  TzaleProud Libertarian ConservativePremium
join:2004-01-06
NYC Metro | Party Line Supposedly my uncle had a party line up until the time he died in 2002. I learned of this yesterday after his wife died from my mom. So I guess the old fashioned shit is still pushed on people. And here is the kicker, it was only 4 dollars less per month. Cheaper for the phone company to just offer that.
Talk about messed up!
-Tzale
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 | | | Re: Party Line "I learned of this yesterday after his wife died from my mom."
Wow, you just confessed that your mom killed her.
Cause of Death: A Mom
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| | | is that only in small towns and in bigger ones they just stop leting people use it? | |
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| | TzaleProud Libertarian ConservativePremium
join:2004-01-06
NYC Metro | Re: Party Line said by Joe12345678:is that only in small towns and in bigger ones they just stop leting people use it? typical central Jersey suburb.
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| | | Just spoke with my great uncle (82 years old) who was told
by Cingular that he needed a new cell phone (he was having
difficulties figuring out why the phone wasn't working).
-- He needed to plug it in --
Nevertheless, he is in a contract for x minutes that amounts
to over 40 cent a minute. Did Cingular, or would any wireless carrier, advise him to get a prepaid cell?
The marketplace in action....
Of course he can't cancel...it would cost a small fortune to sue the cell phone company to do so.
On the other hand, how many people are renting their "Cable Boxes". Equally humorous and likely much larger than the fools that rent their telephones.
Are you one of them?
Talk about messed up!
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| |  PhoenixAZGet A MacPremium
join:2004-01-04
Phoenix, AZ
kudos:1 | Re: Party Line said by xsiddalx:Just spoke with my great uncle (82 years old) who was told by Cingular that he needed a new cell phone (he was having difficulties figuring out why the phone wasn't working). -- He needed to plug it in -- Nevertheless, he is in a contract for x minutes that amounts to over 40 cent a minute. Did Cingular, or would any wireless carrier, advise him to get a prepaid cell? The marketplace in action.... Of course he can't cancel...it would cost a small fortune to sue the cell phone company to do so. On the other hand, how many people are renting their "Cable Boxes". Equally humorous and likely much larger than the fools that rent their telephones. Are you one of them? Talk about messed up! Unfortunately renting a cable box is the only way to obtain digital cable with interactive features for most.
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amungusPremium
join:2004-11-26
America Reviews:
 ·AT&T DSL Service
| incredible. I thought this was phased out entirely, a long time ago.
..goes to show how the telcos are such dinosaurs.
It's unreal that anyone is actually still paying them for this though..
Surely one could find a nice rotary phone at a yard sale, ebay, or leftover from somewhere...
..yeah, hook me up with a red rotary phone, on a separate line plase, directly connected to the President's office. We need the best technology around here, and won't settle for anything less than top of the line. .../sarcasm... | |
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| | | Re: incredible. she could have bought a new phn from walmart every month and still be better off....  | |
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| | | Several years ago, my aunt had a phone put in her lake house. It was on a 10 party line, and the ringer was shared by 2 households. If it was 2 short rings, it was her call, and 1 long ring meant the call was for the other people. | |
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| Reviews:
 ·Bright House
| said by amungus:I thought this was phased out entirely, a long time ago. ..goes to show how the telcos are such dinosaurs. It's unreal that anyone is actually still paying them for this though.. Sadly enough, telco's still charge for DTMF (TouchTone) capability. Even worse is they never bothered to contact the customer and tell them they value them so much, they can keep the phone, as they are no longer rented. I'm sorry, but this is the worst scenario, especially for elderly people who don't know. Mind you they should make it their business, but at the same time, so should the telco for not paying attention to this customer.
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4 edits | I can already hear the conversation Humanist (aka socialist, or dirty commie): Wow, that's kind of sleazy, taking advantage of the elderly.
Free Marketeer: It's their own fault, companies have the right to do anything they want, particularly if I'm an investor, fanboy, or employee! (mmm, granny greenbacks!)
Humanist: Shill!
Free Marketeer: Hippy! | |
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|  GrethorToday Is A Good Day To Format
join:2004-04-14
Puyallup, WA | Re: I can already hear the conversation said by Karl Bode:Humanist (aka socialist, or dirty commie): Wow, that's kind of sleazy, taking advantage of the elderly better than us. Unethical Free Marketeer (Enron): It's their own fault, companies have the right to do anything they want, particularly if I'm an investor, fanboy, or employee! (mmm, granny greenbacks!) Corrected | |
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|  ThrowDemsOutIf you can't convince 'em, confuse 'emPremium
join:2002-03-03
Mullica Hill, NJ
kudos:4 | said by Karl Bode:Humanist (aka socialist, or dirty commie): Wow, that's kind of sleazy, taking advantage of the elderly. Free Marketeer: It's their own fault, companies have the right to do anything they want, particularly if I'm an investor, fanboy, or employee! (mmm, granny greenbacks!) Humanist: Shill! Free Marketeer: Hippy! No one forced her to keep a lease. She was given the choice of opting out in 1985(when she wasn't OLD). She chose not to. Should the company have forced her to buy a phone instead of leasing?
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| | | | Re: I can already hear the conversation No but they should have stopped billing her for the phone that she has paid for several hundred times over.
It should not have been an opt out service. It should have simply ended with customers then having the option to stay in. | |
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| | |  John GaltForward, MarchPremium
join:2004-09-30
Happy Camp
kudos:2 | Re: I can already hear the conversation said by Skippy25:No but they should have stopped billing her for the phone that she has paid for several hundred times over. I think that landlords should do the same thing...once the mortgage is paid off, the tenants should be able to live there for free.
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| | | | | | Re: I can already hear the conversation Bravo for inaccurate comparison hyperbole. | |
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| | | | | John GaltForward, MarchPremium
join:2004-09-30
Happy Camp
kudos:2 | Re: I can already hear the conversation said by Karl Bode:Bravo for inaccurate comparison hyperbole. Hardly inaccurate...
I *REALLY* wanted to point out the Socialist "should" in the post (twice in fact) but settled for the hyperbole instead.
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| | | | wentlancYou Can't Fix Dumb..
join:2003-07-30
Maineville, OH | They do it already. Sure you have to pay your taxes and HOA fees. But you don't pay your mortgage if it is paid off.
puritan | |
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| | |  pnh102Reptiles Are Cuddly And PrettyPremium
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD | said by Skippy25:No but they should have stopped billing her for the phone that she has paid for several hundred times over. I'm surprised no one hasn't called in FEMA to put a stop to this injustice!
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1 edit | Re: I can already hear the conversation said by pnh102:said by Skippy25:No but they should have stopped billing her for the phone that she has paid for several hundred times over. I'm surprised no one hasn't called in FEMA to put a stop to this injustice! Knowing FEMA's quick response somebody might had already call in 1995. | |
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1 edit | How many of those 750,000 do you really believe conciously understand that they're paying insane amounts of money to lease sub-par technology? | |
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| | | | | Re: I can already hear the conversation Check out the tv adds next week... is coming... the class action sue...
Are you between 55-100 years of age? have you been leasing your phn from the telecoms? if so call INSERT FIRM NAME OF YOUR CHOICE.... you may be entitle to a refund.... | |
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| | | | TzaleProud Libertarian ConservativePremium
join:2004-01-06
NYC Metro | Re: I can already hear the conversation said by chemaupr:Check out the tv adds next week... is coming... the class action sue... Are you between 55-100 years of age? have you been leasing your phn from the telecoms? if so call INSERT FIRM NAME OF YOUR CHOICE.... you may be entitle to a refund.... I don't think 55 year olds are old or dumb enough to fall for this. It's the elderly people who are 70 and up who are victim to this type of stuff.
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| | | ThrowDemsOutIf you can't convince 'em, confuse 'emPremium
join:2002-03-03
Mullica Hill, NJ
kudos:4 | said by Karl Bode:How many of those 750,000 do you really believe conciously understand that they're paying insane amounts of money to lease sub-par technology? She had children and grand children to assist her in a better decision. I make sure my parents(in their 80's) aren't getting ripped off. It isn't the job of a business to be a welfare agency for people who make bad decisions.
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| Re: I can already hear the conversation quote:
It isn't the job of a business to be a welfare agency for people who make bad decisions.
But it is their job to take advantage of the elderly by over-charging them for services? I guess that's where we differ. I like justice. | |
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| | | | | ThrowDemsOutIf you can't convince 'em, confuse 'emPremium
join:2002-03-03
Mullica Hill, NJ
kudos:4 | Re: I can already hear the conversation said by Karl Bode: quote:
It isn't the job of a business to be a welfare agency for people who make bad decisions.
I like justice. No, I believe what you like is a paternalistic, socialist state where the government makes all the important decisions for people and protects them from themselves. A state where prices are determined by the government. A state that is anti-capitalist. A state like Cuba and now Venezuela; states that are in the economic toilet or rapidly going there.
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| Re: I can already hear the conversation quote:
No, I believe what you like is a paternalistic, socialist state where the government makes all the important decisions for people and protects them from themselves.
Wow. There you go with the extremes again. I'd like just a functional uncompromised regulatory authority that held corporations accountable for sleazy activity.
Going from that to Cuba is a bridge you're building in your head. | |
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| | | | | | |  R4M0NBrazilian Soccer Ownz Joo
join:2000-10-04
Glen Allen, VA
1 edit | Re: I can already hear the conversation said by Karl Bode: quote:
No, I believe what you like is a paternalistic, socialist state where the government makes all the important decisions for people and protects them from themselves.
Wow. There you go with the extremes again. I'd like just a functional uncompromised regulatory authority that held corporations accountable for sleazy activity. Going from that to Cuba is a bridge you're building in your head. Where does the "regulatory authority" stop then? Does it determine what "sleazy activity" is? What if you don't agree with the authority's determinations of "sleazy activity"? What if, decades from now, it decides that selling for any profit is "sleazy activity"?
I'd say you're the one not thinking far enough ahead. | |
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| | | | | | | | | | Re: I can already hear the conversation quote:
What if, decades from now, it decides that selling for any profit is "sleazy activity"?
Yes, clearly I'm advocating that we outlaw profit. Very observant. | |
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| | | | | | | | | R4M0NBrazilian Soccer Ownz Joo
join:2000-10-04
Glen Allen, VA
1 edit | Re: I can already hear the conversation deleted [repost] | |
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| | | | | | | | | R4M0NBrazilian Soccer Ownz Joo
join:2000-10-04
Glen Allen, VA | said by Karl Bode: quote:
What if, decades from now, it decides that selling for any profit is "sleazy activity"?
Yes, clearly I'm advocating that we outlaw profit. Very observant. Right.... That's exactly what I said. 
And you accused tkjunkmail of creating "bridges in his head"? | |
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See 6 replies to this post |
| | | | | | | |  wifi4milezBig Russ, 1918 to 2008. Rest in Peace
join:2004-08-07
New York, NY | said by R4M0N:said by Karl Bode: quote:
No, I believe what you like is a paternalistic, socialist state where the government makes all the important decisions for people and protects them from themselves.
Wow. There you go with the extremes again. I'd like just a functional uncompromised regulatory authority that held corporations accountable for sleazy activity. Going from that to Cuba is a bridge you're building in your head. Where does the "regulatory authority" stop then? Does it determine what "sleazy activity" is? What if you don't agree with the authority's determinations of "sleazy activity"? What if, decades from now, it decides that selling for any profit is "sleazy activity"? I'd say you're the one not thinking far enough ahead. WOW. Very well said.
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| | | | | | | | | | | Re: I can already hear the conversation Not particularly. It regurgitates a party line on deregulation and makes a bizarre leap to suggest any reasonable regulatory authority would outlaw "making a profit". | |
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| | | | | | | | |  KrKHeavy Artillery For The Little GuyPremium
join:2000-01-17
Tulsa, OK | Re: I can already hear the conversation Isn't it amazing how the leap in logic goes....
"Hmmm Telco shouldn't really be allowed to get away with this" means instantly "You COMMUNIST!!"
ROFL | |
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| | | | | | | fiberguyMy views are my own.Premium
join:2005-05-20
kudos:3 | You don't think far enough ahead, Karl. You want to live in a utopia but it will NEVER happen.
There is NOTHING in life where it says "life will be fair"... there is nothing wrong with this at all. Some regulatory body should determine the price for everything?
Let's take you for a moment. You are obviously involved in technology to a point... you participate here. Let's say you decide that you want to consult. I, as do many people here, feel that $80 an hour for computer technical support is WAY over the top. Enough people complain to a regulatory body and the next thing you know you are being told you can only sell your service for $25.00 an hour, or even worse, minimum wage.
Competition is great! IT is was is supposed to keep prices down.. not government intervention.
The lease charge is on the phone bill. When did these people stop knowing how to read? Go back to their time, trust me, the older generation read MUCH more than todays generation does.
The only thing building in one's head is a utopian society where everything is perfect. Two questions.. 1) how much does such a perfect society cost everyone? and 2) Do you think you will ever see it? why? (because you won't - it's IMPOSSIBLE)
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1 edit | Re: I can already hear the conversation quote:
You don't think far enough ahead, Karl. You want to live in a utopia but it will NEVER happen.
Yet another person who apparently needs to reframe my position to one extreme in order to make it easier to digest and defeat.
Nowhere do I suggest I want a Utopia.
Nowhere do I suggest life should be fair.
There's nowhere I suggest some regulatory body should determine the price "for everything".
I simply suggest over-charging the elderly for antiquated technology is unethical, and our regulatory authority is dysfunctional. Fairly sane and rather correct observation, if I do say so myself.
You clearly are advocating the slaughter of penguins for use in paving American highways! | |
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| | | | | | | | | | | Re: I can already hear the conversation Uh I didn't read all of this arguement but I didn't see Karl post anything bad in the first place. And where did someone get that an authority needed to say it was a sleazy action for them to keep changing the old lady? Is there no common sence anymore? The people at the telephone company should have relized it was sleazy to keep charging her. We don't need an authority to tell us something like this was wrong.
And before someone wants to make a remark saying I said something wrong, Don't cause I am sure I explained what I said directly and clearly. | |
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| | | | | | | | | fiberguyMy views are my own.Premium
join:2005-05-20
kudos:3 | Karl,
you somehow feel that unless you say the "specific words" that you "didn't say it"... That's the way of a politician - happens all the time.
You want a mechanism to correct something you feel is wrong. We don't need that.. a perfect would would have safety nets to catch everything that is "wrong" with the world. THAT, my friend, is a utpoia... perfection. We can't legislate perfection.
The fact is that some people may not get what others feel is "fair"...
You also made comments that they are charging rent for something that is too much for the outdated technology. If it walks like a duck.. it's a duck. Where I come from, that screams someone determining what the price for something should be. And, the way things work in life/the world, they won't stop at telephones. One control leads to another. Isn't that one of the common arguments of the patriot act? It's in the mix! "If they pass a law to go after terrorists, what's to stop them from using it for X?"
If I "clearly advocate the slaugher of penguines for use in paving american highways" then you clearly advocate taking from the rich to give to the poor, Robin Hood. 
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| | | | |  OmegaDisplaced OhioanPremium
join:2002-07-30
Cheyenne, WY
·Bresnan Online
| said by Karl Bode: quote:
It isn't the job of a business to be a welfare agency for people who make bad decisions.
But it is their job to take advantage of the elderly by over-charging them for services? I guess that's where we differ. I like justice. 61 years of age in 1985.
Hardly elderly. (even in 1985).
She simply isn't a smart shopper. It is her fault, let her pay.
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See 31 replies to this post |
| | | | | | And sometimes it is not that easy to get rid of the phone. My mother was being charged for a rental phone and she tried for 6 months to get rid of leased phone and they kept giving her the run around. It took the threat of legal action to stop the charge. | |
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| | | Cod
join:2000-07-05
Kernersville, NC Reviews:
·RoadRunner Cable
| said by Karl Bode:How many of those 750,000 do you really believe conciously understand that they're paying insane amounts of money to lease sub-par technology? If they have the ability to read, then they should understand.
quote from the article:
Skalko said bills are clearly marked, and customers can quit their lease any time by returning their phones.
Strogen says she's not a big fan of her new push-button phone.
"I'd like to have my rotary back," she said. "I like that better."
Just because someone is old doesn't mean they lose the ability to make a decision nor read like the rest of society. If they do, then they souldn't be living on their own but in an assisted living facility.
Caveat emptor
Let the flames begin. | |
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| | | |  DavidI have a son- d3Premium,VIP
join:2002-05-30
Granite City, IL
kudos:68
·AT&T Southwest
 ·DIRECTV
·AT&T Midwest
 ·Google Voice
| Re: I can already hear the conversation New Jersey-based Lucent Technologies, a spinoff of AT&T that manages the residential leasing service, said customers were given the choice option to opt out of renting in 1985. The number of customers leasing phones dropped from 40 million nationwide to about 750,000 today, he said.
that's not bad considering 40m to 750k. Some people just like the fact if it breaks they don't have to fix it. Some people have inline for just this purpose. It breaks they call someone else to fix it.
True, for our purpose most of us can fix the relative's lines and such. But for some people who just don't have anyone else to fix things like this it might be ok for them. Some people just don't have anybody else to take care of stuff like this and they are just as alone till they die. Radiodoc is right people get set in thier ways they can't change it. Remember in the movie "Bruce Almighty" that bruce could not adjust "free will"? well if you cannot adjust "free will" what do you do?
Some people even rent cable modems (true you can buy them) but they figure if it breaks someone has to fix it not them. If I knew that someone would replace my DSL modem for free if I paid them a "rental/replacement fee" I would not mind. After all a replacement modem is not necessarily a bad thing. Some people would rather pay than put up with it, or figure out where to get a new one.
From article:
Skalko said bills are clearly marked, and customers can quit their lease any time by returning their phones.
Strogen says she's not a big fan of her new push-button phone.
"I'd like to have my rotary back," she said. "I like that better."
Now that is interesting, the fact she likes the rotary phone better. Some people just don't like change. Unfortunatley we as geeks and techs have to accept that. Besides, if she likes it better who's to argue with her? Ever hear that old saying "beauty is in the eye of the beholder."?
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| | | | |  N3OGHCertified GLG-20Premium
join:2003-11-11
Philly burbs
kudos:1
 ·Verizon FiOS
| Re: I can already hear the conversation I have an old rotary phone in my kitchen. Partly as a curiosity, partly for nostalgia. It's hooked up to my home phone (it doesn't even have a modular jack, I had to hard wire it in!). I love the way it sounds when it rings.
I also have a 5 GH cordless....
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| | | | | | John GaltForward, MarchPremium
join:2004-09-30
Happy Camp
kudos:2 | Re: I can already hear the conversation said by N3OGH: I love the way it sounds when it rings. I have that same sound as the ringtone on my cell. It is funny to see "younger" people say "what's THAT??"
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| | | | | | hurfyPremium
join:2002-08-06
Spokane, WA | My parents kept the old rotary til fairly recently.
I still use my old Conair Trimline (a exact dup of the old trimlines but touch tone) Not a rotary but quite ancient and well made. And has survived many MANY drops to the ground with no ill effects | |
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| | | | | |  Jon GebWal-Mart Sucks
join:2001-01-09
Howell, MI | Rotary phone ringers will forever remind me of my grandmas house when I was younger. It was some kind of jarring yet cheerful sound when that phone rang in that country farm house.
I can imagine my granda getting snookered by this fee. | |
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| | | |  SarahPremium,ExMod 2002-05
join:2001-01-09
Cambridge, MA
kudos:5 | Re: I can already hear the conversation This happened to my grandmother, she paid thousands of dollars over the years for a rented phone. My father called to cancel her phone service after her death and they actually wanted him to send the phone back. 
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| | |  tsu9
join:2001-08-17
Wheeling, IL | said by Karl Bode:How many of those 750,000 do you really believe conciously understand that they're paying insane amounts of money to lease sub-par technology? If my grandfather was like any of them left, then probably most or all of them. We discovered (back in 2002) that he had been leasing phones that he didn't even use anymore. As in, he'd replaced them with newer models.
When he passed away, AT&T wanted their two rotary phones back (presumably to fleece some more people). We could only find one in the house, and were quoted $75 as a replacement fee for one of the damned things.
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| | |  ChucklesPremium
join:2006-03-04
Saint Paul, MN | said by Karl Bode:How many of those 750,000 do you really believe conciously understand that they're paying insane amounts of money to lease sub-par technology? And how many of the 750k do you think actually look at their bill?
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See 6 replies to this post |
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| | | fiberguyMy views are my own.Premium
join:2005-05-20
kudos:3 | Oh come on now..
Do you know how many time's i've tried to get my 72 year old grandmother to stop paying the phone company for an out-dated rate plan that owuld save her about $17 a month on her bill and she's too hard headed to make a change? Why? her answer is "I don't want to make any changes.. what I have works and I am fine with it"..
Not all old people are dumb,.. not all old people are idiots,.. and not all old people are feable.
As it was said, 20 years ago these people were not old. Stuborn? Sure.. but that's thier fault. You can't protect everyone all the time and I hardly doubt any refunds are in order here either... mandated or not.
I like the analogy of not paying rent to a landloard when the mortgage is paid for. So, I guess cable boxes should be free too? DSL technology is supposed to be paid for by now too, that should be free as well and moved into the socialist column in society as well I guess.
Some how there is this notion that there are laws on what people should be able to sell, not sell, profit from etc when it comes to this kind of thing. "They make enough money"... who decides that? Buyer beware is #1 priority. (I am generalizing, so withdrawl the claws)... SOME areas need protection like in houses and cars... but telephones? 20 years has gone by and people aren't seeing this? It's their fault. I don't want a government stepping in to protect me from being stupid.
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| | | | wifi4milezBig Russ, 1918 to 2008. Rest in Peace
join:2004-08-07
New York, NY | Re: I can already hear the conversation said by fiberguy:Oh come on now.. Do you know how many time's i've tried to get my 72 year old grandmother to stop paying the phone company for an out-dated rate plan that owuld save her about $17 a month on her bill and she's too hard headed to make a change? Why? her answer is "I don't want to make any changes.. what I have works and I am fine with it".. Exactly!
said by fiberguy:Not all old people are dumb,.. not all old people are idiots,.. and not all old people are feable. Spot on!
said by fiberguy:As it was said, 20 years ago these people were not old. Stuborn? Sure.. but that's thier fault. You can't protect everyone all the time and I hardly doubt any refunds are in order here either... mandated or not. 100%
said by fiberguy:I like the analogy of not paying rent to a landloard when the mortgage is paid for. So, I guess cable boxes should be free too? DSL technology is supposed to be paid for by now too, that should be free as well and moved into the socialist column in society as well I guess. Hahahaha!
said by fiberguy:Some how there is this notion that there are laws on what people should be able to sell, not sell, profit from etc when it comes to this kind of thing. "They make enough money"... who decides that? Buyer beware is #1 priority. (I am generalizing, so withdrawl the claws)... SOME areas need protection like in houses and cars... but telephones? 20 years has gone by and people aren't seeing this? It's their fault. I don't want a government stepping in to protect me from being stupid. Perfectly put. And WE dont always agree on things.
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| |  BF69Premium
join:2004-07-28
Camden, TN | No one forced her to keep a lease. She was given the choice of opting out in 1985(when she wasn't OLD). She chose not to. Should the company have forced her to buy a phone instead of leasing?
In 1985 she would have been 61. Maybe not old by today's standards, but in 1985 that was old. In 1985 my grandparents were 64 I was 16, they were OLD. | |
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| | |  KAD ImagingJust Shoot ItPremium
join:2002-09-21
Hialeah, FL | Re: I can already hear the conversation said by BF69:No one forced her to keep a lease. She was given the choice of opting out in 1985(when she wasn't OLD). She chose not to. Should the company have forced her to buy a phone instead of leasing? In 1985 she would have been 61. Maybe not old by today's standards, but in 1985 that was old. In 1985 my grandparents were 64 I was 16, they were OLD.
So then I would presume you AUDIT every single bill you get before paying?? Wonder how timely your accounts are... When you pay for a service, you trust the company will provide that service and nothing more.
I guess you agree that when people cancell AOHELL, they should accept all the charges they get after their accounts have been closed.
Jezz...
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-CK
The victor is the one who makes the next-to-last mistake.
Like Cars? Racing?? Visit my site! SportCompactMiami.com | |
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| | | | wifi4milezBig Russ, 1918 to 2008. Rest in Peace
join:2004-08-07
New York, NY | Re: I can already hear the conversation said by KAD Imaging:In 1985 she would have been 61. Maybe not old by today's standards, but in 1985 that was old. In 1985 my grandparents were 64 I was 16, they were OLD. I hate to break it to you, but the health/mental health statistics for 64 year olds in 1985 is no different than it is now. Are you actually trying to say that people in their 60's were dumber 20 years ago??? That is the most absurd statement I have heard in a long time.
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я люблю медведей! | |
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| | | | | KAD ImagingJust Shoot ItPremium
join:2002-09-21
Hialeah, FL | Re: I can already hear the conversation Err.. I only said THIS part. The block quotes got messed up and did not separate my comments from the thread.
said by me :
I guess you agree that when people cancell AOHELL, they should accept all the charges they get after their accounts have been closed.
--
-CK
The victor is the one who makes the next-to-last mistake.
Like Cars? Racing?? Visit my site! SportCompactMiami.com | |
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| | | | I would expect nothing less from the industry shill mr tkjunkmail.
This woman has a refund coming. (period)
This was CLEAR FRAUD!. | |
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| | | John GaltForward, MarchPremium
join:2004-09-30
Happy Camp
kudos:2 | Re: I can already hear the conversation said by anonpisser :
This was CLEAR FRAUD!.
There was no fraud.
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A is A | |
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| RadioDoc58ef2c0Premium,ExMod 2000-03
join:2000-05-11 | As the article points out, notice was sent to all such lessees in 1985 and they were given the option to quit paying 'rent' and buy their own phone (or even the one they already had) at that time.
That some people didn't exercise that option is hardly surprising. I think it's insane that anyone would pay $600 a month to lease a Cadillac, but they are out there in droves. People will pay for whatever they think has value to them. It's not your place to judge, especially in a "news" item.
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Toolmaster of La Grange.
The Buck Starts Here. | |
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See 17 replies to this post |
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| KearnstdElf WizardPremium
join:2002-01-22
Mullica Hill, NJ | im suprised she wasnt forced out sooner. doesnt it take something extra to support a rotory phone nowdays that everything is done in tones?
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[65 Arcanist]Filan(High Elf) Zone: Broadband Reports | |
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| | | | Re: I can already hear the conversation
No, it doesn't. The switch will still accept rotary pulse dialing. Try it: Hit the hookswitch rapidly 10 times and see what you get. | |
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| | |  Jim GurdPremium
join:2000-07-08
Plymouth, MI | Re: I can already hear the conversation said by Fatal Vector:No, it doesn't. The switch will still accept rotary pulse dialing. Try it: Hit the hookswitch rapidly 10 times and see what you get. The only case where this may not work is a VoIP line.
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Correlation does not imply causation. | |
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| | | | | Some of the newer switches don't support pulse, IIRC. | |
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| bmn? ? ?Premium,ExMod 2003-06
join:2001-03-15
hiatus | Actually, I've boiled their positions down to the root...
said by Karl Bode:Humanist (aka socialist, or dirty commie): Evil, greedy corporations ! Free Marketeer (Randrodes, etc.): Profit first and f*ck the people...
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Ann Coulter doesn't know jack about science...
"Extremes to the right and left of any political dispute are always wrong." —Dwight Eisenhower | |
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| | | | Re: I can already hear the conversation It's a secret, but there's a middle-ground. | |
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| | | bmn? ? ?Premium,ExMod 2003-06
join:2001-03-15
hiatus | Re: I can already hear the conversation said by Karl Bode:It's a secret, but there's a middle-ground. Shhhh... I'm going to have to fire up the grill and buy some kegs to entertain if you keep telling people about it.
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Ann Coulter doesn't know jack about science...
"Extremes to the right and left of any political dispute are always wrong." —Dwight Eisenhower | |
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| |  FiLPremium
join:2005-08-16
Silver Spring, MD
1 edit | Re: I can already hear the conversation so basically, those in favor of the Telco's $14,000 bill advocate ripping off old people. Because that IS what happend...
In a lease, once you've gotten to the point where youve BOUGHT the damn thing it is your renting, guess what? Its yours.
Formulating an Opt Out option and snail mailing it to the ones still renting is similar to me tell you, "ok son, youve got a choice to make, your either in or out!".
Because Im damn well sure the Telco didnt mention to the customer that their phone was already paid off or GOING TO BE paid off in the near future...
That my friends is a rip off.
And Im not to fond of those defending companies that target the public with bogus ass mailings and "warnings" covered up in "YOUR EITHER IN OR OUT!".
Cause thats what it boils down to IMO. The telco ripped off the customer...
$14,000!!!
damn, all of us know that money couldve been well spent on charity, home repairs, etc....uh oh, I said Charity!
(ducks from a crazy Aryan pointin a gun lookin him)
oh, and home girl aint slapping noone unless she wants a lawsuit slapped right back at her! ha! | |
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|  spgGrrrr
join:2001-10-31
NOT Texas! | The Telco didn't rip her off. Since 1985 they were prepared to repair/replace the phone for free as their part of the lease. Is it their fault Western Electric built a superior product that didn't break?
Now we're penalizing quality? I'd love it if my phone would last that long. | |
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| |  nilJava Geek
join:2000-11-27
kudos:1 | Re: I can already hear the conversation Pay $14K for a phone and it just might! | |
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wifi4milezBig Russ, 1918 to 2008. Rest in Peace
join:2004-08-07
New York, NY | The lady is actually mad that they stopped renting it to her As funny as this may sound, if you read the last sentence in the article the woman in question (82 years old) says,
quote:
Strogen says she's not a big fan of her new push-button phone.
"I'd like to have my rotary back," she said. "I like that better."
I guess you cant win them all!
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я люблю медведей! | |
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See 7 replies to this post |
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| | Is this a real news item? "One such renter, Ester Strogen, 82 years old,..."
E Strogen - (estrogen) hmmm, sounds fishy. Is this a real news item? | |
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| | | Re: Is this a real news item? anywho says:
Residential Listings
Strogen, Esther
1101 8 St NW
Canton, OH 44703
330-456-xxxx
Truth IS stranger than fiction when it comes to names. | |
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pnh102Reptiles Are Cuddly And PrettyPremium
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD | What's Worse...? Using a landline or this?
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Only SHATNER is Kirk. | |
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| | What... is this... People just can't let go....
Why don't they just order a rotary phone from ebay????
Then people comlplain aout high phone bills, your kidding me right. | |
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1 edit | Sounds like my grandmother... My grandparents bought a rotary phone through Michigan Bell back in the 70s I think. Roughly 30 years later and my grandmother still (grandfather died 14 years ago) uses it, though at least she hasn't paid for it for several years now. I can't convince her that she needs a new phone despite the fact that it's a static mess much of the time, she likes her volume control and not being able to understand people on the other end half the time. Plus there's the annoyance of menus where you have to press buttons. She can't hear it ring most the time either since she doesn't like wearing her hearing aid. >_
She had a cordless phone 12 or so years ago and it was crap so she never really used it, my uncle has a cordless phone that's at least six years old and that's not so great either, better than my grandmother's old one. But she doesn't seem to understand they've improved a lot more since then, at the very least have a volume setting, are hearing aid compatible and more importantly, you can carry it with you around the house. But many old people just hate change.... | |
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| | | Re: Some people don't know any better said by Jeffrey:my grandfather got taken advantage of by some schmuck because my grandfather thought $150 was the "going rate" to plow 175 feet of driveway in 10 mins. Wow, that is a ripoff. I used to pay the bills for my subdivision and we only paid $200 for snow removal for the entire place.
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What's certain about Darwinism is that it would take less time for (1) a single-celled organism to evolve into a human being through mutation and natural selection than for (2) Darwinists to admit they have no proof of (1) - Ann Coulter | |
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| |  JeffreyWilpon please sell the MetsPremium
join:2002-12-24
Long Island
kudos:3
·Vonage
·Optimum Online
·magicjack.com
| Re: Some people don't know any better said by footballdude:said by Jeffrey:my grandfather got taken advantage of by some schmuck because my grandfather thought $150 was the "going rate" to plow 175 feet of driveway in 10 mins. Wow, that is a ripoff. I used to pay the bills for my subdivision and we only paid $200 for snow removal for the entire place. Tell me about it. When I found out, I asked my grandfather for a description as best as he could do, and spent 2 hours driving around town looking for the guy. Never found him.
Ah well, Karma takes over, and at the time, probably saved me from from being arrested.
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"When you get lost in your imaginatory vagueness, your forsight becomes a nimble vagrant."
[Blog] [Gallery] | |
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| | But she still liked it Many times those agreements also provide for the phone company to work on lines inside the house, something not normally done anymore. For the elderly, its not a bad idea since their houses are usually elderly too. So it means free house calls from a tech. It's not mentioned in the article, so I have to take a guess at what the $29/month acurally buys.
Funny thing is though she misses her rotary phone. I'm not that old, and sometimes I miss those old things sometimes too. You never had to worry about it breaking if you dropped it on the floor..... | |
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| | | Re: But she still liked it "Many times those agreements also provide for the phone company to work on lines inside the house, something not normally done anymore. For the elderly, its not a bad idea since their houses are usually elderly too. So it means free house calls from a tech.
AT&T calls this "linebacker" service and they pull a $2 a month rip for it. The dirty little secret is that inside wiring RARELY, if EVER goes bad, since it's tacked along the baseboard in older installs, and runs inside the wll in newer. WHAT, exactly, is going to damage it?
This is the same slick crap as charging for touch tone (yes, there are STILL places and telcos that charge $2-3/mo for touch tone.
Ma Bell at her money grubbing finest. | |
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| | gao16
join:2006-04-18
Algonquin, IL | Re: But she still liked it How wrong can you be?
The dirty little secret is that bad things happen to inside wirng all the time. When it costs close to $100 for someone from AT&T to come out and tell you that the problem is inside most people wish they had linebacker. Then you tell them that it costs $25 every 15 mins they really wish they had it.
Just like any other insurance you hate to pay for it until you'd be faced with a big bill to repair. Of course if you're disciplined enough to keep money aside to pay the big repair bills you'd probsbly come out ahead not paying for it.
Most people(myself included) aren't that disciplined. | |
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R4M0NBrazilian Soccer Ownz Joo
join:2000-10-04
Glen Allen, VA | According to some of you It seems elderly people cease to be responsible for their own choices after a certain age. The company I work for was paying $250/month for sub-par hosting + 45.00 for email + $25 for "additional web space" + 5 for a domain pointer. That's $305 dollars.
I have them paying $40 for much more features now. Was it the fault of the previous hosting company that they were being ripped off? No.
Old people are still over the legal age if I remember correctly. If they are so gullible, remove their freedom to make their own choices or shut up about it.
Old people have kids, where are they to help them make wise choices in regards to things they don't understand?
I know squat about mutual funds (about as much as old people do about technology). Does that mean the ugly investment firm should be vilified if I make a bad choice in investments? | |
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See 29 replies to this post |
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 tim_kButtons, Bows, Beamer, Shadow, KaseyPremium,VIP
join:2002-02-02
Stewartstown, PA
kudos:8 | some people want to rent-period Some of the guys I worked with tried to talk people out of the phone rental. For whatever reason, the people preferred renting. Blame the telco all you want, the people made the decision. | |
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|  CoronaIt's cool, I'm takin it backPremium
join:2000-03-14
Dallas, TX
·AT&T U-Verse
| Re: some people want to rent-period said by tim_k:Some of the guys I worked with tried to talk people out of the phone rental. For whatever reason, the people preferred renting. Blame the telco all you want, the people made the decision. DO NOT inject fact into this rant against the Telcos. God forbid if the telco had actually changed their service because they thought it was in the customer's best interest there would be an article and rant about that too - and from the same people.
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d00mz | |
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Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS
| Believably Verizon! (er Lucent, er Ma Bell) yd-t-t-t-t-t, rshht-t-t-t, rshht-t-t-ttt, rshht-t-t-tttttt, ddttt, Oh drat, I missed a gosh dar number (click click), yd-t-t-t-t-t, Oh, what was i doing.
Actually, some elder deserve a rotary: they won't be dialing wrong numbers over and over... | |
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 shortcktWatchen Das Blinken LightsPremium
join:2000-12-05
Tenant Hell | What a quaint ripoff! said by Yahoo news article :
Ester Strogen, 82, of Canton, first leased two black rotary phones - the kind whose round dial is moved manually with your finger in the 1960s. Back then, the technology was new and owning telephones was unaffordable for most people. (emphasis mine)
The Strowger switch, which allowed customers to dial their own outgoing calls without an operator, was patented way back in 1891 by Almon B. Strowger. He also invented the pulse-dial telephone to go along with his new switch.
The Strowger Automatic Telephone Exchange Company installed and opened the first commercial automatic telephone exchange on November 3, 1892 in La Porte, IN. The company later became Automatic Electric Co.
In the late 60's you could buy surplus telephone equipment (mostly US Govt war surplus) for next to nothing.
The option to stop renting phones was probably announced once in a small sentence at the bottom of the monthly bill, in language that would need translation for some folks... the entire phone bill would need translation for most.
Charging customers to rent the same outdated equipment that they were bulldozing into the ground by the truckload... the ILECS should get an award for one of the longest running successful scams! | |
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| DolganPremium
join:2005-10-01
Sun Prairie, WI | Re: What a quaint ripoff! Idiots.
The ILECs do not maintain the leases on the phones. They are maintained by Lucent Technologies. | |
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1 edit | Re: What a quaint ripoff!
Ummm...Just WHO do you think, owns Lucent? Why, AT&T does.
As memory serves, Lucent evolved from Western Electric, the subsidiary that MADE rotary phones for Ma Bell beck then. | |
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| | | Jim GurdPremium
join:2000-07-08
Plymouth, MI | Re: What a quaint ripoff! said by Fatal Vector:Ummm...Just WHO do you think, owns Lucent? Why, AT&T does. Not true. AT&T spun off its manufacturing arm to shareholders by creating a separate company called Lucent Technologies. It has its own ticker symbol of LU. The two are no longer connected.
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Correlation does not imply causation. | |
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 RickPremium,MVM
join:2001-02-06
Waterbury, CT | Not to be unsympathetic but I really don't feel sorry for her.
Looking back on many things we all might do in our lifetimes, the time value of money can make them extremely expensive.
Did you ever add up what that MORTGAGE will cost you over 30 years time?
Don't fall over when looking at the number in case you don't know it.
Anything that is rented/leased or financed in some way is generally going to be very expensive. And it's why cash is king. The other factor is simply human nature. Like it or not, most of us as we get older will become much more set in our ways. I've had older relatives where I pointed different things out to them and have basically been told ..thanks, but no thanks for trying to save me anything.
"I know what I want..I know who I want it from..and at this stage of the game..I'm not changing now."
This woman was 60 to 61 years old when the option to change this agreement was there. She didn't take it.
Unless she was senile at which point she should have had a guardian anyway..she made that decision and it obviously wasn't all that important to her to save whatever the difference was.
You also have to realize that long ago..phones were much more expensive. It's comparable to what cable modems used to cost, or any technology for that matter..and why even for myself, at one point it made more sense to just rent it from the cable co. That was true with phones too.
These days..? No, they're a dime a dozen..much like it makes more sense usually to own a modem instead.
But there are surely people out there who do know better..but decide anyway to lease theirs.
Anyways..the bottom line I think is the she's old argument really doesn't wash with me. I've had too many older relatives and found that many times..it's just like talking to a wall. Because they're just too set in their ways.
Just like I will be too I'm sure.
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The life you help save just might be your own Team Discovery | |
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| | I call BS $14000 is Just about 40 years of the lady's **ENTIRE** phone bill. That is a bit different from the actual amount she spent leasing the phone. The lease charges were a few dollars a month as I recall, *STARTING* in about 1982. Before that you had no choice. Your first phone came from the Phone Company. About that time they gave you the chance to buy your phone for about $25, which I of course did. I am still using that phone. It still has the number of where I lived then, too!
Now of course this little old lady has, probably spent $800-1500 for a phone that was probably worth $75 in 1960,
but the difference is qualitative as well as quantitative! | |
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RayWPremium
join:2001-09-01
Layton, UT
kudos:1 | I like my old 501 black boat anchor phone My favorite phone is my old black rotary dial 1960 era telephone. Granted it does not do touch-tone, it is getting kinda ragged, but it does not die, it has very good sound, and it has no batteries.
I can see how the person in question would like it back, even to the point of paying the monthly 'rent'. I tried to keep another one long ago but it was against company policy, even though I had an unconfirmed report that pacbell was destroying the phones instead of letting people keep them after all those years of 'renting'.
I will not get involved in the rights or wrongs about the way the telephone companies do business (even though they are so arrogant that they did not believe they could be blue boxed until one of the mobs bought up the technology), but I remember keeping rotary from 1992 to 1999 at one place just because they wanted to charge me USD1.00/month + taxes and un-taxes to save them money by going to touch-tone (cheaper to buy a $12 switchable phone for sites that needed touch-tone).
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I am not lost, I find myself every time. | |
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| Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS
| Re: I like my old 501 black boat anchor phone Yup, RayW, you are the only one so far in the thread that sees the point I see in all of it. Leaving aside all the business and ethical issues being discussed so vigorously in the other posts, Ma Bell's old black rotary phones were built to last. They may not have been pretty, with personal ringtones and shaped like Minnie Mouse for the kid's room and all that, but damn, they worked. All the time.
dw | |
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 brandonSome truth included in this post.Premium
join:2003-03-31
Hurley, MS | Wait, wait, wait... An 82 year old woman named Ester Strogen?!
If you say that really fast, it's...estrogen.
Not a hoax? | |
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| cptmilesPremium
join:2004-04-22
Swayzee, IN | Re: Wait, wait, wait... What? You haven't heard of her. She married Tester Osteron! | |
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 major marcoRes Firma Mitescere NescitPremium
join:2003-02-13
Stepford, CA | Lucent Screws Its Customers? Really? Say it ain't so! Notwithstanding the unconscionability of charging $30.00 /month for 42 yrs to an octogenerian for a telephone that she could have bought at Target for under $10.00, there is neither a tort nor criminal conduct afoot here.
The question to ask is were Esther Estrogen's family when the woman was paying her monthly bills? Surely someone could have informed grandma of the $30.00 itemization in the monthly billing statement. As much as I despise the telcos for their complicity in the NSA spying scandal, the only ones at fault here are Esther and her family for not paying closer attention to the phone bill.
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Choose Net Neutrality or Lose It
21st C TechnoBarons.
Why Care About Media?
IANYL:TINLA | |
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| pnh102Reptiles Are Cuddly And PrettyPremium
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD | Re: Lucent Screws Its Customers? said by major marco:As much as I despise the telcos for their complicity in the NSA spying scandal, the only ones at fault here are Esther and her family for not paying closer attention to the phone bill. Man, for a second there, I thought you were going to blame the NSA
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Only SHATNER is Kirk. | |
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 53059959Temp banned from BBR more then anyone
join:2002-10-02
PwnZone | you guys are looking at this the wrong way she wanted to keep her old rotary phone so she could hack into the matrix.
duh? | |
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|  DerchPremium
join:2004-10-16
Cross Plains, WI | Re: you guys are looking at this the wrong way Remember, there is no spoon... | |
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Some people don't know any better
