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Comments on news posted 2007-10-01 13:06:18: Roughly 30,000 broadband users have either been sued by the RIAA, or agreed to settle in advance of a lawsuit -- the RIAA making that easy by designing a new insta-settlement website. ..

page: 1 · 2

Oleg
Bellsouth Fastaccess
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join:2003-12-08
Birmingham, AL

First RIAA Lawsuit Heads to Trial

$3000 is not much,but i would not want to pay even $1.00 to RIAA

Hazeleyze

join:2003-05-09
Wauseon, OH

Re: First RIAA Lawsuit Heads to Trial

Exactly why I don't buy music anymore. If they lose the DRM, then I will consider it again.

I would think that if she can prove that Best Buy removed the HD on their own and that she didn't ask them to do it, she should be in the clear. Who knows? Maybe they'll start accusing Best Buy of conspiracy then.
mlundin

join:2001-03-27
Lawrence, KS

Re: First RIAA Lawsuit Heads to Trial

I don't event think she needs to do that. Granted this is civil court and the burden of proof isn't the same as criminal court, the RIAA is still missing that key evidence. The RIAA is making the claim, so it's on them to make a case. If I'm a juror and you can't prove to me that someone actually did steal from you, I'm never going to rule in your favor. On the other hand, if they can prove it another way, she's f***ed.
mAlfunkti0n

join:2003-12-16
Loveland, OH
said by Hazeleyze:

If they lose the DRM, then I will consider it again.
Guess it's time to consider it then.

»tinyurl.com/2c6rlt

Oleg
Bellsouth Fastaccess
Premium
join:2003-12-08
Birmingham, AL
They even have had a case where 80 years old person never owned a computer they just picked IP address that someone used a long time ago.
mrschwarz

join:2001-12-01
Flower Mound, TX

Re: First RIAA Lawsuit Heads to Trial

said by Oleg:

They even have had a case where 80 years old person never owned a computer they just picked IP address that someone used a long time ago.
If they don't have a computer, where did they pick up the IP address, Winn-dixie?
lemonade

join:2003-12-13
Los Angeles, CA

hope the mother win

if i don't have much asset, for example being a broke college student, i will seek a good lawyer who will take the case for free, of course he gets a portion of the settlement if we win... well assuming we have a good case

BillTager

join:2000-09-20
Charlotte, NC

Re: hope the mother win

said by lemonade:

if i don't have much asset, for example being a broke college student, i will seek a good lawyer who will take the case for free, of course he gets a portion of the settlement if we win... well assuming we have a good case
What settlement are you talking about? She is being sued by the RIAA. If she wins, she doesn't have to pay anything, but she doesn't get any kind of settlement.
howrman

join:2000-07-08
Philadelphia, PA

1 edit

First RIAA Lawsuit Heads to Trial

The "loss" of the hard drive is very bad for the defendant. It allows the jury to infer that she destroyed the hard drive because it contained incriminating evidence. That helps the RIAA establish liability and, perhaps more importantly, it makes the defendant look bad to the jury. Moreover, the story about Best Buy replacing the drive without the defendant's permission shortly after she received a letter from the RIAA just doesn't ring true to me. As a result, my guess is that, this case may make some good law for the RIAA.

woody7
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join:2000-10-13
Torrance, CA

Re: First RIAA Lawsuit Heads to Trial

you could change your own drive and who would know. Wouldn't they have to get a subpoena to get the contents of the hard drive? I wouldn't infer that she was hiding anything. The way windows works and the time frame, it is not out of the ordinary for this to happen.And the geek squad are idiots any way. Isn't it incumbent upon the riaa to prove their case, than just state they "uploaded"? You can subpoena my hard drive, but mine are all removable anyway, not that I upload
--
BlooMe

Pirate515
Premium
join:2001-01-22
Brooklyn, NY

Re: First RIAA Lawsuit Heads to Trial

said by woody7:

Isn't it incumbent upon the RIAA to prove their case, than just state they "uploaded"?
Depends on whether this is a criminal or civil case. If it it the former, then indeed the prosecutor must prove that the defendant is guilty beyond a reasonable doubt. However, civil cases (and I think this case is a civil one) are decided on preponderance of evidence. In other words, whoever's side does a better job proving themselves wins.

What I'm really wondering about is whether this case is being heard by a judge or jury. If this is going to a jury, I wonder how many RIAA fanboys are sitting on it? Quite a few jurors usually see cases like these as "David vs. Goliath", where a big fat corporation that just cannot get enough money is trying to shake down a hardworking lady who is struggling to support her family, and regardless of the evidence, guess who they are going to side with?
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Ahrenl

join:2004-10-26
North Andover, MA

Re: First RIAA Lawsuit Heads to Trial

It's absolutely a civil case. First and foremost, there is no criminal copyright law. Secondly, the RIAA is bringing the case, only the government can bring a criminal case. You can't criminally charge someone else, you have to have the DA do it.

Finally, I'm sure the RIAA has some vague IP sniffer data that nobody on the jury will understand, that the defendants lawyer will have to try and debunk. That will most certainly result in that glased eye look you get from the majority of people when you mention any type of computer process.

The icing for the RIAA is that they can blame failure on the "suspicious" disappearence of the defandants HD. So they don't have to worry about creating negative case law.

tc1uscg

join:2005-03-09
Saint Clair Shores, MI

Re: First RIAA Lawsuit Heads to Trial

said by Ahrenl:

It's absolutely a civil case. First and foremost, there is no criminal copyright law. Secondly, the RIAA is bringing the case, only the government can bring a criminal case. You can't criminally charge someone else, you have to have the DA do it.

Finally, I'm sure the RIAA has some vague IP sniffer data that nobody on the jury will understand, that the defendants lawyer will have to try and debunk. That will most certainly result in that glased eye look you get from the majority of people when you mention any type of computer process.

The icing for the RIAA is that they can blame failure on the "suspicious" disappearence of the defandants HD. So they don't have to worry about creating negative case law.
In that case, the judge will toss it out of court due to lack of evidence and they have the burden to prove she told BB to remove it. Maybe she never heard of the program "kill disk" or maybe she did. Played stupid and BB fell for it, swapped out her HD. Regardless. Evidence is circumstantial and without the drive, that's about as far as it will go. Think they can make her take a poly?
Ahrenl

join:2004-10-26
North Andover, MA

Re: First RIAA Lawsuit Heads to Trial

Naah, Civil case only requires a preponderance of evidence. That means they basically just have to prove that there's a better than not chance that she downloaded something.

Also, it would get tossed from lack of evidence in the Grand Jury deliberation, which, if this is going to trial, has already happened.

Doctor ASCAP

@wideopenwest.com

Re: Oh! Yes, Copyright Infringements Can be Criminal

I at one time was involved with suing individuals and there businesses in Federal Court for copyright infringements. And yes, Copyright Infringements Can be Criminal...

United States v. Paramount Pictures, Inc., 334 U. S. 131,
158 (1948). And deliberate unlawful copying is no less an
unlawful taking of property than garden-variety theft.
See, e.g., 18 U. S. C. §2319 (criminal copyright infringement); §1961(1)(B) (copyright infringement can be a predicate act under the Racketeer Influenced and Corrupt
Organizations Act); §1956(c)(7)(D) (money laundering
includes the receipt of proceeds from copyright infringement).
Ahrenl

join:2004-10-26
North Andover, MA

Re: Oh! Yes, Copyright Infringements Can be Criminal

Well that's case law against a corporate entity. Which I would assume would mean they were selling copyrighted material. Which is actually stealing. There's no legislated criminal law on the books for making a copy of something, with no money changing hands. Case law should only be viewed narrowly, especially because it is so often over-turned.
howrman

join:2000-07-08
Philadelphia, PA
said by woody7:

you could change your own drive and who would know.
It's very easy to figure out when a hard drive has been formatted/installed.

woody7
Premium
join:2000-10-13
Torrance, CA

Re: First RIAA Lawsuit Heads to Trial

It doesn't matter when the drive was changed, my point was that is they are just stating the an ip addy was used to upload/download music without any other proof. Is that enough in it's self to win?
--
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Ahrenl

join:2004-10-26
North Andover, MA

Re: First RIAA Lawsuit Heads to Trial

It depends what she has to defend herself. Remember, they only have to be 51% right. There's really no innocent until proven guilty in Civil court, since both sides are technically citizens.
Hanko

join:2001-12-28
Eatonville, WA
Just change the date and time in the bios before you add in the HD and make sure the HD was manufactured before the Date and time you specify..

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said by howrman:

said by woody7:

you could change your own drive and who would know.
It's very easy to figure out when a hard drive has been formatted/installed.
i can set my time in my bios to an date before hand

so nice try

Uncle Paul

join:2003-02-04
USA
kudos:1
Wouldn't part of the process look at the methods the RIAA used to legally obtain the user's information and documentation that the RIAA uses to determine if the end user did indeed infringe or cause monetary harm to them?

And if it did cause monetary harm how that amount was derived?
howrman

join:2000-07-08
Philadelphia, PA

Re: First RIAA Lawsuit Heads to Trial

The RIAA's proof will consist of documentation that, at a specified date and time, IP address xxx.xxx.xxx.xxx was sharing a song whose rights have been assigned to the RIAA. Further, the RIAA will produce proof from the defendant's ISP that, at the time of the alleged infringement, that IP address belonged to the defendant. Lastly, (and most problematic) the RIAA will have to prove that the defendant had control of the computer when the alleged infringement occurred. That should constitute a prima facia case. Since the hard drive was lost by the plaintiff, the RIAA cannot and will not have to show that the protected song and sharing software existed on the hard drive.

Uncle Paul

join:2003-02-04
USA
kudos:1

Re: First RIAA Lawsuit Heads to Trial

I'm just curious.. I could say, create a song sharing web site and log all the visitors there. Take a random sampling of my web logs, dummy a tool, screen shots what have you allege visitor xx was hosting a song...

I'm asking because I'm no lawyer....

How can they prove how many people actually got a file from her?

I mean wouldn't that be like a police officer pulling you over for doing 40 in a 35 and fining you for 200 in a 35 because you're in a car capable of the speed?
howrman

join:2000-07-08
Philadelphia, PA

Re: First RIAA Lawsuit Heads to Trial

It's illegal to offer a song for downloading, even if nobody took the defendant up on her offer. The number of times a song was actually downloaded is only relevant to the extent that it bears on the RIAA's actual damages. However, I suspect that the RIAA will seek only statutory damages (i.e. the amount specified in the statute). If so, the RIAA won't have to prove that it had any actual damages. Statutory damages are set precisely because it may be difficult or impossible for a plaintiff to prove actual damages.
rradina

join:2000-08-08
Chesterfield, MO

Re: First RIAA Lawsuit Heads to Trial

I'm not doubting you but do you have a link to the statute? I'd like to read it.
Couch Potato
What?
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Evansville, IN
If they can't prove they have any actual damages then how/why are they entitled to anything ?!
Ahrenl

join:2004-10-26
North Andover, MA

Re: First RIAA Lawsuit Heads to Trial

Because they paid, before hand, to have it in the statue. I believe it's $700-$150k per song. That's quite a gap eh?
rradina

join:2000-08-08
Chesterfield, MO
What's the case? Illegally possessing, illegally sharing or both? If they are trying to prove she illegally shared the song, does the sharing software she used contain a download counter? Is that what they will use for proof that it was downloaded x times?

If they cannot prove how many people downloaded it, then I agree. In fact, I think it's even worse. It's like owning a really fast car doing 35 in a 35. The cop assumes you are guilty because you drive a really fast car and he knows you have been speeding even if you aren't speeding now...

But -- this is a civil case where the burden of proof is not as strict as criminal. (i.e. The glove doesn't have to fit!)

LordFlux

join:2005-04-20
Warner Robins, GA
I agree. Also the fact that the songs were traced back to the Kazaa name 'tereastarr'... and it just so happens that her MySpace account is 'tereastarr'.

Ouch. As much as I hate the RIAA and their tactics, it certainly looks like they did their homework on this one.

Shamayim
I already have a Messiah.
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join:2002-09-23

Re: First RIAA Lawsuit Heads to Trial

There's always jury nullification.

morbo
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Re: First RIAA Lawsuit Heads to Trial

who told you about that???

JoeOnSunset
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Re: First RIAA Lawsuit Heads to Trial

Morbo laughs at the twelve puny humans who try to decide the validity of the law.

morbo
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2 edits

Re: First RIAA Lawsuit Heads to Trial

Morbo: “Morbo will now introduce tonights candidates. Puny human number one, puny human number two and Morbo’s good friend Richard Nixon.”

Nixon: “Hello Morbo. How’s the family?”

Morbo: “Belligerent and numerous.”

Nixon: “Good man, Nixon’s pro-war and pro-family.”
Sammer

join:2005-12-22
Canonsburg, PA
said by howrman:

The "loss" of the hard drive is very bad for the defendant.
I agree although the jury doesn't have to infer her intent. They only have to determine if it is more likely than not that the missing hard drive contained the infringing content.
ross

join:2000-08-16
said by howrman:

The "loss" of the hard drive is very bad for the defendant. It allows the jury to infer that she destroyed the hard drive because it contained incriminating evidence. That helps the RIAA establish liability and, perhaps more importantly, it makes the defendant look bad to the jury. Moreover, the story about Best Buy replacing the drive without the defendant's permission shortly after she received a letter from the RIAA just doesn't ring true to me. As a result, ny guess is that, this case may make some good law for the RIAA.
Pretty big assumption, since you don't know if the Geek Squad will testify that the drive was replaced and destroyed because it was defective, and they had a "blanket" repair order! I wouldn't allow the plaintiff to assert the absence of evidence is itself "evidence" of wrongdoing without substantial proof that the "missing" evidence was knowingly destroyed by the defendant.

The only good law that could come out of any such litigation would be a ruling that the RIAA filed without sufficient corroborating evidence to establish a reasonable belief the defendant violated their copyrights, or to sustain an objective judgment in their favor, along with an award of attorneys fees and court costs to the defendant.
WirelessMajr
Premium
join:2005-08-03
College Place, WA
With regards to Geeksquad/BestBuy, having worked in Geeksquad...

It all depends on what was wrong with the unit when it was checked in, or what the computer was brought in for. If it was brought in because it had a heavy spyware/virus infection (highly likely), and the drive failed diagnostics tests, then (under warranty) the drive would be replaced (under terms of warranty).

If that was the case, and the BestBuy to which she took her machine did not return the customer her drive, then the customer is not at fault.

supergirl

join:2007-03-20
Pensacola, FL
said by howrman:

The "loss" of the hard drive is very bad for the defendant. It allows the jury to infer that she destroyed the hard drive because it contained incriminating evidence. That helps the RIAA establish liability and, perhaps more importantly, it makes the defendant look bad to the jury. Moreover, the story about Best Buy replacing the drive without the defendant's permission shortly after she received a letter from the RIAA just doesn't ring true to me. As a result, my guess is that, this case may make some good law for the RIAA.
The plaintiff only has to assert "spoilation" on the defendant's part. The woman had a duty to preserve the evidence (the HD). Judges aren't too sympathetic to a party that spoils possible evidence. Judges have even thrown the book at parties in a lawsuit that spoiled evidence that had nothing to do with the case since it made them look guilty.

Why the RIAA isn't arguing spoilation in a summary judgement request (motion) is beyond me.
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fAcEtIOUs
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1 edit
»www.marketwatch.com/news/story/j···DB981%7D
A federal-court jury on Thursday found a Minnesota woman infringed on copyrighted material by sharing music files over the Internet in the first such case to go to trial.

Jammie Thomas had been sued by six record companies in U.S. District Court in Duluth, Minn., in 2006 for sharing songs by artists such as Destiny's Child and Green Day via the popular online service Kazaa.

A jury on Thursday ordered Thomas to pay $9,250 for each of 24 of those songs, for a total of $222,000, according to court filings.
An extensive discussion of the jury results can be found in this news item:
»www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=···er=japan

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Ahrenl

join:2004-10-26
North Andover, MA

Re: **BREAKING NEWS** RIAA Wins lawsuit

I'm not terribly surprised.. What was her defense?

"I didn't do it.. "

jchambers28

join:2007-05-12
Alma, AR

1 edit

i would not evey show up to court

its not a crime therefore they can suck my d*ck

Mike
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Pittsburgh, PA

Re: i would not evey show up to court

... today's episode of keeping it real goes wrong.
Sammer

join:2005-12-22
Canonsburg, PA
said by jchambers28:

its not a crime therefore they can suck my d*ck
There would be a default judgement for the plaintiff and you would lose.

fAcEtIOUs
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said by jchambers28:

its not a crime therefore they can suck my d*ck
Don't show up and they get a default judgement. They then can take your house(in most states), garnishee your wages, and make your life miserable. Only a moron wouldn't show up for the trial.
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Re: i would not evey show up to court

said by fAcEtIOUs:

said by jchambers28:

its not a crime therefore they can suck my d*ck
Don't show up and they get a default judgement. They then can take your house(in most states), garnishee your wages, and make your life miserable. Only a moron wouldn't show up for the trial.
damn thay can have the house it;s worth nothing

(more is owned then it's worth)
margaf77

join:2000-12-22
Bayonne, NJ

One more reason to never buy music again

I havent bought music in years and will never buy again. Every piece of music I have has been obtained using "alternative" methods.

Jason Levine
Premium
join:2001-07-13
USA

Re: One more reason to never buy music again

At most, it's one more reason not to buy music from RIAA members. Not all music comes from RIAA members or from people who approve of the RIAA's tactics.

Barenaked Ladies, for example, left their label a few years back because (among other reasons) they didn't like that their label was suing fans. Now they sell their songs online with no DRM under an independent label.

I've gotten quite a bit of music (123 songs) for very little money ($10.38) by buying music from AmieStreet.com. You could also go to eMusic.com. I've heard they have a good selection. (Personally, though, I don't like the monthly charges. Some months I'm just not in a "hunt for new music" mood.)

Buying music from non-RIAA labels helps take down the RIAA much more than not buying music at all. First of all, it supports good musicians and shows other musicians that they can sell their music online without being shackled to the RIAA. Secondly, it bypasses the "main" recording industry middleman in a way that they can't counter with lawsuits. (Go ahead, RIAA, and sue me for downloading Marina V songs from Amie Street!)
jasso

join:2004-11-15
Chico, TX

1 edit

Re: One more reason to never buy music again

There's one big problem, in the United States, the RIAA has been given the right to collect royalties in the name of ANY artist.

Jason Levine
Premium
join:2001-07-13
USA

Re: One more reason to never buy music again

That's a separate issue as it only applies for performances of songs. So if you broadcast Enter the Haggis' "The Barfly" on your Internet Radio station, SoundExchange (formed by the RIAA) will come asking for royalties. Even though Enter the Haggis isn't part of any RIAA member label, SoundExchange will demand to collect the royalties assuming that Enter the Haggis will go to them to get their royalty check. (And if they don't, SoundExchange might just quietly pocket the cash.)

This is completely unfair as there is no reason why SoundExchange should be given the right to collect royalties to songs they don't own the copyright to nor were given permission to collect on. However, as I said before, it's a separate issue from buying music. Why should wrong actions by SoundExchange mean that I shouldn't purchase music by a band completely unconnected to SoundExchange/RIAA?

LOLRIAA

@verio.net

Ok I keep it on then! lol

Can I avoid this lawsuit if I immediately delete the illegal music and file-trafficking service from my computer?

No. Furthermore, once litigation becomes a possibility, deleting music files or the P2P service from your computer would violate your obligation to preserve evidence.

phoneboy3

@shawcable.net

I don't think so!

hmmmmmm,

Single native American mother of 2. That's perfect!

Yea, they are going to throw the book at her over "allegedly" downloading music......I DON'T THINK SO!

I'd call the RIAA's bluff with that hand any day! They have already done the math and know they can't win in the court of public opinion! They will make this quietly go away somehow.

If all these people they are threatening with lawsuits stood up to the RIAA this whole stunt would be over tomorrow. No way the RIAA would spend money on 30,000 individual lawsuits. NO WAY!

53059959
Temp banned from BBR more then anyone

join:2002-10-02
PwnZone

Re: I don't think so!

yeah you think they would go after some greasy 30 year old who still lives in his parents basement, but oh no wait-they are years ahead of the riaa. ahahah!

riaa will just end up getting it dismissed without prejudice and they will succeed in ruining her life on way or another
ncbill
Premium
join:2007-01-23
Winston Salem, NC
Single Native American mother of 2...

Isn't she judgment-proof already?

I bet her earnings are too low for garnishment.

Probably no house or other attachable assets.

imanogre

join:2005-11-29
Mcdonough, GA

Re: I don't think so!

If she doesn't have any assets, she probably can't afford a good lawyer. And therefore this case will be an easy win for the RIAA... and therefore set precedence for any new cases brought to court.

elios

join:2005-11-15
Springfield, MO

Re: I don't think so!

no theres TONS of them that will take the case free just to stick it to the RIAA

imanogre

join:2005-11-29
Mcdonough, GA

Re: I don't think so!

said by elios:

no theres TONS of them that will take the case free just to stick it to the RIAA
Too bad one of these lawyers didn't step up to the plate. Her lawyer's defense SUCKED.

As I said, this just sets precedence for any future lawsuits.

brut7

join:2000-10-06
Babylon, NY

Punishment should fit the crime.

I feel that if someone downloads tunes or movies, their should be no further penalty than the price of the DVD or CD.

However if someone is uploading to many then the crime is different but the same rules should apply the DOWNLOADERS should each pay for dvd or cd while the uploader should be guilty of a misdemeanor.

Release groups of pirated material could be liable as felons but even that is extreme.

I'm convinced these people in the RIAA and MPAA are evil and should look toward their own relatives, nieces, nephews, sons, daughters and even parents and see what they are sharing. I guarantee most who work for the RIAA or MPAA have relatives that pirate but would of course overlook them.

So prosecute your niece or leave everyone alone!

They attack the little people because they can.

It's not right and some descent politician if their is any left should have a good look at this whole mess.

These people are really low lifes but I guess you all don't need me to tell you that.

What's happened to gov't? Didn't it used to be "For The People"?

God help us.

See 7 replies to this post

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back history

This is the case the RIAA did not want to go to trial. »arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20···ury.html
quote:
The RIAA is trying to keep Virgin Records, et al v. Jammie Thomas from a jury trial, filing a motion for summary adjudication on some specific aspects of the case............

.........Perhaps the biggest reason that the RIAA doesn't want this—or any other—case to go to trial is the possibility of losing. The RIAA has fought the exoneration efforts of every defendant tooth and nail, trying to simply walk away from the litigation by dismissing it without prejudice. A handful of defendants have managed to be exonerated, most notably Debbie Foster, Patricia Santangelo, and Tanya Andersen—who is now suing the RIAA for malicious prosecution.

A loss at trial would be even more catastrophic for the RIAA. It would give other defense attorneys a winning template while exposing the weaknesses of the RIAA's arguments. It would also prove costly from a financial standpoint, as the RIAA would have to foot the legal expenses for both itself and the defendant. Most of all, it would set an unwelcomed precedent: over 20,000 lawsuits filed and the RIAA loses the first one to go to a jury.
The RIAA lost their request for summary adjudication. In the trial, it appears that their "expert witness" may have some holes in his expected testimony: »www.afterdawn.com/news/archive/11281.cfm
quote:
The RIAA's evidence in the case of Virgin v. Thomas seems to hinge on the testimony of an expert witness whose expertise has already been called into question in another case.

In a deposition earlier this year, Iowa State University associate professor Douglas Jacobson testified about his forensic examination of a defendant's computer hard drive. The examination was done on behalf of the RIAA legal team, based on information provided by MediaSentry, a company that works with the entertainment industry to identify copyrighted works shared illegally on P2P networks.

His testimony states an assumption on his part that MediaSentry had conclusively proven an IP address registered to the defendant was used for sharing files.His conclusion, resulting directly from that premise, stated that despite a lack of either MP3 files that could have been shared or KaZaA software RIAA attorneys claim was used to share the files doesn't exxonerate the defendant, but rather shows that she has another computer.

Despite his complete lack of physical evididence, a report he submitted to RIAA lawyers indicates that he can "demonstrate how defendant's internet account and computer were used." However, when pressed by the defense he admitted that what he meant by a demonstration was quoting MediaSentry's results.

Upon futher questioning, he admitted that not only did he not have any evidence of files being shared from the defendant's hard drive, but also that he didn't bother to document his forensic examination aside from the conclusions he reached, despite the capability of EnCase, the forensic examination software he uses, to create detailed reports. His said "I examined the hard drive, found no evidence of file sharing software or audio files, and so there was nothing to document."
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meister_sd
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Re: back history

EnCase is a scary program - it does find everything.

I had a clients old hard drive. FDisked, repartitioned and formatted it. Ran EnCase on it and after all that, I found websites he visited - and that wasn't a hard search of the hard drive.

bent
and Inga
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Re: back history

That's because when you fdisk and format, you aren't even touching the data area. Get a strong degaussing coil. EnCase won't find anything, and neither will anything else.
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"That government is best which governs least" - Thoreau
lemonade

join:2003-12-13
Los Angeles, CA

Re: back history

does low level format help?

bent
and Inga
Premium
join:2004-10-04
Loveland, CO
Reviews:
·Comcast

Re: back history

No. A low level format, if even possible, will not necessarily write every bit of the HDD, and therefore will not "scrub" a drive. There are "disk shredder" utilities out there that will write the data area of the drive with random data 7 times over, and that is considered secure.
--
»www.lp.org/issues/family-budget.shtml

"That government is best which governs least" - Thoreau

No to ESPN

@comcast.net

Best Buy Technician

It would be interesting for the RIAA lawyer to get the Best Buy Tech on the stand and see what happens. If the Tech has his wits about him he/she can say that the HD was bad, was replaced and what is all the fuss about. The RIAA lawyer will say something about conspiracy and the Tech will say something about he would be tested for admission to a mental institution. Could turn into a real circus with the RIAA as an act and not the ring master.

Last bit of damning evidence, "Oh my computer had Windows on it and it did not work. The Best Buy people cleaned up an operating system problem." I wonder how many of the jurors would understand that.

slimpickinz

join:2003-11-29
Conyers, GA

What about...

an open, unprotected wireless connection?
Could not someone in the street or next door have used their connection to upload the files in question?
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Sean

join:2004-01-23
Toronto

Native American

A couple songs for the land her ancestors have worked on for as long as history dates?

Sounds fair.
ohyaknow

join:2005-01-28

Re: Native American

I was told by a Native American the other day to never gone one of her people mad...
representing
5th Sniper

join:2001-01-20
Prince George, BC

RIAA vs Music i have purchased

Well i live in canada and from what i understand the RIAA has some cross border abilities, i may be wrong but not sure. either way, if someone before me used my IP to download songs and they searched my harddrive they would wet their pants with the over 14000 songs i have on my harddrive... now the funny thing is every single song came physically off a cd an was loaded onto the computer. Do i own these cds well yes at one time i did. now some theif that broke into my house owns them... in their eyes because i dont' have the original media i stole them... Also there is not one song that i have downloaded that i have not at one time, or multiple times, owned. I must have bought the same few cd's multiple times because something usually happens, now with the new ways to fix scratches i started to buy cd's and rip em to my computer then i would burn a cd to take with me in the car etc.

Here is a scenario then. I rip all my music to my harddrive, my cd's and many other things get stolen, i in the mean time have made multiple burned cd's and now dvd's with mp3 formats so i can use them in the car or elsewhere, my hdd fails unexpectedly so i replace the harddrive and then reload most of my music from what cd's i did burn and what cd's i have left from the break in. When i use that song again some of em want to connect to the internet to obtain a licence...well since i have owned that cd at least once i click ok. deos that mean that the song is now valid for me again or what? also after getting sick of paying the same company/artist/whatever up to 30 dollars a cd again, i decide to download the songs that i actually liked off the cd, am i breaking the law by not choosing to purchase music i owned legtimately at one time in the past? Even insurance won't cover my cd's because they weren't itemized with reciepts, and if they are in the car when stolen, because they weren't attached to the car in any way... so how is the RIAA going to prove that the music you may have downloaded is not actually the same song you have purchased before but lost and don't feel you should repurchase it, as i am sure some dldrs feel.

also my cd's get stolen sold to a pawnshop who don't care cuz there is no way to track the original owners, then sell them to someone else at a much lower cost then i paid originally, or i buy them again from a pawn shop to replace em for less than a store, am i infringing on copyrights because i didn't buy the cd new? whos to say the cd i pick up from the pawnshop isn't actually the one that was stolen from me? Also are they going to go back through your financial statements all the way to the initial date of the cd's release to find out if maybe you did purchase that particular cd once or twice or are they going to try to sit high and assume that the media you chose to replace your stolen product is in fact stolen anyways so the victim now turns to the thief but morally they don't care because they are after what... up to 30 thousand in fines per song... if they can prove that what is on my harddrive right now is a song that i have not paid at least twice for in my life then i have no problems with them charging me the 2.00 a song that the artist may have lost, but if it was off a best of cd and there were more songs then normal the price would be what 1.30 per track... i am curious to find out where all these lost expenses are in these lawsuits that do pop up. where are they justifying that the amount they are seeking is legitimate and just?

hope this all makes sense i am tired and having problems focusing right now lol...
Baseline7

join:2001-02-26
Buffalo, NY

Sick.

Oh boo hoo. The poor RIAA. The people who want $15 for a CD but give the artists $1.

Suck it RIAA, hope you lose. Corporate thieves. You are the people that give terms like Capitalism and Free Market a bad name. Going after single mothers, elderly people, broke college kids and underage youngsters.

Disgusting. But don't worry, I totally understand you need everyone on your exec board to have another Ferrari and Mansion in the Bahama's this Christmas, so we must stop these evil criminals, right?

Fuck off.
MTB

join:2007-06-29
Newport Beach, CA

1 edit

Re: Sick.

RIAA will need the money to reconstruct all the bits and bytes.

When music CD's first came out the industry told the athorities at hand that the prices of CD's would be cheaper and hence the need for customers to make the switch to CD's.

That whole industry is lame.

After all is said and done they should all be able to get a job at SONY.

tell RIAA not to F with Buckey

PoloDude
Premium,VIP
join:2006-03-29
Northport, NY
kudos:2

Bot pc?

I know this truley wouldn't happen but.... what if her pc was part of a bot net/infected so that someone had controll of it and DLd to it then use some other transfer method to UL it?
just a theory.

UrNxT

@cgocable.net

Re: Bot pc?

hmm.. If her hard drive is gone then the RIAA has nothing but some tracing info on her broadband modem. No REAL proof of it being on her computer. I'd just sit back and let the lawyer handle it from there cuz there's no way they can do anything. Nothing legal anyhow. I suppose they could beat it out of her or try to charge a family relative of something stupid to get her to admit to it... but other then that.

With all that said.. Wonder if her lawyer is getting over $3,000? As funny as it would be to watch the RIAA cry in their corner I'd pay them the $3,000 before the lawyers bill got ridiculous.
thesimonsens
Premium
join:2007-09-14
USA

RIAA sucks!!

They sent a letter to my father-in-laws bar saying that he can not play any music in there without paying a licensing fee telling him that since he makes money off his bar he can not have a radio in there and must use a jukebox instead. I guess they started sending these letters out to a lot of the bars and such in the area

See 10 replies to this post

Mountie

@echostar.com

WiFi??

Couldn't someone have hacked into her WiFi network, assuming she has one, and used her public IP to download music while parked on the street with a laptop?

Sam5423

@rr.com

ARP Spoofing?

Couldn't you just get a lawyer to go before the court and explain how arp spoofing works? Then that would dismiss the "evidence" of the IP address all together.

I say have the lawyer explain it because if the defendant explained it the judge would think he is some kind of hacker

baufan2010

@bellsouth.net

Hard Drive

In a court of law you really can't assume. So just because she replaced the hard drive is in no way an admittance of guilt.
howrman

join:2000-07-08
Philadelphia, PA

Re: Hard Drive

said by baufan2010 :

In a court of law you really can't assume. So just because she replaced the hard drive is in no way an admittance of guilt.
To the contrary, the law has a doctrine known as "spoliation of evidence" which provides that, if a party destroys evidence, the jury may assume that the evidence was unfavorable to the party who caused the destruction.
wth
Premium
join:2002-02-20
Iowa City,IA

Get Updates Here

You can get updates here: »www.duluthnewstribune.com/
But you'll have to register to get past the home page.

Sam5423

@rr.com

Re: Get Updates Here

ah heck, they got her kazza share folder with her user name on it. She might just be screwed..... That is very sad.

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