Nightfall
My Goal Is To Deny Yours
Premium,MVM
join:2001-08-03
Grand Rapids, MI
 ·Site5.com
 ·AT&T Midwest
 ·Comcast
| Not a suprise
This doesn't suprise me. They are buying bandwidth from the US. P2P file sharing takes up a lot of bandwidth. I make sure P2P file sharing, and other bandwidth intensive apps are banned/blocked on my network here at work. I would do the same thing if I worked at that ISP.
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Nightfall - »www.nightfall.net |
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Phoenix Gold
Hypocrite
join:2001-11-24
Faulkton, SD
clubs: | I'd make sure i wasn't a customer of your ISP. |
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jmargel
join:2001-03-07
Northumberland, PA
| This won't stop anything..
pfft... if the users dont use the bandwidth, spamming companies will use it up for their ads & junk mail.
More bandwidth is used for that trash than p2p could ever use.
If ISPs want to save bandwidth, quit selling their damn users email addresses, and start going after the spammers! |
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Nightfall
My Goal Is To Deny Yours
Premium,MVM
join:2001-08-03
Grand Rapids, MI | reply to Phoenix Gold
Re: Not a suprise
said by bremerton:
I'd make sure i wasn't a customer of your ISP.
Did you even read the article? :P
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Nightfall - »www.nightfall.net |
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NKVD4
join:2001-01-11
Chico, CA
| Everything else
Then the gaming bandwidth or FTP stuff, VoIP, or any other heavy use of the internet.
P2P may use a lot if the end users want to use it heavy enough but lets not pick on one thing and call it the axis of evil. Lots of other things use up bandwidth also.
I would not use your ISP either just for the fact that you want to say what I can and cant do with my internet connection... thats why I quit my old ISP for the same thing.. If you can block P2P then whats next. |
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Nero534
join:2001-10-12
South Bend, IN | I know I dont allow that kind of network traffic at my office, I am a System Admin at my office, and I dont allow that kind of stuff on my network eaither. |
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jmargel
join:2001-03-07
Northumberland, PA
| isp
Nero.. im the director of IS here as well. Work & home are TWO different things. I won't allow it at work either, not only for bandwidth, but for legal purposes. I'm not gonna be liable for someone else's file sharing.
If my co-workers wanna do p2p at home, I can careless. But p2p is not affecting bandwidth in a negative way. That's why most ISPs have bandwidth caps. |
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jmargel
join:2001-03-07
Northumberland, PA
| One other point.. Bandwidth is not a tangible object, like oil or gas. We can NEVER run out of it. You just have to build more lines & add more routers, etc..
So there is no limit to the amount of bandwidth that could be available to the public. |
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Jeff Brantley
@maritz.com
| Bandwidth too costly
Why does it cost so much to blink a light a few billion times a second? Maybe the problem, then, is that bandwidth SHOULDN'T cost so much.
Yes, it would take an effort on all internet companies starting with the owners of the OC-192s FIRST and working down from there to get the prices down. But with how greedy everyone is with bandwidth and being able to charge so much for so little real overhead, it won't work.
The "conservation of bandwidth" argument hurts my head. |
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NOVA_Guy
Obama- Commander in Thief
Premium
join:2002-03-05
 ·VOIPo
| reply to Nightfall
Re: Not a suprise
said by Nightfall:
I make sure P2P file sharing, and other bandwidth intensive apps are banned/blocked on my network here at work. I would do the same thing if I worked at that ISP.
Let's differentiate between work and home use Internet for a moment. I certainly have no problem banning access to P2P file sharing services at work, as it:
(1) Is company-paid and supplied bandwidth, giving them the right to ultimately control what it is used for, and
(2) Isn't job-related or productive use of the Internet connection.
It's a cost-saving measure to some extent, and I really don't think it's necessary to download MP3s all day at work. Heck, that's not what I'm being paid for.
Now, on the other hand, when I the user am paying an ISP my hard-earned money for service, I expect to be able to determine what I do and don't do. I've paid for bandwidth and service; that's how my DSL line was sold to me. Telling me I can't use file sharing applications on my home connection is tantamount to telling me I can't start a VPN session to access my computer at work, telling me I can't connect to an FTP server to download a document, and telling me I can't run an email server on my home network.
Assuming that other ISPs were available in my area, I certainly wouldn't choose one that blocked my ability to do anything on the Internet, even if I had to pay more money.
And I disagree with placing caps on how much data can be downloaded per month too. The service I buy already has a certain speed it's capped at; if the ISP is unwilling/unable to support people using an all-you-can-grab connection at those speeds, they should either close their doors or upgrade their network. (Again, I have no problem putting my money where my mouth is)
Hopefully not all ISPs will implement download amount caps. While I'm far from one of the "vampires" mentioned in the article, I still use the Internet on a daily basis from home. And I still download files, sometimes large ones. And I use my DSL connection for full-screen remote control of office computers once I've connected to work through their VPN resources. I don't know how much data is transferred as a result of my being connected to the Internet 24/7, and I don't want to keep track of it either. And I'm willing to pay for this luxury.
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"Objects in the rear view mirror may appear closer than they are." - Meat Loaf, Bat out of Hell II |
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CyberNation$
join:2001-12-08
Los Angeles, CA
| reply to jmargel
What is the cost of Bandwidth?
said by jmargel:
Bandwidth is not a tangible object, like oil or gas. We can NEVER run out of it. You just have to build more lines & add more routers,....So there is no limit to the amount of bandwidth that could be available to the public.
How exactly does the amount of bandwidth used by a provider's members cost that provider more or less money? If I understand it correctly the provider has infrastructure that has a maximum capability of how much bandwidth it can supply. Let say for the sake of example that by using its state of the art flux capacitor it can supply up to 1.21 gigawatts equivalent of megabytes of bandwidth.
If I understand things correctly it doesn't matter whether at any given moment that the users are using 1/2, 3/4 or all of the bandwidth that provider can supply. The cost is essentially the same regardless of usage.
If this is not so perhaps in lay terms and concisely someone could explain to me how bandwidth usage has a significant cost to the provider.
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The DSLR power and procedure of locking or blocking threads is sometimes badly abused.
[text was edited by author 2002-04-17 22:17:47] |
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martissimo
join:2001-12-01
Las Vegas, NV
clubs:
| reply to Jeff Brantley
Re: Bandwidth too costly
have you noticed how many articles you see each month about large fiber laying companies going bankrupt?
they are allready forced into selling bandwidth pretty low just to compete with the companies who purchased pre-laid fiber from bankrupt companies for a song and can afford to undercut their prices. |
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Phoenix Gold
Hypocrite
join:2001-11-24
Faulkton, SD
clubs: | reply to Nightfall
Re: Not a suprise
yea, i read it. My point was that given a choice in a free market i wouldnt choose your service, or any service that did this. |
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DJStarfox
join:2000-07-05
Orlando, FL
·Embarq
|  Blocking P2P
I agree that people at work should not be file sharing because it's very expensive in terms of bandwidth and time. When it comes to a home connection, I say leave it be because it's in the privacy of your home.
What is criminal is if you charg people $0.10 for every .mp3 they download from your P2P server. I think there's a big difference between potential income ("lost sales") and actual income. |
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roamer1
sticking it out at you
join:2001-03-24
Atlanta, GA
clubs:
| reply to Nightfall
Re: Not a suprise
Corporate networks are one thing (most block much more than just P2P); we're talking about an ISP blocking its paying customers from using P2P apps. This is no different than cable and ILEC-owned DSL providers disallowing servers (most independent ISPs don't care), C*x and C*mc*st blocking VPN, even if noncommercial, on "residential" service, etc. -- policies with which which I completely disagree, especially if customers are paying by bandwidth used instead of a flat rate, or are subject to bandwidth caps.
Also, more than likely there's something in NZ (copyright, etc.) law that makes ISPs there uncomfortable with allowing P2P to go on, unlike in the US.
-SC
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Atlanta Apt/Condo Cable & Broadband Info: »www.atlaptcable.info/ |
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martissimo
join:2001-12-01
Las Vegas, NV
clubs: | reply to DJStarfox
Re: Blocking P2P
the whole argument of stopping p2p programs by ISPs will baically be moot for a home isp... all they will do is encrypt their transmissions, sure in a work environment they have the right to decrypt that stuff, but a home users ISP doesn't. |
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ariesguy
join:2001-01-30 | reply to CyberNation$
Re: isp
It appears as if they're buying the bandwith they use from another company. The more they use, the more they have to pay. Just my guess. |
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MrCornell
join:2000-04-06
Seattle, WA
clubs:
|  I guess they no like teh Intarweb in Middle Earth!
OMG OMG they don't like teh Intarweb in Middle Earth!! 
Well it's the first time I heard of an ISP banning P2P stuff to conserve bandwidth, but many colleges and universities in the US have had to ban P2P software to keep their networks from becoming completely saturated and unusable for "real work"...
The real problem isn't P2P software. It's the lack of bandwidth to really support a worldwide data network at all points: there's bound to be a bottleneck somwhere. Telecom backbones are massively overbuilt, but the regional networks are all massively underbuilt.
[text was edited by author 2002-04-17 16:51:05] |
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NOVA_Guy
Obama- Commander in Thief
Premium
join:2002-03-05
·VOIPo
| reply to roamer1
Re: Not a suprise
said by roamer1:
Corporate networks are one thing (most block much more than just P2P)
Yep. I'm not exactly sure what's blocked here where I work. And to tell you the truth, I'm not really interested in trying to find out. 
said by roamer1:
we're talking about an ISP blocking its paying customers from using P2P apps. This is no different than cable and ILEC-owned DSL providers disallowing servers ... C*x and C*mc*st blocking VPN ... -- policies with which which I completely disagree, especially if customers are paying by bandwidth used
I agree 100% here too. This is one of the big reasons I dropped my cable modem with Cox and went with DSL from an independent company that doesn't care what I do with my bandwidth.
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"Objects in the rear view mirror may appear closer than they are." - Meat Loaf, Bat out of Hell II |
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martissimo
join:2001-12-01
Las Vegas, NV
clubs:
| reply to martissimo
Re: Blocking P2P
on a side note about the possible implications of encrypted p2p programs, is the interesting tidbit that they could actually fall under DMCA protection as encrypted technology, would be funny to see em get shot down in court because of the law they pushed so hard for  |
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