how-to block ads
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Comments on news posted 2003-11-07 16:39:12: Hardware manufacturer Belkin comes up with the not so ingenious idea of having their wireless routers occasionally redirect users to advertisements. ..
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Alex G Bell
join:2002-07-02
Boston, MA
|  Dumb Idea!
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"Remember, Comrade, people who are willing to destroy an efficient telephone system may not be playing with a full deck." | |
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Digital
As-Salamu Alaykum
Premium
join:2000-07-24
Mentor, OH
| Re: A Statement in Contrast said by ZOG321  :
Unlike the others I noticed in this thread bashing Belkin, I see the good thinking in it's attempts to sell more Belkin products. The Register article said Belkin was using it's router's driver software to sell Belkin's parental controls program, not some penis enlargement pills or easy mortgage program. Face it folks, the economy is tight, businesses need to recoup costs, and this form of company self-advertising is not the worst thing that could happen. If Belkin does start using its products advertise(spam) other parties, then I could see the problem. Until then I think Belkin is using their heads on this one.
By the way, I use a Belkin F6C120-UNV Universal Power Supply(UPS) and it has paid for itself a dozen times over. It's funny how the Belkin naysayers only come out when others react to supposedly negative press.
Agreed. Read this. »groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&l···kin.com+ | |
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CherryIcee
Winter
join:2001-10-25
Bellevue, WA
| What are you smoking? They definitely are NOT using their heads on this one. Public perception is very fickle and this was bound to cause negative reactions. If their marketing people are too stupid to understand that, then they need to be replaced toot sweet. 
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Stare into the light, dance along the ledge. Feel the wicked blade, Kiss the razor's edge. | |
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ZOG321
Premium
join:2003-10-22
Slingerlands, NY
 ·RoadRunner Cable
| Re: A Statement in Contrast said by CherryIcee :
What are you smoking? They definitely are NOT using their heads on this one. Public perception is very fickle and this was bound to cause negative reactions. If their marketing people are too stupid to understand that, then they need to be replaced toot sweet.
I'm smoking Marlboro Menthols right now, maybe a cigar a little later. 
You're right, the public is fickle but not on one topic. Right now, in society, the public is concerned about what is available to children on the internet. Offering Parental controls, to the parents of internet children is a great idea. Belkin has seen this as a way to make money and associate their brand name with safety. They(Belkin) is doing all this while cutting costs in advertising.
Look, you and other people using these forums are smart enough to ask questions and do research on any product offered in any market today, but there is a very large group of people out there that only want email, music downloads, and games....nothing wrong with that, but how does a company market to these people....by advertising new products on their brand name devices already sold. Some do not want this, while others might. Belkin takes the risk of alienating some of it's loyal customers but they think can add more than they will lose.
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XP Home, P4/HT, 3.00 GHz 800MHz FS Bus, 200GB NTFS HD, 2GB DDR SDRam @ 400MHz, 128MB DDR ATI 9800 Pro, 19" CRT & 15" Flat, SBAudigy 2 Altec Lansing 5.1, Belkin F6C120-UNV UPS, Toshiba PCX2500 TW Cable modem. Too much for me now, but........ | |
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ZOG321
Premium
join:2003-10-22
Slingerlands, NY
·RoadRunner Cable
| Re: A Statement in Contrast Sorry big greg, I don't work for Belkin, so no 15% disounts for you. lol. Why would you think Belkin is counting on someone like me? Because I use their products and find them to be worth the money spent? If so, then I guess I can be counted on.
No. I, like you, don't like pops ads when I am browsing. I find most ads to be not worth finishing of the headline.(that's in all mediums including the net) I use pop blockers and spyware remover programs that deal with pops.
**Thanks on the "uninterruptable." I will not edit the original post in case someone in the future looks at this thread**
Finally, everyone has their own preferences on what harware/software to use. You don't like Belkin and I do.
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XP Home, P4/HT, 3.00 GHz 800MHz FS Bus, 200GB NTFS HD, 2GB DDR SDRam @ 400MHz, 128MB DDR ATI 9800 Pro, 19" CRT & 15" Flat, SBAudigy 2 Altec Lansing 5.1, Belkin F6C120-UNV UPS, Toshiba PCX2500 TW Cable modem. Too much for me now, but........ | |
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big greg
Premium,MVM,Ex-Mod 2005-6
join:2003-10-11
Boston, MA
clubs: 
| Re: A Statement in Contrast said by ZOG321 :
Sorry big greg, I don't work for Belkin, so no 15% disounts for you. lol. Why would you think Belkin is counting on someone like me? Because I use their products and find them to be worth the money spent? If so, then I guess I can be counted on.
No. I, like you, don't like pops ads when I am browsing. I find most ads to be not worth finishing of the headline.(that's in all mediums including the net) I use pop blockers and spyware remover programs that deal with pops.
**Thanks on the "uninterruptable." I will not edit the original post in case someone in the future looks at this thread**
Finally, everyone has their own preferences on what harware/software to use. You don't like Belkin and I do.
ZOG, this isn't a pop up that is delivered to you when you look a free content on the Internet. That's what popup killers are good for (if you use IE, the Google Toolbar has the best one out there; if you use Mozilla Firebird, the built in one is awesome).
There is a big difference here. This is your own equipment spamming you AFTER you paid for it - to encourage you go buy yet more Belkin stuff.
Belkin is counting on good natured people like you. You may think "Wow how thoughtful of them to advertise their excellent products to me, I really like Belkin even more!" Most people won't feel that this is a useful feature. (Just look at the rest of the posts in this forum.) Belkin's misguided (desperate?) move is going to hurt them in the long run.
Most people aren't as forgiving as you are, and in the long run it can only hurt Belkin's reputation. (Already they are trying to put a positive spin on this "adware".) There are plenty of other vendors that sell networking equipment that doesn't try to spam you.
As far as the definition of "UPS" goes you are welcome. In the future you may also want to use the really excellent spell checker that is available on this site. | |
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ZOG321
Premium
join:2003-10-22
Slingerlands, NY
·RoadRunner Cable
| Re: A Statement in Contrast big greg,
I understand the reason that spybot and it's ilk cannot remove the Belkin redirect feature. As I see it, spam is unwanted advertising that you keep receiving after you, the user, has expressly told the other party you don't want anymore. A blanket request to deny all advertising is not fair to you, the user, and to the companies out there trying to sell you their goods and services. (man I am going to be misread by some on that!) Look back to your sociology lessons. We are not self sustaining, meaning we need to find what we want from others. Those "others" are the companies that vie for your attention and support with your purchase of their product. I don't like having a company such as Gator(Claria) compiling data on me but I do want companies to know what I want(goods/services), when I want them without my having to hold a sign up. Until there is a better way of achieving this we will have to keep saying "no" to the different advertisements that we deem not for us. | |
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big greg
Premium,MVM,Ex-Mod 2005-6
join:2003-10-11
Boston, MA
clubs:
| Re: A Statement in Contrast said by ZOG321 :
I understand the reason that spybot and it's ilk cannot remove the Belkin redirect feature.
What Belkin is doing isn't a popup. It redirects your request for a web page to a site that is trying to sell you something. Instead of getting the page you wanted, you get a page asking you to sign up for a service marketed by Belkin.
said by ZOG321 :
As I see it, spam is unwanted advertising that you keep receiving after you, the user, has expressly told the other party you don't want anymore. A blanket request to deny all advertising is not fair to you, the user, and to the companies out there trying to sell you their goods and services. (man I am going to be misread by some on that!)
Do you work for a company that does email marketing? SPAM is not something that you opt-out of and still get. SPAM is something that you never heard of being crammed down your throat.
You may getting email selling you products for penis enlargement or breast enlargements? Would you buy such a product just because you got an unsolicited commercial email advertisement for it?
Clearly someone is buying these products as a result of the spam. The number of people annoyed by the advertising has to be over 99.99% of the people getting these advertisements. Is that fair to subject the vast majority of people to these advertisements? No. What makes this possible? Email advertising is cheap.
Why does Belkin market this product by hijacking HTTP requests? Because they can build it into their routers at almost zero cost. They don't care that the vast majority of people buying their router aren't going to use the service.
said by ZOG321 :
Look back to your sociology lessons. We are not self sustaining, meaning we need to find what we want from others. Those "others" are the companies that vie for your attention and support with your purchase of their product.
Remember that if someone wants to find a good or service, they normally go looking for it. I don't have anything against legitimate marketing of new products. If I'm in the market for a new car or toothbrush, I can go look for information on the internet, in magazines, at a retail store. I don't want to bombarded with ads for cars or toothbrushes when I'm not in the market for one.
This isn't seeing an ad for a new product you may see on the back of a bus or on top of a taxicab. Belkin is crippling their product's functionality to try to sell you additional services. This is like buying a new car that refuses to start until you listen to a 60 second ad that tries to sell you an extended warranty.
Why didn't Belkin just advertise this feature as available by printing something on the outside of the box? Or in the user manual? Or maybe even in the router's setup?
Remember your sociology. First impressions count.
If my new car wouldn't start 8 hours after I took delivery, I'd have a poor impression of the vehicle, the retail outlet, and the manufacturer. I might take the car back to the dealer and never consider that make or model ever again.
If my Belkin router started hijacking web page requests the first day I used it, I would have a poor impression of my router, the store where I purchased it, and the company who made it. I may never consider another Belkin product ever.
Belkin now has seen the negative reaction to their obnoxious marketing scheme. Now they spinning it as "protecting children". I don't buy that at all. I think that Belkin made a huge mistake, and they are going to take a beating in the marketplace.
said by ZOG321 :
I don't like having a company such as Gator(Claria) compiling data on me but I do want companies to know what I want(goods/services), when I want them without my having to hold a sign up. Until there is a better way of achieving this we will have to keep saying "no" to the different advertisements that we deem not for us.
In the unlikely event that your computer is infected with Gator or other spyware and you want to remove it, there is a great program called Ad-Aware (»www.lavasoftusa.com/) that you can download for free. It does a good job, and if you like the operation of the program, you can support the company that produced the product. From what I can tell, all their marketing is word-of-mouth, they have an excellent product.
The marketing department at Belkin could take some lessons from them. | |
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ZOG321
Premium
join:2003-10-22
Slingerlands, NY
·RoadRunner Cable
| Re: A Statement in Contrast No big greg, I do not work for a marketing company. I am not in sales either. Imagine what happens if all advertising stops. Internet, tv, radio, billboard, etc. Also imagine that the companies out there are still the same size...what happens? The consumer is stuck paying whatever the seller wants as a price. Advertising creates competition by informing the consumer of different companies serving the same market. Competition keeps prices down. I don't need penis or breast enlargement but someone out there right now does. How does a company get the word to that consumer?
Word of mouth is too slow in today's "demand now" society. Come up with a way to effectively get your product out before your competitors do and you have an advantage.
When browsing redirect becomes more mainstream we will have to just use the "opt out" feature.
By the way, I use Ad-aware, Spybot S & D, and NSW Pro. You do know Norton uses redirect when you do online scanning? | |
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big greg
Premium,MVM,Ex-Mod 2005-6
join:2003-10-11
Boston, MA
clubs: | Re: A Statement in Contrast It's not just black and white here ZOG.
I'm not saying all advertising is bad, I'm just saying crippling your product to ram ads down my throat is wrong, and I won't buy products that do that. | |
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wozster
Premium
join:2000-10-21
Lenexa, KS
| said by ZOG321 :
I think Belkin is using their heads on this one.
Put down the crack-pipe and slowly walk away from the computer
Marketing 101, Lessson 1: DON'T PISS-OFF THE TECHIES (You will regret it) Just ask Intuit.
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Protect online free speech | |
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ZOG321
Premium
join:2003-10-22
Slingerlands, NY | Re: A Statement in Contrast mmmmm. CRACK. I don't think so. Flaming will get you nowhere. Techies are important but I don't think you/those are the customers Belkin was going after when they decided to advertise through their already sold products. | |
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ZOG321
Premium
join:2003-10-22
Slingerlands, NY
·RoadRunner Cable
| Re: A Statement in Contrast Whoa dude! Way to angry at the world. I'm guessing somewhere in the EULA of the hardware/software/user manual that Belkin sells there is something mentioned in it that they would like to give you information on "other great products and services....." This doesn't make it a right, but it should warn YOU that they are interested in keeping you as an informed, loyal customer.
Ummmm, the billboard thing.....I agree. Music....is a commercial too. The songs sell the artist; the albums, t-shirts, concert tickets, The RIAA, etc. I don't like having to use fake email addresses either. Hell, we should all have to use are given names, but guess what.....SOOL. The ads on the internet are different from what Belkin did. At least there was some interest in the Belkin name before that user was shown a Belking ad.
The "Private Property" thing.....buy a gun, that worked for me.
Even if Belkin goes out of business for this.....there will be others that will follow suit and succeed. Take something that is a mere nuisance to you and shut the option off.
ps. Your sig is an advertisement. I like it but all the same, you are pushing something onto others that they might not want to see. AKA spam. | |
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CherryIcee
Winter
join:2001-10-25
Bellevue, WA
| Not having children myself, the aspect of safety online never enters my thoughts. Now that you mention it however, i would wholeheartedly agree that many parents are indeed concerned about what their children are exposed to (although unfortunately there are far too many parents who don't seem to care.) The problem I have with that skew on the topic is that it doesn't really have anything to do with safety. Redirecting their users to ads does absolutely nothing to protect children, it merely serves to associate them with the Belkin product line. Not a bad deal for Belkin, but a sleazy way to do it IMO.
I also agree that many casual users don't do a great deal of research before purchasing a product (other than asking the nearest Best Buy sales associate for their opinion.) But that doesn't mean that they should be automatically targeted because they aren't familiar with hardware. I disagee with your overall ideaology that its ok for a company to unknowingly "market" to these people. You mentioned online safety as a popular concern as of late, but what about spam? I would have to say that hands down, the spam thing is far more topical to most of us then online safety (remember that not all of us have children, but all of us do use computers and email of some kind.) Why do you think the national DNC (Do not call) list is such a hot topic. Its because we have come to the point where we (as consumers) are sick to death of being "marketed" to. I don't need, nor do I want to hear about a companies new products or hot deals. As was stated above, if a company puts out a great product at a reasonable price, that in and of itself is the greatest marketing they can do. I take offense to being targeted left and right by companies. The business atmosphere and overall attitude that we are simply fodder for their growth needs to be addressed and something needs to be done. I would be willing to bet that if it were put to a vote (national or global) the overwhelming response would be negative in regards to Belkins practice. We want LESS spam not more and receiving it from a company simply by using their product is just wrong. Don't discount peoples anger and completely adverse feelings towards company spam. It WILL drive people away.
Lastly, if another company does decide to "adopt" Belkins practice, then I would imagine they would receive the same animosity towards them that Belkin receives from us. I also disagree that they will succeed. Companies at some point need to understand that they can't keep invading our privacy for the sole reason of selling something. It should not be a part of their business model. I am somewhat bitter towrds companies today because they have no heart and no soul. They are big money whores and I for one am tired of them. You mentioned that "Some do not want this, while others might." I would care to wager that the few percentage of those who would want it, will not make up for the throngs of users who do not want it. Trust me, the casual user will not be apathetic towards it once they discover whats going on. In fact they will most likely be even more angry, and word of mouth travels fast.
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Stare into the light, dance along the ledge. Feel the wicked blade, Kiss the razor's edge. | |
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ZOG321
Premium
join:2003-10-22
Slingerlands, NY
·RoadRunner Cable
| Re: A Statement in Contrast CherryIcee,
A mistake on Belkin's part would be not stating in their product manuals, in a concise way, how to disable the router's redirect feature. From the way the original article was posted, all the user needs to do is to shut off the feature. I still stand behind the advertising practice Belkin is employing. I was thinking of other companys that employ this tactic. I use Frontier telephone for my local/long distance service. Frontier has called me on occasion to inform me of new plans and features they offer. TW RoadRunner has also done this when I log into my RR mail account. Do you have a newer car? My dealership has repeatedly sent mailers out telling me that I'm due for a service, or that there was a recall on certain defects. All these are advertisements, some of them are unwanted. Unwanted advertising is spam, but to get rid of spam effectively is to remove some of those advertisments that might interest me.
I think the national Do-Not-Call list is a great idea, but is uneccessary. Tell someone or a company you don't want them advertising to you---if they fail to comply with your wishes, press charges for harassment. | |
| | wtansill
Ncc1701
join:2000-10-10
Falls Church, VA
| said by ZOG321 :
Unlike the others I noticed in this thread bashing Belkin, I see the good thinking in it's attempts to sell more Belkin products. The Register article said Belkin was using it's router's driver software to sell Belkin's parental controls program, not some penis enlargement pills or easy mortgage program. Face it folks, the economy is tight, businesses need to recoup costs, and this form of company self-advertising is not the worst thing that could happen. If Belkin does start using its products advertise(spam) other parties, then I could see the problem. Until then I think Belkin is using their heads on this one.
By the way, I use a Belkin F6C120-UNV Universal Power Supply(UPS) and it has paid for itself a dozen times over. It's funny how the Belkin naysayers only come out when others react to supposedly negative press.
Edited to add: That USB massager looks great!
Fine. Let them advertise their service. I'm sure that their router comes in a box of some sort, complete with an owner's manual, maybe some setup software and the like. I'm certain that they can enclose a slip of paper that adequately explains their service, how it is enabled, costs, virtues, etc. Why is this not sufficient?
If they are going to include spam in their router's firmware, what other potentially unsavory activities are they up to? Are they secretly monitoring my net traffic and phoning home in order to build a profile so that they can market to me more extensively? I want my router to route. Period. It's all about trust.
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That which does not kill me merely prolongs the agony. | |
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ZOG321
Premium
join:2003-10-22
Slingerlands, NY
·RoadRunner Cable
| Re: A Statement in Contrast Ncc1701,
I agree, but what about the new products/services coming to the market. How can a company adveritse "in" a product that sat in a warehouse for three to six months then sat on the store shelves for another three months. Unless the store is sliding flyers into the shrinkwrap, I don't think your idea will work.
NOTE: The word spam is being misused. Spam is unwanted ads that you keep receiving after you said you don't want them anymore.
orthogonal,
Turn the feature off if you wish to stop receiving redirect in your browser. | |
| | | | wtansill
Ncc1701
join:2000-10-10
Falls Church, VA
| Re: A Statement in Contrast said by ZOG321 :
Ncc1701,
I agree, but what about the new products/services coming to the market. How can a company adveritse "in" a product that sat in a warehouse for three to six months then sat on the store shelves for another three months. Unless the store is sliding flyers into the shrinkwrap, I don't think your idea will work.
NOTE: The word spam is being misused. Spam is unwanted ads that you keep receiving after you said you don't want them anymore.
orthogonal,
Turn the feature off if you wish to stop receiving redirect in your browser.
The original complainer (see this link: »groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&l···iny=1995)
noted that this "feature" was embedded in a (I assume firmware) upgrade which (again I assume) came from Belkin's Web Site. I suspect that Belkin could have made some mention of the new "feature" at that point, offering the user a chance to download the firmware with the feature disabled, if necessary... In any case, it makes me wonder what *else* Belkin routers have been programmed to do... I will not buy or recommend Belkin products to anyone ever again. They have abused the trust of their customers.
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That which does not kill me merely prolongs the agony. | |
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orthogonal
@verizon.net
| Unlike the others I noticed in this thread bashing Belkin, I see the good thinking in it's attempts to sell more Belkin products.... By the way, I use a Belkin F6C120-UNV Universal Power Supply(UPS)
Hi! This is your Belkin UPS!
Please go to www.belkin.com to view an ad for our Parental Control feature.
If www.belkin.com doesn't respond with a special cookie in five minutes, I'll have to start cycling your power, so hurry up and start that browser!
And remember, I'll be abck to do this again in eight hours, so have a great day until then! | |
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Belky
@cox.net
| Belkin is the worst partner to work with. Every OEM/ODM partners were treated like dirt and slave: "Belkin is the whore company" is a very close statement.
It is running by a bunch of Yes- and Nocapable-Product Managers and Business Unit Manager. However, these men know how to squeeze their Suppliers to death. I was one of them.
Asking Accton, ATen, MCT, etc...
Networking Business Unit included arrogant, useless, and unworthy group. Market share has dropped tremendously. Customers are very unhappy with Tech Support. Middle and High Level Management protect each others. Low level and productive employees have nothing but hot air and promises such as stock option, benefit, bonus.. | |
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ZOG321
Premium
join:2003-10-22
Slingerlands, NY
·RoadRunner Cable
| Re: Belkin" Whore Company" said by Belky:
Belkin is the worst partner to work with. Every OEM/ODM partners were treated like dirt and slave: "Belkin is the whore company" is a very close statement.
It is running by a bunch of Yes- and Nocapable-Product Managers and Business Unit Manager. However, these men know how to squeeze their Suppliers to death. I was one of them.
Asking Accton, ATen, MCT, etc...
Networking Business Unit included arrogant, useless, and unworthy group. Market share has dropped tremendously. Customers are very unhappy with Tech Support. Middle and High Level Management protect each others. Low level and productive employees have nothing but hot air and promises such as stock option, benefit, bonus..
I would assume the partnership your company and Belkin had/have was a profitable one. The way Belkin treated their suppliers is a little off topic but this affirms Belkin's desire to achieve rigid standards that they in turn pass onto the consumer. As for support, this is where Belkin might see a need to re-evaluate and change their customer service. I haven't had a problem with the tech support so I wouldn't know exactly what you're talking about.
Your flashy title is a little over-the-top. A whore is someone/something that sells itself. If Belkin is a "Whore Company," then they are doing what businesses should be doing, selling itself. | |
| shuubz
A Good Kind Of Pain
join:2001-02-12
Dexter, MI
|  Microsoft-class feature
If this was a product feature you knew about before you bought the router, would you buy it?
Is there a reason that companies think it's ok to treat a paying customer like a urinal?
I have no kids. I'm a professional geek. I will not buy a Belkin product, and I will recommend that all the people who come to me for advice (which happens daily) do not buy one, either.
It is worth noting that I own several Belkin KVM switches. They're pricey, but not good: they produce ghosting on an LCD monitor (CRTs too).
It's not just the marketing that sucks.
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What is left for the meek is not worth having...I don't need a shepherd, I need a Muse...The only thing I can call my own is who I am; insecurity is pointless. | |
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Rambo76098
join:2003-02-21
Pataskala, OH
| Stupid Belkin I think i just bought a Ethernet cord from *them the other day... so if my computer starts to get flooded with pop-ups and spam, we'll know why | |
|
Agent 86
| Fodder for Dilbert Hey Eric Deming (Belkin Product Manager who invented the spamming router), have you ever wanted to be a character in a Dilbert strip? | |
| 
DSLTech
join:2000-12-30
San Jose, CA
| Companies showing their desperation. Looks like another company showing, in desperate times, that they are willing to take these kinds of chances with their customers.
First the Verisign fiasco, now this crap. Whats next? Microsoft embedding ads into their OS?
Talk about sheer stupidity and nerve. I can just imagine a group of morons sitting at some conference room named "Barney" discussing this brilliant idea about using a product that they've sold to their customers, in order to place advertisements infront of them, for free.
Look Belkin, we buy the product, not your ads. These are tough times for everyone, not just you. Dont be so damn slimy. Who's going to trust you now? Find a buyer. Now. | |
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Sisqo
World Champs. Babe Who?
Premium
join:2002-08-14
Methuen, MA
| This isn't any better! Guys check this out!
»www.cnn.com/2003/TECH/internet/1···dex.html
I just found this out right now, this is why I am a happy mac user. I can't believe how bad things have gotten that they actually implemented such a thing. | |
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big greg
Premium,MVM,Ex-Mod 2005-6
join:2003-10-11
Boston, MA
clubs:
| Re: This isn't any better! No, it's a whole different thing.
The "windows messenger" service was great to send messages to everyone on your LAN back in the old days. Microsoft is correct in shutting it off, but they are about 3 years too late. Yeah it should have had security on it... back in the Windows 3.1 days security wasn't an issue... at least Microsoft is now trying to do something about "insecure by default" platforms.
Your router shoving ads at you by design is MUCH worse than a useful feature with no security that has been taken advantage of by spammers. | |
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NOVA_Guy
Obama- Commander in Thief
Premium
join:2002-03-05
 ·VOIPo
| Yeah...
But this is just something that Microsoft "forgot" about changing and it has not been exploited too badly (yet).
Perhaps if companies like Microsoft could be held to a standard that forced them to provide compensation to their customers for errors, glitches, and flaws in their products we would see better software coming from Redmond.
I program professionally for a living and am held to certain standards on various projects. (maximum number of reported bugs, etc.-- depending upon client and contract) Why should it be any different when you're selling software to the public at large?
--
Be a responsible citizen:
Boycott all products from all RIAA members
Only buy used CDs (no royalties are paid from those)
Boycott movies (the MPAA) | |
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big greg
Premium,MVM,Ex-Mod 2005-6
join:2003-10-11
Boston, MA
clubs:
| Re: This isn't any better! said by NOVA_Guy :
Yeah...
But this is just something that Microsoft "forgot" about changing and it has not been exploited too badly (yet).
Perhaps if companies like Microsoft could be held to a standard that forced them to provide compensation to their customers for errors, glitches, and flaws in their products we would see better software coming from Redmond.
I program professionally for a living and am held to certain standards on various projects. (maximum number of reported bugs, etc.-- depending upon client and contract) Why should it be any different when you're selling software to the public at large?
I'm a professional programmer too. Microsoft didn't "forget" about changing this. I'm thinking they consider it a feature and not a bug. It is easily turned off by end users (just like security is easily turned ON by most end users that care). Public pressure made them do this. (Besides, I turned off the message service on all my machines years ago when this started happening.)
It actually IS a useful feature that has been abused by internet lowlifes. I know that my APC UPS software used the Message Service to tell me that the power was lost on my servers (until I disabled that feature, because I thought it was dumb).
Besides, I think they have their hands full fixing buffer overruns, which are serious bugs that seem to be all over all their operating systems. Talk about undisciplined programming! Un-patched buffer overruns are how real bugs like BLASTER got all over your servers.
From looking at your sig, I suppose you are now going to add "Be a responsible citizen: Boycott Microsoft because they didn't disable the message service (think of the wasted electrons)" | |
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Belky
@cox.net | "Be a responsible citizen: Boycott Microsoft because they didn't disable the message service (think of the wasted electrons)"
Boycott BELKIN...Don't buy their Spam Router. | |
| 
him5
How 'Bout Some Ether?
Premium
join:2001-01-21
Westminster, MD | One word... | |
| 
lgreg
Child of the 40's
join:2002-06-09
Norfolk, VA
| Their statement The front page of their website »www.belkin.com says:
Important message from Belkin:
We at Belkin apologize for the recent trouble our customers have experienced with the wireless router/browser redirect issue. We will be offering firmware fixes available for download early next week. We do not have exact details yet but we can tell you now that each router's firmware that incorporates Parental Control as an option will be changed.
Please expect more detailed information to follow early next week. Thank you | |
| 
Varangian
join:2002-12-08
Collinsville, IL |  Bye Belkin!
The sentence is death - as far as MY purchasing is concerned.
May Adam Smith have mercy on your souls.... | |
| |
Belky
@cox.net
| Re: Bye Belkin!
What is KVM switch and Router have in common? | |
| MyTwoCents1
join:2003-10-11
San Pedro, CA
| Damage Control
Do the research. Become informed. Make insightful comments.
Belkin obviously was mistaken to redirect ANY url request, but if you would have bothered to check the behavior of this you would have found a couple interesting things. First, the url redirect apparently only happens at the start of a new http session. Those of you downloading the cure for cancer for you children need not be alarmed. Your precious cargo will not be mingled with a Parental Control Sign-up page. That's right folks, it is a signup page. Not that it makes right. Belkin does need to (and looks like they are gonna) step up, re-tool, fix and move on. Second, no active http sessions are interrupted (at least during the last 10 hours I have been probing ... picked up the Register article some time ago ... never got around to playing with it). Do not fear, your porn will come thru without a redirect Theoretically, I suppose if you allow pop ups and other such scripts to run then those new http sessions may be tagged for the redirect ... at least in theory.
BTW, the Parental Control feature is fairly innovative. Privacy advocates like yourselves should check it out, provide criticism and help good ideas evolve. It is a good way to keep your unsuspecting spouses and children away from the true internet vultures out there that try to do real harm.
Bottom line ... If someone from Belkin reads this (and you can bet the farm they are) I suggest the following. Add the Parental Control Sign-up to your "EZ Install" process. If you are afraid of losing potential Parental Control customers then make the first attempt o log into YOUR ROUTER prompt your trusting customers for permission to sign them up for Parental control next time the router gets an active internet connect.
Just my two cents when it counts ....
Flame on. | |
| | 
qsoak
Premium
join:2003-10-30
Long Beach, CA
| Re: Damage Controlsaid by MyTwoCents1 :
When did dslreports.com member become a bunch of flamers?
Do the research. Become informed. Make insightful comments.
Belkin obviously was mistaken to redirect ANY url request, but if you would have bothered to check the behavior of this you would have found a couple interesting things.....
Maybe, but IMHO this has been a lot more fun! I'd even bet that many of the people following this thread have had at least a day go by where they didn't even think about how much they hated their cable provider. They probably saved a lot of time too, by not running 50 speed tests a day, just to confirm what they already know- that their local cable company is lying to them about their speed caps. [/LEVITY]
Seriously, you might have shed some detail on how it works but that does not change the fact that it was improper and that it was done in a sneaky way, guaranteed to anger those who value privacy, security, trust, integrity..insert your value here...
As far as "When did dslreports.com member become a bunch of flamers?" You might be the best one to answer that. Based on your sarcasm about a parent whose child has cancer and your taunts about not worrying, your PORN will still get through. Was any of that necessary to make your point?
So far most everyone has just tried to find a better way of expressing everyone's anger and dismay at Belkin for pulling a boneheaded stunt. But, it has been everyone directing the bad feelings at Belkin. Yours is the 1st post I see directing the sarcasm and bad feelings at the other members here. [/SOAPBOX] And with that, I say goodnight and wearily click the POST NOW! button.
--
By trying we can easily learn to endure adversity. Another man’s, I mean.--Mark Twain | |
| | 
highhatsize
Norm, The Enourmous Basset
Premium
join:2001-02-08
San Francisco, CA
 ·SONIC.NET
| quote:
Those of you downloading the cure for cancer for you children need not be alarmed. . .Do not fear, your porn will come thru.
Thank god that there are those who walk among us untainted by the visceral distractions of venting and lust! I was enjoying this creatively libelous thread until I read your post.
It was wrong. . .so wrong.
I was even ignorant of the curative powers of pornography!
--
SanFranSon | |
| Just Looking9
join:2002-02-09
Alexandria, VA
| This was a serious security issue. Consider how the spam is turned off. The remote Belkin site modifies the configuration of your router. No login. No authentication. There's no telling how this could have been abused. Serious sysadmins started dumping this equipment as soon as they heard about it.
-Just | |
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See 7 replies to this post | |
alex344
join:2003-07-02
North York, ON | we are half to blame for spam !!!!! Everyone is crying spam but could it be that we don't take the time to research what we buy or use and the ahole manufacturers use that as thier tool to f us over | |
| patskoo
join:2001-01-02
Fremont, CA | Sell Ads Using Belkin Router | |
| 
Freiheit 09
Cool Chicks Will Dig Me Soon
Premium
join:2003-06-08
Saint Louis, MO
clubs:
| it sucks I just wish that the news we see here would pop-up on all screens of msn and aol users when they log on. Majority of users don't know about this stuff. The majority of users don't even know about the true user-friendly like sites like ths one. I went off topic here, but my point is, if we had more "educated users" belkin and the rest of ***** wouldn't stand a chance. | |
| dave
Premium,MVM
join:2000-05-04
not in ohio | Another bunch of morons-come-lately ... ...that seems to think that HTTP is only used for human-controlled browsers connecting to web sites for shopping. | |
| 
rusdi
American V
Premium,MVM
join:2001-04-28
Flippin, AR
clubs: | Unbelievable!! What genius @ Belkin, came up with THIS brilliant idea??!!!
--
For my Mom | |
| |
Belky
@cox.net
| Rebate from Belkin: Watch Out. You never Get It..!
Asking Tech Support about their boss and how he treats employees and customers.
Consult with Belkin's suppliers to see how they treating partners. You will never believe what you hear: inhuman.
Check their credential before you buy. Stay away from Belkin and its products. | |
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