sonnybadbutt
join:2001-05-11
Elizabethtown, KY | Freq.
If they can do 20 or 30 miles hops the frequency can't be that high. As higher the frequency goes more the rain fade and most of these links are a couple of miles at best at higher frequency. So rain fade shouldn't be a problem. |
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swhitney2003
I can't drive 55.
Premium
join:2003-06-13
NH
clubs:  | Head aches
Are people complaining about headaches from these microwave towers? I don't want to get sick! |
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OSUGoose
join:2007-12-27
Columbus, OH
clubs:
 ·AT&T Midwest
 ·Cingular Wireless
·Verizon BroadbandA..
 ·RoadRunner Cable
| LOL
Pigeon:Ah this is pigeon 529er requeting a go no go status on the Sprint Tower at Main & High.
At&t Dispatch: ahhhh, thats a green light bomber 529er
Pigeon 529er: Ah Roger
At&T Dispatch: Be advised bomber 529er, friendlies settingup contingey strike.
Pigeon 529er: Rodger, whats the friendlys markings
at&t Dispatch: Bomber 529er, all black, with a red checkmark
VZW Pigeon: abort at&t bomber 529er, bird down!
Pigeon 529er:" aww F*** (Load allready drop), hey what the heck (gets droped on from above)
VZW Renegage Piegon: Can You Hear me Now at&t pigeon? (chuckles) |
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blah
@xspedius.net | Not an issue at all
Rain fade really is not an issue with Microwave links at all. I worked for a company for many years that used one and even under the most heavy rains we saw no issues at all. The link was about a 10-15mile distance too. |
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TKJunkMail
Enjoy the sun
Premium
join:2002-03-03
Avalon, NJ
·Sprint Mobile Broa..
·Comcast
|  Sprint can start leasing bandwidth on Comcast & TW fiber
Now that Comcast & TW are backing the Sprint Wimax effort with big $ investments, they can recoup some of their investment by leasing capacity on their fiber backbones to Sprint for backhaul purposes.
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My BLOG .. .. Internet News .. .. My Web Page |
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OSUGoose
join:2007-12-27
Columbus, OH
clubs: | Hate to pop ur bubble, but they just as all wireless carriers, have been doing that for years. |
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sporkme
drop the crantini and move it, sister
Premium,MVM
join:2000-07-01
Morristown, NJ
·Optimum Online
| reply to blah
Re: Not an issue at all
said by blah :
Rain fade really is not an issue with Microwave links at all. I worked for a company for many years that used one and even under the most heavy rains we saw no issues at all. The link was about a 10-15mile distance too.
The piece sounds a bit FUD-infested. Unless this is some new, untested microwave technology, it doesn't really make sense. Well-engineered links should not have problems unless the signal is marginal to begin with. |
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Fubar
join:2001-02-20
Phoenix, AZ | reply to TKJunkMail
Re: Sprint can start leasing bandwidth on Comcast & TW fiber
They need fiber to the cell sites.... So if they are close enough... Maybe...
We aren't talking backbone that is needed.... |
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en102
Canadian, eh?
join:2001-01-26
Valencia, CA
·RoadRunner Cable
·DSL EXTREME
| reply to blah
Re: Not an issue at all
If I'm not mistaken, Bell Canada originally deployed microwave links across Canada for communications ~ 50 years ago.
»www.histori.ca/minutes/minute.do?id=10223
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Canada = Hollywood North |
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Matt
Take me down to the paradise city
Premium
join:2003-07-20
Jamestown, NC
·North State Commun..
| reply to sporkme
said by sporkme  :said by blah :
Rain fade really is not an issue with Microwave links at all. I worked for a company for many years that used one and even under the most heavy rains we saw no issues at all. The link was about a 10-15mile distance too.
The piece sounds a bit FUD-infested. Unless this is some new, untested microwave technology, it doesn't really make sense. Well-engineered links should not have problems unless the signal is marginal to begin with. I agree. I know of a local carrier that has a 30+ mile microwave link between Greensboro, NC and Asheboro, NC. I specifically asked about weather interference and he said it was non-existent unless the link was marginal to begin with. |
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wifi4milez
Big Russ, 1918 to 2008. Rest in Peace
join:2004-08-07
New York, NY
 ·Verizon FIOS
·Sprint Mobile Broa..
·RoadRunner Cable
 ·BroadVoice
| reply to OSUGoose
Re: Sprint can start leasing bandwidth on Comcast & TW fiber
said by OSUGoose :Hate to pop ur bubble, but they just as all wireless carriers, have been doing that for years. He means they can do so at a preferred rate since they are all in the project together. |
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OSUGoose
join:2007-12-27
Columbus, OH
clubs:
·AT&T Midwest
·Cingular Wireless
·Verizon BroadbandA..
·RoadRunner Cable
| i seriously doubt they will do that, does at&t backbone give at&t broadband/dsl a prefered rate? Nope they are just another customer, since is a seperate affilate, as its not a complete company but a company operating under the at&t brand thats affilated with them, like here in ohio, Its Still Ohio Bell, but d/b/a At&T Ohio, nothing changed but the name the public sees. |
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keefe007
Premium
join:2004-02-24
Germantown, WI
| reply to Fubar
Yes this article isn't exactly accurate. Rain fade isn't really a problem on microwave links, especially short ones up to 30 miles. I have many links and never experience any problems with weather. This information sounds like it came out of the mouth of Sprint's competition.
There's also a big misconception about 'microwave.' Technically speaking anything over 1 ghz is microwave so things like wifi, cordless phones, cell phones (on 1800 and 1900 bands), wireless cameras, and lots of other stuff is on 'microwave' bands too. |
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rf_engineer
join:2003-08-04
USA
| reply to sporkme
Re: Not an issue at all
said by sporkme :said by blah :
Rain fade really is not an issue with Microwave links at all. I worked for a company for many years that used one and even under the most heavy rains we saw no issues at all. The link was about a 10-15mile distance too.
The piece sounds a bit FUD-infested. Unless this is some new, untested microwave technology, it doesn't really make sense. Well-engineered links should not have problems unless the signal is marginal to begin with. I agree. Microwave has been around for a long, long time and is well proven. Here's a site that chronicles a lot of the old AT&T networks: »long-lines.net/ . Some ill-informed people like to think microwave is some new, risky technology but it's been around longer than several other broadband technologies.
Microwave links are engineered using one of a handful of propagation/rain models which predict the annual availability. Getting the desired availability, whether it's four nines, five nines, or more is merely determining the appropriate antenna gains, transmitter powers, path distances and a few other key factors.
The upcoming wireless backhaul bandwidth crunch is going to be handled largely by hybrid fiber and microwave networks. There's just no way fiber is going to be able to reach rural sites and copper-based T1s from LECs just aren't going to cut it anymore.
Proxim has been around awhile, but they're not the only company offering broadband microwave. Other companies such as Ericsson, NEC, Alcatel, Harris-Stratex, Dragonwave, and Ceragon, to name a few, all offer licensed microwave solutions that you'll likely see deployed for wireless backhaul. |
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NOCMan
Verizon Fios User
Premium
join:2004-09-30
Flower Mound, TX
| WiMax Stpuid
There are companies up in Chicago what are selling 1GB backhaul links via WiMax.
WiMax is perfectly capable of handling it's own back haul through a distributed network between the WiMax towers.
Money posted an article 2-3 years ago saying if Sprint went with this method they could avoid 20 billion in back haul costs.
Clearly Sprint must of goofed on their design or something because they are obviously not using WiMax to it's fullest potential.
--
Mac Chatter
»www.macchatter.net |
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xenophon
join:2007-09-17
·Sprint Mobile Broa..
1 edit | WiMAX as a backhaul
It will be a couple years but when WiMAX 802.11n is released, it could be used as a backhaul for theoretically up to 1Gbps. Sprint/Clearwire also have the spectrum to do this, about 100Mhz spectrum per market, enough to technically do 1Gbps. But even if they use only 100-200Mbps, they'll be sitting well.
I don't think any other carrier has more than 20Mhz allocated nationwide for 4G. With Sprint/Clearwire having 100Mhz, they have a great deal more potential and opportunity than any US carrier. |
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keyboard5684
join:2001-08-01
Youngsville, PA
·Teliax VOIP
·WestPAnet Inc.
·WestPAnet Inc. CA..
| reply to sonnybadbutt
Re: Freq.
A good engineer knows it is going to rain, snow, fog, whatever and would plan for it. I have set up 20 mile links with towers at 105ft using Proxim gear. Make sure you compensate for the rain fade and other problems and it is fine.
This is really old news. Wireless links like this have been used for decades. |
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xenophon
join:2007-09-17
·Sprint Mobile Broa..
| reply to NOCMan
Re: WiMax Stpuid
Ah, we both posted idea of WiMAX backhaul at same time.
Methinks the reason Sprint is not using WiMAX yet as backhaul is because the repeater equipment isn't available yet. Sprint said very early on that they intend to use WiMAX as backhaul when it's ready to deploy.
Should really help dynamically manage bandwidth at many sites instead of piping fixed lines into each site. |
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rawgerz
In Debt we trust
Premium
join:2004-10-03
Grove City, PA
·Verizon Online DSL
·Sprint Mobile Broa..
| reply to keyboard5684
Re: Freq.
Wow, I hate to guess what they used to cost back then!
Looks like 60 GHz starts at $14,000 and 74 Ghz is $45,000!!  And I thought the 8K units were a lot
I don't know if that is per link, or radio but it's still helluva expensive! I really don't think Sprint can afford that right now..
--
You can't make all the people happy all of the time. But it should be common sense to shoot for the majority. |
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EPS
join:2008-02-13
Hingham, MA
| reply to xenophon
Re: WiMAX as a backhaul
VZW has 22 Mhz from the recent auction, which I guess is technically more than 20  Still a lot less than 100Mhz though.
I was looking at documents released by Sprint after the merger was announced, and the new Clearwire will indeed have a very impressive spectrum portfolio. |
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