Nam Vet
Premium
join:2001-12-03
Allentown, PA | YEA ,SELF REGULATION WORKS GREAT
another dog and pony show in DC. |
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PhoenixDown
-- Wants FIOS
Premium
join:2003-06-08
Fresh Meadows, NY
clubs:   | When will they get it?
When will these companies and politicians start to understand that we don't want malicious and obtrusive programs installed without our knowledge on our PC's nor do we want our privacy violated.
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www.shinraonline.com |
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Rhobite
Premium
join:2002-02-24
Cambridge, MA
clubs:
| Regulation isn't the answer
As bad as spyware is, regulation isn't the answer. Software is a form of speech and it's protected by the 1st amendment. Perhaps the ACT of installing spyware deceptively should be illegal, but the mere existence of software that may be undesirable should never be banned. Also, why can't truly deceptive spyware be prosecuted under existing fraud laws? I realize this sets the bar pretty high for prosecution, but there really should be actual damages demonstrated before we go about fining and locking up people for writing certain types of software. Fraud laws are sufficient for dealing with truly bad spyware.
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Jimmysquid.com - I take pictures. |
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dadkins
Can you do Blu?
Premium,MVM
join:2003-09-26
Hercules, CA | Why...
...did I know that they weren't going to do anything? |
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blah194
join:2002-03-04
Lake Charles, LA
| reply to Rhobite
That is a bunch of horsecrap
If someone is writing a program that is specifically designed to enter my computer without my knowledge and either take over my resources or report information that I do not want reported, then that it tantamount to breaking and entering, and that is NOT free speech. |
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mdupont
Premium
join:2004-04-20
Varennes, QC
| reply to Nam Vet
Re: YEA ,SELF REGULATION WORKS GREAT
I do computer service and spyware are causing more and more problems with systems. They are getting worse every day!
Last system i repaired had 28 diffrent spyware prog!
It took 5 utils to clear it!
Look for Norton Spyware remover 2004 on your local store
shelves soon! (the last line was a joke... or was it?) |
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Rhobite
Premium
join:2002-02-24
Cambridge, MA
clubs:
| reply to blah194
Re: That is a bunch of horsecrap
Just as copyright infringement isn't "stealing," distributing spyware isn't "breaking and entering" either. You have no legal right to privacy, and if you accept a spyware license you should expect them to run software on your PC and report on your PC usage. As I said though, if you can demonstrate actual damages and the spyware is deceptively installed, it should be illegal.
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Jimmysquid.com - I take pictures. |
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Beeper
Part Of The Problem
join:2001-09-27
Dayton, OH
clubs:
| reply to PhoenixDown
Re: When will they get it?
said by PhoenixDown  :
When will these companies and politicians start to understand that we don't want malicious and obtrusive programs installed without our knowledge on our PC's nor do we want our privacy violated.
1)When they get handwritten letters and phone calls to their local offices.
2)When an incumbent loses.
Neither one is likely.
--
Guaranteed Fear and Loathing. Abandon all hope. Prepare for the Weirdness. Get familiar with Cannibalism. |
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Sysadmin
NoBama
Premium,MVM
join:2000-07-07
Sacramento, CA
 ·Pacific Bell - SBC
| The government should stay out of it...for now.
I would rather see the government fix the spam law before they mess up and give spyware the same rights they gave the spammers.
I am however, concerned about the spyware companies suing the "little guys" that are taking steps to help us get rid of this garbage on our computers. They cant afford the attorney fees to defend themselves and it could knock them out of business. I'm sure that is exactly what the spyware companies are hoping for.
--
Join Team Starfire SETI@Home
Put your unused clock cycles to work! |
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Karl Bode
News Guy
join:2000-03-02 | reply to dadkins
Re: Why...
Yes, isn't it shocking? |
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linicx
Caveat Emptor
Premium
join:2002-12-03
United State
·CenturyLink
| Do what works best: Boycott
Don't use the product. We need an Internet site where we can submit the name of the spyware; where/how we were infected/ and how/what happened when we uninstalled it.
A couple of years ago I found spyware/keylogger embedded in a very popular genealogical software I bought. Called Aqueduct it had .txt, read me files and .dlls. The read me spelled out what it did and why, but forgot to mention phoning home. When I uninstalled it, it killed my genealogy program, several months of work and several thousand names. Since I belonged to several genealogy sites, It didn't take very long before the whole genealogy community was talking about it and the software maker removed it in the next update. Considering the gross amount of uncontrolled greed and theft surrounding family research I suspect it will be back in said product very soon.
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No windows; No gates; Apple inside |
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Thaler
Premium
join:2004-02-02
Encino, CA
|  Self-Regulation My Foot
"the FTC chief supporting the concept of "industry self-regulation" when it comes to intrusive spyware."
This is again akin to letting the inmates run the asylum here. Has ANYONE seen ANY effort on the part of the adware/spyware developers to make their products less stealthy/easy to uninstall?
Hell and no.
With time, the produts have just found more ways to stealth themselves from the users they leech off of, and have made themselves harder than hell to remove. (24 step WildTangent removal, anyone?) These companies have also gone after sites that are helping users regain control of their computers from their product!
Adware/Spyware companies have made no step in improving relationships with their customers/hijacked audience. In fact, it is in their best financial interest NOT to do so. |
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Oleg
Bellsouth Fastaccess
Premium
join:2003-12-08
Birmingham, AL | Synclock spyware
There is spyware called " synclock" that will set your system clock to the wrong time I just don't see point in this spyware |
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Slidetbone
Mazin Go
Premium
join:2002-11-10
Land O Lakes, FL
| reply to Nam Vet
Re: YEA ,SELF REGULATION WORKS GREAT
Wait until it happens to their PC's and find out that their info got splattered somewhere on the net and also try to figure out why they are getting IQ tests, porn pop-ups and their hijacked browsers open up to iamahorsesbutt.com.
Anything for money, potential votes and for those that lobby for them for all the wrong reasons! |
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Camelot One
Premium,MVM
join:2001-11-21
Sarasota, FL
clubs:
| Good, we don't need more regulation
I'm glad they are going to leave it alone. I don't think government regulation in this case would do any good anyway, the government pretty much sucks when it comes to dealing with technology.
And I am sick of regulation for stupid people. Stop installing spyware if you don't want spyware, or take the time to learn what you are doing.
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AMD 2400+M @2376mhz/ DFI Infinity II Ultra/ 2x 512Mb Kingston HyperX PC3500/ WD 120Gb on serial/ Gainward GF4 4600/ Enermax 465P-VE/Custom water cooler |
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KrK
Heavy Artillery For The Little Guy
Premium
join:2000-01-17
Tulsa, OK
·AT&T Yahoo
·AT&T DSL Service
 ·Cox HSI
| "industry self regulation"
So, they expect the theives, crooks, and cheats to restrain themselves?
I have this idea. How about we forget this whole War on Terror thing and just let the Terrorists know we want them to "play nice" and we'll let them "self-regulate" themselves.
Yeah, there's a good idea.
This Administration is a laughing stock.
--
"Regulatory capitalism is when companies invest in lawyers, lobbyists, and politicians, instead of plant, people, and customer service." - former FCC Chairman William Kennard (A real FCC Chairman, unlike the current Corporate Spokesperson in the job!) |
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KrK
Heavy Artillery For The Little Guy
Premium
join:2000-01-17
Tulsa, OK
·AT&T Yahoo
·AT&T DSL Service
·Cox HSI
1 edit | reply to Camelot One
Re: Good, we don't need more regulation
The Voice of the Clueless barks forth.
"Let them Eat Spyware!"
Actually, that's a bit harsh. I understand what you are saying, however, much spyware these says installs itself illegally without any notice or acceptance from the owner, and even the ones that install as part of some package are misleading or deceptive at best. |
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KrK
Heavy Artillery For The Little Guy
Premium
join:2000-01-17
Tulsa, OK | reply to Oleg
Re: Synclock spyware
I think it's point it to piss you off.
I think someone needs to install it on the machines at the FTC. |
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KrK
Heavy Artillery For The Little Guy
Premium
join:2000-01-17
Tulsa, OK
·AT&T Yahoo
·AT&T DSL Service
·Cox HSI
| reply to PhoenixDown
Re: When will they get it?
said by PhoenixDown :
When will these companies and politicians start to understand that we don't want malicious and obtrusive programs installed without our knowledge on our PC's nor do we want our privacy violated.
I think they know that. It's just for whatever reasons, they *want* to be able to install malicious and obtrusive programs without our knowledge on our PC's in order to steal and learn our private information and make sure we dont have any *privacy*. Whether it be for greed or for power, whichever one, they want it.
--
"Regulatory capitalism is when companies invest in lawyers, lobbyists, and politicians, instead of plant, people, and customer service." - former FCC Chairman William Kennard (A real FCC Chairman, unlike the current Corporate Spokesperson in the job!) |
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asdfdfdf
@xtraport.net
| reply to Camelot One
Re: Good, we don't need more regulation
You're right, it shouldn't be treated as an issue of regulation. It should be treated as a crime. When individuals engage in this behavior it is already treated as criminal. If I sucker you into installing trojan code on your machine by connecting it to a porn download, I would be treated as a criminal. If a 13 year old, with no business affiliation, was to do exactly what these companies are doing the fbi would be beating on his door and confiscating his xbox. If crackers and script kiddies were to start throwing a bit of legalese, in a pop-up, into the proceedings would their behavior suddenly become legitimate? We are talking about getting people to install code that they aren't aware is being installed by techniques of social engineering, that is trickery/deception. There really is very little distinction between this behavior and the behavior of crackers, hackers, people offering chocolate bars for passwords(after all one is offering something of value, a chocolate bar, in return.). There is only one real difference. In this case, business organizations are doing it and therefore rules don't apply. In short, the business community gets by with sleaze no individual would ever get by with.
You say why should we protect the stupid?
Very well. If being unable to adequately protect yourself from sleaze makes you stupid, and if being stupid means that others are justified in preying upon you then why should we be prosecuting crackers who break into secure business computers or government sites? Surely those sites deserve whatever they get since the people running them were stupid enough not to be able to protect them? Why should we "regulate" the behavior of individuals in the cracking community?
There is, as always, a radically different set of standards for the individual citizen. |
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