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Comments on news posted 2002-02-25 09:08:10: The documents librarian at George Mason University was told in a government letter to destroy the CD-ROM of the nation's water supply data "by any means. ..
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  nc1165
join:2001-04-10
Delray Beach, FL | Maybe we should close Radio Shack, too. There was never anything free about freedom. I thought book burnings were behind us. Well, for anybody wanting instructions on what an e-bomb consists of, it can be put together for about $400 - a crappy little device that would, theoretically, put the technological world back about 200 years.
quote:
With no war declared, an undefined battlefield and time frame involved, how much information will disappear from the Net? And for how long?
History books are our manual and I will not be scared into surrendering my freedom. New Hampshire's State motto says it best - "Live free or die."
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If my enemy cuts me, I will drown him in my own blood. | |
| |  TZi
join:2001-07-05
Miami Beach, FL | Re: Maybe we should close Radio Shack, too. I agree. This does nothing to stop the real issue at hand.
A terrorist, or anybody else with malicious purpose will probably be able to get access to any information they want by devious means.
If we were to start destroying and/or classifying important public data, the only people that would really stand to be hurt by this would be the average Americans that have legitimate uses for the data.
Furthermore, leaving such information in conspicuous places such as libraries and public information centers could give us a heads up on who might be planning what. Why not monitor who looks at this data instead of hiding it altogether. Lets catch the next would-be-terrorist sitting at the micro-fiche in a local library instead of at a water plant with sabotage plans he obtained through an alternative source somewhere overseas! Banishing information from the institutions under our control does not prevent access to it, it only defers it to places where we really don't know who's looking at what!
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Miami Hurricanes #1 (we're back!) | |
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| | when big brother's attack, part 3, tonight on FOX I work at a library, and I have to admit that if the people there got a letter from the US GOVT. they would follow it to the letter. We need to start standing up for our rights.
The United States Government is going to impose a bunch of laws and regulations which may look legit today- because of course, hey, its war right? We can do this for National Security. After the Taliban hype, the laws will still exist, and won't be repealed.
I think the entire WTC/911 issue is a scam by big brother. War creates national pride and allows us to make laws we wouldn't be able to make if there was no war. | |
| | TZi
join:2001-07-05
Miami Beach, FL
| Re: when big brother's attack, part 3, tonight on FOX said by BlackOPS:
War creates national pride and allows us to make laws we wouldn't be able to make if there was no war.
I disagree with what the government is doing in terms of suppressing data, however it is important to realize that no law is permanent. Every time an issue comes up concerning a given law, that law is subject to judicial review and can be thrown out or go otherwise un-enforced at any time without consulting its authors. That's why our founding fathers created the separation of the three branches-- so that one could evaluate the other at a later time without fear of retribution or entanglement. It would be pretty hard to carry on a conspiracy in a government with such provisions in place.
In Coral Gables, where I live, there is a law on the books which says that 3 unrelated women can't live in the same house or it's considered to be a whore house, and the women who live in it whores. Needless to say, though this law is still on the books, it is never enforced. Still, though, this prevented sororities from building sorority houses at The University of Miami when the college was built and there still aren't any cuz now there's no room! Sucks--so many fine women, but no sorority houses to go get denied a date at! =)
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Miami Hurricanes #1 (we're back!)
[text was edited by author 2002-02-25 10:18:25] | |
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| |  All of it is TOTAL FRAUD!
Add it all up!
TALEBAN IN TEXAS FOR TALKS on GAS PIPELINE.
The deal goes sour so Bush goes after them, not Osama.
»news6.thdo.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/···7021.stm
The US Combat Commander in Afghanistan said that apprehending bin Laden "isn't one of the missions."
Bush "says" he wants Bin's head, but that is only to rally public support for HIS OIL WAR.
»www.usatoday.com/news/attack/200···toll.htm
If it was not for the smugness of Bush towards Clinton
(Clinton was after Bin Laden and bombed him already)
and Bush trying to make a deal to control OIL there and didn't want to tick off the Taliben, 9-11 most likely wouldn't even had happened!
»www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dy···002Jan19
»www.salon.com/politics/feature/2···12/bush/
Talk about looking into why 9-11 happened and Cheney calls you a traitor and threatens you:
»www.msnbc.com/news/694812.asp
Cheney will also die before giving up his Enron papers. They show the sweet deal of OIL all of them would make BILLIONS on.
This entire thing is one big "Wag The Dog | |
| | TZi
join:2001-07-05
Miami Beach, FL
| Re: All of it is TOTAL FRAUD! How can you say that? Are you accusing our government of killing ~3000 people in NYC and Washington D.C. to start a war over oil? This war is about some 3000 people dying plain and simple.
Obviously, being from California, you're ignorant to the depth of the feelings of the people in NYC and D.C or the parents of Daniel Perl. To them, and to me, this war is over their mother, brother, son, daughter, best friend, or arch enemy who died as a result of what happened.
Personally, I care more for life than oil and I think our government does too. To suggest otherwise does not only devalue the lives of those who died innocent, it makes you look like a fool! How would you like it if i called the execution of someone who murdered you a government conspiracy for oil! It's downright disrespectful. I did an internship at Morgan Stanley Dean Witter and the woman who was kind enough to let me into her life and office is now dead. Do you she think wanted to be accused of dying for oil?
PS If you truly think it's an oil conspiracy, stop using oil and do something about it! Don't drive your car to work this morning or take the bus. I wouldn't want anymore innocent people to die in an "oil war".
[text was edited by author 2002-02-25 10:35:10] | |
| | | | | Re: All of it is TOTAL FRAUD! Just as Enron is providing smoking guns that point in unexpected directions, it also provides a model for understanding our larger political situation. Bethany McLean showed in Fortune magazine a year ago that Enron, 'the 7th Largest Corporation In America,' was actually making less money than a small chain of Dairy Queens, yet no one would believe her. Jeffrey Skilling and friends went to her boss and demanded, 'What are her credentials?' Which is another way saying, 'She's just some punk reporter, a chick at that, and who is she to challenge the CEO of the 7th Largest Corporation In America?' And that summed up the entire reaction of Wall Street, brusquely dismissing McLean and continuing to issue 'Strong Buy' ratings on Enron till the bitter end. While Bethany McLean merely possessed the facts, what Skilling and Wall Street possessed is what can be called 'the prevailing narrative;' consisting of what everybody seems to be believing because it's what the particular vested powers of the situation want to be believed. Investors who lost billions in the collapse of the Internet bubble are currently being castigated because they believed the hype; yet during the bubble the business press printed nothing but hype. Same with Enron, same with all of Wall Street, with its pro forma earnings statements and consulting/auditing kickback schemes. The truth can't be told because the viability of the enterprise depends entirely on telling lies.
The facts of the Bush administration's true agenda in Central Asia, and of still undressed questions concerning the events of 9/11, can be discovered by anyone with the slight wit and ambition required to do a Google search. Try 'Zacarias Moussaoui and FISA warrants,' or 'FISA warrants and John Ashcroft and Janet Reno.' According to www.securityfocus.com/news/201 , under Clinton and Janet Reno, "In 2000 as in previous years, no FISA (Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act) warrant requests were refused." In the current Village Voice, Nat Hentoff reports that Ashcroft's chief legal counsel confirmed to him that FISA requests were rarely refused. Why was Zacarias Moussaoui the exception to the rule? An identified terrorist, already in custody on the basis of an expired visa and the paying of large wads of cash for rather selectively chosen flying skills? Now known to be the 20th hijacker? And why has MSNBC apparently scrubbed their original reporting on this issue? (Saved at www.infowars.com/saved%20pages/Prior_Knowledge/Access%20Denied.htm?cp1=1)
Do a search on Afghanistan, Caspian Sea Oil, pipelines, Unocal, etc., it's all out there. For a good overview, check out the Asia Times - »atimes.com/c-asia/DA25Ag01.html and »www.atimes.com/c-asia/DA26Ag01.html . The same story is found in the Russian press, the Indian press, the English press, etc. They have the mere facts, they just don't fit the prevailing narrative we're getting from CNN and Fox.
And speaking of whispers and murmurings, run a Google on 'Operation Northwoods,' and wonder why ABCNews chose this moment to confirm that in the early 1960's our Pentagon planned a coordinated series of attacks on American cities, airliners and ships to be blamed on Cuba, providing justification for an invasion of that country.
Only by looking back at history can you see forward to build a better future.
EVERYONE should have a major in history!!! | |
| | |  dnoyeBFerrous Phallus
join:2000-10-09
Southfield, MI | Daniel Pearl. I am suspecious that he likely was discovering more info about the US in Afganistan that he was about the Taliban. I know and admit to being a cynic so take my beliefs with a grain of salt.
I put at least 50% of the blame of 9/11 on the US governments letting corporations run roughshot over citizens rights. When you dance with the Devil, 9/11 is what you get. Don't blame the devil for simply being himself.
Opening the Alaskan refuge for oil because of 9/11??? Last time I checked we weren't getting any oil from Afganistan. So why now do we need to divest ourselves of middle-eastern oils??
Did you read the story about the Russian billionare claiming to have evidence that the Russian Government was behind the bombings of the Russian civilian apartments in an attempt to garner public support of invasion of Czeck Rrepublic? Same chit different nation.
Yea, you gotta keep you eyes open on these fools. Not to mention that Enron executive who off-ed himself in the middle of a Texas highway. Hmm. I can think of better places for a remorseful person to kill himself. You know most people who commit suicide do it in such a way not to hurt anyone else...
I admit that sometimes I may be overly cynical, but some times people want to believe its all good and they just ignore the facts. Them we call ignorant.
Be sure you check my biblical quote below. This chit has been going on for all of time. The revolutionary war was fought over this exact thing. Corporations raping the citizens.
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dnoyeB"Then said I, Wisdom [is] better than strength: nevertheless the poor man's wisdom [is] despised, and his words are not heard. " Ecclesiastes 9:16
The government is pricing our rights our of our reach. | |
| | |  Kelarch
join:2001-12-23
Lawrenceville, GA | said by TZi:
I care more for life than oil and I think our government does too
The government has proven several times that they will throw away the lives of people in order to get what it wants. The government allowed the Japanese to attack Pearl Harbor so FDR could join the war. A war the American people didn't give a crap about to begin with. The government plotted to kill civilians and blame it on the Cubans. The government experimented on American civilians without their knowledge or consent during the manhattan project. The government ran the Native Americans off their land and killed the ones who refused to leave in order to get more land. And I still believe it was the government that sunk the Lusitania and blamed it on the Cubans.
A life is more important to you than money, but that is because you have a conscience and morals. The government has no conscience and its morals are screwed up. To them, money is more important than a life.
To the government, lives come and lives go but the Almighty Dollar is here to stay. People are expendable, but Uncle Sam's pocketbook isn't.
(Yes, It's a screwed up world we live in  )
--
ICQ - 139492227, Odigo - 903182, AIM - Ranukhan | |
| | | | | | | | | Kelarch
join:2001-12-23
Lawrenceville, GA | Re: All of it is TOTAL FRAUD! Woops! I was thinking of the Lusitania and the Maine at the same time and messed up what I was talking about. I have heard of a Conspiracy Theory that the British purposefully sent the Lusitania into harms way to persuade America to get involved, but I have a hard time swallowing that one.
But your right, I did mean the Maine.
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ICQ - 139492227, Odigo - 903182, AIM - Ranukhan | |
| | | | | |  KrKHeavy Artillery For The Little GuyPremium
join:2000-01-17
Tulsa, OK
 ·AT&T DSL Service
| Re: All of it is TOTAL FRAUD! The British didn't so much as send the Lusitania into harms way, more as they knew it was in harms way but failed to do anything to protect it. Winston Churchill himself was reported to have said something along the lines of "If the Lusitania is sunk by the U-boats it will help bring the US into the war on our side" prior to it happening. It was also known that the Germans knew the ship was carrying war materials and had been modified to carry naval guns and so was a legitimate target of war.
The Lusitania was hit by one torpedo and sank incredibly quickly--- at that time, despite the warnings of U-Boats, nobody had ever thought of the idea of closing inner doors and hatches within the ship. Basically, all the coal storage bunkers were open, all the hatches and doorways that ran the length of the ship and engineering spaces were all latched open, etc etc. The water was free to flood every compartment of the ship without resistance, leading to the extremely rapid sinking (12 minutes from time of torpedo impact till ship went completely under). Given the size of the ship, nobody believed it could have sunk so quickly. There was a second explosion, and even the British Admiralty had thought the German torpedo had caused a secondary explosion in the contraband munitions which blew out the Hull and caused the rapid sinkage. It has since been proven that that isn't true--- the munitions never exploded, the second explosion was actually a boiler exploding as the cold sea water hit it.
In many ways, the Lustinana disaster is much like the Titanic. There are a lot of "If Only's" ie "If only such and such had been done, then it would of never happened..." etc. Example: If the coal bunker door had been closed (The bunker was empty, and so the door being open was unnecessary... it was just standard practice that noone ever bothered to close them when they were emptied) the ship would not have even sunk.
Simulations reveal that if the coal bunkers were closed, the ship would at a minimum taken 4 torpedoes, evenly spaced along the length of the ship to sink it... and even then it should have taken more then an hour to sink, enough time to launch the boats and for rescuers arrived (remember she sank in sight of the English Coast). 11 miles offshore, I believe.
A few years after the disaster policies were changed so that ships at sea would keep hatches and doors shut when not in use. Someone finally figured out having them all open made it a lot easier to sink.
Wow, that was a nice ramble... | |
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| | | | said by TZi:
How can you say that? Are you accusing our government of killing ~3000 people in NYC and Washington D.C. to start a war over oil? This war is about some 3000 people dying plain and simple.
So, you just think arabs in the middle east would just up and hate us and want to "kill the infidels" for no reason? Surely you're not as ignorant as you sound just now.
Our foreign policy is why two planes smashed into the WTC. Not just because some jihad, or crazed muslims were bent on our destruction. There are reasons for everything. Not to justify their actions by any means, but think for a moment why they hate us. And then think about them simply "being evil" or attacking us for no reason. It makes no sense.
If you knew much about our foreign policy and how many people we've killed, overthrown in coups, played as pawns and ultimately left neglected once we got what we wanted (be it a puppet government, paid or coerced foreign government officials, oil or to stop "the evil spread of communism" that was so popular during the cold war). Do some research before you take all the propaganda the U.S. media and corrupt government officials shove down our throats next time.
And don't try responding that I'm not a patriot or love our country. I'd be first in line to defend the honor of our fine nation but many of the "officials" running the show today are corrupt and appropriate tragedies such as 9/11 to force their own, often times, bent and malicious agendas on us. Remember, when someone like Bush says, "it's in our best interest..." he really means, "it's in my best interest..." Our nation's forefathers are rolling in their graves right now. | |
| | | | TZi
join:2001-07-05
Miami Beach, FL
| ignore this accidentally double-posted
[text was edited by author 2002-02-26 06:17:19] | |
| | | | TZi
join:2001-07-05
Miami Beach, FL
| Re: All of it is TOTAL FRAUD! I understand. I think that a fundamental mistrust in government is healthy for a democracy, and it's definitely part of our American heritage (that's why we have the right to bear arms after all). I just reacted with a knee jerk reaction because I was personally affected by 9/11, but then again who wasn't? I don't doubt the government can and will be as subversive as possible whenever they can, so I value conflicting points of view like this. However, keep in mind that there are some people who keep this issue close to their heart. Whether we get more oil out of this war or not, I really don't care. Criticize me all you will, but for many this is a war of REVENGE. That is, a war of revenge and as a result we get to rape the natural resources of their country. So what if we get oil, I don't care. Perhaps feelings of revenge are politically incorrect, but that's how I feel. To me, getting oil out of the deal is just an added bonus for having spent billions on this war already!
--
Miami Hurricanes #1 (we're back!)
[text was edited by author 2002-02-26 06:21:00] | |
| | | | | | | Re: All of it is TOTAL FRAUD! TZi, I can see your point but have you ever wondered if their attacking us was revenge? Perhaps it was revenge for things we did to them? Perhaps not as widely known, perhaps covered up, etc. Obviously someone is not going to go through the massive trouble of training suicide bombers to train for years, learn to fly air craft and ultimately fly into a building killing thousands without some sort of motive or impetus. That is to say, I'm sure along the way with our American-centric, who-gives-a-damn-about-anyone-but-America thinking and oil-centric foreign policy have won us over many enemies. Perhaps these people are attacking us not because they're "evil" but because we started killing them, and their families, first?
It's funny that people are "evil" only when they're not on your side. | |
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| nc1165
join:2001-04-10
Delray Beach, FL | Thank you VERY much. For all those individuals in this forum who think I am some sort of a crackpot, this is the sort of news that is available to those who are interested in pursuing the truth and not putting credibility in the glossy headlines and soundbytes that are fed to us by the big three prime time ratings clowns.
Anyone interested in scratching beneath the surface, just let me now.
UNOCAL and Halliburton will get their pipeline, through Afghanistan and/or Iran, and the American people will remain fixated on this war on terrorism as long as we are able to round up the usual suspects and parade them in front of the cameras. All Bin Laden wanted was a bigger slice of the oil pie Bush that was dividing. Now watch us get lost in the Colombian jungles protecting Armand Hammer's oil pipeline down there, as well.
Bush has to stop blocking punches with his face.
Good job, killingspam.
--
If my enemy cuts me, I will drown him in my own blood. | |
| | | dnoyeBFerrous Phallus
join:2000-10-09
Southfield, MI | Re: All of it is TOTAL FRAUD! Lets not forget the occasional "security alert" to divert attention for any real information which might be forthcoming. | |
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| In response to kilingspam: You should explain to Osama bin Laden, the Palestinians, Israelis, and the the families of the three thousand killed in the WTC, including the 25,000 children who lost one or both of their parents that it is "simply about oil." I am sure that the last thoughts of the hijackers were of the price of a barrel of oil. A barrel of oil, now there is something worth dying over.
[text was edited by author 2002-02-25 14:09:38] | |
| | | nc1165
join:2001-04-10
Delray Beach, FL
| Re: All of it is TOTAL FRAUD! said by Lost in Space:
In response to kilingspam: You should explain to Osama bin Laden, the Palestinians, Israelis, and the the families of the three thousand killed in the WTC, including the 25,000 children who lost one or both of their parents that it is "simply about oil." I am sure that the last thoughts of the hijackers were of the price of a barrel of oil. A barrel of oil, now there is something worth dying over.
[text was edited by author 2002-02-25 14:09:38]
I'll go even one better. How about a nickel? That's right. You forget about how and why the Ayatollah came into power. How about because the Shah would not sell the U.S. oil for a lower price. So, what does the U.S. do? Find a leader who promises them the price they want. The difference was $0.05/per barrel. But, like so many despots we help into power, he turns on us. Treacherous being.
(I hope you are not getting scared by all this hysteria.) Now, P.M. Karzai should be able to last since he did consulting work for UNOCAL. Musharraf, OTOH, I'm not so sure about. Watch this as it unfolds and see how the U.S. responds to crisis after crisis. We have one brewing right now in Colombia and Venezuela. That region sends the U.S. more oil than the entire Middle East combined. You better believe Chavez is on the U.S. radar screen.
--
If my enemy cuts me, I will drown him in my own blood. | |
| | |
| Perhaps you need to go to Hiroshima and tell the people there it was necessary for us to drop an ATOMIC bomb on men, women, children. Kids were in school, women having babies, people getting married, having dinner, KABOOM!
There are people still alive today living in extreme pain from radiation burns over 20% of their bodies not to mention cancer from the radiation.
When WE dropped that BOMB at 8:15am.
WE killed 140,000 men, women, & children.
400,000 were left alive.
352,000 of those had/have health & disabilites from that bomb.
Here is a picture of the city after.
»mothra.rerf.or.jp/Images/giff/Dome.gif
Oh, don't forget three days later we did it again at Nagasaki.
WE dropped that bomb at 11:02am.
There WE killed 73,884 men, women, children.
Another 74,909 had/have health & disabilites from that bomb.
I can't even begin to imagine the millions of Jews who were killed by the Nazis. All because ONE man wanted to create HIS vision of a perfect world.
As I have stated above, you should never forget History.
BTW. The White House LET Pearl Harbor happen to gain 100% support from the American people to drop those bombs.
Oh, don't forget, WE (American CIA) educated and trained Osama Bin laden to be the killer he is.
(Evil doers abound on both sides of the fence. They always have)
I LOVE my Country.
I FEAR my Government.
[text was edited by author 2002-02-25 15:31:49] | |
| | | | nc1165
join:2001-04-10
Delray Beach, FL | Re: All of it is TOTAL FRAUD! Well, at least there is one group we don't need to remind of how we decimated their populations - small pox served to be the most lethal weapon of all time as it was used to wipe out entire Native American tribes and villages.
BTW, terror alert number 155 - Senator declares there are over 100 al-Quaeda members still in the U.S. If I have the need to defend my country, so be it. But it won't be for some Texas two-stepper and his petroleum lackeys.
--
If my enemy cuts me, I will drown him in my own blood. | |
| | | | | | War is hell, and the Japanese government brought the disaster on their people. The second bomb was the direct result of the government's arrogance, as they were ordered to unconditionally surrender after the first bomb, and given warning that a second would be dropped. They didn't surrender immediately, and the bomb was dropped again. It was a hard lesson, but one learned well. Don't take atomic bombs lightly. | |
| | | | | | Just a historical point from a person who has studied the history of WWII:
Operation OLYMPIC was the invasion plan of Japan before it was known that the atomic bomb programme was going to work. This particular plan involved an assault of Kyushu in 1945 as a preliminary to the massive invasion of the main island of Honshu [known as Operation CORONET; to take place in MArch 1946].
The estimated casualties for these two operations were approximately 1 million American soldiers. The Japanese casualties would have been approximately 2-3 million.
All of a sudden the bomb becomes available, and we use it to drop Japan into submission. By your count, if we include the wounded, there are 492,000 casualties.
492k casualties vs. 2-4 million.
Gee. What a choice.
Secondarily, that little tidbit about Roosevelt knowing about Pearl Harbor? It has been bandied about by some historians...but it has not yet been given credible status as hard and true fact. It's just a maybe.
At least, that's per college professors who specialize in the subject. *shrugs* | |
| | | | | | | Re: All of it is TOTAL FRAUD! I am glad to see someone else also has studied history! =o)
My post was simply a rebuttal to the post above it.
It was to point out 9-11 was a tragic moment in history,
like many others have been.
The point in question about Pearl Harbor.
Who knows if we will ever know the whole story. | |
| | | | | | | | Re: All of it is TOTAL FRAUD! Yup. 9-11 was just like other moments we've had - we just hadn't experienced one in a while.
OTOH, all of the stuff about this data being removed and that stuff being taken off the net - it's not something I worry about very much. Similar things occur throughout the entire history of America and the world. This will be no different then the 90s or 80s or 70s or 60s und so weiter.
As for Pearl Harbor, yes, we will probably never know. | |
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| | | | | War is brutal and there is no nice way to kill people.
Conventional bombings of Tokyo killed more people (500,000) than the total killed by both atomic bombs. The people in Tokyo were just as dead as those in Hiroshima and Nagasaki. Just as dead as the millions killed in Dresden, London, Warsaw, Berlin, and numerous cities in China and Manchuria.
You know, as I read the entire thread on this subject I notice that you and "nc1165" share the trait of professing knowledge that is counter or contrary to what is written in traditional history books and reported by the media.
Without agreeing or disagreeing with you let me ask you both a sincere question. What are your backgrounds or experiences that exposed you these truths as you see them. How do you learn what you claimed? I would really like to know. Thank you. | |
| | | | | nc1165
join:2001-04-10
Delray Beach, FL | Re: All of it is TOTAL FRAUD! Looking for sources of information outside the U.S. media is a basic start. Talking to people and making friends with those who have actually fled regimes is another. It all comes down to following the money trail. Where did it come from and who has it. Was it a coincidence that the hostages in Iran were released the week Reagan took office? Live overseas, if given the chance. Breathe their air, eat their food, and you will see that the U.S. is one of a handful of countries where you won't be forced to struggle for survival on a daily basis. You will find yourself trusting the thieves before you trust the cops. And when you read documented accounts from reliable journalists documenting that representatives of The Taliban are meeting in Texas just weeks leading up to 9/11, and that they are the reason UNOCAL can't get it's hands on a trillion dollars worth of oil, you will start to see that families like the Bush's have erased the line that used to separate public service from private interest.
--
If my enemy cuts me, I will drown him in my own blood. | |
| | | | | | | said by dslreader:
You know, as I read the entire thread on this subject I notice that you and "nc1165" share the trait of professing knowledge that is counter or contrary to what is written in traditional history books and reported by the media.
Without agreeing or disagreeing with you let me ask you both a sincere question. What are your backgrounds or experiences that exposed you these truths as you see them. How do you learn what you claimed? I would really like to know. Thank you.
Errrr. Contrary to what is in traditional history books? Oook.
Operations OLYMPIC and CORONET are declassified papers from the military concerning their invasion plans of Japan. I first became aware of them because my grandfather was in the Marines and scheduled for the assault on Kyushu. For documentation of the plans, see these books by reputable historians:
"The Invasion of Japan: Alternative To The Bomb" by John Ray Skates
"World War Two: U.S. Military Plans For The Invasion Of Japan" by Thomas Fench
"The Final Months of the War With Japan: Signals Intelligence, U.S. Invasion Planning, and the A-Bomb Decision." by Douglas J. MacEachin
I chose books that you would be able to get from Amazon if you so desired.
As for my background, I have a minor in History specializing in the history of Ancient China up to the end of the Ming Dynasty. My particular interest in WWII is no more than that of a history aficionado. | |
| | | | | | | | Re: All of it is TOTAL FRAUD! said by DSL Oberst quoting dslreader:
You know, as I read the entire thread on this subject I notice that you and "nc1165" share the trait of professing knowledge that is counter or contrary to what is written in traditional history books and reported by the media.
Without agreeing or disagreeing with you let me ask you both a sincere question. What are your backgrounds or experiences that exposed you these truths as you see them. How do you learn what you claimed? I would really like to know. Thank you.
There appears to be a misunderstanding. I made no reply to your comments or post. What you quote by me above is in reference to the posts of nc1165 and kilingspam.
I am, however, the one who voted your original post thumbs up. | |
| | | | | | | | | Re: All of it is TOTAL FRAUD! said by dslreader:
There appears to be a misunderstanding. I made no reply to your comments or post. What you quote by me above is in reference to the posts of nc1165 and kilingspam.
I am, however, the one who voted your original post thumbs up.
Ooops. Sorry about that. Hit the wrong button on the reply whatchamijiggy.  | |
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| | jamesd0
join:2001-09-13
Carol Stream, IL | damn dude don't be an idiot it ALL ABOUT OIL!!!!! | |
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| | | Hmm....oil, that's...interesting | |
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| |  Hysteria City.
It is a fact that with more laws, restrictions, government "protection", rules, and regulations comes a certain loss of personal freedom. However, it is a balance and collectively we must decide what that balance should be. For instance people may disagree what exactly the changes should be but most would agree that because of 9/11 and subsequent events the balance has in some areas for now shifted from where it was before and more towards protection. In the future it will hopefully shift back the other way.
As the article in question states: "Finding the right balance is difficult. Some groups that traditionally favor full disclosure--consumer groups, academics and the press--have come to support certain restrictions since the September terrorist attacks."
That sounds pretty reasonable to me.
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| | | | Re: Hysteria City. The main problem I'm seeing with your rosey picture of deciding as a whole population what we want, is that with the present psuedo-dichotomy we get to choose between one set of infringements or the other. On the left wing we have gun control, on the right wing we have abortion control. Both sides have tons of bad ideas, and it's a lose/lose situation to vote for either in some way. This is also the reason why many people don't bother to vote, they understand they're going to be screwed by either of the major parties.
Some people wear rose-glasses and think one party really has all of everyone's best interests in mind, but they don't, they have their own interest in mind.
Thanks for your opinions, but you're really only talking about two sides of one coin. | |
|
 InseyInsey
join:2001-12-12
Fort Washington, PA | You will all be assisinated You know, if the Government found this thread on dslreports, they would probably hunt each and every one of you down and kill you. You would be considered a thread to national security. | |
| | |  Freedom vs. National Security
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| | | Readers of Tom Clancy know... Several years ago, he wrote "The sum of all fears" which outlined how terrorists got ahold of an inactive nuclear bomb and then blew it up at the Superbowl.
At the end of the book, the author(Tom Clancy) wrote about how he telephoned government nuclear testing facilities and inquired about nuclear bomb technology. The government Fed-Ex'ed the information to him a few days later.
He even had to purposely omit information while writing the book, because he had all the information right in front of him.
Why are we just now thinking of national security?
--spud-- | |
| |  jhudson2Copyright Martyr
join:2000-11-07
San Marcos, CA | Re: Readers of Tom Clancy know... "Just now" thinking about security?
Since the end of WWII we've spent trillions of dollars on what....Girl Scout Cookies? | |
| | | | | Re: Readers of Tom Clancy know... That was a rhetorical question..
--spud--:) | |
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|  History corrected by visitors to DSL web site!
Damn! I want my money back for all that I spent at the University and other higher education institutions I attended. They sure fed me a line of propaganda and lies! And to think I always thought the phone company killed Kennedy but in fact it was really the oil companies. Right?
[text was edited by author 2002-02-25 20:09:15] | |
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See 10 replies to this post | |
| | Think some of you will get a kick out of this one!
»sports.yahoo.com/oly/news/ap/200···ent.html | |
| | | geez
I guess the cia and fbi had Elvis killed because of oil?
Oh, and by all means they must be implicated in the death of Princess Di too. After all, she was dating one of them rich oil guys. They probably had her wiped out because they were afraid the British would corner the oil market.
You know what really concerns me? I worry that some of you jokers actually believe what you write here. Now that's really scary.
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Just the truth and nothing but the truth please. | |
| |  socalzPremium
join:2001-01-26
Anaheim, CA | Re: geez Jeez, I'm sort of surprised your remarks didn't draw an immediate response. Maybe they're off making hats out of aluminum foil...
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Just remember...if the world didn't suck, we'd all fall off. | |
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