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Comments on news posted 2014-05-19 16:29:30: Confirming leaks from the last several weeks, Verizon today announced the company's new "XLTE" branded speed upgrades, powered by the AWS spectrum Verizon has started utilizing in a growing number of markets. ..

page: 1 · 2 · 3 · next


SlowFITL

join:2012-02-01
Mobile, AL

AT&T doesn't have the spectrum to keep up

I'm not sure what AT&T plans to do in this market. Verizon and T-Mobile have pretty much all the AWS while AT&T has 10x10 in 700 mhz. Looking at the spectrum allocation AT&T is running out of bandwidth!

patt2k

join:2009-01-16
kudos:1

xlte

many people on droid life hit 100 mbps.
I hit about 55-83 max on AWS aka xlte.

78036364

join:2014-05-06
USA
reply to SlowFITL

Re: AT&T doesn't have the spectrum to keep up

Well they did say they plan on buying 20-40 MHz in the 600 MHz auctions. If they got 40 MHz they would blow everyone else away because 600 MHz would have much better coverage than AWS. they also said they are re-farming 2G spectrum to LTE by 2017.

78036364

join:2014-05-06
USA
reply to patt2k

Re: xlte

said by patt2k:

many people on droid life hit 100 mbps.
I hit about 55-83 max on AWS aka xlte.

Yeah you can sustain that if you're the only one on the network. AWS like 700 MHz is still limited to a max of 150 Mbps COMBINED usage among ALL users. The advantage of the AWS spectrum is that it's 20 MHz wide not 10 MHz like 700 MHz so it can support 800 simultaneous users instead of 400. Of course 800/150Mbps is 192 kbps.

BiggA

join:2005-11-23
EARTH
reply to SlowFITL

Re: AT&T doesn't have the spectrum to keep up

They still have a far more dense network in most markets, so their spectrum is thinner, but their re-use is better. And they are all set with quad-band devices out there, so they can re-farm B2 and B5. They have already done some B2 re-farming for capacity, all the B5 LTE so far is only in places that they don't have 700, so that they can roll out sub-1ghz LTE.

BiggA

join:2005-11-23
EARTH
reply to 78036364

Re: xlte

You have a point. But it's going to be a while before enough AWS devices are out there to really load it down, and not all devices will always be able to get it, i.e. they may only be able to get B13 if they're far away from a tower or deep in a building.

HOWEVER, they have 20x20 AWS in many areas, which is double the capacity of the current 10x10 B13 rollout, resulting in triple the capacity overall.

800 and 400 are entirely arbitrary numbers, and bandwidth doesn't divide up that way. Most of the time, most devices aren't transmitting or receiving, so you could have a lot of users on a tower and still get great speeds.

78036364

join:2014-05-06
USA
said by BiggA:

You have a point. But it's going to be a while before enough AWS devices are out there to really load it down, and not all devices will always be able to get it, i.e. they may only be able to get B13 if they're far away from a tower or deep in a building.

HOWEVER, they have 20x20 AWS in many areas, which is double the capacity of the current 10x10 B13 rollout, resulting in triple the capacity overall.

Well of course even those only on 700 MHz devices are helped by those switching to AWS leaving more capacity at 700 MHz.

800 and 400 are entirely arbitrary numbers, and bandwidth doesn't divide up that way. Most of the time, most devices aren't transmitting or receiving, so you could have a lot of users on a tower and still get great speeds.

Yeah except when you have those with unlimited data still that tether their phone to their computer to stream Netflix at 6 Mbps. You can see it wouldn't take long for tower capacity to get all used up by very few people and streamers are on the network for LONG periods of time not just a few seconds accessing a website.


ArrayList
netbus developer
Premium
join:2005-03-19
Brighton, MA

4 recommendations

yawn.

not a big deal until they bring back unlimited data.

78036364

join:2014-05-06
USA
said by ArrayList:

not a big deal until they bring back unlimited data.

And if they did the network would be congested to hell and everyone would get dial-up speeds if they could connect at all. Why people still don't get this is beyond me. If you need to use that much data its called wi-fi. Try it. We have 5 smartphones on a 6 GB plan of which we have yet to use more than 3 GB in a month. We are 23 days into our current month and we are at less than 2 GB so far.

LTE4LIFE

join:2013-02-28

1 recommendation

you must work for Verizon Wireless... That congestion excuse is getting long in the tooth. It's a myth!! You automatically assume that if unlimited data was given that the networks would become congested... Even if that was the issue, they can always put up more towers in heavily congested areas and use multiple gigabit fiber or microwave backhaul to feed those towers.. They don't even have to go with unlimited data.. 100GB would be plenty for most and I seriously doubt with 100GB data caps, the network would suffer from usage. The problem is that all of these cellular providers make billions each month and are slow to build out their networks. They spend more money in wowing the public with stupid commercials and paying their executives that for the most part have absolutely no idea how the technology even works..

silbaco
Premium
join:2009-08-03
USA
reply to 78036364

Re: xlte

said by 78036364:

said by patt2k:

many people on droid life hit 100 mbps.
I hit about 55-83 max on AWS aka xlte.

Yeah you can sustain that if you're the only one on the network. AWS like 700 MHz is still limited to a max of 150 Mbps COMBINED usage among ALL users. The advantage of the AWS spectrum is that it's 20 MHz wide not 10 MHz like 700 MHz so it can support 800 simultaneous users instead of 400. Of course 800/150Mbps is 192 kbps.

Their 700 MHz supports 150 Mbps theoretical? I thought it was lower than that.

dmeyer

join:2014-02-10
West Lafayette, IN

Waiting for XXXLTE.

C'mon Verizon, I want Band 2 and Band 5 lit up with LTE as well.

itguy05

join:2005-06-17
Carlisle, PA

1 recommendation

reply to 78036364

Re: yawn.

said by 78036364:

And if they did the network would be congested to hell and everyone would get dial-up speeds if they could connect at all.

Bzzt, wrong, thanks for playing. Collect your consolation prize at the door.

If it were truly about congestion they would throttle you or cut you off. They would also not sell absurdly large buckets of data.


aaronwt
Premium
join:2004-11-07
Woodbridge, VA

2 edits

1 recommendation

reply to 78036364
said by 78036364:

said by ArrayList:

not a big deal until they bring back unlimited data.

And if they did the network would be congested to hell and everyone would get dial-up speeds if they could connect at all. Why people still don't get this is beyond me. If you need to use that much data its called wi-fi. Try it. We have 5 smartphones on a 6 GB plan of which we have yet to use more than 3 GB in a month. We are 23 days into our current month and we are at less than 2 GB so far.

I use more than that each month from streaming Pandora and Amazon MP3. And that is in areas where WiFi is not an option. Like my car.

Fortunately I'm grandfathered in on unlimited data though. Because if I had to subscribe to just something like the 6GB tier, My yearly cost would increase by $720.(monthly would go up $60). The prices for that small amount of data is extremely high.

No idea though if my Droid DNA has access to their XLTE.


DaveDude
No Fear

join:1999-09-01
New Jersey
kudos:1
reply to ArrayList
its good to see verizon catch up on technology

shmerl

join:2013-10-21
reply to 78036364
You claimed it last time, but didn't provide any research which backs the claim that current networks can't handle simultaneous load of all subscribers in that area. So are you guessing or you have hidden sources?

patt2k

join:2009-01-16
kudos:1
Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS
reply to 78036364

Re: xlte

said by 78036364:

said by patt2k:

many people on droid life hit 100 mbps.
I hit about 55-83 max on AWS aka xlte.

Yeah you can sustain that if you're the only one on the network. AWS like 700 MHz is still limited to a max of 150 Mbps COMBINED usage among ALL users. The advantage of the AWS spectrum is that it's 20 MHz wide not 10 MHz like 700 MHz so it can support 800 simultaneous users instead of 400. Of course 800/150Mbps is 192 kbps.

I also seen speedtest of 130 mbps on different forum that was made couple months ago but I have to admit couple days ago at my place I didn't get AWS speeds even though my iPhone 5S was on band4 today I checked and indeed i get more speed.

78036364

join:2014-05-06
USA
reply to LTE4LIFE

Re: yawn.

said by LTE4LIFE:

you must work for Verizon Wireless... That congestion excuse is getting long in the tooth. It's a myth!! You automatically assume that if unlimited data was given that the networks would become congested

A myth? Ok why did they spend $3.6 billion for AWS spectrum and billions more deploying it? For shits and giggles? All the customers complaining abut congestion are liars? fact is Verizon has had congestion especially in the large metros that's why they are deploying AWS and that with only 25%-30% having unlimited data. And no I don't work for Verizon just because I'm not part of the "Mobile Data is a Magical Resource that is Infinite and Works On Sunshine and Rainbows and Pixie Dust" club.

78036364

join:2014-05-06
USA
reply to itguy05
said by itguy05:

Bzzt, wrong, thanks for playing. Collect your consolation prize at the door.

When you have to be a smart ass to make a point your point is usually wrong.

If it were truly about congestion they would throttle you or cut you off.

This is where it help to know the topic of which you are discussing. Verizon's 700MHz LTE is on the lower C block which has special rules. And those rules specially prevent Verizon from doing those very things.

(a) Applicability. This section shall apply only to the authorizations for Block C in the 746-757 and 776-787 MHz bands assigned and only if the results of the first auction in which licenses for such authorizations are offered satisfied the applicable reserve price.

(b) Use of devices and applications. Licensees offering service on spectrum subject to this section shall not deny, limit, or restrict the ability of their customers to use the devices and applications of their choice on the licensee's C Block network


They would also not sell absurdly large buckets of data.

They sell up to 50 GB and it costs $375. How many single line or 2 line customers can they possibly have for that? Also you can have up to 10 devices on an account so 50 GB/10= 5 GB each.

78036364

join:2014-05-06
USA
reply to shmerl
said by shmerl:

You claimed it last time, but didn't provide any research which backs the claim that current networks can't handle simultaneous load of all subscribers in that area. So are you guessing or you have hidden sources?

I have math. not even hard math. Use it and you'll get the answer. First though I suggest study up on how LTE works. If you think you can have an infinite number of people using infinite amount of data on a cell tower you clearly don't understand the basics.

78036364

join:2014-05-06
USA
reply to aaronwt
said by aaronwt:

Fortunately I'm grandfathered in on unlimited data though.

Enjoy it while it lasts. Which should be about another couple of months at best. When unlimited data is finally gone EVERYONE gets to benefit because the caps will be increased.

78036364

join:2014-05-06
USA
reply to dmeyer

Re: Waiting for XXXLTE.

said by dmeyer:

C'mon Verizon, I want Band 2 and Band 5 lit up with LTE as well.

Verizon won't be converting those over to LTE for another 6 years.


Mike
Premium,Mod
join:2000-09-17
Pittsburgh, PA
kudos:1

Oh good, capacity

Pittsburgh needs it badly. Just ran a LTE speed test at full bars and got 1.8mb down and 839kbps up.


Anon9385

@50.180.37.x
reply to aaronwt

Re: yawn.

Assuming that this "XLTE" thing is the recent deployment of AWS spectrum, I do not believe your Droid DNA has access to it. Only the very latest phones, I think starting with the LG G2 or maybe the Moto X, have the hardware to take advantage of the higher speeds.

Friendly note: if you ever want to upgrade your phone on-contract and keep your unlimited data, and you have at least one other person on your account that doesn't have the unlimited data, there's a loophole in the system you can take advantage of, if you go to a third-party retailer instead of a corporate Verizon store where the employees would be disciplined for doing it. Basically you can use your upgrade eligibility on the other line on the account to get the phone for the cheap contract price, then do one equipment swap to put that line back on its original equipment, then do one more equipment swap to get the new phone onto your number. It may burn a SIM card or two, and it requires more time than a typical Verizon phone upgrade, but it can be done if you ask nicely.


delusion ftl

@50.168.216.x
reply to silbaco

Re: xlte

You are correct, it's approx 37 mbit per 5x5 channel. So 10x10 (verizon and ATT's 700 lte) is about 74 mbit.

itguy05

join:2005-06-17
Carlisle, PA
reply to 78036364

Re: yawn.

said by 78036364:

This is where it help to know the topic of which you are discussing. Verizon's 700MHz LTE is on the lower C block which has special rules. And those rules specially prevent Verizon from doing those very things.

I know all about their rules for 700Mhz. And the thing is 700 Mhz doesn't have the bandwidth that the higher frequencies do. So they want to get you off it and onto the higher AWS spectrum (and even 800 Mhz) as much as possible.

Your phone can go to any available frequency at the request of the base stations. So you could be on 850, 700, AWS, or 1900 depending on where the network wants you. So they cold default to AWS, then 1900, then 850, and lastly 700 if they wanted to. No violation of the laws.

And it's not been proven that these buckets even help congestion.

Verizon states a large majority are on the bucket plans and, well, hmm, there are still congestion issues in cities. How could that be if the buckets were to eliminate them.

And to top it all off, Verizon wants to sell HomeFusion broadband over the same LTE network?

quote:
When you have to be a smart ass to make a point your point is usually wrong.
So, yeah my smartass comments are not wrong.

pittpete1

join:2009-06-12

Question for a person who hates using a smartphone to surf?

Why is it so important to have such high speeds on a phone/mobile device?
If you are in the car, you can't/don't stream movies.
If you are home shouldn't you use your own wifi to stream?
Really just curious

sonicmerlin

join:2009-05-24
Cleveland, OH
kudos:1
reply to 78036364

Re: xlte

quote:
Yeah except when you have those with unlimited data still that tether their phone to their computer to stream Netflix at 6 Mbps. You can see it wouldn't take long for tower capacity to get all used up by very few people and streamers are on the network for LONG periods of time not just a few seconds accessing a website.

Uh... How many people do you think actually do this, especially in congested downtown areas? Not how many do this in your fantasy world, but in real life.

sonicmerlin

join:2009-05-24
Cleveland, OH
kudos:1
reply to 78036364

Re: yawn.

$3.6 billion is only a fraction of what they earn in one year. They spent $150 billion to buy out vodaphone's stake.

The fact that they've been able to support their entire massive user base thus far with measly 10/10 channels at 700 MHz (with towers spread so far out) speaks volumes about how much capacity LTE has. Category 8 will be here in just a few years and bring a 10X increase in capacity.

sonicmerlin

join:2009-05-24
Cleveland, OH
kudos:1
reply to 78036364
Why would verizon increase caps? Why is unlimited going to be "gone" in a couple months?