UnKown
The Underground Network
join:2002-09-08
Orlando, FL
 ·Earthlink Cable Mo..
|  Im all for it
this sure is a large amount of people and businesses competing in this. im really glad to see all the support for this and kepp on thinking about the term, Majority Rules. the FCC has put restrictions on us for way to long and its about time some 1 actually beat the fcc. |
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g0nepostal
I Am The One Her Mom Warned Her About
join:2001-03-23
Concord, CA
clubs:
 ·DSL EXTREME
·Astound Broadband
 ·magicjack.com
|  It's all about interpretation, isn't it?
It always amazes me how legal disputes can turn on the slightest of phrases. To you and I, "any entity" means just that: ANYBODY.
Of course our local bell and cable providers don't see it that way. I sincerely hope the Municipalities win.
Do you all see a particular trend coming into view here? All sorts of people are tired of being lorded over (for lack of a better term) by entrenched political and corporate oligarchs. The Bells vs. Municipalities battle is yet another symptom of us regular folks (in this case, Municipalities and those who want to help them) saying that we aren't taking it anymore.
Good for them!
gp |
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ravital
Just Another Pesky Independent Nh Voter
Premium
join:2001-07-19
Merrimack, NH
| The grasp of the obvious
What's amazing, is that it takes the cumulative centuries of legal expertise between 9 Supreme Court justices, to settle what any child could clearly identify as nothing more than big business buying themselves mercenary legislators, both at the local and national levels. We're sorely in need of a new Teddy Roosevelt.
Does anyone know exactly when the SC is supposed to hear this? I couldn't find that in the article (sorry if I've missed it). Thanks. |
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DrTCP
Yours truly
Premium,ExMod 1999-04
join:1999-11-09
Round Rock, TX |  Supreme Court to decide if "any" really means ANY
You would think "ANY" is clear for most people. Well, it seems not so simple for some. |
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David
No,there is another.
Premium,VIP
join:2002-05-30
Granite City, IL
clubs:
 ·DIRECTV
·magicjack.com
·AT&T Midwest
| The other dumb question
Note: this is not a bell shill post or anything just a general question
Would they have to play by the same rules the business does already?? Ya know share lines and such.. I would imagine with any communications business(and yes police department radio towers have to still obey the FCC) still have to obey the FCC guidelines in regards to competition?? I would think just because a local goverment provides the service they have to...
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Fast and furious!! 225lbs lost and a future that I never dreamed of... Whodathunkit?? |
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godsmack
join:2003-06-08 | I don't have any trouble with this......
Until they start to use tax money for funding either the start up or to keep operations afloat......I really don't want my tax money used for it...who knows it may cause a tax increase locally?????????? |
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tazman69
Safety Guy
join:2000-12-22
Charles Town, WV | What are you talking about? This is all about municipal provided broadband. They normally sell bonds to fund the projects start-up and operating costs for the first few years. I'm not sure when your tax dollars would come into play. |
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woody7
Premium
join:2000-10-13
Torrance, CA | reply to David
Re: The other dumb question
Then they could screw whom they gave access to............hmmm |
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mjcrocket
Mjc
join:2000-12-02
Abingdon, MD
| reply to tazman69
Re: I don't have any trouble with this......
said by tazman69  :
I'm not sure when your tax dollars would come into play.
Tax Dollars come into play, because that is where the guarantee on the bonds comes from. The Municipal government guarantees that the principal & interest on the bonds will be paid; and the credit rating of the local government is used to get the good interest rate on the bonds. The value of these bonds is also counted against the total credit limit of the municipal government concerned. |
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mjcrocket
Mjc
join:2000-12-02
Abingdon, MD
| reply to ravital
Re: The grasp of the obvious
said by ravital :
Does anyone know exactly when the SC is supposed to hear this? I couldn't find that in the article (sorry if I've missed it). Thanks.
The SC is not hearing it! Until one of the parties involved the two referenced court cases (Eighth Circuit and the DC Circuit), appeals to the SC; the SC will not get involved. Also, just because you appeal to the SC; it does not mean the SC will hear the appeal. The SC receives far more appeals than it can ever handle; so they have to pick & choose which cases they will actually hear & rule on. The effect can still be the same. If an appeal is filed with the SC, and it is not accepted for hearing; that effectively affirms the findings of the lower court. All of this is done on the public record and is reported in the public media. |
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David
No,there is another.
Premium,VIP
join:2002-05-30
Granite City, IL
clubs:
·DIRECTV
·magicjack.com
·AT&T Midwest
| reply to woody7
Re: The other dumb question
said by woody7 :
Then they could screw whom they gave access to............hmmm
Keep in mind and I have spoke to a few covad techs, they are still allowed in C.O.'s and in thier cages. Just like ASI is. Trust me I talked briefly (about the time I was hired at SBC) to a covad tech and he was in the C.O. before ASI became seperate on the day in may..
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Fast and furious!! 225lbs lost and a future that I never dreamed of... Whodathunkit?? |
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godsmack
join:2003-06-08
| reply to tazman69
Re: I don't have any trouble with this......
At some point when they start to fail as a business.....they just might hit up the general funds (hence tax's). where I am for an example the county runs an amusement park called Playland in Rye NY......This park is not self sufficient they are in fact subsidized by county tax's. |
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dvd536
as Mr. Pink as they come
Premium
join:2001-04-27
Phoenix, AZ
| Exactly
Exactly why the big boys dont want munis. they know their service sucks and is too expensive for what you get. given a choice, anyone with half a brain would go with the muni's.
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You can never be too rich, too thin or have too much Bandwidth |
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ravital
Just Another Pesky Independent Nh Voter
Premium
join:2001-07-19
Merrimack, NH
| reply to mjcrocket
Re: I don't have any trouble with this......
said by mjcrocket :
said by tazman69 :
I'm not sure when your tax dollars would come into play.
Tax Dollars come into play, because that is where the guarantee on the bonds comes from. The Municipal government guarantees that the principal & interest on the bonds will be paid; and the credit rating of the local government is used to get the good interest rate on the bonds. The value of these bonds is also counted against the total credit limit of the municipal government concerned.
That is only true with General Obligation bonds. Many municipal governments fund it with Revenue bonds, which cost absolutely not one penny in tax money. Not one red cent.
However, when the project is a success, it means the municipal government can direct money earned from the project to other purposes, like a property tax abatement or a reduction in other fees, which benefits everyone, whether they subscribe to the service or not.
So taxpayers lose nothing, and in many cases, benefit from something without having invested in it.
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"And if you call me brother now, forgive me if I inquire, just according to whose plan?" |
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hescominsoon
join:2003-02-18
Brunswick, MD | reply to godsmack
fortunatly most muni's are profitable and totally self-sufficient.
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God Blesshttp://www.faithwalk.org |
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godsmack
join:2003-06-08 | That is good news then !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! |
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apsinkus
join:2002-06-25
Chicago, IL
| Somehow people forget...
Before I go any further: do you go to vote? If not, you should can it and take your comments somewhere else! Why? We elect our government (don't start with your retarded illuminati crap and how everything is already predetermined), there for government represents us (at least the ones who voted). What am I leading to? All municipalities should be allowed to start any ventures as long as :
1. Majority of citizens support the venture
2. Profits go back into community to provide additional money to schools and other badly underfunded areas (not mayor's new car or new offices for the government in lucrative properties)
Look at Native Americans, they got their casinos and so on and they pump back all that money into their communities ontop of the fact that things they provide make their own quality of life better. Think about it this way (and I know I will piss off HAMs who majority of I have no love for), communities who are underserved by communications giants should have every right to use every technology to get the services, it should not matter if it is BPL or anything else. It is a fact that kids and young adults have a higher chance to be successful if they are given best communications, education, and other good things that come with strong public/private services.
So, grab your ID an go register to vote. Once you get your voice heard, start bitching or supporting. |
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PthirusPubis6
join:2003-05-24
00000
| Giant sucking sound!
Worried that a muni operation might cause a tax increase?
Consider this. A small community with just 5000 phone lines sends $2,400,000/yr out of the local economy to the national telco.
$40/mo * 12 mo * 5000 customers = 2,400,000
This money leaves the local community, never to be seen again. Obviously, a muni operation will keep a portion of that to be used locally.
So the question is do you want to contribute to angry Ed's obscene bonus or keep the money local? |
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highjinx
join:2000-10-12
Alturas, CA
| reply to ravital
Re: I don't have any trouble with this......
said by ravital :
said by mjcrocket :
said by tazman69 :
I'm not sure when your tax dollars would come into play.
Tax Dollars come into play, because that is where the guarantee on the bonds comes from. The Municipal government guarantees that the principal & interest on the bonds will be paid; and the credit rating of the local government is used to get the good interest rate on the bonds. The value of these bonds is also counted against the total credit limit of the municipal government concerned.
blah, blah, blah...However, when the project is a success, it means the municipal government can direct money earned from the project to other purposes, like a property tax abatement or a reduction in other fees, which benefits everyone, whether they subscribe to the service or not.
Nice spin. Not only will they not "re-direct" profits, you can be damn sure that eventually it will be a source adding to the coffers.
Way back when, when I lived up in Northern California, they told us that the 15 cent toll to cross the Bay Bridge would go away after 5 years....Today they charge $2.00 and there's 6 Billion in new bonds for the new bridge. What do you think the new toll will be?
On the surface, Muni-Networks have a grass-roots sort of appeal. I just don't think that muni's understand the continual costs and technological risks associated with building/running/maintaining a fiber network.
Until someone convinces me otherwise, I say let private investment build it.
HJ |
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