dslreports logo
site
spacer

spacer
 
    All Forums Hot Topics Gallery
spc

spacer




how-to block ads


view:
topics flat nest 
Comments on news posted 2014-04-02 19:17:39: Back in February AT&T made a few changes to the company's Share Everything mobile data plans, reducing prices significantly if you were buying data buckets of 10 GB or larger. ..

page: 1 · 2 · next


gigahurtz
Premium
join:2001-10-20
Palm Coast, FL

1 recommendation

Verizon's not scared...

RIIIIIIIGHT



n2jtx

join:2001-01-13
Glen Head, NY

No Surprise Really

Verizon and AT&T mimic each other all the time. They might as well merge into one company and get it over with already. AT&T comes up with a consumer unfriendly policy, you can be sure Verizon will implement it with a month or two. Likewise, Verizon dreams up a new fee and AT&T will have it just as fast.
--
I support the right to keep and arm bears.


ptbarnett

join:2002-09-30
Lewisville, TX

If Edge is as big a ripoff as Next...

... then this is no deal at all.

AT&T offers the $15/device fee for no-contract smartphones, too. If you are willing to pay full price for a no-contract phone (i.e. $650 for a 16GB iPhone), you can save $150 over the typical 2-year contract. If you keep your phone for 3 years, it's a savings of $450.

And that's aside from the ability to sell your phone at a price higher than AT&T will offer you.



Mr Guy

@charter.com

How is Edge a rip off?

OK get typical $600 phone for $200 subsidy and $30 upgrade fee on a 2 year contract. TOTAL $230

Edge plan with $25 a month discount. Phone cost $600, Edge discount $600. Total cost of phone $0. Even better you can upgrade after 1 year.


openbox9
Premium
join:2004-01-26
Germany
kudos:2
reply to gigahurtz

Re: Verizon's not scared...

Until VZ actually throws down and competes with someone besides T, I'd suggest that the company really isn't scared. Maybe if churn starts ticking higher.....



simlesa
Premium
join:2006-04-14
Astoria, NY

$160 or $260?

When I price out 4 smartphones with 10GB of service I get $260. Am I doing something wrong?



BOGBS
Premium
join:2004-05-11

said by simlesa:

When I price out 4 smartphones with 10GB of service I get $260. Am I doing something wrong?

Did you factor in the 25/mo discount, per phone, when doing the payment plan, or buying the phone outright?

sharksfan3
Premium
join:2004-02-16
North Hollywood, CA
reply to simlesa

You MUST sign on to the EDGE program for all 4 devices. Once the 4 devices are paid off you lose the discount. They aren't matching AT&T. This is merely a smoke screen.



Mr Guy

@charter.com

said by sharksfan3:

You MUST sign on to the EDGE program for all 4 devices. Once the 4 devices are paid off you lose the discount. They aren't matching AT&T. This is merely a smoke screen.

The At&t plan also requires you to pay full price for the devices.

ptbarnett

join:2002-09-30
Lewisville, TX
reply to Mr Guy

Re: If Edge is as big a ripoff as Next...

said by Mr Guy :

OK get typical $600 phone for $200 subsidy and $30 upgrade fee on a 2 year contract. TOTAL $230

Come on, you can do arithmetic better than that.

It's $200 (and $30 for the upgrade) for the phone, plus $40/month for 2 years. That's $1,190 for two years.

Without a contract (on AT&T, not Verizon), it's $650 for an iPhone and $15/month for 2 years. I don't know if the upgrade fee will be charged, but I'm sure AT&T will charge some other fee. So, let's throw in another $30. That's $1,040 for two years, a savings of $150.

said by Mr Guy :

Edge plan with $25 a month discount. Phone cost $600, Edge discount $600. Total cost of phone $0.

Now that Verizon and AT&T have finally reduced the per device fees, they are comparable to no-contract. There's no "discount": you simply pay for the phone over time: $650/24 = $27.08/month for 24 months, plus $15/month for device fee. Net cost is nearly the same if we assume there are no activation or upgrade fees: $1,010 over two years.

said by Mr Guy :

Even better you can upgrade after 1 year.

But, there's a catch, which is why they are a rip-off: if you upgrade before you pay off the phone, you have to trade in the phone to AT&T or Verizon at the price they offer. It's like trading in your car to a dealer instead of selling it yourself -- you are likely to get less.

If you are willing to wait out the 2 years, the plans are equivalent.

However, there's one more significant difference: a no-contract phone is unlocked, from the day you buy it. You can put another SIM in it at any time, temporarily or permanently. And you can avoid huge international roaming fees.


Iwilltakeit

@cox.net
reply to Mr Guy

Re: $160 or $260?

I just did it and fully aware that I have to pay full price for phones. Since I am the only one who upgrades every year with the family I will just sell off and pay the difference as I usually do.

Last months Bill 273.00
This month 155.00 due to some prorates
But my new bill should be about 185-200 with the newly attached iPad I added.

Also including company discount.

So not bad at all. Something is better than nothing.


ptbarnett

join:2002-09-30
Lewisville, TX
reply to sharksfan3

said by sharksfan3:

You MUST sign on to the EDGE program for all 4 devices. Once the 4 devices are paid off you lose the discount. They aren't matching AT&T. This is merely a smoke screen.

Wow, that makes it a huge problem for people that don't upgrade every 2 years. I wonder if Verizon will eventually realize it's an oversight, and change it when they start losing customers?

When you can port your number to AT&T and keep the reduced rate ($100/month less for 4 smartphones), it's a no-brainer unless you have another reason to stay on Verizon. Or maybe they will be counting on people not paying attention.

ptbarnett

join:2002-09-30
Lewisville, TX
reply to Mr Guy

said by Mr Guy :

The At&t plan also requires you to pay full price for the devices.

Not with AT&T Next. But, the question remains: once no devices are under contract, does Verizon allow you to retain $15/month per device?

Right now, Verizon isn't allowing you to BYOD and provide service for $15/month per device. AT&T is -- you can buy an unlocked phone from Apple (or AT&T) and get that price. Verizon isn't offering that option.

I suspect it's only a matter of time before they do.


Mr Guy

@charter.com

said by ptbarnett:

said by Mr Guy :

The At&t plan also requires you to pay full price for the devices.

Not with AT&T Next. But, the question remains: once no devices are under contract, does Verizon allow you to retain $15/month per device?

I suggest you read the fine print on that value plan and what the Next program is. Next is the same as Edge you pay full price. Edge it's over 24 months. With Next it can be either 20 or 26 months.


Mr Guy

@charter.com
reply to ptbarnett

Yes if you sign up with Edge and you pay it off after 24 months you lose the discount CURENTLY. Who knows what their policy will be on that in April 2016 when you actually pay the phone off. And if it hasn't changed in 2 years then switch. I'm not seeing the issue.


ptbarnett

join:2002-09-30
Lewisville, TX
reply to Mr Guy

said by Mr Guy :

I suggest you read the fine print on that value plan and what the Next program is. Next is the same as Edge you pay full price. Edge it's over 24 months.

Sorry for the confusion: I thought you meant "full price" up front.

But, you should so the same. Without Next or Edge, you pay "full price", it's just bundled into your monthly service price: $25/month higher, on both Verizon and AT&T. But, only if you have at least a 10G/month data plan.

I guess I don't understand why people why anyone thinks they are getting a discount. You aren't getting one if you sign up for a 2-year contract. All you are doing is spreading out the cost over the 24 months, whether it is explicitly a line item, or baked into the service cost.

ptbarnett

join:2002-09-30
Lewisville, TX
reply to Mr Guy

said by Mr Guy :

I'm not seeing the issue.

If you aren't under contract and on Edge (either when you buy the phone, or after you have paid off the phone), Verizon charges you $40/month for a smartphone.

This is a big disincentive for people that bring their own unlocked device... today. And people that have a phone that is out of contract... same problem. You don't have to wait until 2016 to experience the effect of their oversight in policy.

At least AT&T figured that out.


Mr Guy

@charter.com
reply to ptbarnett

Re: If Edge is as big a ripoff as Next...

said by ptbarnett:

said by Mr Guy :

OK get typical $600 phone for $200 subsidy and $30 upgrade fee on a 2 year contract. TOTAL $230

Come on, you can do arithmetic better than that.

It's $200 (and $30 for the upgrade) for the phone, plus $40/month for 2 years. That's $1,190 for two years.

I do math fine and I'm comparing Verizon's Edge program with it's regular pricing.

$15/month for 2 years is $360 plus $600 for the phone is $960.

So Edge is a better deal if you are getting the $25 a month discount. If you're are only getting the $10 a month discount it's not. Unless upgrading every year is something you desire.


Mr Guy

@charter.com
reply to ptbarnett

said by ptbarnett:

But, there's a catch, which is why they are a rip-off: if you upgrade before you pay off the phone, you have to trade in the phone to AT&T or Verizon at the price they offer. It's like trading in your car to a dealer instead of selling it yourself -- you are likely to get less.

If you agree to pay $600 a phone over 2 years and after 1 year you want a new phone why should you get to keep the old phone without paying it off or trading it in?

If you get a new car on have a 5 year loan and after 3 years you want anew car you don't get to just stop making payments on the old car and still keep it.

However, there's one more significant difference: a no-contract phone is unlocked, from the day you buy it. You can put another SIM in it at any time, temporarily or permanently. And you can avoid huge international roaming fees.

All Verizon 4G phones come unlocked form the start.


Mr Guy

@charter.com
reply to ptbarnett

Re: $160 or $260?

Well T-Mobile doesn't even offer discounted subsidies anymore. Anyone wanting service from them has to pay full price. And everyone said other carriers should do what T-Mobile is doing so there you go. Subsidies will be dead in less than 5 years. But if you have a 10 GB data plan then the Edge plan is cheaper than getting a subsidy and you don't have to wait 2 years to upgrade.



Mr Guy

@charter.com
reply to ptbarnett

said by ptbarnett:

If you aren't under contract and on Edge (either when you buy the phone, or after you have paid off the phone), Verizon charges you $40/month for a smartphone.

Then why pay the phone off early or pay full price all upfront? It's not like Verizon charges you a service fee or interest for being on Edge. Edge is obviously for people that don't have $650 upfront for an iPhone.

This is a big disincentive for people that bring their own unlocked device... today. And people that have a phone that is out of contract... same problem. You don't have to wait until 2016 to experience the effect of their oversight in policy.

At least AT&T figured that out.

Considering how many changes Verizon has made in the last couple of months how do you know they won't change this policy in the near future?

People have this notion that Verizon pricing policies are static. If they were you'd be paying $250 a GB like it cost 7-8 years ago.

ptbarnett

join:2002-09-30
Lewisville, TX
reply to Mr Guy

Re: If Edge is as big a ripoff as Next...

said by Mr Guy :

$15/month for 2 years is $360 plus $600 for the phone is $960.

I was using $650 for the phone, as that's the iPhone no-contract price. But, I'll use a $600 phone, with a contract-subsidized price of $200. The HTC One appears to fit that price point.

On Verizon, sans any activation and upgrade fees, over 2 years:

Contract, no Edge: $199.99 + $40/month = $1,159.99.
No contract, no Edge: $599.99 + $40/month = $1,559.99.
Contract, with Edge: $0 + $25.22/month + $15/month = $965.28.

So, I see your point: now that Verizon has provided the $25/month discount (instead of only $10/month, which I presume is for the data plan 10G/month), it's a better deal.

crooked

join:2000-07-29
Durham, NC
reply to Mr Guy

said by Mr Guy :

If you agree to pay $600 a phone over 2 years and after 1 year you want a new phone why should you get to keep the old phone without paying it off or trading it in?

More in favor of it not being a ripoff: you can pay off the phone and then get a new one without a problem.

Say you broke your phone after a year -- with a normal plan where you paid $200 for the phone, you'd be paying $650 out of contract for a new one. With Next/Edge, you'd be paying $290 out of pocket to pay off your old phone ($650 minus 12 payments of $32.50ish) and then $0 upfront to get a new one.

I had to really sit down and do math on it to realize that it could actually be beneficial to go with Next/Edge.

ptbarnett

join:2002-09-30
Lewisville, TX
reply to Mr Guy

said by MrGuy :

If you agree to pay $600 a phone over 2 years and after 1 year you want a new phone why should you get to keep the old phone without paying it off or trading it in?

I'm not suggesting that you should be able keep the phone after only paying 50% of the payments. I was saying that you are forced to accept Verizon's trade-in value, rather than selling it for a "retail" price via your method of choice. Although you do offer a reasonable alternative: pay off the phone before upgrading.

said by Mr Guy :

All Verizon 4G phones come unlocked form the start.

Ah, I didn't realize that. I did some digging, and found out why: it was a requirement imposed by the FCC on the spectrum Verizon is using for their 4G LTE network.

But, there's a gotcha: the phone will only operate in 3G mode outside Verizon's network.

ptbarnett

join:2002-09-30
Lewisville, TX
reply to Mr Guy

Re: $160 or $260?

said by Mr Guy :

Then why pay the phone off early or pay full price all upfront?

A few reasons why you might not be on-contract, and not on Edge:

* You bought a used phone
* You have a hand-me-down phone from family or friend (and not on their plan)
* You were on-contract, but the 24 months have elapsed and you didn't buy a new phone.

I'm sure you could probably think of a few more. My point is that not everyone buys new phones. And I'm thankful for that, as there is a market for mine, even 2 years after they were released.

ptbarnett

join:2002-09-30
Lewisville, TX
reply to Mr Guy

said by Mr Guy :

Subsidies will be dead in less than 5 years.

A year ago, I would have thought: "not a chance". But now, I absolutely agree with you -- except I think it will be sooner.

What was missing: AT&T and Verizon's insistence on charging the same prices for service, whether you were on contract or off-contract. Edge and Next were just lipstick on that pig. But now they have lowered their per-device prices to subtract out the subsidy if you either pay full price or "finance" it with Edge/Next, I think subsidies will be "pinin' for the fjords" soon.

The best deals are limited to people with large data plans (either because they use a lot, or have a large family). But, even for two people the 10G plan is a good deal. On AT&T, you must have a really low monthly data limit to get lower monthly costs. With more than 2 people, I'm not sure where the cross-over point is, or if it even exists.

There's an interesting incentive on AT&T: corporate discounts apply only to the data portion. So, if you have a 20% discount on the 10G plan, it's $80 instead of $100/month. Per device fees aren't eligible for the discount, so shifting your monthly bill from the device fee(s) to the data fee actually increases the discount amount.

It's also worth noting that on AT&T, the big break on device fees is only for smart phones. Basic phones are still the same monthly fee on and off contract, even if they have limited data capability and use the shared data plan. For those, the subsidized 2-year contract may still be the best option.

BiggA

join:2005-11-23
EARTH
reply to openbox9

Re: Verizon's not scared...

T is their only competitor.


BiggA

join:2005-11-23
EARTH

EDGE a huge catch

With AT&T, you can do legit BYOD and actually get your monthly bill way down, and if you keep the phone longer or get cheaper devices, you can save a LOT that you can't with Verizon. Their whole problem is their reluctance to open their network to unlocked devices. If they did, far more devices would support CDMA 850/1900, UMTS 850/900/1900/2100 and B13/B4 LTE, in addition to the various bands needed for other carriers (B4 HSPA+ for T-Mobile, B17, B2, and B5 LTE for AT&T, etc).



simlesa
Premium
join:2006-04-14
Astoria, NY

How to sign up?

How do I put the order in cart at Verizon website for 4 smartphones? When I try to add more than 1 phone, it tells me I cannot make more than one Edge order.


openbox9
Premium
join:2004-01-26
Germany
kudos:2
reply to BiggA

Re: Verizon's not scared...

Agreed.