woody7
Premium
join:2000-10-13
Torrance, CA | Hmmmmm........
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amenite
The Soylent - It's People
Premium
join:2002-11-21
Ridgewood, NJ
clubs:
 ·Verizon Online DSL
| Instability threatened by spyware?
quote:
In late 2003 Dell took an image hit when they told support techs to avoid helping customers with spyware, even if customer system instability was being affected.
Maybe needs rephrasing?
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Time is an abstract concept invented by carbon based life forms to monitor their constant decay.-Thunderclese |
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nozero
Eschew Obfuscation
Premium,MVM,ExMod 2003-06
join:1999-12-29
InnerSanctum
clubs: | May others follow...
Good, I hope other PC manufacturers do the same.
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mwf
join:2000-11-26
Granite Quarry, NC | DUDE!
you need a penicillin shot! |
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J D McDorce
Premium
join:2001-12-29
Westland, MI | reply to amenite
Re: Instability threatened by spyware?
Based on my experience with a Dell laptop, maybe it is okay as written.  |
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Wills
join:2001-01-03
Port Charlotte, FL
| Why?
Why should Dell take an image hit for not helping customers with spyware?
Why should Dell now take the time to create a website and offer popup stoppers and spyware software?
It's pointless.
I have a buddy of mine who just got a computer. I took my time to teach him the menaces of the internet. I explained spyware, adware, popups, malware, blah blah blah. I installed popupstopper. I installed adaware. I showed him how to use each. I showed him how to update adaware.
So far, in the last 2 months I have had to go over to his house three times to fix a "slow computer". I find the same thing each time. Active-X turned back on, popupstopper turned off, and adaware finding 200+ instances clearly not being run at least once a week.
Please explain to me, why I, or Dell, should support people like this that refuse to listen or learn from their mistakes?
It's a waste of time, and in Dell's case a waste of money and resources.
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Abit VP-6 twin 800EB's @ 1002 Mhz.Proud member of the XDC. |
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ParanoiaInc
join:2002-08-28
Tucker, GA | Dell (any PC maker) vs. Microsoft
This IS amusing. If Microsoft tried to offer free software in its operating system to control/eliminate spyware, etc. they'd get blasted, both by the general public and by the department of justice. |
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amenite
The Soylent - It's People
Premium
join:2002-11-21
Ridgewood, NJ
clubs:
·Verizon Online DSL
1 edit | reply to Wills
Re: Why?
Just start charging him $80/hour including travel time, and he'll either get the idea or continue being a schmuck, it's that simple.
edit> I mean, if I were a professional auto mechanic I wouldn't rope myself into free transmission repairs for my friends who can't stop doing neutral drops. Why should the computer be any different? Give them a freebie or two, then for the saps who can't/won't listen and learn it's pay as you go.
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Time is an abstract concept invented by carbon based life forms to monitor their constant decay.
-Thunderclese |
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PinHead
Premium
join:2002-06-19
The Dungeon
clubs: | Dell is in the forums now!
If this is true, it looks like they are setting up specialized techs for spyware.
»180 search assistant
you decide! |
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techwench
I Work For Food
Premium
join:2003-06-26
Sherman, TX
| reply to Wills
Re: Why?
said by Wills  :
Please explain to me, why I, or Dell, should support people like this that refuse to listen or learn from their mistakes?
It's a waste of time, and in Dell's case a waste of money and resources.
I agree.
I work for a small Telco/ISP and a good 60-75% of the support calls that come in are spyware/adware/malware related. 9 times out of 10, we're giving computer lessons over the phone. It takes (and wastes) a lot of time explaining to someone over the phone 1) what spyware is, and 2) where they should go next to get rid of this stuff.
We are not staffed nor equipped to handle every single *ware problem that comes in step-by-step until the computer is squeaky clean. All we can do is give a brief overview of the problem, and where they should go next.
Yes, we piss some people off...probably a lot of people, in fact...but the time and money it would cost to deal with spyware (especially over the phone) is a whole lot more than the measly $15/$40/mo. we would lose should the customer get angry and decide to cancel their service.
P.S. We don't read from scripts here either. |
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dave
Premium,MVM
join:2000-05-04
not in ohio
·Verizon Online DSL
 ·Verizon FIOS
| reply to Wills
said by Wills :
It's a waste of time, and in Dell's case a waste of money and resources.
Well, I expect they're making a business decision.
Either they lose money by offering a service to their 'uninformable' customers, or they lose money by not getting repeat business from those same customers and their friends.
There's no should/shouldn't in action here, beyond the great imperative to make a profit. |
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heels_fan
1.20.09 The start of Socialism
Premium
join:2003-02-07
Columbia, TN
| i know first hand
i used to work for Dell. I was a tech support rep at the Nashville call center. I was there when the whole "no spyware support" thing came out.
From my experience, I would be very safe to say that 70%-75% of the calls that I took was either related to spyware or viruses.
I was taking around 25-30 calls in an 8 hour period, so you can imagine the call volume.
In my opinion, Dell should not worry about spyware on a customers PC.
That is like saying, you buy a brand new car, 2 months later you installed a new cam, or a new carb....You cant expect to take it to the dealership and have them fix it or repair it without aying for it.
What needs to be done is EDUCATE...EDUCATE...EDUCATE the customers
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I have neither the time nor inclination to explain myself to a man that rises and sleeps under the blanket of protection that I provide and then questions the manner in which I provide it! |
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fireflier
Coffee. . .Need Coffee
Premium
join:2001-05-25
Limbo
 ·Skype
| reply to Wills
Re: Why?
Your dilemma is pretty much why I've stopped touching other peoples' PCs when they have issues. I'll give them advice on apps to use and web site addresses to check out, but physically touching the PC? Forget it. Trying to train the average user on what they should and shouldn't do is a waste of time in most cases if there's no financial incentive for them to learn. I stopped working on people's PCs 3 years ago after helping someone set up home networking. I set it up on saturday. On monday they called and said "when you set up networking, it screwed up Excel". I went over, checked their event log and found that the error they were experiencing started on FRIDAY. This kind of cause-effect behavior happens all the time. After my experiences, I believe in the adage: "Do someone a favor and it becomes your job".
As far as going back to help the friend resolve the same issue time and time again, another adage comes to mind: "People can only take advantage of you if you let them." I'd rather have them pissed off at me than have to spend all my saturdays cleaning up after their blissful ignorance. In the days of DOS, issues were usually easy to resolve and seldom had complications. These days, you touch someone's PC and something completely unrelated screws up 4 months later, and guess who gets blamed? I'll advise for free, but I won't touch someone else's system.
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Who is General Failure and why is he reading my hard disk? |
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fireflier
Coffee. . .Need Coffee
Premium
join:2001-05-25
Limbo
·Skype
| reply to heels_fan
Re: i know first hand
I agree that education is an answer, however I think the dilemma is, how do you educate customers who have no incentive to learn? I suppose when they call in for customer support, you could direct them through a web page that walks them through mal/spy/ad/ware analysis and removal before you ever let them touch tech support, but of course there will always be the whiny clueless who'd balk at that and say "Why should *I* have to fix this?" They'll just skim through it, not act on any of the suggestions and wind up at tech support mad anyway.
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Who is General Failure and why is he reading my hard disk? |
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heels_fan
1.20.09 The start of Socialism
Premium
join:2003-02-07
Columbia, TN
| reply to techwench
Re: Why?
i too work for a small cable ISP. And I know exactly what your talking about. When I mean small, I talking we have around 5000 subscribers.
and your estimates are about right concerning the percentage of support calls regarding spyware.
But because we are over-building charter, we have to provide a higher level of support than Charter. Very often we have truck rolls to customers sites to help them clean spyware. And we do not charge the customers (this will probably change in the near future)
But the good thing is, our company is starting to have little classes offered to the public, to help educate, and inform the customer on various topics. One being viruses and spyware
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I have neither the time nor inclination to explain myself to a man that rises and sleeps under the blanket of protection that I provide and then questions the manner in which I provide it! |
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TheMadSwede
Premium
join:2001-01-30
Holland, MI
 ·Charter Pipeline
| Elitist snobs
This is hilarious. Some of you sound like high school students. Perhaps you're overcompensating. If you don't want to help people, fine, but to assume everyone in the world should know as much as you about computers is ridiculous.
The real problem is the spyware itself. If I sent people a free coffeemaker in the mail to "promote my new coffee", but also included a hidden camera in the coffeemaker that would record people's kitchen habits, would you say the people who used the coffeemaker are idiots? No. They're getting scammed. Spyware is the same thing; just a bit more intangible.
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A good idea expressed in a poor manner is a bad idea. |
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antiphishing
Phishing Scam Terminator
Premium
join:2004-06-09
Wilkes Barre, PA
| Dell Changes Spyware Tune
I will sleep better at night knowing that "Dell Tech Support India" will help me when it comes to being educated about spyware. It took them look enough to get with the program.
Now if you could only understand what "Dell Tech Support India" are saying ,then every computer user would be a lot better off.
By the way, in a PC World July 2004 article "Misadventures in Tech Support" (page 137)the magazine gave Dell high marks for Tech Support when it came to knowledgeable staff.
Dell Computer owner
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»www.antihotmail.com
spammers_are_scumbags@antihotmail.com |
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techwench
I Work For Food
Premium
join:2003-06-26
Sherman, TX
| reply to TheMadSwede
Re: Elitist snobs
said by TheMadSwede :
This is hilarious. Some of you sound like high school students. Perhaps you're overcompensating. If you don't want to help people, fine, but to assume everyone in the world should know as much as you about computers is ridiculous.
The real problem is the spyware itself. If I sent people a free coffeemaker in the mail to "promote my new coffee", but also included a hidden camera in the coffeemaker that would record people's kitchen habits, would you say the people who used the coffeemaker are idiots? No. They're getting scammed. Spyware is the same thing; just a bit more intangible.
You're partially right. BUT, at the same time, if people call up the manufacturer of the coffee maker to complain about the camera you put in, the manufacturer is not responsible for your (being the peeper) actions.
There's a fine line over liability that is being drawn here. Some of the larger companies are starting to offer more services to "save face", but it really isn't the manufacturer/isp's fault. They shouldn't be obligated to do anything for the customer if it has nothing to do with the product/service they are offering.
My company offers internet and all that comes with it, good or bad. If you let the bad stuff get you, we will point you in which direction to go next, but we will not hold your hand and we certainly will not do it for you unless you want to pay our standard "truck-roll" fee of $90/hr plus mileage if the customer is more than X miles away. |
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antiphishing
Phishing Scam Terminator
Premium
join:2004-06-09
Wilkes Barre, PA
| reply to heels_fan
Re: i know first hand
_____________________________________________________
I was a tech support rep at the Nashville call center
______________________________________________________
I thought Dell outsourced Tech Service jobs to Bangalore
India?
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»www.antihotmail.com
spammers_are_scumbags@antihotmail.com |
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antiphishing
Phishing Scam Terminator
Premium
join:2004-06-09
Wilkes Barre, PA
1 edit | reply to techwench
Re: Elitist snobs
______________________________________________________
but it really isn't the manufacturer/isp's fault. They shouldn't be obligated to do anything for the customer if it has nothing to do with the product/service they are offering.
________________________________________________________
I would agree with you one hundred percent on this one.
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»www.antihotmail.com
spammers_are_scumbags@antihotmail.com |
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