koitsu
Premium
join:2002-07-16
Mountain View, CA | Surely you jest.
*sigh* PG&E all over again... |
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BBC4544
join:2002-03-12
Saint Peters, MO | broadband for everyone
this is great, gov't is starting to realize that if they step aside there will be progress. how many things have been held due to gov't involement? |
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garagerock
Premium
join:2002-06-14
Louisville, KY
| said by BBC4544  :
this is great, gov't is starting to realize that if they step aside there will be progress. how many things have been held due to gov't involement?
Yeah, like 40 hour work weeks, child labor laws, OSHA regs...all terrible, bad things.
Free market isn't always the answer. |
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BBC4544
join:2002-03-12
Saint Peters, MO | what are you talking about???????? |
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morbo
Complete Your Transaction
join:2002-01-22
00000
clubs:
 ·Charter Pipeline
 ·AT&T Southwest
| reply to BBC4544
said by BBC4544 :
this is great, gov't is starting to realize that if they step aside there will be progress. how many things have been held due to gov't involement?
hilarious.
--
Nixon : "Hello, Morbo, how's the family?" Morbo : "Belligerent and numerous." |
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BBC4544
join:2002-03-12
Saint Peters, MO | reply to garagerock
my post was in reference to broadband regulation not labor laws, you may have accindently posted on the wrong site, apology accepted |
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garagerock
Premium
join:2002-06-14
Louisville, KY
| reply to BBC4544
Your quote says:
quote:
this is great, gov't is starting to realize that if they step aside there will be progress. how many things have been held due to gov't involement?
You didn't specify broadband regs...sorry, my bad.
But I don't agree that deregulation is the answer. |
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BBC4544
join:2002-03-12
Saint Peters, MO
| it seems the technology is out there but will not be rolled out due to an unprofitable market. i do not need hear about how much sbc made last. it is simple. if it was profitable then clecs would be depolying and so would sbc. we may disagree on deregulation but you would have to admit that change is need to make it desirable to do busy in rural areas. |
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jsouth
Jsouth
join:2000-12-12
Wichita, KS
|  Vote!
I for one hope they keep the regulation. Who doesn't think that SBC (name changed to protect the guilty) wouldn't raise prices on those who already have DSL so that they can pay for "more rural access"? I have family all over this state and they are collecting signatures to send in to try and stop the bill from passing. It does say on the bill that whoever votes for deregulation will NOT receive those peoples votes that are listed on the petitions. |
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Maxo
Your tax dollars at work.
Premium,VIP
join:2002-11-04
Tallahassee, FL
clubs:
| Regulation
From what I understand the regulation that is in effect in most states is very unfair to the ISPs. I don't see why people think it has to be one extreme of the other. How about logical regulation that helps promote both the consumer and investor. It doesn't have to be regulate the sh*t out of the corporations or don't regulate at all. How about intelligent regulation. No regulation allows for a monopoly while too much regulation forces the companies to not even offer any service at all.
From what I understand in many places the ISPs are forced to sell their lines for below what it costs to put them there and mantain them. So if we were to regulate in a way that encouraged competition and also gave the people who own the lines some benefits as well then everyone would win.
--
»www.tfn.net/~jdbaucum |
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RayW
Premium
join:2001-09-01
Layton, UT
clubs: | And they own 'frame' technology for websites
see »zdnet.com.com/2100-1106-981446.html for one news article.
--
I am not lost, I find myself every time. |
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garagerock
Premium
join:2002-06-14
Louisville, KY
| reply to Maxo
Re: Regulation
quote:
From what I understand in many places the ISPs are forced to sell their lines for below what it costs to put them there and mantain them
See, therein lies the rub. That's what they would have you believe, but judging from the PUC reports that have been posted, I don't buy it.
Maybe when they provide hard evidence to the contrary, I'll reconsider. Until then, I see it as bullshit smoke and mirrors. |
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petecellar
join:2002-10-15
Philadelphia, PA | reply to Maxo
Well, de-regulation of cable television was a joke. It's still an expensive monopoly.
Also, the whole "frames" debacle makes them losers. That's like saying all auto makers must pay Ford co. since they made the first cars... |
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KoolMoe
Aw Man
Premium
join:2001-02-14
Annapolis, MD
clubs:
 ·Verizon FIOS
·Speakeasy
| reply to BBC4544
Re: broadband for everyone
The problem is, I think, the definition of an 'unprofitable market'.
If, as the ILECs claim, regulation is forcing them to sell access to their lines to CLECs at below the TRUE costs for maintaining those lines, then I agree - that could be unprofitable.
However, as I understand the current regulation, the costs the ILECs must use to rent to the CLECs is one dollar above maintenance costs.
This results in profit - but of course, not as much profit as SBC would like.
SO the REAL issue: is SBC being misleading when it says they have no incentive to build-out when it's not profitable? Are they really saying, the build-out will not be done because it would take us two years longer to recoup the build-out expenses than we'd like?
If that's the case, then my feeling is SBC needs to suck it up and deal - they've had a regional monopoly for long enough...AND they LOBBIED for the TA96 act to get into the (dubiously) lucrative long-distance market. So now, lie in the bed you made.
Perhaps instead of fighting so hard, they could be cooperative? How about working out a deal with the competitors to share the build-out costs? At least try?
Or perhaps someone in the state who cares needs to take the initiative and point out the federal programs setup to help such rural services (as noted here on DSLR over the past couple week headlines) so SBC can be bypassed entirely.
Ultimately the problem comes down to those in the legislature, in any state, being clueless as the real issues and options.
KM |
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Maxo
Your tax dollars at work.
Premium,VIP
join:2002-11-04
Tallahassee, FL
clubs:
| reply to petecellar
Re: Regulation
If you pay millions to lay down lines and set up DSLAMs etc. Then you shouldn't have to let others use it for below the cost to put it there and maintane it. I don't know the exact cost/maintane ratio but that's just what I hear from reliable sources. I do think that SBC is full of crap when they talk about how bad they have it, but I also don't think they should have to lease out the lines below cost. I'm definitely not a fan of deregulation and believe in regulation it just needs to be sensable regulation.
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»www.tfn.net/~jdbaucum |
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garagerock
Premium
join:2002-06-14
Louisville, KY
| Thing is, that's exactly what they asked for in TA'96 as a concession to get into the (what they thought) lucrative long distance market.
I agree with you that sensible regulation is always a good idea. My fear is that they will just throw out the baby with the bath water on this in the name of "deregulation" and we'll all wind up back on T-1's at work and ISDN at home.
Perhaps wireless will make all of this moot. |
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averagedude
join:2002-01-30
Mesa, AZ | It is our turn to bait and switch
I say give them everything they want so that all the rural areas get connected - then change the law back.
That is fair play, they have been bait and switching us for years, now it is our turn. |
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Maxo
Your tax dollars at work.
Premium,VIP
join:2002-11-04
Tallahassee, FL
clubs:
| reply to garagerock
Re: Regulation
quote:
Perhaps wireless will make all of this moot.
That's what I'm forseeing anyhow. I definitely wouldn't invest in DSL or T1 if I was into investing. I think broadband is the future with hard lines only for business and mission critical connection, or whomever must have a solid-low ping connection that won't deteriate with bad weather.
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»www.tfn.net/~jdbaucum |
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mr sean
Professional Infidel
Premium,ExMod 2001-07
join:2001-04-03
N. Absentia
clubs:
| Quote of the Week
said by Randy Tomlin:
It is not deregulation. It is a removal of an opportunity to regulate
They are probably still laughing at that one in San Antonio.
--
One riot; 71 Rangers. |
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ib50MbSoon
Formerly TwoKDialup
Premium
join:2002-06-07
Coloma, MI
| reply to RayW
Re: And they own 'frame' technology for websites
said by RayW :
see »zdnet.com.com/2100-1106-981446.html for one news article.
Exactly! And in my opinion, their fees to use a menu in a frame on a Web page are ridiculous.
FWIW, they want $180/mo (ISP extra) for a 128kb ISDN line in my area.
I wonder what the new, unregulated SBC will charge for a 768kb DSL line?
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Earthlink/DirecWay SRS | SatMex 5-990 | Win2K - ICS on Celeron 500 w/192MB -> Netgear RO318 -> Home network |
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