Seandhi
Seeing From a New Level
Premium
join:2003-04-19
Humble, TX
| If voters vote yes...
Municipal Utility Districts (MUDs) should be allowed to do whatever they want... as long as the voting public allows them to do so. These major media outlets need to have competition, and that's what the MUDs are providing.
However, if they are only charging 2 dollars less per month than the incumbents, where is the extra money going? Cable operators charge an amount amount to make substantial profits, and even at $2 less per person, there is a substantial profit being made. They should use that profit for further improvements and tax relief... but we're talking government here.
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Trusted Computing will destroy the information age! Educate yourself at »www.againsttcpa.com |
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dufrense
join:2002-03-09
Neenah, WI
| Why not cry about it
Its about time that some competition comes into those markets - I grew up in Waupaca and remember how excited I was when the fiber was put in my neighborhood to finally get a cable modem (however my folks didn't appreciate the hole i drilled in the floor of the office to bring myself a line to my bedroom). ..
I think its riduculous to NOT allow the munis to offer something... Apparently, since i just read that waupaca was muni-broadband, without that we'd still be stuck without the cable modem there... Businesses need competetion, otherwise we'll wind up with more microsofts on our hands. Typical that the republicans are whining about this idea since it would actually make things easier for people to afford broadband... I'd love to see all broadband more affordable. |
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jhboricua
ExMod 2000-01
join:2000-06-06
Minneapolis, MN
clubs:
| Wisconsin is weird, lol
I'd love to see what all those who complain about telco/cable incumbents having to share their cable plants and "competitors should run their own cable" have to say about this.
It is pretty obvious that, no matter if you want to use existing plant or deploy your own, the telco/cable incumbents will make every effort to make it an unprofitable endeavor for the competitor.
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"Look, If I warm up my breasts with my hands, do you think they'll get bigger or smaller?" - Asuka on the subject of thermal expansion |
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Kaltes
Premium
join:2002-12-04
Los Angeles, CA
| reply to Seandhi
Re: If voters vote yes...
BASIC cable (the $10/month version) isnt really all that profitable, and it wouldnt be offered at all unless there were laws forcing the cable companies to offer it.
Remember that any municipal venture will have a substantial bond that it must pay back. Once the bond is paid off expect municipal prices to drop EVEN LOWER than the already-low initial prices.
Incumbents are afraid because they know once word gets out about how great municipal broadband is and how effective it is at ensuring lower prices for a better product, these municipal ventures will spring up all over the place, and heck even prime time news stories might be run showing the disparity between cities with muni and without. |
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Karl Bode
News Guy
join:2000-03-02 | And stop covering the Kobe Bryant trial?  |
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Seandhi
Seeing From a New Level
Premium
join:2003-04-19
Humble, TX
| reply to Kaltes
If the government starts pushing prices too low, and if what you say is true about 10/month not being profitable, how will cable companies compete? Once they are pushed out of the market, then we just have another (worse?) monopoly.
On the other hand, I fail to see how the MUD can drop rates too low if tax payers will not be splitting the bill (as is stated in the article). This would just cause the cable company to be a little more fair to their customers.
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Trusted Computing will destroy the information age! Educate yourself at »www.againsttcpa.com |
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Kaltes
Premium
join:2002-12-04
Los Angeles, CA
| reply to dufrense
Re: Why not cry about it
said by dufrense  :
Typical that the republicans are whining about this idea
Actually if you followed the municipal broadband battles, you'd see that plenty of democrats who have been bought and paid for by the major Cable/DSL companies have been busy trying to kill municipal startups.
The real issue here is corrupt representatives being paid off by large companies to kill off competition before it gets off the ground. Since municipal broadband is such an obscure issue that most people don't know much (if anything) about, it is also possible that lobbyists can genuinely convince some representatives who might believe in small government to resist publicly-owned utilities providing services that the private sector already offers.
I would say the republican support is more uninformed than corrupt while the democratic support is simply corrupt. The democrats have no policy excuse here: municipal broadband is right up their big-government alley. |
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ravital
Just Another Pesky Independent Nh Voter
Premium
join:2001-07-19
Merrimack, NH
| The trend
The trend is definitely alarming. State after state is falling for the same "even playing field" rhetoric, not to mention lobbying efforts with the usual - or greater than usual - monetary contributions to legislators' campaign coffers. This will not change until the towns involved begin some sort of "education" effort or whatever else they care to call it. The towns are the ones interested in their own networks, after all. More power to them, but they do have to do some heavy lifting and knock on the doors of their own residents and give them what for.
One interesting possible outcome of a law that forbids the use of tax funds - it works both ways. With such a law in effect in a state, any town that finances such an initiative with anything but tax money - such as revenue bonds - can tell opponents what to go do with themselves.
Here in NH I'm hearing about legislative initiatives that actually push in the opposite direction - proactively encouraging municipalities to get involved in such efforts. Must be something in the water in NH, either that or a state with a mere 1.2 Million residents is not interesting enough for the incumbents to fight so hard over.
And please, there is absolutely no value added in telling readers that "republican legislators" are behind this, as opposed to just "state legislators." I've read the bill from the linked PDF, and it lists all the sponsors, and anyone can find the Wisconsin Legislature on line and learn that there are quite a few democrats listed at the top of the bill. Media and telecommunications are an area where legislators - Demublicans or Repocrats, each as useless as the other - have always relied on general public apathy or ignorance of complex issues, and often respond all too enthusiastically to lobbying. Unless of course there's a different agenda here. |
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Karl Bode
News Guy
join:2000-03-02
Host:
Road Runner
PC gaming GAMES
PC gaming Tech
| reply to Seandhi
Re: If voters vote yes...
Well for one thing, cable providers profit margins are INSANE. They could afford some pretty hefty price cuts before getting shoved out of any market....they could also spin off sports programming a-la-carte and save a bundle.....
Governments can't afford to push their prices too low, they aren't Walmarts..they're serving small communities at the moment. I think I've seen one instance so far where a muni engaged in questionable behavior, in Grant County, Washington:
»Competitive Conundrum
If the time comes when they are abusing their position and posing serious life or death threats to the incumbents on a broader scale, then perhaps examine leashing them somewhat. What's occuring on the state level here is a bunch of well lobbied politicians falsely assuming you can put equal regulatory restrictions on both incumbents and muni-upstarts and receive competitive parity; which simply isn't accurate.
Something these politicians forget is the fundamental fact that these muni's are being formed because communites are NOT being served and are being over-charged, plain and simple....I think that gets forgotten in the legalese.....the customer is always right, or so someone once said. |
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Karl Bode
News Guy
join:2000-03-02
Host:
Road Runner
PC gaming GAMES
PC gaming Tech
| reply to ravital
Re: The trend
Yes, your accurate about it not being a partisan push, I simply added 'Republican' because Representative Phil Montgomery and Senator Ted Kanavas (both repubs) were the primary pushers in this instance. I've rephrased it to read simply "Lawmakers in the state".... |
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TheGhost
Premium
join:2003-01-03
Lake Forest, IL
clubs:
 ·AT&T U-Verse
 ·Comcast
| reply to Seandhi
$2 less on basic...
The $2 difference is for "basic" cable. I wonder if this is more like the "lifeline" cable which just includes most of the locals, a few shopping channels, and a few extras. The difference is $8 on advanced services.
The real benefit is that it might actually get some of the incumbents to upgrade their systems. I know that my community cable company (TCI/ATT/Comcast) has not done much. I moved in over 4 years ago and was told that digital cable and cable modems were "months" away. I signed up for cable TV and ISDN access, planning to upgrade when they came available. TV service was very poor (picture quality, outages) - worse than the cable adds against satellite, and ISDN was getting expensive. I ended up switching to DirecTV and DSL service.
I recently received a call from Comcast asking if I would like to "switch" to digital cable. They were very "hazy" on the details and it seems like they were trying to hide the true costs. It ended up that they would basically match the cost of the my DTV for the first year, but then prices would go up. They still did not offer cable modem service.
I doubt I will ever go to Comcast if I have a choice, even if I would eventually have to pay a bit more. They ignore communities like mine, yet have the major dollars to go after smaller communities that try and help themselves.
On a side note on lost jobs threat. I would imagine that they would still need people to service the area, especially if they were going to compete, and the new entrant (be it MUNI, whatever) would also need new employees. It seems like the MUNI would even have more LOCAL employees than a major player like Comcast, which centralizes facilities. |
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Varangian
join:2002-12-08
Collinsville, IL |  Well ,we know who is owned then
Vote out the suits' lapdogs -the sponsors and supporters of this bill- at your first opportunity.
Theyll vote in sexual access to your wives and daughters next... |
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Seandhi
Seeing From a New Level
Premium
join:2003-04-19
Humble, TX
| reply to TheGhost
Re: $2 less on basic...
I guess I have really been lucky. I have lived in two different cities, and both of them had pretty good cable service. I lived in Lubbock for 2 years, and the cable internet and tv was great. I now live in Houston, and IMHO Time Warner rocks. We have digital cable, and all of the digital channels are dvd quality. (The channels that appear on analog cable are not quite as clear) We also have Video on Demand, which is extra cool. My Road Runner service is also outstanding. I would really be reluctant for the government to come in and try to compete. Less government is good government.
The prices probably need to come down, but I think that Time Warner is offering top notch service.
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Trusted Computing will destroy the information age! Educate yourself at »www.againsttcpa.com |
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Camelot One
Premium,MVM
join:2001-11-21
Sarasota, FL
clubs:
| And this years top Telco/CableCo donations go to..
quote:
Representative Phil Montgomery and Senator Ted Kanavas are trying to push through the 11th bill in four years
Gee, is it obvious to anyone who is paying for their re-election campaigns?
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AMD XP2500+ @2300mhz/ Asus A7N8X Deluxe rev 1.04/ 2x 512Mb Kingston HyperX PC3500/ WD 120Gb on serial/ Gainward GF4 4600/ Enermax 465P-VE/Custom water cooler |
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godsmack
join:2003-06-08 | I say...........
Power to the people.......
Give the people what they want......... |
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oliphant5
Got Identity?
Premium
join:2003-05-24
Corona, CA
| Telco whores
The lot of 'em. What would fix this is simply banning campaign contributions from anyone other than REGISTERED VOTERS from the district the political hack serves. Any one who doesn't have a right to vote (like unions, corporations etc), certainly doesn't have any business buying votes.
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-- Munis Killed the Telco Star -- Powered by Barry McKockenner Racing in association with Jack Mikkokov Motorsports |
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ravital
Just Another Pesky Independent Nh Voter
Premium
join:2001-07-19
Merrimack, NH
| reply to Karl Bode
Re: The trend
said by Karl Bode :
Yes, your accurate about it not being a partisan push, I simply added 'Republican' because Representative Phil Montgomery and Senator Ted Kanavas (both repubs) were the primary pushers in this instance.
I stand corrected, thank you. My point was that when it comes to telecom/media interests lobbying, both parties are equally mercenary.
Thanks again and best regards. |
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burger2000
join:2001-06-25
Madison, WI
| Overpriced services = muni push?
Granted Telelphone and Cable service are extremely overpriced for products offered....
I can think of very few areas in Sun Prairie that are not covered by Charter's plant. There are a few houses here and there in the country without, but almost all of Sun Prairie is covered. I know a few farms miles outside of the city limits that have cable. And in the Madison area, if cable passes it is Digital, Broadband and VoD/HDTV ready. I don't know about Verizon's services but do know that Sun Prairie already offers ~400kbps wireless internet service.
I fail to see the need to invest in a fiber build where the only reason is overpriced services. There is no lack of broadband deployment. Cellular and DBS do a fantastic job of undercutting incumbents. |
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zabes63
join:2003-04-05
Batavia, IL
| Think about this...
Seeing that most, if not, gosh-darned, nearly all, of the Muni's are approved of via some kind of voter approval. I find it ironic, if not sad, that, only in America, can we have legislation pushed to benefit Corporations by short circuiting the democratic process, while our men and women are dying to bring the right to vote to other nations.
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A Jobless recovery is not a recovery at all!! | Tri-City Broadband |
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bmbarnes
join:2003-08-10
Derwood, MD
| What about the Brewers?
I just moved from the Town of Madison, WI and I remember having SkyCable, a wireless cable service, at the apartment. Few channels, but ESPN and ESPN2 were in the package so I ate it up. What we never got that we wanted was the Midwest Sports Network (now Fox Sports North or some such...) as Charter had exclusive rights for cable distribution throughout WI. For five years, I never saw the Brew Crew. Not a problem really, they stink. But, the idea that a muni telco solves all problems underestimates the power of Charter. They waived that $19.95/mo for a year under my nose to have me ditch SkyCable. I bit. Given then the option, I didn't watch the Brewers really, come to think of it.... |
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