 | | That would cool if it works That would great if that works. But ya wonder if it smokes and mirrors going on here?
Can the same math formulas be applied to FIOS? | |
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 |  OlegBellsouth FastaccessPremium
join:2003-12-08
Birmingham, AL | Re: That would cool if it works How about the price if it's going to cost $80-$100 a month no thanks. | |
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| | Reviews:
 ·Charter
| Re: That would cool if it works said by Oleg:How about the price if it's going to cost $80-$100 a month no thanks. Its up to 250Mbps man. Well worth $100 or even some more. | |
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|  ieolusSupport The Clecs
join:2001-06-19
Duluth, GA | Depends, is there interference from neighbors on a fiber line?
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"Speak for yourself "Chadmaster" - lesopp | |
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| | | I wouldn't think this would apply to FIOS since it uses fiber which doesn't have interference problems. Its clean!!! like the kid says in the commercial. | |
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| | | I wonder what Verizon and ATT think about this. | |
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| | | | Re: That would cool if it works I would think that it is still in their best interest to deploy the fiber for Verizon so they can have their triple play sooner and don't have to worry about POTs maintenance issues with copper quality (or distance for that matter). AT&T since they are doing their u-verse DSL then it would be in there interest to watch (maybe even invest) in the service so they can use it in there DSLAMs (which they keep upgrading as it is for more features and speed) as a standard upgrade down the road. | |
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| | | firewire... I do believe the title of this was 250mbps over copper. not fiber which is what fios is. | |
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| | | | Re: That would cool if it works I know it was copper. Just wonder if same math formulas, etc can be applied to fios. | |
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| | | | | Re: That would cool if it works Firewire - that is a fair question. In a general mathematical sense it's related in a way. The fact that all transmissions signal will degrade over distance copper, microwave, or optic. Copper uses RF to transmit data and can be extended by repeater.
VZ FIOS (the last mile) is all optics, a wavelength (lambda)is assigned to each service offering (video, data, voice). Potentially FIOS can push through put speed of over 600MB/s and up to 1000MB/s (GigE)or even higher. This is depending on the transmitting equipment. Service speeds of 5MB, 10MB, 30MB, 50MB, 20/20 MB/s is just the starting point. Of course this means Billions of dollars are need to upgrade the Backbone infrastructures. Doesn't make sense to give the end user a Ferrari with no road to drive on. | |
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| | | | | Firewire - that is a fair question. In a general mathematical sense it's related in a way. The fact that all transmissions signal (rf, microwave, optics, etc) will degrade over distance. Copper uses RF to transmit data and can be extended by repeater, very costly to maintain.
VZ FIOS (last mile) is all optics, a wavelength (lambda)is assigned to each service offering (video, data, voice). Potentially FIOS can push through put speed of over 600MB/s and up to 1000MB/s (GigE)or even higher. This is depending on the transmitting equipment of course. Service speeds of 5MB, 10MB, 30MB, 50MB, 20/20 MB/s is just the starting point. Of course this means Billions of dollars are need to upgrade the Backbone infrastructures. Doesn’t make sense to give the end user a Ferrari with no road to drive on. Cable is still working DOCS 3.0, so we'll see. Fiber is the future, Coring has already invented fiber that can be bent 360 degrees that can still transmit data. »www.corning.com/opticalfiber/med···902.aspx. This future is here ... content and application developers need to catch up. | |
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| | broadband over power lines? Does anyone remember when BPL was announced as the next great innovation in broadband?
I hate to be cynacle (sp?) But when I see things like this I just shrug my shoulders and move on. | |
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| SB7785
join:2007-08-15
South Richmond Hill, NY | 3-4 Years Seems a little too late for me. If this was 1999, this would be "groundbreaking". | |
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| |  PhilRojo SolPremium
join:2001-06-11
Camarillo, CA
kudos:2 | Re: 3-4 Years If claims of 250Mbps were true, how would that not be ground-breaking over current 3-6Mbps DSL connections? | |
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| | | | | Re: 3-4 Years because in 3 to 4 years fiber and other things will be out. In fact I think cable with DOCIS 3.0 will be killing everyone by that time! | |
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| | | | | | Re: 3-4 Years Yeah, right. Just 3-4 years ago the top speed I could get for reasonable money was 6mbs, now I get a whopping 15mbs. Huge improvement for 3-4 years (yeah, right). Yes, I have fiber as well, just because they have it, doesn't mean they're going to offer it. | |
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| | | | | | | Re: 3-4 Years your right you won't get it unless there is a competition in the area. so if fiber and vdsl is out cable will beat the speed until one or the other is maxed. | |
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| | | | | | | | Re: 3-4 Years if this works then it could mean a cheaper path to faster broadband for a whole lot of people. there would be less need to spend money on costly network upgrades. this would be especially helpful to AT&T, whose FTTN/VDSL plans would be helped greatly if there was a method by which they could get more from the VDSL side (say what they will, i still think FTTN/VDSL was the wrong choice).
just keeping my fingers crossed and hoping this turns out to be more than just hype... | |
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| | | | | | | I have to agree I mean this is the United States we're talking about. All other countries may advance by leaps and bounds but most of us will still be stuck with single digital mbps because theres no competition in our area. Then if they do increase speeds, without competition theres gonna be a price to pay. | |
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| | | NormanSPremium,MVM
join:2001-02-14
San Jose, CA
kudos:4 Reviews:
 ·SONIC.NET
·Pacific Bell - SBC
| said by Phil:If claims of 250Mbps were true, how would that not be ground-breaking over current 3-6Mbps DSL connections? VDSL2+ is capable of up to 100Mbps over copper already.
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Norman
~Oh Lord, why have you come
~To Konnyu, with the Lion and the Drum | |
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| | | | | | Re: 3-4 Years You mean VDSL2. It's capable of much higher if under a short distance. | |
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| PhilRojo SolPremium
join:2001-06-11
Camarillo, CA
kudos:2 | Re: info We won't see any details until they've got their patents... | |
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| | | | Re: info »www.rimsemi.com/
I heard from an Embarq field tech that the stuff this company makes works in field trials and could have an important impact on just what you are referencing. | |
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| | | | | Re: info said by TScheisskopf:» www.rimsemi.com/I heard from an Embarq field tech that the stuff this company makes works in field trials and could have an important impact on just what you are referencing. Wow, Embarq? Sometimes they blow things badly, but other times they hit the nail on the head....let's hope the trial goes well and Embarq deploys this at all their DSLAMs eventually. I'm all for upgrading to fiber-optics, but I also realize how unrealistic that is (especially out in the country)....I guess we'll have to wait and see what Embarq has in store for us. | |
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| | | | | | Re: info said by Fox McCloud:said by TScheisskopf:» www.rimsemi.com/I heard from an Embarq field tech that the stuff this company makes works in field trials and could have an important impact on just what you are referencing. Wow, Embarq? Sometimes they blow things badly, but other times they hit the nail on the head....let's hope the trial goes well and Embarq deploys this at all their DSLAMs eventually. I'm all for upgrading to fiber-optics, but I also realize how unrealistic that is (especially out in the country)....I guess we'll have to wait and see what Embarq has in store for us. This would fit Embarq's gameplan. They aren't going FTTH. Their goal is to provide broadband to all their customers rather than hitting the metro areas with fiber. I like Verizon's approach better, but for Embarq its not an option due to cost and risk. Embarq is pretty good about getting DSL to their customers out in the middle of nowhere. They could do better, but of all the telcos they do try the hardest to service everyone.
If this works it would be big news for Embarq. Minor DSLAM upgrades and modem upgrades for new speeds would be a real winner. | |
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| | | | | | | Re: info said by RainWind7:said by Fox McCloud:said by TScheisskopf:» www.rimsemi.com/I heard from an Embarq field tech that the stuff this company makes works in field trials and could have an important impact on just what you are referencing. Wow, Embarq? Sometimes they blow things badly, but other times they hit the nail on the head....let's hope the trial goes well and Embarq deploys this at all their DSLAMs eventually. I'm all for upgrading to fiber-optics, but I also realize how unrealistic that is (especially out in the country)....I guess we'll have to wait and see what Embarq has in store for us. This would fit Embarq's gameplan. They aren't going FTTH. Their goal is to provide broadband to all their customers rather than hitting the metro areas with fiber. I like Verizon's approach better, but for Embarq its not an option due to cost and risk. Embarq is pretty good about getting DSL to their customers out in the middle of nowhere. They could do better, but of all the telcos they do try the hardest to service everyone. If this works it would be big news for Embarq. Minor DSLAM upgrades and modem upgrades for new speeds would be a real winner. especially if it gives these insanely high speeds at "good" distances.
One thing I do like about Embarq is that they do plan on having 100% coverage (by the end of 2009). Will they make it? I have my doubts, but if they do, then they can really concentrate on replacing crappy copper, bottlenecks, and invest in projects such as these. | |
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| | | Protocol: BS (blowing smoke) Distance probably up to and not to exceed 10' | |
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| |  53059959Temp banned from BBR more then anyone
join:2002-10-02
PwnZone | Re: info agreed. from what I understand this only works for VDSL (which is like 2500ft max 1000ft recommended). great for fttn setups like AT&T's but probably won't do anything for existing ADSL. | |
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| | | Re: 250MBs we have heard this before with the theoretically speeds. Cable had unlimited bandwidth possibilities years ago. EVDO was capable of 12 - 15 mbps. Wimax can achieve over 50mps but it won't ect ect. | |
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|  MysticGogetaThe Robot DevilPremium
join:2005-03-14
League City, TX | said by anonidopolous :
LOL. Yeah right
Perhaps this is why AT&T is holding onto copper they were on to something lol.
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Team Discovery-Join the fight | |
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PDXPLT
join:2003-12-04
Banks, OR | Old News Too bad there's this trend now of universities and academics doing clumsy PR.
Cioffi at Stanford (who invented much of DMT DSL technology, BTW) has been saying for awhile that VDSL up to 1 Gbps may be possible on 4 bonded pairs. That's 250 Mbps per pair. This assumes the lines are short enough, and full MIMO (for interference mitigation) is used.
For background, see »isl.stanford.edu/~cioffi/dsm/tut/chap11.doc. Note in section 11.6: "A 500-meter binder of 50 pairs could carry 10 Gbps total capacity symmetrically and reliably". That's 200 Mbps per pair. | |
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| | | Re: Old News You do realize how short 500 meters is right? And to carry that data any further they need to pull an optical cable to that 500 meter point to demarcation. So what you have is a fridge sized phone box on every single block and fiber pulled to everyone of them. If your going that far why not lay the fiber to the home and forget the copper and all it's weaknesses? | |
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| dcs2281
join:2004-09-14
Santa Clarita, CA | I believe the guy is going to work for or with Cioffi according to other sources to perfect it. Cioffi couldn't get it to well at any distance, so they are going to team up. | |
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| | hmm I thought the group that came up with the technology that fios is using in homes stated that coaxial cable had a maximum of 270Mbps. IS this a different type of cable they are talking about? Are they talking about phone wire? | |
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 Mega DETHIt's All About The Ping
join:2003-08-20
Watertown, WI | YES! YES! now U-Verse will be a success!!  
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"Action does not equal Achievement" | |
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Reviews:
·Optimum Online
 ·Verizon FiOS
| short length transmission Copper will never be cost effective for long distance (last mile) haul for data, that's a proven fact. No one said dsl can't work in the marketplace (as interim for fiber deployments). Look at AT&T's u-verse dsl strategy. Much of that network will have to place nodes at critical places to repeat the signal. We also know that for much of the network, the PREFERRED medium is FIBER to the node supported by dsl conversion. WHY? Even AT&T knows that if they went 100% copper, they'd have to charge what the market would laugh them into and beyond bankruptcy.
BTW, last mile is usually a contradiction.. for many subscribers they are MUCH, MUCH, MUCH more than 1 mile from a node or central office. In some cases 20 miles or MORE (RURAL). That is why crappy cable companies like comcast are the only "micro broadband" game in town.
Back to the lab drawing board and a few more Fosters mugs. | |
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|  TechieZeroTools Are Using MePremium
join:2002-01-25
Gibsonton, FL | Re: short length transmission LOL Yeah I wonder if the distance to the CO has to be 5 feet for this to work.  | |
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| KearnstdElf WizardPremium
join:2002-01-22
Mullica Hill, NJ | distance is the one i wonder about, considering Uverse which is VDSL(or is it VDSL2?) needs several of those boxes for one neighborhood.
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[65 Arcanist]Filan(High Elf) Zone: Broadband Reports | |
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 PacketeersPremium
join:2005-06-18
Forest Hills, NY
kudos:1 | I hope it's true I want Verizon and others to stop building FIOS
so we don't have to keep subsidizing that waste.
new wireless or copper broadband using existing
infrastructure would be a much better investment. | |
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See 6 replies to this post |
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 Anonymous_AnonymousPremium
join:2004-06-21
127.0.0.1
kudos:2
1 edit | That can all ready be done dose an LAN count?
if so i am all ready getting 1Gbps over my LAN
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( . Y . ) | |
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| | | Re: That can all ready be done Gigabit ethernet???  | |
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| | | Copper can conduct many things i wont be suprised if this will effect fiber. | |
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| | |
 n2jtx
join:2001-01-13
Glen Head, NY
·Optimum Online
| I Have This Great Invention! I have a great invention that will produce all the free energy you could ever want and it is no bigger than a window air conditioner! Unfortunately I cannot share the details with you because I have to apply for patents and line up investors. Trust me though it is fantastic.
250Mbps over copper sounds like a good companion for this free energy device!
(For the humor impaired, my statement what most "inventors" of so called "free energy" devices make)
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I support the right to keep and arm bears. | |
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| fiberguyMy views are my own.Premium
join:2005-05-20
kudos:3 | Re: I Have This Great Invention! .. and the same could have been said about the guy who claimed he could send a voice conversation over a piece of wire from one end to another.. or the guy that said he would make man fly, or the guy that said "some day, everyone will have a computer"... or the guy that said "man will be able to fly to the moon.."...
follow?
If you don't, then ask yourself, why are all the nut-job geeks the ones who are the rich ones.. and the rest of the world comes to BBR and casts stones at those making an attempt.
*open your minds and stop thinking inside the box* because it's outside the box where new technology comes from.
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"Complaining is the least path of resistance for the self-serving, the lazy, and I’m told it’s a woman’s prerogative..." | |
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| | Great work there now the telecos got another excuse to use. Now the stupid telecos like Qwest & AT&T got a excuse not to layout or plan for any fiber in the future.... They will just keep dragging on about this upcoming thing which may or maynot be able to deliver 250Mbps in real world.
Seriously, when fiber gets mass deployed by some, I was hoping the other telco will see the light and do it as well so that the cost of deploying fiber drops a lot. But, they rather just offer crappy DSL for the rest of their lives while to work to upgrade the copper network to this for another 10 years. | |
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See 6 replies to this post |
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| | | Re: I believe it. how bout investing your PHD to get DSL to go out farther without a remote terminal! | |
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| | Re: 250 mbps over copper. With all the money Vz spent (and is still spending) on fios, somehow I don't think they're going to invest too much time or money in this technology. Although this would be a good way for one of those "fly by night" telcos to compete against dsl, cable and fios... if they're still around in three to four years. | |
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 batterupI Can Not Tell A Lie.Premium
join:2003-02-06
Netcong, NJ | Copper = Leeches. Leeches must die, copper must die. That is business, technology be damned.
The people wanted it this way; Ma Bell is dead and yet the people bitch. | |
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| | | Re: AhHA! What would have been the point? They would have had to upgrade to fiber anyway. Why not blow cable out of the water now? Copper is doomed no matter how you look at it. | |
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I believe it.