 N3OGHYo Soy Col. "Bat" GuanoPremium
join:2003-11-11
Philly burbs
kudos:1 | reply to Ender_W
Re: Luxury I second that, and agree with Cod. Broadband is a luxury, all be it, a very useful one.
I see someone above stated that broadband is a utility because a lot of people don't have a telephone, and a telephone is a utility.
I think that's specious reasoning. The telephone has become the defacto medium to summons emergency services, and has been for the past 50 years.
Not too many people are logging on to call the police when a burglar is trying to break into their house, or their house is on fire. |
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Conk2k9
join:2005-04-15
Riverside, CA | reply to npln
Re: most people do not need it If you go to school and everything and practically live off it then it is a utility.
I vote for utility. It use to be a luxury but now everything practically requires the internet. Dialup is way to slow for anything now except email. We are in the information age so it is a utility in this day'n age. |
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 ET TUIts' Only TempPremium
join:2005-05-21
Belvidere, NJ | This is so stupid! As said before todays way of living the big info age
Dr's using internet for surgery etc... video conf. at first a luxury ,But know look at all that is being done
But the best of it all is yet to come.Think of what is going to be in 5 years.What you don't have email,you can get it on our website,hello this is just the tip of the iceberg!!!!! internet broadband is a tool most of all
The companies have to stop gouging our pockets of the last dime some times money isn't the answer that is what is keeping America down in the tech Field putting $$$ first
kills the advancement to a crawl!!! Look at all the other countries passing us by Hey CEO's want to give your company a big profit boost cut your wage by 75% That would be a big boost to alot of company's income I have done it even some services for free
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Yes I am a Doctor and no you still must make an appointment Mors ultima linea rerum est stercus accidit Quando podeces te regi eorum fecerunt? |
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 JRW2R.I.P. Mom, Brian, Ziggy, Max and Zen.Premium
join:2004-12-20
La La Land
kudos:5
 ·Optimum Online
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Re: most people do not need it said by npln:I see it mostly like a luxury, the world was doing fine before it!!! I have it....barely ever use it!!! Utility not really....... A Right......you are kidding right? Many years ago...
People did just fine without PHONES....
People did just fine without ELECTRICTY....
People did just fine without MEDICINE...
Broadband opens up access to information to the masses, and that is a right, it should be treated like a utility, you might be able to argue that at some point, the AMOUNT of bandwidth could be considered a luxury, but it would IMHO be a weak argument... |
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 ylen131
join:2000-02-09
Canoga Park, CA | reply to JRW2
Re: A Right! said by JRW2:said by ylen131:luxury, person can survive with out it You can survive without a phone, but how many people have one, and that IS a utility!! phone can still be argued a luxury, with internet you can use 56k modem,so there is no way for now broadband can be argued is a right |
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| You might be able to argue that phone is a luxury, but it's considered a utility by Government in that is has be available just about anywhere in the U.S.
I think the crux of the debate is how necessary is it to put broadband in the level of importance that the Government should deem it necessary to have it just about everywhere. Corporations depend on it so in that arena the vote is yes. |
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 bokambaChengdu RocksPremium
join:2002-04-05
Falls Church, VA | A utility, not a right I think broadband is best viewed as a utility. It's something that, if it's available, can significantly improve quality of life. It's homogenous enough that as long as people get fast, reliable service for the right price, it doesn't matter who's providing it. I don't think it's morally wrong not to have broadband, which is what calling it a "right" would imply. |
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N3OGHYo Soy Col. "Bat" GuanoPremium
join:2003-11-11
Philly burbs
kudos:1 | reply to broadbanderexpanderc
Re: utility, need and more Not to go off topic, but what is it with the proliferation of unregistered posts lately.
I noticed the unregistered tag no longer carries the poster's ISP info, and such.
Hey, BBR, it's time to do something about these unregistered posts..... |
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| BroadBand is a luxury moving towards utility Back when phone service and indoor plumbing were new, they were luxuries. The very rich had them and the poorer folks made due without. As time went on, more and more people became accustomed to life with these services. At some point, they shifted from being a luxury to being a utility. (Meaning that an average person was able to expect access to such a service at a reasonable rate.)
Broadband is still a luxury, IMO, but it is quickly moving to the utility stage. Many services are beginning to assume that you have high-speed Internet access. This, combined with the growing broadband-enabled population percentage, means that a person without broadband is going to be significantly "left behind" from society at large. I don't think we're quite at that point yet, but in a few years we just may be.
Incidentally, I'd qualify a "right" as something so essential to life that a person cannot be denied access to it and, in some cases, can't be charged for it. (Beyond what you pay in taxes if the government runs the service.)
Indoor plumbing has progressed far enough that it's a right. While you still might have some very rural areas without indoor plumbing, most do and it's virtually assumed to be present. Try selling a home in 99% of the country if said home doesn't have any indoor plumbing. ("A nice view of the city from your spacious outhouse."  ) Broadband definitely hasn't progressed to the "right" stage yet.
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-Jason Levine
http://www.jasons-toolbox.com/
http://www.PCQandA.com/
http://www.urateit.com/ |
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| reply to Brownbay
Re: A Right! It's not a right, it's a luxury..
However, having said that, does it make sense to let the government force companies to build (i.e. The TVA style). I'd say yes.
The government subsidised UNIVERSAL phone service. Can you say that the internet is different? not really. Both were considered 'luxuries' when they started, but today you can't survive without a phone (except for some very rare obscure area's). In subsidizing phone service everywhere, the early adopters were forced to pay more to make up for the unprofitable customers. Do we want to do that again for broadband?
The problem is simply wires. It costs a LOT of money to run wires everywhere. Running fibre to obscure towns, obscure roads in those towns, and widely distributed houses on those roads would be a very very expensive proposition. But is it fair to them that they don't have it? I mean, the government gave the cable and phone companies HUGE subsidies to build out in the populated areas (i.e. right of way, etc). Doesn't that free subsidies give the companies a legal obligation to support EVERYONE then? I would argue yes, since the telco's and cableco's have gotten subsidized by the government, they have an obligation to run wire everywhere.
Of course, this means the shareholders make less money. But, wait, the shareholders made more money due to subsidation, so don't loose any sleep or cry any tears over that loss. It's payback time..
now, if Verizon was SMART, it wouldn't be running fibre everywhere. It's already been proven that about 400 low earth (i.e. 200 miles up, not 25,000 miles up) satellites could provide continuous high speed coverage to the entire country. For 100 billion dollars, a company could build the network, and provide 100mb full duplex service everywhere. We have the technology, we have the capabilities, we don't have the vision..
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Grand Poobah |
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 ChiyoSave Me Konata-ChanPremium
join:2003-02-20
Charlotte, NC
kudos:1 | reply to Jason Levine
Re: BroadBand is a luxury moving towards utility yes it would suck not to have the internet but you DON'T NEED IT your not gonna die from not surfing the net (well atleast not all of us  ) I say luxary item besides stroll down to your public libary if you want to hop on the net ITS FREE.
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"Sure there have been injuries and deaths in boxing - but none of them serious."- Alan Minter, Boxer"I get to go to lots of overseas places, like Canada."- Britney Spears, Pop Singer |
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 LinklistPremium
join:2002-03-03
Longport, NJ
kudos:5
1 edit | A utility - but not a right Broadband should be seen as a utility like phone service or water service or sewer service. But that doesn't make it a right. Many areas of the country have neither water service or sewer service. Those people have to dig wells for water and cesspools for waste output.
To call it a right just plays into the hands of the welfare state advocates who will want the taxpayer to subsidize every welfare household with broadband access. Nix on that.
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 DHRacerTech Monkey
join:2000-10-10
Lake Arrowhead, CA | reply to JRW2
Re: most people do not need it oh, you mean the DARK AGES?
Bubonic Plague and all that? People didn't look like they were doing too fine then.
Sure but the life expectancy was you were lucky to get to 50.
Of course working your ass off in a field for your king probably meant that obesity wasn't a big deal at the time.
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"No one will believe you solved this problem in one day! We've been working on it for months. Now, go act busy for a few weeks and I'll let you know when it's time to tell them." (R&D Supervisor, Minnesota Mining & Manufacturing /3M Corp.) |
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| reply to l33t
Re: Luxury/Utility yes it is a luxury. |
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| reply to kapil
Re: What kinda' question is this? Um ... China has far better broadband penetration than the United States. I'm sure many children in China would consider it a utility. Also, the days of Chinese sweatshops may be numbered. Today, the Chinese government unhinged its currency from the dollar, so pretty soon, hopefully, China's currency will increase in value and imports and exports will be more balanced. That would be good news for citizens and workers in China and the international economy. In some time, one could imagine China trying to modernize its exports (so as to produce cars and jet planes and robotics) thus thrusting itself into the realm of modern global markets such as the United States and Japan (its already on the cusp, afterall. It is the number 2 economy in the world). With a $6 billion, you can believe that the government has some money to spend. |
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| reply to N3OGH
Re: utility, need and more I post anon on here often, you can check other topics and see me there. I live in Washington, DC and my ISP is T-Mobile sometimes, Verizon at other times. I feel marginalized for my mysterious nature! Help! Help! I'm being oppressed.
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 warriorsIt's A Great Time Out
join:2001-06-05
San Jose, CA
1 edit | I say it's necessity! I say it's necessity!
Even though I can survive without it, I just can't live without it. It's like life without a flushing toilet. A few days without might be ok, but I just can't live without it! |
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| Utility It's like electricity or a phone. Sure, you could live without them, but people should have the abilty to have it. |
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| reply to ET TU
Re: This is so stupid! You bring up an interesting point as to why the tech sector throws economics off so much.
Advancement in technology is not always good in the eyes of capital. Even if it is obviously good.
For example, company A produces 16 drugs for cancer type C.
Company As main source of revenue is the 16 drugs for cancer type C. Researcher at company A finds a way turn those 16 drugs into one drug. That one drug will essentially cure cancer type C.
If cancer type C is cured, the company collapses. Therefore, it is good for company A to NOT market the drug (if you are a laissez-fairest above all else that is).
There are many instances where this is the case. The problem is that not every company markets one thing. That is the big problem with the oil industry, in my opinion. Oil produces make a host of products. If hydrogen was introduced as a legitimate energy alternative, those companies would lose those oil profits and many other sectors of the economy would collapse as well, even though hydrogen would be a far more efficient and cheaper resource.
Of course, I don't initially see any connections with that and broadband, but Et tu, your somewhat off-topic rant is appreciated. |
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 ptrowskiGot Helix?Premium
join:2005-03-14
Putnam, CT
kudos:4 | Luxury.... I can see it now, every crackwhore in NYC mapping out their next tricks on mapquest.com
Can't live with out broadband? Good lord! I like it, but food, water, shelter etc is more important.. |
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