspiracy if you want, but there is more to governments than most will ever know.

"NSA Leaker Reveals Himself"

At first I thought it was about an NSA spook being arrested for intoxication and indecent exposure.