vpoko
Premium
join:2003-07-03
Jamaica Plain, MA | Anon. access to the internet is here to stay
What about library computers, or mall/airport kiosks? It's like saying payphones make it harder to track down criminals. |
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gatorkram
Spelling and Grammer impared
Premium
join:2002-07-22
Winterville, NC
clubs:
 ·Embarq
 ·linode
| BS
Does anyone else feel like all this news is coming out to help kill wifi efforts to bypass the last mile?
Seems like strange timing to me, as we have been getting news about large city wifi plans recently too.
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Give me bandwidth or give me death! |
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Thaler
Premium
join:2004-02-02
Encino, CA
| Please Clarify Two Things:
One, how exactly does WiFi access give brick 'n mortar thieves any kind of an advantage? What, pull over and MapQuest out a getaway route at an unsecure WiFi? I'd imagine that a large amount of the police's workload consists of physical crimes. Yes, cyber crime is out there, but I doubt capping open hotspots will be the cure-all for that department. Nigerian internet scams have been pulled off long before WiFi got popular...why would they be "untrackable" now?
Second, how exactly does one track down someone who pulls up to an open Linksys or whatnot? Aside from physical identification (ie. that strange car parked on the driveway), computers don't leave identifying information about who was there (unless they were dumb enough to type in their name, address, or whatever). You can get a MAC address of who was there, possibly fetch whatever information packets they sent, but what else is there?
Basically, if I'm parked on someone's WiFi unnoticed, how exactly will they track me back to my front door, barring stupid criminal blunders? Or is it these blunders that investigators bank on? |
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BodyBumper
join:2004-06-21
Beverly Hills, CA
| reply to vpoko
Re: Anon. access to the internet is here to stay
said by vpoko  :What about library computers, You just can't walk into a library and use their computer, you should know this.
or mall/airport kiosks? Those airport & mall kiosks like most public kiosks have very limited internet access.
It's like saying payphones make it harder to track down criminals. Well thats because its true.
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"War is peace. Freedom is slavery. Ignorance is strength." |
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manfmmd
Premium
join:2003-01-14
Earth
clubs:
| reply to gatorkram
Re: BS
said by gatorkram :Does anyone else feel like all this news is coming out to help kill wifi efforts to bypass the last mile? Seems like strange timing to me, as we have been getting news about large city wifi plans recently too. It isn't meant to kill PAID Municipal or City wi-fi, since these users must register to use the service. It may however affect completely free and open wi-fi.
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huh? | AIM | Speaker Pelosi?!?...OH THE HUMANITY! |
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raythompsontn
join:2001-01-11
Oliver Springs, TN
| reply to BodyBumper
Re: Anon. access to the internet is here to stay
said by BodyBumper :said by vpoko :What about library computers, You just can't walk into a library and use their computer, you should know this. Well, yeh, you can. I do it all the time when I travel. I find an library and put my name on the list to get access. Well, not my name, but a name. None of the libraries that I have used have ever checked my identification. |
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vpoko
Premium
join:2003-07-03
Jamaica Plain, MA
| reply to BodyBumper
said by BodyBumper :You just can't walk into a library and use their computer, you should know this. You sure can. Of course most will ask you to sign up to reserve your time, but you can put whatever name you want there, librarians don't check ID's.
said by BodyBumper :Those airport & mall kiosks like most public kiosks have very limited internet access. I've never seen a kiosk with limited internet, not one that requires payment anyway. Most airport kiosks (which I'm more familiar with than mall kiosks) give you limited access to the net for free. Put a $5 bill in there and you can access the whole internet.
said by BodyBumper :Well thats because its true. My point is that there's no sense whining about it. Lots of things might technically make law enforcement harder, but you have to balance it against peoples' rights. |
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ArgMeMatey
join:2001-08-09
Milwaukee, WI | Where to draw the line
I agree with the cops.
It would be a lot easier if everyone were just born in jail, and they only let us out once they verified we wouldn't cause problems.
Now, off to Priceline for that one-way ticket to North Korea. |
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Michieru2
zzz zzz zzz
Premium
join:2005-01-28
Miami, FL
| reply to raythompsontn
Re: Anon. access to the internet is here to stay
Yeah, try that crap at the Main library in Downtown Miami. There gonna have a giant foot up your ass because they don't allow "random" users to simply come up and sign.
You either have a library card under your name and showing your state identification or license, or your just flat out denied.
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The only limits we have are the one's we set ourselves. |
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vpoko
Premium
join:2003-07-03
Jamaica Plain, MA
1 edit | said by Michieru2 :Yeah, try that crap at the Main library in Downtown Miami. There gonna have a giant foot up your ass because they don't allow "random" users to simply come up and sign. You either have a library card under your name and showing your state identification or license, or your just flat out denied. That's because you're talking about Miami, which has one of the highest crime rates in America. Understandably, they're paranoid.
On the other hand, go into any town library, and chances are nobody will even notice you're there. |
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Michieru2
zzz zzz zzz
Premium
join:2005-01-28
Miami, FL
| !
Vender's point of view:
It's not our responsibility to secure people's routers. They have the option of doing so, if they don't that's there problem.
Customer's point of view;
They should simply provide mandatory security settings at startup of the device, that way everyone would at least have a custom password.
Cops point of view:
Hell, these criminals have a fiesta with all these sheep who don't secure there WiFi and then they go crying about how they been caught downloading child pornography. The person responsible for letting some psycho child molester have his seek need go to more heights.
Whose at fault?
Vendors/Customers.
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The only limits we have are the one's we set ourselves. |
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Trinijoy
Premium
join:2005-09-12
Brick, NJ
2 edits | Customers all the way are at fault. It's not anyone's issue but there own because they do NOT EDUCATE THEMSELVES about something. Nor is it anyones fault that they don't read the manual or the warnings.
That's like saying "OMG my meal didn't come out good, because they didn't tell me I needed an oven." Umm, no.
There is a big problem in this world, where people have a hard time blaming themselves, it's always someone else's fault.
Again, would you buy a car before even test driving it or learning what it can and cannot do? ABSOLUTELY NOT, you just don't jump in the car and say "Yup i want it, i don't what it looks like, what color it is, what engine, just give it to me and I am on my way." |
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tshirt
Premium,MVM
join:2004-07-11
Snohomish, WA
 ·Comcast
| reply to Thaler
Re: Please Clarify Two Things:
Not the brick 'n mortar thieves who still will be traced by conventional methods, but what about sex offender contacting children from an unknown location?
At least a library, kiosk, or payphone has a known tracable physical location where conventional methods (witnesses, survalance tapes, fingerprints, etc)can be applied with open wide area wi-fi the offender could be anyone, anywhere in range.
Any open system gives freedom, and freedom carries riskswhich need to be ascessed and some will need to be addressed.
just because it is a public system, and allows free use doesn't mean the couldn't require some identifiable login proceedure. ie before any use free or otherwise you would need to go to some public office (police, fire station, city hall, library and provide verifiable photo ID (to be recorded) to recieve a login ID and password.
Should your ID be implicated in a crime, you would be traceable. |
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ooluser
@optonline.net | Does it matter?
There are programs out there that can break into an encrypted wireless network within the hour. So if the person doing criminal activity is smart enough, encryption shouldn't be a problem. |
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BodyBumper
join:2004-06-21
Beverly Hills, CA
| reply to vpoko
Re: Anon. access to the internet is here to stay
said by vpoko :said by Michieru2 :Yeah, try that crap at the Main library in Downtown Miami. There gonna have a giant foot up your ass because they don't allow "random" users to simply come up and sign. You either have a library card under your name and showing your state identification or license, or your just flat out denied. That's because you're talking about Miami , which has one of the highest crime rates in America. Understandably, they're paranoid. No, they require us to sign up for an libary card which requires a valid form of ID here as well.
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"War is peace. Freedom is slavery. Ignorance is strength." |
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vpoko
Premium
join:2003-07-03
Jamaica Plain, MA
| said by BodyBumper :said by vpoko :said by Michieru2 :Yeah, try that crap at the Main library in Downtown Miami. There gonna have a giant foot up your ass because they don't allow "random" users to simply come up and sign. You either have a library card under your name and showing your state identification or license, or your just flat out denied. That's because you're talking about Miami(spoiler) No, they require us to sign up for an libary card which requires a valid form of ID here as well. Ok, I guess it varies. In my old town of Sharon, MA (I've never used the library in my current town) you could just walk in and use the computer.
It's a moot point anyway, pay kiosks sure as heck don't ask you for ID. |
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Thaler
Premium
join:2004-02-02
Encino, CA
| reply to tshirt
Re: Please Clarify Two Things:
said by tshirt :Not the brick 'n mortar thieves who still will be traced by conventional methods, but what about sex offender contacting children from an unknown location? Aren't payphones just the same for sex offenders? Or mail? Just because a message is sent from a public terminal or resource, doesn't mean you know 100% who sent it.
said by tshirt :At least a library, kiosk, or payphone has a known traceable physical location where conventional methods (witnesses, survalance tapes, fingerprints, etc)can be applied with open wide area wi-fi the offender could be anyone, anywhere in range. Again, aren't all those true in terms of WiFi as well? Cars leave tracks, witnesses may see something, etc. Those methods seem just as fallible as the brick-n-mortar methods of payphones, kiosks, etc. |
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Warez_Zealot
Rural land of the rising sun
join:2006-04-19
japan
| reply to BodyBumper
Re: Anon. access to the internet is here to stay
said by BodyBumper :said by vpoko :What about library computers, You just can't walk into a library and use their computer, you should know this. Yeah you can.. You could also walk into a college and use the open access labs without any passwords or people questioning you..
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The meek shall inherit the earth but don't forget the poor are the ones who inherit the debt. |
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dadkins
Can you do Blu?
Premium,MVM
join:2003-09-26
Hercules, CA | DUH!
"Car 21, 802.11b in progress." LMAO!
History repeats itself, huh?
»Re: Priorities
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Think outside the Fox... Opera |
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peter_m
Premium
join:2005-07-13
Canada, QC
| reply to vpoko
Re: Anon. access to the internet is here to stay
ALL, as in every single library I've been to doesn't require ID, or a password to access the net. Even University LANs are wide open, just stick your ethernet cable in and you're in business. It's a big security hole that needs to be addressed. Same applies for coffee shop WiFi. They should issue passwords based on supplied ID and accurate logs should be kept... well... accurately...
Now the real question is: Do you trust any of these bozos to not fumble and give out the wrong name/ID when authorities come asking for it???? |
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