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Comments on news posted 2014-06-02 08:31:52: In June of last year Google unveiled Google Loon, the latest in a long line of similar projects that will use hot air balloons to deliver broadband and wireless services to under-served or emergency prone areas. ..

page: 1 · 2 · next

tmc8080

join:2004-04-24
Brooklyn, NY

pie in the sky...

if the economy in the US isn't doing that well.. how 'in the world' do you expect the rest of the globe to afford access...

getting more US cities connected should be a priority for billions of dollars of investment.


existenz

join:2014-02-12
kudos:1
Reviews:
·Google Fiber

The white paper claims about 100ms latency...

...for low orbit, which is not bad compared to about 500ms traditional SAT orbit.

»www.o3bnetworks.com/media/45606/···0417.pdf


BosstonesOwn

join:2002-12-15
Wakefield, MA
Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS

1 recommendation

im just curious why not trench the fiber and also help run electricity to these places ? I know it's expensive, but at that point solar powered gear and wireless for the last mile from some points makes more sense.
--
"It's always funny until someone gets hurt......and then it's absolutely friggin' hysterical!"


existenz

join:2014-02-12
kudos:1
Reviews:
·Google Fiber
reply to tmc8080

Re: pie in the sky...

There are many uses for having global internet access in hard to reach areas including out at sea and at mountain peaks. It wouldn't just apply to 3rd World. And the low orbit gives better latency than current SAT internet, closer to HSPA latency.

A few $B is nothing to Google. $50B+ to fiber up entire country would be a major hit for them and likely would never hit rural areas. Low orbit is a great way to cover entire planet for fairly cheap and with doable latency.



fqw qwee add

@108.249.170.x
reply to BosstonesOwn

Re: The white paper claims about 100ms latency...

said by BosstonesOwn:

im just curious why not trench the fiber and also help run electricity to these places ? I know it's expensive, but at that point solar powered gear and wireless for the last mile from some points makes more sense.

corruption in many of these countries and the lack of political stability. People can still get solar charging for tablet size devices that could use satellite. Also, this works for low population density areas.


novaflare
The Dragon Was Here
Premium
join:2002-01-24
Barberton, OH

1 recommendation

reply to BosstonesOwn

they want to blanket the planet with internet. There is no possible way to run fiber in to say the congo region or amazon river regions Wifi balloons or other arial drone system would cover those areas or any other area on the planet with out the massive expense or running millions of miles of fiber. With this idea they also avoid the environmentalist groups going insane.



fg8578

join:2009-04-26
Salem, OR

Anybody remember "Iridium"?

Iridium was a network of 66 satellites to provide voice service, they declared bankruptcy in 1999. What does google plan to do differently that will make it successful where Motorola was not?


existenz

join:2014-02-12
kudos:1

1 recommendation

Low orbit allows for lower latency, new tech allows for higher speed, less weight, lower power needs, and now cheaper ways to deploy. It's a completely different era on all levels - 1999 is literally last century.


ITGeeks

join:2014-04-20
Cleveland, OH
reply to existenz

Re: pie in the sky...

There is already internet at Sea. Hughes Net and all the others. Mountain peaks? The same. Why invest in something thats already there and that you won't be able to do any better with the way it was designed.

And that $$$$ that they're spending on this, is something when you look at the shareholders. Haven't we learned that Google has hobbies/projects and not products?


ITGeeks

join:2014-04-20
Cleveland, OH
reply to existenz

Re: Anybody remember "Iridium"?

History repeats itself. Or is this different since according to you, Google can only do great things nobody else could have?


existenz

join:2014-02-12
kudos:1
reply to ITGeeks

Re: pie in the sky...

Because as mentioned they are higher orbit with poor latency. And Google isn't just going after what someone else offers, they are clearly trying to slow down various ISP restrictions popping up that harm their business model.



chip89
Premium
join:2012-07-05
Independence, OH
reply to ITGeeks

Expect that Google will a ton better then Hughes c***p!


existenz

join:2014-02-12
kudos:1
Reviews:
·Google Fiber

1 recommendation

reply to ITGeeks

Re: Anybody remember "Iridium"?

No, O3b is doing it. Google is just helping to enable it because it likely helps Google's long term biz model. I have no idea if it will be successful but the chances are much much higher with what O3b is doing and newer tech available on all levels, including deploying to space.


decifal

join:2007-03-10
Bon Aqua, TN
kudos:1

great

Great... With google building fiber, i'm sure even after they claim to cover the entire country in fiber (lets say 2050) i'll be the only s.o.b stuck with satellite only options from them and it may be decent for a little while before they do the ceremonial self detonate sequence on the bird being nobody "needed" it.

I hate living in the service nexus of the world, non rural, life all around us, but services are scattered like a redneck board nail shotgun.

But with the land and house fully paid for, there is no moving.. Not with this artificial economy



chip89
Premium
join:2012-07-05
Independence, OH
reply to fg8578

Re: Anybody remember "Iridium"?

Iridium still exists today... »en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iridium_···ellation



robbyglack

@50.243.146.x
reply to fg8578

said by fg8578:

Iridium was a network of 66 satellites to provide voice service, they declared bankruptcy in 1999. What does google plan to do differently that will make it successful where Motorola was not?

both iridium and globalstar tried to provide service to handheld devices, that is far more complicated than to fixed locations with much larger antennas.

iridium also9 did not predict the widespread deployment of cellular and thought there would be a market for satellite voice service for business people commuting between there homes in the suburbs and the city. at the time cellular was not expected to cover those areas in between.

me1212

join:2008-11-20
Pleasant Hill, MO
reply to existenz

Re: pie in the sky...

World wide internet access with latency similar to HSPA... That would be awesome! Sure its not fiber but its still really cool.


me1212

join:2008-11-20
Pleasant Hill, MO

1 recommendation

reply to existenz

Re: The white paper claims about 100ms latency...

100ms, dang thats good enough to do some gaming on, not optimal sure but I got used to 300ms playing with some guys in europe so 100 sounds good to me.


ITGeeks

join:2014-04-20
Cleveland, OH
reply to existenz

Re: pie in the sky...

And you don't think that they're won't be restrictions on this? There is only so much bandwidth available on a bird. You do understand that right???

And ya the MOT product was that way as well.


ITGeeks

join:2014-04-20
Cleveland, OH
reply to chip89

Maybe. They actually have to have a product first. And then actually DEPLOY the product and not sign mass amounts of contracts that mean nothing.


ITGeeks

join:2014-04-20
Cleveland, OH
reply to fqw qwee add

Re: The white paper claims about 100ms latency...

And who says those same places won't shoot down these balloons?


ITGeeks

join:2014-04-20
Cleveland, OH
reply to existenz

Re: Anybody remember "Iridium"?

Nothing has changed with the physics from space. You can't change the laws of physics that's the thing. And so you'd rather see a company drop billions in a business that probably will die just as it did before? Great business model eh?

And helping and purchasing are two different things and there is nothing in a long term business model that calls for balloons from years ago.


BosstonesOwn

join:2002-12-15
Wakefield, MA
Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS
reply to ITGeeks

Re: The white paper claims about 100ms latency...

That was my thought... but I think they said its like 12 miles up. Have to be either a good shot or state sponsored thuggery im guessing.
--
"It's always funny until someone gets hurt......and then it's absolutely friggin' hysterical!"


existenz

join:2014-02-12
kudos:1
Reviews:
·Google Fiber
reply to ITGeeks

Re: Anybody remember "Iridium"?

I don't think you understand what you post most the time - you half understand but try as hard as you can to diss anything Google or not in support of whatever ISP you work for.

Low orbit satellite will have lower latency than high orbit satellite. You seem to partly understand but don't seem to fully understand.



novaflare
The Dragon Was Here
Premium
join:2002-01-24
Barberton, OH

1 recommendation

reply to BosstonesOwn

Re: The white paper claims about 100ms latency...

it would be nearly impossible to shoot any thing down that is 12 miles up from the ground.

Also does any one know if the 100 ms is round trip or one way? I know most sat net providers will talk about 500ms and make it out like this is round trip when in reality it is each way and that's only in best conditions. Im thinking that it is round trip. Potential is allot better though id say 75ms pings once its all up and running would not be out side the realm of possibility with this. Basically is you can get sub 100ms from a server half way around the world then the 12 mile altitude is not going to make a huge difference. It will be a limit on what their transceivers can push out wattage wise. Higher watts better pings lower watts higher pings. Granted other factors will effect it clouds etc. Pretty much any thing that will effect sat signal will effect this but to a much less extent.



anonasdasdas

@50.170.133.x
reply to BosstonesOwn

Well duh, lasers?



anonaaaaaaaa

@50.170.133.x
reply to existenz

Re: Anybody remember "Iridium"?

A) Satellites are slowly becoming obsolete because well duh - lower power requirements, less weight, better materials, and software to keep them (wireless radio-equiped solar aircraft) on the 'path'.
B) The real advantage to what Google is doing is inspiring people to roll their own alternatives to the locked-down WWW of the future.


existenz

join:2014-02-12
kudos:1
reply to novaflare

Re: The white paper claims about 100ms latency...

I'd think it's one-way too but not sure. They are saying 4-5 times better than traditional SAT for round trip but I'd think just from device to SAT, not the entire path of other systems involved.



novaflare
The Dragon Was Here
Premium
join:2002-01-24
Barberton, OH

Ahh 4 to 5 times better that would be 1 way. Sat net is 500ms 1 way 1 second round trip. That seems a little slow to me honestly.

A tv satellite (same orbit as a satellite internet satellite is 22,236 miles high above us. Now 12 miles is 1/2000 the distance. See why 100ms one way seems a bit high to me? Ahh well looks like there is plenty of room for improvement with this tech. Id say in 5 years after it is in place we should see ping times round trip in sub 100 ms. Doubt we will see any thing much better than mid 70s. But of course like sat net this is not meant for heavy gaming etc just for getting net to places where your not normally able to. You just know googles gona pump out ip tv service with this to. If they do it will kill satalite tv out right i suspect and honestly id love to see dish and direct tv get smashed esp direct tv. The fee you to death sobs need to be put to death heh. Got to love $90 for tv packages advertised at sub $30.



IPPlanMan
Holy Cable Modem Batman

join:2000-09-20
Washington, DC
kudos:1

Pissing money away....

It amazes me how much money Google has to piss away.