ddg4005
Premium
join:2001-08-22
Bronx, NY | Verizon says "No redlining in NYC."
Talk is cheap. Let's see what they actually do.
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A man must have a code -Bunk |
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RARPSL
join:1999-12-08
Suffern, NY
| said by ddg4005  :Talk is cheap. So is not doing what they promise given the "Pocket Change" size of the so called "Penalties" for not meeting the milestones.
Let's see what they actually do.
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wifi4milez
Big Russ, 1918 to 2008. Rest in Peace
join:2004-08-07
New York, NY
 ·Verizon FIOS
 ·Sprint Mobile Broa..
 ·RoadRunner Cable
 ·BroadVoice
| reply to ddg4005
said by ddg4005 :Talk is cheap. Let's see what they actually do. SIGH. Its uninformed comments like yours that really get to me. The reality of the situation is that FIOS is available TODAY in Brooklyn, Bronx, and Queens. Manhattan (the wealthiest borough of NYC) only has a few buildings being lit for a controlled (beta) introduction. So is Verizon currently doing reverse redlining?? How come all the people who live on 5th Avenue arent picketing in the streets complaining about being discriminated against??
This has been proven time and time again; there is NO FIOS redlining anywhere in the country so get over it. Taken as a whole, lower and middle class areas (ie. where most people live) are the primary targets of FIOS rollouts, and thats just a fact.
--
I urge you to beware the temptation of pride -- the temptation of blithely declaring yourselves above it all and label both sides equally at fault, to ignore the facts of history and the aggressive impulses of an evil empire
Still True Today; RR
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MichaelWacey
OwlSaver
Premium
join:2005-01-30
Berwyn, PA
·Verizon FIOS
·Comcast
| This would be Technically Difficult
There are two things working against Verizon being able to redline specific areas:
-They want to switch from Copper to Fibre. There are so many reasons. The cost of maintaining copper, the recent spike in copper lines being stolen, implementing a single set of equipment in each CO.
-They need to role out by CO which does not line up with neighborhoods in general.
Verizon could delay entire CO's because they do not expect a ROI.
It will be interesting to see how this plays out over the next few years. |
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Pathfinder
Dazed Confused
Premium
join:2000-03-26
Mount Vernon, NY | Redlining
A convenient word thrown around by the uninformed.
Can anyone show one shred of evidence that Verizon is redlining? |
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expert007
join:2006-01-10
Buffalo, NY
| Ok................
Of course they weren't affiliated with the company. Its quite common for people to make up signs to support a large corporation saying things like "keep cable honest" and "competition works". Um......right.  |
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Iknowenuff
join:2001-06-28
Riverside, CA | Yeah. I think what the Verizon rep meant was "we didn't pay them directly." |
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PDXPLT
join:2003-12-04
Banks, OR
2 edits | reply to wifi4milez
There's redlining here ...
said by wifi4milez :This has been proven time and time again; there is NO FIOS redlining anywhere in the country so get over it. NOT TRUE. The regional franchise authority here does not work as well as that in NYC. Verizon told them that two of the communities in the region will not get FIOS, and that was OK with the franchise board. It also happens that the two communities in question are the ones with the lowest average incomes. The meets the definition of "redlining" as commonly used.
The franchise board consisted of representatives from every community in the region. The reps from the two redlined communities voted NO, but the reps from the communities getting FIOS took what the Brits call an "I'm all right Jack" attitude and voted yes.
The only reason the outlining boroughs in NYC have FIOS and Manhattan doesn't yet is that there are very few single-family homes in Manhattan. Verizon is just now figured out how to deploy FIOS in apartment buildings.
Bottom line FIOS redlining is alive and well. |
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rit56
join:2000-12-01
New York, NY
| The build out
Anyone see a map? I'd like to see the plan and we can determine for ourselves whether they're redlining. Out of towners keep in mind neighborhoods have changed in the past 10 or so years. What were once bad places to live in all 5 boroughs are not any more. The Lower East Side is not a ghetto anymore. If they site that as "hey we're not redlining, we're in the LES" because there are still projects there is a load of bull. Locals know the real deal. |
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Dogfather
Premium
join:2007-12-26
Laguna Hills, CA | reply to wifi4milez
Re: Verizon says "No redlining in NYC."
This is absolutely true. The first areas in California to get FiOS TV were Beaumont and Murrietta, not exactly Newport Coast. |
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TKJunkMail
Enjoy the sun
Premium
join:2002-03-03
Avalon, NJ
·Sprint Mobile Broa..
·Comcast
| reply to Pathfinder
Re: Redlining
said by Pathfinder :A convenient word thrown around by the uninformed. Can anyone show one shred of evidence that Verizon is redlining? No. It is just more of the left's anti-corporate rant they trot out every time a cable or telco does a rollout. And every time they have no facts to back their complaint. I think they whine hoping that the companies will give PREFERENCE to poor areas as opposed to doing a rollout based on the many factors that determine order of installation.
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My BLOG .. .. Internet News .. .. My Web Page |
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ddg4005
Premium
join:2001-08-22
Bronx, NY
 ·Verizon Online DSL
2 edits | reply to wifi4milez
Re: Verizon says "No redlining in NYC."
said by wifi4milez :said by ddg4005 :Talk is cheap. Let's see what they actually do. SIGH. Its uninformed comments like yours that really get to me. The reality of the situation is that FIOS is available TODAY in Brooklyn, Bronx, and Queens. Manhattan (the wealthiest borough of NYC) only has a few buildings being lit for a controlled (beta) introduction. So is Verizon currently doing reverse redlining?? How come all the people who live on 5th Avenue arent picketing in the streets complaining about being discriminated against?? This has been proven time and time again; there is NO FIOS redlining anywhere in the country so get over it. Taken as a whole, lower and middle class areas (ie. where most people live) are the primary targets of FIOS rollouts, and thats just a fact. I am well aware that Fios is available in parts of the Bronx, Brooklyn, and Queens. And my comment stands: what a company says and what it does are two different things. Only a portion of each aforementioned borough is wired; we'll see if the rest are wired within a reasonable time. |
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mglunt
join:2001-09-10
Fredericksburg, VA
·Verizon FIOS
1 edit | reply to wifi4milez
Locally, Spotsylvania County is way ahead of Stafford county to the north with much higher real estate values.
All these redlining claims are BS. Unless they start with the lowest income welfare developments and then work their way up someone screams.
Even if they were, how dare VZ install the product where people can actually afford it and/or know what it is. |
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SD6
join:2005-03-26
| Some Perspective?
If I may make a moderating comment. People in NYC should realize that they are in a much better position as a result of this franchise agreement regardless of the precise buildout details.
I think there are several cities who now have less chance of seeing FIOS anytime soon (nearby cities such as Philly, Allentown/Bethlehem and Albany particularly). Poor neighborhoods in NYC are now much, much, more likely to get FIOS soon than even the richest neighborhood in say, Baltimore. |
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SD6
join:2005-03-26
| reply to TKJunkMail
Re: Redlining
said by TKJunkMail :said by Pathfinder :A convenient word thrown around by the uninformed. Can anyone show one shred of evidence that Verizon is redlining? No. It is just more of the left's anti-corporate rant they trot out every time a cable or telco does a rollout. And every time they have no facts to back their complaint. I think they whine hoping that the companies will give PREFERENCE to poor areas as opposed to doing a rollout based on the many factors that determine order of installation. I think there is some truth in the sense that the squeaky wheel gets the grease whether the squeaks are warranted or not. But it's not solely the left or anti-corporate politicians. Look into Yonkers, NY (3rd largest city in NYS) where the local republican, Nick Spanos, cried redlining very loudly, and the franchise agreement became unstuck after that. Several parts of Yonkers have many hi-rises and they got a guaranteed 100% buildout within 5 years. This was a year ago before the MDU problem was declared solved. |
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ddg4005
Premium
join:2001-08-22
Bronx, NY
·Verizon Online DSL
| reply to SD6
Re: Some Perspective?
said by SD6 :If I may make a moderating comment. People in NYC should realize that they are in a much better position as a result of this franchise agreement regardless of the precise buildout details. I think there are several cities who now have less chance of seeing FIOS anytime soon (nearby cities such as Philly, Allentown/Bethlehem and Albany particularly). Poor neighborhoods in NYC are now much, much, more likely to get FIOS soon than even the richest neighborhood in say, Baltimore. Point taken. |
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wifi4milez
Big Russ, 1918 to 2008. Rest in Peace
join:2004-08-07
New York, NY
·Verizon FIOS
·Sprint Mobile Broa..
·RoadRunner Cable
·BroadVoice
| reply to PDXPLT
Re: There's redlining here ...
said by PDXPLT :The franchise board consisted of representatives from every community in the region. The reps from the two redlined communities voted NO, but the reps from the communities getting FIOS took what the Brits call an "I'm all right Jack" attitude and voted yes. So a local franchise board made up of members of the local community voted on where to install FIOS. They voted not to install it in two specific areas. Yet somehow, you are equating this to Verizon redlining poor areas?? Thats some interesting logic my friend.....
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I urge you to beware the temptation of pride -- the temptation of blithely declaring yourselves above it all and label both sides equally at fault, to ignore the facts of history and the aggressive impulses of an evil empire
Still True Today; RR
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wifi4milez
Big Russ, 1918 to 2008. Rest in Peace
join:2004-08-07
New York, NY
·Verizon FIOS
·Sprint Mobile Broa..
·RoadRunner Cable
·BroadVoice
| reply to ddg4005
Re: Verizon says "No redlining in NYC."
said by ddg4005 :I anm well aware that Fios is available in parts of the Bronx, Brooklyn, and Queens. And my comment stands: what a company says and what it does are two different things. Only a portion of each aforementioned borough is wired; we'll see if the rest are wired within a reasonable time. That is correct, a good portion of the outer boroughs are currently wired for FIOS. Manhattan on the other hand, has maybe 3 buildings in total that are slated for rollout sometime this summer (other than the 3 currently served). The main reason that many more NYC (and outer borough) residents do not have FIOS today is directly due to bleeding heart bureaucrats and meddling politicians. The past two years of "secret behind closed doors" meetings between Verizon and the city have screwed us all. Instead of letting Verizon get on with things, the city tried to come up with the stupid "access for all by 20XX" plan. If anyone thinks that requiring Verizon to wire some abandoned warehouse in Queens with FIOS will help with anything, they are sorely mistaken. It has already been stated numerous times on this website that the penalties for Verizon missing the target dates are negligible, so in all honesty what was the point?? For those who think they have "won the battle" by forcing Verizon to make FIOS available to some drug flop house in (insert crappy neighborhood) think again.
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I urge you to beware the temptation of pride -- the temptation of blithely declaring yourselves above it all and label both sides equally at fault, to ignore the facts of history and the aggressive impulses of an evil empire
Still True Today; RR
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KCrimson
Premium
join:2001-02-25
Brooklyn, NY
·Optimum Online
·Verizon FIOS
| reply to ddg4005
I'm sure that Verizon was RUNNING to get the big bucks from Prospect Heights and Crown Heights Brooklyn - two of the areas that are among the first to see FiOS. Both feature below average income demographics, and both feature a majority of multi-dwelling buildings.
So I guess that people who propose that 5th Ave. Manhattan was only stalled because of the difficulties of running fiber in multidwellings didn't consult with Verizon first!
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Happy With What I Have To Be Happy With |
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Pathfinder
Dazed Confused
Premium
join:2000-03-26
Mount Vernon, NY | reply to wifi4milez
There are far more than 3 buildings in Manhattan with FIOS. When I left there 2 years ago there were 3 in East 56th District already with more on the map. I will try to get a count from some friends of mine. |
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