dslreports logo
site
spacer

spacer
 
    All Forums Hot Topics Gallery
spc

spacer




how-to block ads


view:
topics flat nest 
Comments on news posted 2013-06-27 11:41:27: Fortunately for the cable industry, the "competition" they face in the vast majority of their markets are cash-strapped telcos who won't be seriously upgrading user connections for years to come -- if ever. ..

page: 1 · 2 · 3 · next


FFH
Premium
join:2002-03-03
Tavistock NJ
kudos:5

1 recommendation

Glad not ready til 2015

I am glad Docsis 3.1 won't be ready until 2015. That gives me a couple more years on my current owned Docsis 3 cable modem until I have to buy a new CM to handle Docsis 3.1.
--
"If you want to anger a conservative lie to him.
If you want to anger a liberal tell him the truth."



GlennAllen
Sunny with highs in the 80s
Premium
join:2002-11-17
Richmond, VA

Puny upstream.

OK, other than in the PR blurbs... where is this actually significant? Will it give them more capacity for HD channels to use less compression and raise PQ? (Now that would be significant.)


34764170

join:2007-09-06
Etobicoke, ON

1 edit

To improve the situation with low upstream speeds for cable Internet. DOCSIS 3.1 is long overdue.


tmc8080

join:2004-04-24
Brooklyn, NY
Reviews:
·ooma
·Optimum Online
·Verizon FiOS

copper bandwagon

AT&T isn't exactly a piss poor Telco.. they have the coin to drop on select markets for FTTP, they just CHOOSE not to..

In part it's AT&T that lost in the big long distance wars with Verizon.. AT&T wanted to provide landlines in the northeast, but were pushed out by former Bell Atlantic & their lobbyists. Without landline in the northeast AT&T they promised the moon & stars for the Bell South merger and delivered squat to the southern states! They are probably worse off now than if they never merged in the first place. Bell South WAS eyeing fiber for it's most dense populations, but wanted a total strategy & pathway for FTTP/FTTC (possibly with coax where it made sense too).



intok

join:2012-03-15

Thats the case everywhere, the telcos don't realize that they are communications providers and not just phone and cellular providers. They complain about cable eating their lunch but do nothing about it, eventually they will only be cell providers and the cable companies will gouge for all services because you wont have a choice and will eventually start making moves into the mobile space when they have nowhere else left to expand their profit potential but have plenty of infrastructure to pull it of with minimum effort.

ATT/SBC killed off Ameritech fo us here in Wisconsin.



intok

join:2012-03-15
reply to GlennAllen

Re: Puny upstream.

No, it will however help with the anemic internet upload speeds.

To have more channel space they need to move to FTTH, then they can push 10Gbit over it easily giving you enough space for 4K/QFHD channels and ridicules internet speed.



KA3SGM
- -... ...- -
Premium
join:2006-01-17
West Chester, PA
kudos:1
Reviews:
·Comcast
·Cricket Broadband
·Verizon FiOS
reply to GlennAllen

said by GlennAllen:

Will it give them more capacity for HD channels to use less compression and raise PQ? (Now that would be significant.)

No, they are talking specifically about the upstream path for cable modems, and trying to squeeze more capacity into the 5-42MHz existing space they are already using for it.

It won't give you more TV channels, DOCISS 3.1 will only prevent you from losing some of the TV channels you already have, or forcing them to be further compressed.

If they are forced to use anything above 54MHz they are eating up regular In-Band channels which are in the 54-870MHz range(1000MHz on some systems), and used for Video, VoIP Telephone and Downstream Internet.
--
ROCK 'TIL SUNSET

Matt7

join:2001-01-02
Columbus, OH
Reviews:
·AT&T U-Verse
·Insight Communic..
reply to intok

Re: copper bandwagon

said by intok:

ATT/SBC killed off Ameritech fo us here in Wisconsin.

Yep - Ameritech was all about becoming a player with Video, Phone, Internet... Then the merger with SBC happened and "Americast" was sold off to WOW and others and then SBC morphed into AT&T.. and they gobbled up Cingular.. and well now the mighty AT&T does not care about wire line services.. but pricey unregulated wireless. (That they can cap like crazy).


GlennAllen
Sunny with highs in the 80s
Premium
join:2002-11-17
Richmond, VA
Reviews:
·Comcast
·Verizon FiOS
reply to 34764170

Re: Puny upstream.

Yes, I know (as well as it being restated in the the news blurb). My point is though, what percentage of customers have any use at all for more upstream than they already have? 1%? 2? (Outside of these few, nobody's even pushing the existing "paltry" upstream speed limit.) It may currently be "anemic" by comparison, but by and large it doesn't matter anywhere outside of the comparison with those other mentioned providers. Hence, nothing more than a PR "war". And just another reason to keep raising prices.

On the other hand, every [TV] customer would like better PQ.


nonymous
Premium
join:2003-09-08
Glendale, AZ
reply to Matt7

Re: copper bandwagon

Now wireless may turn interesting with Softbank.


adampsyreal

join:2012-10-13
Reviews:
·Comcast

1 recommendation

Fix Upstream Signal -to- Noise Ratio's!

Former cable guy / comcast NOC tech here
If the company would allow more time for quality work; then the upstream signal would be "clean" enough for most users anyway. (how often does Video on demand, or voice phone calls, or web page loading seem to lag? well, if the signal were consistently clean enough to actually make it out of the home; then we would all be better off)
[& don't jump in here & blame bad neighbor wiring; I have personally ensured that the houses around me are clean. the only thing left is the mainline. give those mainline techs the time they need already!]



Cthen

join:2004-08-01
Detroit, MI

Really?

How can any cable company call this a godsend for upstream when they don't bother taking advantage of it on any DOCSIS version?
--
"I like to refer to myself as an Adult Film Efficienato." - Stuart Bondek


Wilsdom

join:2009-08-06
reply to FFH

Re: Glad not ready til 2015

Stupid logic, you're "glad" to have mediocre service? Not to mention 3.1 is backwards compatible, so you could stick with the old speeds while those who invest in new equipment get better service


tmc8080

join:2004-04-24
Brooklyn, NY
Reviews:
·ooma
·Optimum Online
·Verizon FiOS
reply to Cthen

Re: Really?

said by Cthen:

How can any cable company call this a godsend for upstream when they don't bother taking advantage of it on any DOCSIS version?

True... in docsis 1 they had 1-way modems in 1.1 they had kilobits & 1-2 megabits up.. in 2.0 they splurged and did up to 5 up.. now it's 8-15 up with docsis 3.0 and channel bonding is FISRT getting to customers THIS year.

Technically, docsis 3.1 was SUPPOSED to be a mere technical FIRMWAREish upgrade.. not replacing cmts/node equip, scrubbing the outside plant for line noise and other expensive plant tasks... but that's what it's turning out to be... much to the annoyance of cablecos. Luckily it isn't as bad as individual line conditioning on copper twist pairs or you'd never see such a quick upgrade.


RyanThaDude
Indiana's No. 1 Zero

join:2004-01-24
Walkerton, IN
Reviews:
·Mediacom

1 recommendation

Better upload would be nice...

...but you and I know that cable companies are already stingy with the upload. C'mon, I can download at 20Mbps but only upload at 1? The capability of a faster upload is already there and they're not using it. What makes you think that DOCSIS 3.1 will help any?



IowaCowboy
Iowa native
Premium
join:2010-10-16
Springfield, MA
kudos:1

1 recommendation

I just bought a new modem

I just bought a new Motorola SB 6141 to replace my SB 6120 that was acting up.



charterengr
Premium,VIP
join:2002-03-09
Englewood, CO
reply to tmc8080

Re: Really?

said by Cthen:

Technically, docsis 3.1 was SUPPOSED to be a mere technical FIRMWAREish upgrade.. not replacing cmts/node equip, scrubbing the outside plant for line noise and other expensive plant tasks... but that's what it's turning out to be... much to the annoyance of cablecos.

False - this was never approached as a firmware upgrade. (I've been in the middle of it since inception.). As we have gone through the process, there has definitely been tweaking - but that's normal; and it's largely still in line with what we set out to do.

openbox9
Premium
join:2004-01-26
Germany
kudos:2
reply to nonymous

Re: copper bandwagon

Why?



mackey
Premium
join:2007-08-20
kudos:12

1 recommendation

reply to GlennAllen

Re: Puny upstream.

said by GlennAllen:

My point is though, what percentage of customers have any use at all for more upstream than they already have? 1%? 2?

It depends on who's upstream speeds you're talking about. If you're talking Comcast then yes I would agree with you. However, those of us stuck with Time Warner are in dire need of faster upstream speeds. Wanna try some new 'cloud' service? Not gonna happen. Offsite backups? Prepare to mail a thumb drive or external HDD.

/M


antdude
A Ninja Ant
Premium,VIP
join:2001-03-25
United State
kudos:4

I am still using DOCSIS 2

I have 10/1.5 for my TWC standard package. I could pay more for faster speeds, but uploads still not fast enough. I will wait for DOCSIS 3, but I doubt upload will be that much faster.



Chris 313
Come get some
Premium
join:2004-07-18
Houma, LA
kudos:1
Reviews:
·AT&T U-Verse
·Vonage
·Comcast
·Comcast Digital ..
reply to IowaCowboy

Re: I just bought a new modem

said by IowaCowboy:

I just bought a new Motorola SB 6141 to replace my SB 6120 that was acting up.

You'll probably get 2 years or more out of it before the switch is truly needed.

dfxmatt

join:2007-08-21
Evanston, IL
reply to GlennAllen

Re: Puny upstream.

It doesn't matter what the percentage is, because nobody has that choice at the moment. People can't even explore what they can possibly do with it because upstream is significantly restricted.



Cabal
Premium
join:2007-01-21
reply to Wilsdom

Re: Glad not ready til 2015

No one said anything about mediocre service.
--
If you can't open it, you don't own it.



buzz_4_20

join:2003-09-20
Limestone, ME
reply to Chris 313

Re: I just bought a new modem

If it's through Time Warner probably can get 10 years before you'll be running faster than the SB6141 can handle.

And even then, probably only the top tier.


majortom1029

join:2006-10-19
Lindenhurst, NY
kudos:1

1 edit
reply to tmc8080

Re: Really?

said by tmc8080:

said by Cthen:

How can any cable company call this a godsend for upstream when they don't bother taking advantage of it on any DOCSIS version?

True... in docsis 1 they had 1-way modems in 1.1 they had kilobits & 1-2 megabits up.. in 2.0 they splurged and did up to 5 up.. now it's 8-15 up with docsis 3.0 and channel bonding is FISRT getting to customers THIS year.

Technically, docsis 3.1 was SUPPOSED to be a mere technical FIRMWAREish upgrade.. not replacing cmts/node equip, scrubbing the outside plant for line noise and other expensive plant tasks... but that's what it's turning out to be... much to the annoyance of cablecos. Luckily it isn't as bad as individual line conditioning on copper twist pairs or you'd never see such a quick upgrade.

Cablevision has had downstream channel bonding for a while. They announced optimum ultra in 2009 which uses downstream channel bonding

They started UPSTREAM channel bonding in the past week.

Also cablevision just got rid of the analog channels at the end of 2012. The upstream channels were being used by the analog tv channels. So the room for more upstream was just freed up.


pnjunction
Teksavvy Extreme
Premium
join:2008-01-24
Toronto, ON
kudos:1
reply to GlennAllen

Re: Puny upstream.

I know many people that upload things to sites like dropbox. It's a couple of taps on new smartphones to upload all camera pics to dropbox, and it's a smart thing to do since phones can get lost or die resulting in data loss. It's also very slow to do right now with 1 MBps upload.

And I know we're cynical here but if you just look at fixed speeds prices have been dropping in my experience (25mbps for $40 here these days). Nobody is putting a gun to people's heads and making them upgrade to higher speeds instead of staying slower and paying less. The lowest tier is unlikely to drop below $25, but now that tier is 6-7 Mbps instead of 0.5 Mbps around here.



MovieLover76

join:2009-09-11
kudos:1
reply to GlennAllen

Maybe this is a chicken and the egg scenario, maybe once more people have more symmetrical speeds, applications that utilize more upload will become more prevalent.

I always want more upload, I'm lucky enough to have FiOS though.
It's far from a useless upgrade.



tiger72
SexaT duorP
Premium
join:2001-03-28
Saint Louis, MO
kudos:1

1 recommendation

reply to Cabal

Re: Glad not ready til 2015

you're right. Just terrible logic.



kittyburgers

join:2012-01-31

Modem Upgrades

I'm rather surprised that the 3.0 modems can't simply be firmware flashed to the newer standard. Are there any known modems that might have the capability to be flashed to any newer standard?



RWSI

join:2012-11-27
Albuquerque, NM

Interference

Broadcast, 2 way radio, Ham radio, outdoor lighting and more can and will cause degradation of usage of those frequencies. There is no hope of ever fixing these issues
no matter how much money or technology is thrown at the up stream needs. I will see Cable TV companies that can move to FiOS to save the up coming needs of customers.
Cable TV has limits on what the technology is possible of doing.