 
anthonyc1234
@rr.com | wtf will this affect their business class users? i will cancel my service if it does. im already paying 100.00 monthy for 15/2 business class | |
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Nightfall
My Goal Is To Deny Yours
Premium,MVM
join:2001-08-03
Grand Rapids, MI
 ·Site5.com
 ·AT&T Midwest
 ·Comcast
| Re: wtf said by anthonyc1234 :
will this affect their business class users? i will cancel my service if it does. im already paying 100.00 monthy for 15/2 business class
Looks like this is only for home users. I highly doubt business class users will get hit with this. | |
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| iansltx
join:2007-02-19
Golden, CO | Only $100 a month? With a 3-year contract AND phone service it's $150 around here. With 1-year and no phone, it's $280! | |
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tad2020
join:2007-07-17
Orange, CA
·AT&T DSL Service
| Re: wtf When I was looking in to the business class line last year it was like $180/m for 15/1 with no phone.
If they bring caps and overages here, I'll cancel my account and my boss's 3 accounts. I'm not dealing with them any more if that's the route their going. | |
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tad2020
join:2007-07-17
Orange, CA
·AT&T DSL Service
| Re: wtf I was only looking in to getting a business line, but not for 4 times the price and also since they couldn't even offer any services at the location I needed. I've got 4 other locations with consumer HSI service with TWC, those are the ones I'm going to cancel if they throttle/cap/overages on any of them. I'm just getting really sick of my ISPs (TWC and AT&T), I wish I had another choice. | |
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ARGONAUT
got ping?
join:2006-01-24
New Albany, IN | cable gate keeper Lack of cable competition.  | |
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Dogfather
Premium
join:2007-12-26
Laguna Hills, CA
1 edit | LOL I just have to laugh and the level of greed at TWC. They aren't even trying to hide it any more.
But I'm sure the resident cable kiss-asses will make excuses for this as well and explain how these caps are great for all of us. | |
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FLengineer
Premium
join:2007-06-26
Leesburg, FL
2 edits | Re: LOL Reasonable caps are good for the general public on any network including FiOS. Comcast's 250GB caps are reasonable unlike the caps that TWC are going to use. I wonder which executive is getting the gold brick driveway first.
EDIT: grammar | |
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| | nasadude
join:2001-10-05
Rockville, MD
·Comcast
| Re: LOL said by FLengineer  :Reasonable caps are good for the general public... why are caps good for the public? It's not clear caps are even needed - the ISP reason is "the bandwidth hogs causing congestion at peak times so everybody suffers".
I call BS - Rogers was told to provide evidence of this "congestion" and it couldn't do it (the data it provided showed no problem).
just because a large ISP says it doesn't make it true. | |
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Dogfather
Premium
join:2007-12-26
Laguna Hills, CA
3 edits | Re: LOL And FiOS isn't anywhere near capacity and caps on their fiber networks would simply be greed, not need.
Let TWC demonstrate their cable systems are at capacity like Bell Canada tried to. | |
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FLengineer
Premium
join:2007-06-26
Leesburg, FL | Re: LOL And just to clarify....
I do NOT agree with the 20GB/40GB caps
I DO agree with the 250GB cap | |
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| | | | | | MrSpock29
join:2008-02-09
Hammonton, NJ
| Re: LOL said by FLengineer :And just to clarify.... I do NOT agree with the 20GB/40GB caps I DO agree with the 250GB cap a 250 Gb cap today is probably what 20 Gb was 5 years ago. I don't support capping at all, but if they did cap, and didn't raise them often, and substantially, you are slowing innovation and creation that relies heavily on the internet.
Those movies you download? Sure is nice to do that instead of getting in your car and paying $4 or more per gallon of gas isn't it? | |
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nixen
Rockin' the Boxen
Premium
join:2002-10-04
Alexandria, VA
·Cox HSI
·Speakeasy
| said by FLengineer :Example from personal experience. I am on Comcast, Everynight around 11:30 my HSI speed drops to about 1Mb/s until 8:00 or so the next morning. I called Comcast because I can't watch Netflix without pauses. Comcast said they would look into it. A week later I don't have any problems and one of my neighbors mentioned he got a letter from Comcast about running P2P. I can only assume this was the cause of my problems but I never asked him for more info. This is an isolated incident relative to my neighborhood only however if there are 5% of the subscribers nationwide using 50% of the network resources then If they get rid of those users by using caps then 95% of users will be much happier with the ISP. That would be less an example of whether caps are appropriate than is flow-control appropriate.
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The trouble with the world is that the stupid are cocksure and the intelligent are full of doubt. -- Bertrand Russell | |
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Dogfather
Premium
join:2007-12-26
Laguna Hills, CA | Re: LOL It's of an example of how Comcast shouldn't be spending $250M on new furniture and video walls and fix these individual cable systems that have issues. | |
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annanananas
@comcast.net | It's thier funds to do as they wish. I could see complaining about the government misusing funds because you dont have a choice but to pay taxes, but no one's forcing you to use comcast. | |
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FLengineer
Premium
join:2007-06-26
Leesburg, FL | Still need to define "Bandwidth Hog". At what point do you get lower priority packets.? | |
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nixen
Rockin' the Boxen
Premium
join:2002-10-04
Alexandria, VA
·Cox HSI
·Speakeasy
1 edit | Re: LOL said by FLengineer :Still need to define "Bandwidth Hog". At what point do you get lower priority packets.? What you're failing to understand is that caps don't protect you against congestion.
Ok, so your neighbor has X gigabytes per month to play with. That still means that, while he may not be able to do it for the entire month, until he's blown through those X gigabytes, he still has 100% of the capability of impacting your experience. What have caps really bought you and the other service users?
The only thing that caps do is introduce overage fears. Those really only last as long as it take for people to figure out how much data they can actually move and how long it takes to move it. Once they've figured out the boundaries, caps become fairly ineffective. It's part of the reason why companies that implement caps tend to be loathe to reveal just what the caps actually are.
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The trouble with the world is that the stupid are cocksure and the intelligent are full of doubt. -- Bertrand Russell | |
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pspcrazy
Anime Freak
join:2008-02-06
San Diego, CA
·DSL EXTREME
| You know even with a 100 GB cap I can still congest a crappy network in minutes, and it'll take around... a week for it to stop, caps won't help congestion much it'll just cost the end user more. Congestion occurs when more then the expected amount of users want to actually use their service like expected. | |
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| | | | | | nasadude
join:2001-10-05
Rockville, MD
·Comcast
| Re: LOL said by FLengineer :...YOU paid for that upgrade. ... ALL customers of the ISP pay for the upgrade and ALL consumers benefit from the upgrade. | |
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join:2002-04-05
Jamaica, NY | Re: LOL Thats communism!!!!! | |
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| | | | | jimk
Premium
join:2006-04-15
Raleigh, NC
·AT&T Southeast
·RoadRunner Cable
| said by FLengineer :Example from personal experience. I am on Comcast, Everynight around 11:30 my HSI speed drops to about 1Mb/s until 8:00 or so the next morning. I called Comcast because I can't watch Netflix without pauses. Comcast said they would look into it. A week later I don't have any problems and one of my neighbors mentioned he got a letter from Comcast about running P2P. I can only assume this was the cause of my problems but I never asked him for more info. To me, this indicates that they are selling more than they can deliver in your area. If it was in fact that one person causing your performance to drop that badly, that indicates a capacity problem as far as I am concerned.
I'm not saying that people should leave P2P applications running full tilt 24/7 or anything, but the cable companies do encourage heavy use by constantly increasing speeds. Then, when people use them, the ISP gets all upset because they can't deliver what they promise. | |
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| | | elwoodblues
Elwood Blues
join:2006-08-30
Toronto, ON
| said by nasadude :said by FLengineer :Reasonable caps are good for the general public... why are caps good for the public? It's not clear caps are even needed - the ISP reason is "the bandwidth hogs causing congestion at peak times so everybody suffers". I call BS - Rogers was told to provide evidence of this "congestion" and it couldn't do it (the data it provided showed no problem). just because a large ISP says it doesn't make it true. Actually it was Bell | |
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BF69
join:2004-07-28
Camden, TN
| said by nasadude :said by FLengineer :Reasonable caps are good for the general public... why are caps good for the public? It's not clear caps are even needed - the ISP reason is "the bandwidth hogs causing congestion at peak times so everybody suffers". I call BS - Rogers was told to provide evidence of this "congestion" and it couldn't do it (the data it provided showed no problem). just because a large ISP says it doesn't make it true. So you rather have it now with ISPs and there secret caps which you don't know what they are or if you're hitting them? If your conenction all of sudden slows down is there an issue somewhere or did you hit the secret cap? Yes MUCH better system now. | |
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BF69
join:2004-07-28
Camden, TN
| Re: LOL said by Dogfather :TW doesn't have secret caps (at least that I know of). That's why they are called SECRET caps. | |
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Dogfather
Premium
join:2007-12-26
Laguna Hills, CA | Re: LOL My point is I haven't seen (personally or in the forums here) anyone tossed from RR like I have from Comcast.
Can you provide examples of people tossed off RR for excessive use? | |
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dvd536
as Mr. Pink as they come
Premium
join:2001-04-27
Phoenix, AZ
| said by nasadude :said by FLengineer :Reasonable caps are good for the general public... why are caps good for the public? It's not clear caps are even needed - the ISP reason is "the bandwidth hogs causing congestion at peak times so everybody suffers". its not the bandwidth hogs but the lack of network/capacity upgrades.
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When I gez aju zavateh na nalechoo more new yonooz tonigh molinigh - Ken Lee | |
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Dogfather
Premium
join:2007-12-26
Laguna Hills, CA | Re: LOL So far no terrestrial ISP has demonstrated a nationwide network capacity problem (that warrants nationwide cap policies). | |
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FLengineer
Premium
join:2007-06-26
Leesburg, FL | Upgrades that wouldn't be necessary if the top 5% of the customers wasn't running P2P 24/7. | |
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Bellundo
@teksavvy.com | How could there ever be congestion on bell sympatico? The whole network including the 3rd party providers are speed thottled down to 30 kilobytes per second down and 30 kilobytes per second up when 95 percent of the subscribers are awake. | |
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BabyBear
Keep wise ...with Night-Owl
join:2007-01-11
| Beep! Your now capped! Beep! Beep! Its funny they say "No surprises", except of course doubt anyone using the 7mb would NOT be surprised by a new 20gb cap on their service.
Would hate to be one of their CSR's, they are going to get some nasty calls in the future. From people who sign up with open WiFi, people with 3-4 family members working off that 20gb cap in a matter of a week or so, etc..  | |
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Millenniumle
join:2007-11-11
Fredonia, NY
| ... When I look back it occurs to me that I didn't get internet access until unlimited access became available. I wasn't interested in cap and fee then and not surprisingly I'm not now either.
I like to think they are shooting themselves in the foot with this, but then I think of cell phones. People are willing to pay. Shoot, in my home we have inexpensive, reliable, unlimited VoIP and my wife pays for cell phones for herself and our oldest.  | |
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| averagedude
join:2002-01-30
Mesa, AZ
·Cox HSI
| Re: ... said by Millenniumle :When I look back it occurs to me that I didn't get internet access until unlimited access became available. I wasn't interested in cap and fee then and not surprisingly I'm not now either. 2nd | |
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pitroad01
join:2006-07-10
Raleigh, NC
 ·Time Warner VOIP
·RoadRunner Cable
| not in PLG contract I recently switched to the PLG plan (added digital phone service) and I can't find any mention in my contract concerning 'consumption allowance'. I am in the Raleigh, NC service area. Are these caps a Texas market only thing or am I missing something ? | |
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MacLeech
The one and only
Premium
join:2001-07-14
SoCal
1 edit | Re: not in PLG contract said by pitroad01 :Are these caps a Texas market only thing or am I missing something ? It's a TRIAL in one area in one TWC division in Texas.
There are more TWC customers with Powerboost or Pivot than caps....
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Don't mind me, I'm just trying to help...
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fireflier
Coffee. . .Need Coffee
Premium
join:2001-05-25
Limbo | Re: not in PLG contract Dumb question: What's "Pivot"? | |
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MacLeech
The one and only
Premium
join:2001-07-14
SoCal
| Re: not in PLG contract Pivot was the TWC branded Sprint cell phone service, it was actually supported by a group of cable companies.
It started a couple years ago in several TWC markets until Sprint announced they were bailing out on the project a few months ago.
See this for more info: »www.multichannel.com/article/CA6427970.html | |
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Vertickle
join:2003-08-05
Madison, AL | What? No rollover bytes? Maybe they should offer rollover bytes so you can have extra "padding" for the long months (31 days).  | |
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| jimk
Premium
join:2006-04-15
Raleigh, NC
1 edit | Re: TW Users, let them know what you think I've sent them my feedback twice and haven't heard back once, despite an autoreply saying I would get a reply within 24 hours. First email was as a Road Runner customer (different market, though), second email was as a former customer. | |
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navalpatel
join:2003-07-28
Lubbock, TX
| All Caps Aren't Evil I was with Comcast before TWC took over my area (North Texas). I generally thought the 250GB hidden caps were reasonable, but the 5-40GB caps that are being touted are ridiculous. My home doesn't use more than 100GB in a given month - more around 50GB, but to set caps so low only to expect users to go over... sinisterly brilliant on their part.
Luckily, I do have FIOS in my neighborhood so as soon as these caps creep my way (long shot, I know), I will make the switch. | |
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| jimk
Premium
join:2006-04-15
Raleigh, NC
·AT&T Southeast
·RoadRunner Cable
1 edit | Re: All Caps Aren't Evil said by navalpatel :I generally thought the 250GB hidden caps were reasonable, but the 5-40GB caps that are being touted are ridiculous. The overage costs for Time Warner are too high as well. Look at what amazon.com charges for their S3 service... as low as $0.10 per GB (upload) or $0.10 - $0.17 for downloads, and a decent amount of that is likely to be profit. Keep in mind they have an SLA and target businesses, and businesses pay more than residential customers.
Since amazon.com is not an ISP, they probably pay more for bandwidth as well, especially with all of the redundant connections. | |
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| | | jimk
Premium
join:2006-04-15
Raleigh, NC
·AT&T Southeast
·RoadRunner Cable
| Re: All Caps Aren't Evil said by espaeth :Amazon's bandwidth is provided over a small number of high-capacity circuits, and they are all concentrated into their data center locations. Broadband ISPs need to have a vastly more complex network that delivers capacity right to your house. Unless you live within the 100meter Ethernet spec of an Amazon DC to handoff to one of their access switch, you can't compare the costs. But the connections to your house aren't anywhere near as complex, nor do they have the redundancy. Obviously the costs between the example I listed and a residential ISP are far different, that info was just provided as a point of reference.
If it was really costing this much ($1/gig) to deliver the bandwidth to a home, caps would have probably been in place from the start. | |
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CableMeNot
@rr.com
| RedBox Lives! Unless Verizon follows suit (and they have little reason to), this is like an automatic endorsement for Fios.
I suspect this play will be short-lived. It will get them in more trouble than forcing HSN and spanish channels and "digital tiers" ever did.
But if not, I'll just go back to my text email account and watching rented DVDs. Their loss, not mine. | |
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tiger72
SexaT duorP
Premium
join:2001-03-28
Saint Louis, MO
clubs:
 ·T-Mobile US
·RoadRunner Cable
| Re: RedBox Lives! said by CableMeNot :
Unless Verizon follows suit (and they have little reason to), this is like an automatic endorsement for Fios.
I suspect this play will be short-lived. It will get them in more trouble than forcing HSN and spanish channels and "digital tiers" ever did.
But if not, I'll just go back to my text email account and watching rented DVDs. Their loss, not mine.
as long as you pay them for cable, don't expect any changes
--
"What makes us omniscient? Have we a record of omniscience? ...If we can't persuade nations with comparable values of the merit of our cause, we'd better reexamine our reasoning."
-United States Secretary of Defense (1961-1968) Robert S. McNamara | |
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Jason Levine
Premium
join:2001-07-13
USA
| Any way to track your usage? I have Time Warner cable and while I'm not in their test market, I'm concerned about this issue. I would track how much bandwidth I use, but my problem is that I have three computers (two laptops, one desktop) that use the Internet. One of those uses the Internet from home and from work. Is there a reliable way to track how many GB I'm using per month across multiple computers? | |
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nasadude
join:2001-10-05
Rockville, MD
·Comcast
| artificial scarcity this is what no competition enables.
it is very likely there are no congestion problems that upgrading some nodes couldn't fix. why do that, however, when you can spread FUD about "bandwidth hogs", then proceed to implement caps to "fix" the "problem".
voila! the ISP bandwidth is now "scarce" and must be mitigated via caps on customers and per bit overage charges.
silly consumers! savvy ISPs don't upgrade networks, they institute caps! | |
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jchambers28
join:2007-05-12
Alma, AR | if that happend to me if that happend to me I would go the dsl route | |
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| | nasadude
join:2001-10-05
Rockville, MD
·Comcast
| Re: if that happend to me unfortunately, I have only one route - comcast.
if they implement caps, the first time I go over and have to pay extra, I will cancel comcast video service and go to over the air. I can do without 500 video channels of crap, but not my broadband (1 billion channels of crap!). | |
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Hall
Premium,MVM
join:2000-04-28
Dayton, OH | Where's saber11 ? Where's saber11 ?  | |
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funchords
Hello
Premium,MVM
join:2001-03-11
Washington, DC |  Congestion Control or COMPETITION Control -- Make No Mistake
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annoyed
@mycingular.net
| caps show either infrastructure or money problems the only two reasons for an ISP to use caps is either because they are forecasting bandwidth problems, in which case network upgrades are needed or, as others have stated, marketing sees an easy buck to make so set the caps low so people will go over.
high resolution video, gaming, voip, email, streaming, downloading, uploading, browsing, etc
if your network can handle it, caps are not necessary. if it can't, upgrade it. ISP's need to stop complaining, they are being paid to provide a service. | |
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Dogfather
Premium
join:2007-12-26
Laguna Hills, CA | Re: caps show either infrastructure or money problems No it shows competition problems.
They don't want to lose VOD revenue to the likes of DirecTV VOD, Amazon Unbox, iTunes Movie Rentals, Netflix or any of the other emerging online video competitors. | |
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viperpa33s
Why Me?
Premium
join:2002-12-20
Bradenton, FL
·Bright House
| Get less to save less Get less to save less is what they should be advertising. TWC really hasn't changed anything with the Triple Play except giving you less and adding extra fees.
Right now, Verizon 3mb DSL is more of a value than TWC 7mb Cable internet. Verizon DSL maybe slower but your not limited to what you can do and you don't get charged extra for doing it.
TWC don't understand there customers very well. TWC will just turn into another Dell or Sprint, high churn rate will be the norm.
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tmc8080
join:2004-04-24
Floral Park, NY
| dancing in the streets.. yeah, you've got consumers dancing in the streets over $4-5 / gallon gasoline too! hopefully twc loses enough customers for their trial balloon that they won't ever pull a stunt such as this again. shouldn't even still be talking about it.
there is one end of the internet industry trying to make the price per gigabyte so infinitesimal that it's use can enable a whole variety of new services distributed over the internet such as video/broadcasting. this would virtually wipe out locally distributed content providers' monopoly due to the strong probability that ultra high speed data networks will be used for piracy that could supplant cable-tv services, not just music, television shows & first-run movies!
at the other end of the spectrum, you've got media companies (time warner IS a relative media giant in the US) trying to find some way of leveraging a "glut of bandwidth" and call it a "drought of both bandwidth & infrastructure" that an ultra low "limit" be based on each consumer above which surcharges should be applied, such as back in the good old days of telegraph, local & long distance phone calls, and now the same strategy applied to internet data.
the argument for paying more and getting less even in the days of $5 gasoline (for our international audience $130/US barrel of oil) when it comes to internet data transmission defies all logic & common sense.
the companies who provide cable-tv service & internet access are at a crossroads of sorts.. their business model, much as we've seen with the music industry is evaporating out from under them, and $1 per gigabyte is a shot across the bow to consumers.. to say if you "pirate" we'll be forced to price collude in the "last mile" to earn back revenue lost from intellectual property... but too bad to say it, but it won't work! things are going to get a whole lot worse before they get any better for "MSO"'s... Especially with companies such as Verizon breathing down their neck with 50/100mbit services on the immediate horizon in NYC! | |
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ispjournalist
@speakeasy.net
| also not mentioned . . . Price caps help the phone and cable monopolies because prices are going down, so a "price lock" should hurt you.
These days, the monopolies are maintaining the same price but offering more bandwidth for it. Would a price lock guarantee lock you out of additional bandwidth? I'll leave that to those reading the fine print. | |
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Go from std 20GB to 40GB for extra $9.95
