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Comments on news posted 2014-09-04 14:35:14: Most FCC bosses (from both parties) have paid a lot of lip service to broadband competition over the years, but usually lack the conviction to upset major campaign donors and embrace the kind of policies that could really fix things. ..

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Drakemoore
join:2005-02-03
Hawthorne, FL

1 recommendation

Drakemoore

Member

Or worse, a monopoly.

Unless you count cruddy wireless 1gb cap or satellite 15gb cap.

Everyone in my region of Florida only has ATT DSL at best.

buzz_4_20
join:2003-09-20
Dover, NH

1 recommendation

buzz_4_20

Member

Race to a gig...

Lemmie guess... the race is held in big cities and major roads...
xthepeoplesx
join:2013-10-21

2 recommendations

xthepeoplesx

Member

What does the 4mbps/1mbps broadband mean?

I have CenturyLink with an upload speed of 768k. Does this mean I do NOT have broadband? If so are there any laws to state that CenturyLink is not allowed to call it broadband or does what the FCC state as broadband just not matter? Can CenturyLink be sued for misrepresenting this?

EDIT: Also does this mean that I am in an area where there is NO broadband? And I am not part of the charts or graphs?
Drakemoore
join:2005-02-03
Hawthorne, FL

1 recommendation

Drakemoore

Member

Re: What does the 4mbps/1mbps broadband mean?

Mine's 368K with ATT.

CapsGreed
@50.170.133.x

1 recommendation

CapsGreed to xthepeoplesx

Anon

to xthepeoplesx
Even more hilarity from CL. I was considering switching to them and read this regarding how much it would take to reach the 250GB limit (which is why I'm not switching to that nonsense - 7Mbps doesn't even need a GD cap):
"Q: Will these guidelines impact my Internet usage?
A: In order to exceed the monthly guidelines, each month, you would have to send, view, watch or listen
to:
15+ million unique e-mails
300,000 - 500,000 photos
1,000 - 3,000 30-minute shows streamed from Netflix
40,000 - 80,000 MP3 music files"

That's off by what, a factor of 10 or more on Netflix? Why don't I use their math and say 10000%? XD Let's assume 10MB per MP3. That's 25K at any decent bitrate. Whoever did that chart is assuming the worst resolutions and sample rates with the best compression. Also, I won't even do the math for Blu-Ray resolution movies since it's so obvious.
xthepeoplesx
join:2013-10-21

xthepeoplesx

Member

Re: What does the 4mbps/1mbps broadband mean?

haha right! At blu-ray quality between 25gb-50gb, in between 10 - 5 movies a month with NOTHING else being downloaded. And yea I thought every service had 256k mp3s now? Whatever, I think we all know what is going on here.
Drakemoore
join:2005-02-03
Hawthorne, FL

Drakemoore to xthepeoplesx

Member

to xthepeoplesx
Another example, a lot of the more recent PC games are approaching 15-20GB+. Furthermore, there's console digital purchases now and a whole other plethora of content besides Netflix.

It's stupid to have data caps so low, or have them at all in my opinion.
PowerMac
join:2011-03-02
Anaheim, CA

PowerMac

Member

One word

Yawn
PacW97
join:2013-04-23
Bellevue, WA

4 recommendations

PacW97

Member

Two main points, speed and last mile...

The two main emphasis I would love to see highlighted are,

1. Wheeler said that a 25 Mbps connection "should be considered 'table stakes' in 21st century communications."

2. the entire Open Internet proceeding is about ensuring that the Internet remains free from barriers erected by last-mile providers."

He stated what a lot of us have been saying for a long time. The last mile... from my view is where competition should be encouraged. All the community broadband projects out there should own the last mile and local building code should enforce that builders put those lines in. The connection point should be open for any broadband provider...

25 mbps should be the lowest practical speed for any residential connection. That speed covers H.265 (4k streaming) fairly well and for those households doing simple streaming there should be enough bandwidth to connect and use more than one device.

v6movement
@206.51.28.x

v6movement

Anon

Re: Two main points, speed and last mile...

said by PacW97:

25 mbps should be the lowest practical speed for any residential connection. That speed covers H.265 (4k streaming) fairly well and for those households doing simple streaming there should be enough bandwidth to connect and use more than one device.

The problem is 25 Mbps should have been the defined minimum speed a few years ago. Setting that as the minimum speed now means that in the areas that are stuck on 1.5 / 3 Mbps DSL connections or anything similar by the time they see such an upgrade and if it is literally to just 25 by the time that rolls out 2-3 years from now it will be too little too late. The minimum should be set to something higher like 50 Mbps so when areas are upgraded they will be at the speeds that will be the average speed for areas already upgraded instead of building to an outdated specification.
Skippy25
join:2000-09-13
Hazelwood, MO

Skippy25

Member

Re: Two main points, speed and last mile...

Being back in 1996 Verizon said it was 45/45mbps that is the definition that should have been set back then.
BiggA
Premium Member
join:2005-11-23
Central CT
·Frontier FiberOp..
Asus RT-AC68

BiggA to v6movement

Premium Member

to v6movement
Once you build out the physical coax or fiber, which is required for more than a couple of mbps, you pretty much automatically get to 100mbps or higher. So it's basically all-or-nothing. VDSL doesn't really count since it's so distance limited anyways that it's mostly deployed in suburban and urban areas.

v6movement
@135.23.225.x

v6movement

Anon

Re: Two main points, speed and last mile...

said by BiggA:

Once you build out the physical coax or fiber, which is required for more than a couple of mbps, you pretty much automatically get to 100mbps or higher. So it's basically all-or-nothing. VDSL doesn't really count since it's so distance limited anyways that it's mostly deployed in suburban and urban areas.

You're assuming they're using coax or fiber. You know there are people in suburban and urban areas that don't have access to broadband? Even outside of those areas VDSL2 could be used just fine. Lots of people would kill for a 50 Mbps connection over 1.5 or 3 Mbps.
BiggA
Premium Member
join:2005-11-23
Central CT
·Frontier FiberOp..
Asus RT-AC68

BiggA

Premium Member

Re: Two main points, speed and last mile...

Very few urban or suburban areas lack broadband. If the density is high end up to put VRAD-like devices out there for VDSL, then it's definitely dense enough to do coax or fiber. The challenge is the rural areas. Really, we should just wire fiber everywhere like we did for telephone. But that takes a lot of money to do. Money the telcos don't want to spend, even for a monopoly.

Cookiepuss
@172.242.86.x

3 recommendations

Cookiepuss

Anon

Fixed LTE

The fact that he's even entertaining the notion of fixed LTE after AT&T has unveiled their barely competitive with satellite plans is kind of worrying.

It's a well written speech, I'll definitely give him that, but even the slightest token action to actually promote a fair broadband market would be worth so much more.

Zenit_IIfx
The system is the solution
Premium Member
join:2012-05-07
Purcellville, VA
·Comcast XFINITY

5 recommendations

Zenit_IIfx

Premium Member

Re: Fixed LTE

Fixed-LTE is a joke. If the data caps were reasonable, like 100gb, 250gb then sure its a decent solution for those with nothing.

With VZ's current fixed LTE prices I would pay $2000 in overages for 200gb of usage.

Something will need to be worked out.
78036364 (banned)
join:2014-05-06
USA

78036364 (banned)

Member

Re: Fixed LTE

said by Zenit_IIfx:

Fixed-LTE is a joke. If the data caps were reasonable, like 100gb, 250gb then sure its a decent solution for those with nothing.

With VZ's current fixed LTE prices I would pay $2000 in overages for 200gb of usage.

Something will need to be worked out.

Technically your overages would be $1700 but you point is made.

Well when fixed LTE uses just 10 MHz of spectrum the same spectrum is also being used by cell phones then no you're not getting 250 GB caps. I'd say you're about 4 years out minimum from being able to have these caps increased significantly.

buzz_4_20
join:2003-09-20
Dover, NH

1 recommendation

buzz_4_20 to Zenit_IIfx

Member

to Zenit_IIfx
Fixed LTE is quite a joke.
And current pricing doesn't do it any favors.

There are some good point to point systems, but they use microwaves. and are quite spendy.

aaronwt
Premium Member
join:2004-11-07
Woodbridge, VA
Asus RT-AX89

aaronwt

Premium Member

Re: Fixed LTE

said by buzz_4_20:

Fixed LTE is quite a joke.
And current pricing doesn't do it any favors.

There are some good point to point systems, but they use microwaves. and are quite spendy.

I thought Fixed LTE competes with Satellite Internet? Not wireline internet. Fixed LTE is a good alternative to satellite internet service.
sparek
join:2002-06-10
united state

sparek to Cookiepuss

Member

to Cookiepuss
Fixed LTE could be a real solution. I know it costs money to run new lines and new fiber lines to under served areas, and wireless towers can cover that more efficiently. But something will have to be done to the caps and pricing to make this more competitive.

Fixed LTE with 50GB at $40/mo would seem to be a reasonable medium.

I know wireless bandwidth isn't free for these wireless companies, but how much pure profit are they making at that $10 per 1 GB? That's something the FCC and FTC should look into.

Also, whatever happened to the whitespace broadband effort? All that unused spectrum from the analog to digital TV conversion? That would seem to be a market that community and smaller local telephone or telecommunication groups could take advantage of.
elefante72
join:2010-12-03
East Amherst, NY

1 recommendation

elefante72

Member

Re: Fixed LTE

+1

802.22 and whitespace. The low-cost answer and no spectrum vig. It almost seems to easy for the last mile problem.

»www.nict.go.jp/en/press/ ··· 3-1.html
sparek
join:2002-06-10
united state

sparek

Member

Re: Fixed LTE

How close do you think any of this is to coming to the states?

There are some local smaller (non-national) ISPs around here that can't lay fiber or cable in the territory where these larger national ISPs have control, would whitespace broadband be an option for them? They could set a tower up near the corner of where their controlling territory ends and allow whitespace wireless broadband to these other individuals. Individuals that these larger national broadband companies have chosen to ignore.

Not sure what the costs involved in setting this up would be. Not sure if it would be legal. But since whitespace is suppose to be unregulated, as long as the tower is set on local ISP controlled land and fed with local ISP fiber as a backhaul, might that work?

Will be interesting to see how this technology takes off.

GreedyEffs
@50.170.133.x

GreedyEffs

Anon

Re: Fixed LTE

They specifically designed the regulations to prevent that. All the regulations are bad - except the ones they need to keep us from opening our own competing non-BS services. Yeah, they're not libertarian in the least f***ing way. Communists by another name want to keep their monopoly on power.

Zenit_IIfx
The system is the solution
Premium Member
join:2012-05-07
Purcellville, VA
·Comcast XFINITY

Zenit_IIfx

Premium Member

Re: Fixed LTE

Not even Communists. They are making a huge profit on the service, not a total loss. (Although the telcos do have the mismanagement style of a soviet bureaucracy - "Please wait 10 years for broadband....if Chairman McAdam allows it!")

They are more industry robber baron monopolist banker types that want EVERY penny of everyone's money.
xthepeoplesx
join:2013-10-21

xthepeoplesx to sparek

Member

to sparek
Verizon? 4 BILLION this last quarter.
Skippy25
join:2000-09-13
Hazelwood, MO

4 recommendations

Skippy25 to sparek

Member

to sparek
Wireless will never be a solution for broadband in the place of wired.

If they where able to get electrical lines, gas lines or phones lines to a place then they are able to get a fiber line and provide real broadband and that is the standard that should be used.

Zenit_IIfx
The system is the solution
Premium Member
join:2012-05-07
Purcellville, VA

1 recommendation

Zenit_IIfx

Premium Member

Re: Fixed LTE

I agree entirely with you. It was profitable to build out telephone service to these areas, so why not broadband via FTTH?

Wireless is a hack, a temporary solution for use on mobiles or as a connection of last resort.
sparek
join:2002-06-10
united state

sparek to Skippy25

Member

to Skippy25
I agree that wired connections are always going to have an advantage. I'm just saying that if you have a sparsely populated area, which is most rural areas, fixed LTE or whitespace wireless broadband, could be more cost effective than a wired connection for broadband companies.

I don't see fixed LTE or wireless ever competing with wired connections in terms of monthly bandwidth caps. But I do think these could be a bit more reasonable. 30 to 50GB per month at a reasonable price is adequate for those areas.

Believe it or not, there are actually people that don't stream Netflix and watch youtube or other videos for entertainment every night. 250GB of bandwidth isn't necessary for everybody. But these 5 to 10GB (at a pretty penny too) for current wireless offerings is a little lackluster. Especially when you tie in necessary operating system updates and other application updates.

The majority of people I know, some of which are actually still using dialup (don't ask me how), I just don't think speed is that much of an importance to them. They're on dialup, they don't stream Netflix, they just want the websites that they visit to load in a reasonable amount of time. And for that purpose, a 768kbps DSL and a 30Mbps cable connection, is going to load the website in about the same amount of time. It's not the speed that is a detriment, it's the monthly bandwidth cap. I have a hard time recommending a $50 for 5GB per month plan for them, because that 5GB can be used up fairly quickly. I would rather see a 768kbps with 50GB monthly cap than a 25Mbps 5GB cap for these individuals.
Skippy25
join:2000-09-13
Hazelwood, MO

Skippy25

Member

Re: Fixed LTE

Regardless, as I stated if electricity water phone or any other service has been feed there, then fiber should be required.
sparek
join:2002-06-10
united state

sparek

Member

Re: Fixed LTE

Well, I kind of agree (I guess, "required" is the word I'm hung up on).

I'm just saying that some form of wireless LTE with acceptable and meaningful monthly caps, would be easier for the broadband companies (I think... maybe not?).

There was a local ISP around here that got a very large government grant to run fiber throughout their entire service area, and they did. For all the talk about the employment and lack of jobs throughout this country, if the government would take some of that money, find these service areas that are not covered by any form of broadband and use a similar program to feed them fiber and get this country wired for the 21st century, I would think that would be a win-win. So that's definitely something that could be looked at.

But I keep pointing to the broadbandmap.gov website and the government has no idea how unwired parts of this country truly are.
Skippy25
join:2000-09-13
Hazelwood, MO

Skippy25

Member

Re: Fixed LTE

Sure it would be easier. It would be even more easy for them to do absolutely nothing and just charge everyone $75 a month for providing no services at all.

However, they make billions every quarter (not year) and can afford to roll it out if forced to.

Zenit_IIfx
The system is the solution
Premium Member
join:2012-05-07
Purcellville, VA
·Comcast XFINITY

1 recommendation

Zenit_IIfx

Premium Member

Talkin a lot

Wheeler is talking a lot, but action is not existent.
The government will have to man up for this task just like they did Electricity 100 years ago, and Telephone 90 years ago.

Universal Service or a busted economy, your choice US Gov.

Anyways, I agreee with the chairman on a lot of these points...25mbit is a good starting point for 21st century broadband. Its fast enough that updates and downloads are not grueling, and most applications (save massive backups) can be performed over the internet with that type of connection speed.

Cable has that covered easy. But the ILEC's are going to have problems continuing to stretch every penny out of the copper twisted pair network.

bluefox8
join:2014-08-20

bluefox8

Member

Re: Talkin a lot

said by Zenit_IIfx:

Wheeler is talking a lot, but action is not existent.
The government will have to man up for this task just like they did Electricity 100 years ago, and Telephone 90 years ago.

All he has done is talk.. talk.. talk..

Democrats = delay delay delay until elections
Republicans = support "free" market monopolies

I think both parties understand their roles in keeping any change from happening. While Comcast/Verizon/etc continue to steal/extract profits from the american public and continue to give politicians (both R and D) their cuts/campaign contributions.
sparek
join:2002-06-10
united state

sparek

Member

Fix broadbandmap.gov

That would be one thing I would look to fix first. The FCC's broadbandmap.gov website is severely broken, showing broadband options for areas that do not have any broadband options.

If these broadband companies are getting government subsidies or kickbacks because the maps are showing that they serve areas that they don't serve, that needs to stop. The broadbandmap.gov website needs some oversight, so that the FCC can see just how poorly some areas of the country are wired for broadband.

•••••••
ocjosh
join:2013-03-19
Anaheim, CA
·T-Mobile
·Verizon Wireless

ocjosh

Member

Competition?

How about one zip code in Anahiem 92801, on the Orangethorpe Ave, there is only one far far away ISP AT&T DSL up to 1.5 Mbps in my address where should be considered as high density populated area.

It's a pity for Los Angeles, North Orange county market with my case, only slowest DSL. Slower bonded U-verse, spotty coverage Time Warner, Selective city has FiOS, Charter or Cox.

FCC or someone needs to act fast to save the developed country title.

OpTiC
Premium Member
join:2014-03-08
West Covina, CA

OpTiC

Premium Member

Re: Competition?

Same in my case some parts of my city West Covina has Charter and the other half is Time Warner Cable. Fios covers most of West Covina and there are some areas in West Covina is still stuck in DSL. I live in the part of West Covina where it has Time Warner Cable 300/20 mbps or Verizon Fios. Luckily my area has fios.
Teresa50
join:2014-04-30
Greenfield, TN

Teresa50

Member

Ha!

Maybe you should help rural America too! I'm stuck with satellite internet and a whopping 15gb monthly data allowance. Ha! Well maybe I should go wireless and only get 5gb of data, both are a joke but these two options are my only choice And G** forbid if I go over these monthly allowances I have to pay $10 for one extra gb of data on my satellite that I already pay $80 a month for or have an outrageous phone bill with the overages if I go over their limit. Help out rural America. Won't count my chickens before they hatch this is what I get for choosing to own my own home that isn't in the city.

Selenia
Gentoo Convert
Premium Member
join:2006-09-22
Fort Smith, AR

Selenia

Premium Member

Accurate but for the speeds

It is a good guide as to what providers are out there, but not the speeds they provide on the wired and wireless. Yes, my providers at home are Cox and AT&T but 1 gbit available from Cox?!!! I wish. Speed 3-6 mbit was spot on for AT&T though so I think you can figure out who I picked. More like 150/20 is the max at my address, which I used. I also typed in the location I am staying now and it actually does not give TWC enough credit. It says 10-25 mbps and they actually offer 35, but at a steep price. It gives Verizon too much credit at 6-10 mbps. 6 is available in very few spots and never reaches 6. Many are still stuck on 3. As far as 10, I want to know about that secret package. Just like I would love to know Cox's secret 1 gbps package back home they won't tell me about. They lie to me and say Ultimate is the best at 150/20

KrK
Heavy Artillery For The Little Guy
Premium Member
join:2000-01-17
Tulsa, OK

KrK

Premium Member

Around here, people who HAD DSL can no longer get it.

That's right. It's going backwards. Areas that had (albeit, slow) broadband can no longer get it anymore, as they are being abandoned by the SINGLE provider of broadband to them.

Great progress, America.

•••
bcltoys
join:2008-07-21

bcltoys

Member

Bull shit

Census block bullshit mean's fucking nothing.
MaynardKrebs
We did it. We heaved Steve. Yipee.
Premium Member
join:2009-06-17

MaynardKrebs

Premium Member

Current state of affairs isn't much different than this

United States v. Paramount Pictures, Inc.
334 U.S. 131 (1948)

»supreme.justia.com/cases ··· 334/131/

Back then the US Supreme Court had real men sitting on it and actually did something positive.
RustyDonut
join:2013-05-28
Boston, MA

RustyDonut

Member

FCC and GOV needs to do its job.

Are we really allowing all of this to happen? The government does not care about the people. They take bribes and money from Big companies and corporations and do what they say. They need to stop these ISP cartels who will do ANYTHING to get more and more money when they already have more than enough money. I am disgusted with the federal government nor do i trust them. I am not even going to vote this year for any politicians, Just the ballot initiatives. Because Politicians wont even do their real jobs.

telcodad
MVM
join:2011-09-16
Lincroft, NJ

telcodad

MVM

Is Wheeler looking upon the Comcast-TWC merger unfavorably?

Is this the beginning of the end of the Comcast-TWC merger?
By Brad Reed, BGR - September 4, 2014
»bgr.com/2014/09/04/fcc-c ··· r-cable/
quote:
FCC chairman Tom Wheeler just gave a tough speech about the state of broadband competition in the United States and it seems to bode very poorly for Comcast’s proposed merger with Time Warner Cable. Per The Washington Post, Wheeler ripped into what he said were broadband “duopolies” in many markets while noting that “meaningful competition for high-speed wired broadband is lacking.”
:
While he never mentioned the Comcast-TWC merger, these remarks seem to indicate that Wheeler looks upon it unfavorably since it would take the two largest cable companies in the United States and make them even bigger. After all, fostering competition will only get harder when there’s one mammoth company that dominates high-speed broadband access in the United States.
telcodad

telcodad

MVM

Re: Is Wheeler looking upon the Comcast-TWC merger unfavorably?

Also on the FierceCable site today:

Wheeler's comments foreboding to Comcast-TWC merger? Depends who you ask
By Daniel Frankel, FierceCable - September 5, 2014
»www.fiercecable.com/stor ··· 14-09-05

OpTiC
Premium Member
join:2014-03-08
West Covina, CA

OpTiC

Premium Member

America

Welcome to America where people expect you to pay thousands of dollars for slow ass internet speeds.
xQim
join:2003-09-20
01234

1 recommendation

xQim

Member

Change Will Never Happen

There is absolutely no motivation/incentive for any ISP companies to expand and/or upgrade the speed packages, pricing, or data caps if you are unlucky enough to deal with that. The American Democracy is for the people (Corporations), by the people (Corporations). These corporations pay big money to lobby and bribe their way out of providing decent service at a reasonable price. This is how congressional individuals fund their campaigns or "side projects." It is almost impossible to even start a new ISP as the oligopolies will just destroy your company with frivolous lawsuits to bankrupt you, undercut your service effecting your customers, or provide 2nd class service. It is quite sad. They always claim of costs yet rake in billions of dollars in profit each year. If you can have a telephone wire run to your home then at the very least offer unlimited 128K-ISDN & IDSL @ $40/Month/Maximum. Almost no ISP seems to offer these services. I realize these aren't truly broadband but at least they offer broadband latencies and I would gladly take them over dial-up, satellite, and wireless cellular. Why not create a hybrid 1-Way Satellite system using ISDN or IDSL for uplink on extended ranges, giving you higher downloads with broadband latency? Then again, you would have to raise the ridiculously low data caps. The minimum data cap should be 30GB/Month as a starter package. Just my ranting....

•••
rfrooney
join:2006-02-26
Antioch, TN

rfrooney

Member

Wheeler is nothing more than another gutless politician

He will make a lot of noise, grab some more headlines, then do nothing in the end. Better he just shut the hell up and go away.

Joe22
@70.196.3.x

Joe22

Anon

I WANT a duopoly in my town!

I WANT a duopoly, because right now I have ZERO options in rural Texas. Maybe the FCC should FORCE large corporations like ATT an VERIZON to cover EVERYONE EVERYWHERE in the US before worrying about duopoly in the city!
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