Lenagainster
join:2005-01-07
Silver Spring, MD
 ·VoicePulse
 ·DIRECTV
·magicjack.com
| Not surprising
Most folks are not that technically astute when it comes to VoIP. Most folks don't even know what VoIP means. Tell them to plug in the TA to the router and you'll get a blank stare. So when Commiecast says we will give you unlimited calling for $25 and throw in a few features with it, and let you keep your precious phone number, and Commiecast does all the work to set it up, sure they will go for it. It's less than the $50 plus they were paying to the landline company. Relatively few are technically saavy enough and brave enough to venture into the world of independent VoIP providers and get a much better deal for even less $$. |
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lengyelc
join:2005-12-11
Alpharetta, GA
·AT&T CallVantage
 ·AT&T U-Verse
1 edit | Agree 100%, and so will just about everyone reading this thread. People don't have the time to mess with home wiring, QoS routers and/or firmware flashing, and all those other hardware/software tricks that are required to get a nice stable voip connection through a third party provider.
Comcast certainly preys on customer stupidity. Have you seen their commercials? Those alone were enough to make me puke and change providers! |
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Chris 313
Come get some
Premium
join:2004-07-18
Houma, LA
clubs:
 ·Comcast
·Comcast
·Charter Pipeline
·Comcast Digital Vo..
·AT&T CallVantage
| reply to Lenagainster
said by Lenagainster  :Most folks are not that technically astute when it comes to VoIP. Most folks don't even know what VoIP means. Tell them to plug in the TA to the router and you'll get a blank stare. So when Commiecast says we will give you unlimited calling for $25 and throw in a few features with it, and let you keep your precious phone number, and Commiecast does all the work to set it up, sure they will go for it. It's less than the $50 plus they were paying to the landline company. Relatively few are technically saavy enough and brave enough to venture into the world of independent VoIP providers and get a much better deal for even less $$. Less money sure, but what about 911 service and having phone when the power goes out?
I got Comcast Digital Voice now and it works like a charm, even when I don't have power. That's worth the money to me. |
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ftth_freak
join:2005-06-17
Ballwin, MO
| reply to lengyelc
Re: YOUR WRONG
Obviously you are technically lacking in VoIP knowledge. Cable Co's like Comcast, Time Warner, Charter, Cox and others use an entirely separate CMTS and separate return and forward signal than their cable modem system. This insures the QoS for the cable co's VoIP/phone service. For all of you P2P defenders, this mean when you are sucking up all of the upload and downoad capacity in your neighborhood with your cable modem, the VoIP/phone CMTS will not be affected. When using a third party VoIP like Vonage, Vonage piggy backs off of the same bandwidth as your cable modem and thus will be affected by the users bandwidth habits.
For instance, a user who pays for the lowest level of modem speed and uses Vonage will hear a degraded quality of voice and could also experiance dropped call if the down/up load a large file at the same time.
FYI...all things are not created equal in reality...only in your mind. |
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fatmanskinny
Premium
join:2004-01-04
Wandering
·Comcast Digital Vo..
·Comcast
| Ya think?
Hmm, I can get "Triple Play" from one provider or I can song and dance with 3 different providers. Most people are going to go for the one-stop deal. I did Comcast Digital Voice because it is $19.99 a month for one year and I have everything unlimited (except internet downloads, lol!).
I save over $50 a month. Being that my wife is still unemployed (and looking as hard as ever!), we have to save and cut spending where ever we can.
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The only place where Success comes before Work is in the dictionary. |
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fatmanskinny
Premium
join:2004-01-04
Wandering | reply to ftth_freak
Re: YOUR WRONG
That was a great post. Thanks for educating me. I sure as hell didn't know that!
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The only place where Success comes before Work is in the dictionary. |
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Dogfather
Premium
join:2007-12-26
Laguna Hills, CA | Not shocked at all
With the HORRIBLE service I had with Vonage, to the failure of Sunrocket and the dismal performance of ViaTalk, it's certainly not shocking that the indy VoIP providers are bleeding customers. |
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Kearnstd
Elf Wizard
Premium
join:2002-01-22
Mullica Hill, NJ
| reply to Lenagainster
Re: Not surprising
Vonage also cant roll a truck for no Dialtone and your ISP has zero obligation for rapid repair service to your broadband just because its your Vonage. to the ISP Vonage is just another data source and your "HSI out" will be worked in when there is time.
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[65 Arcanist]Filan(High Elf) Zone: Broadband Reports |
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Gandalf1315
Freelance Philosopher
join:2001-05-23
Indianapolis, IN
·RoadRunner Cable
·Vonage
| This is only taking into account the U.S. market.
The article only talks about the United States based VOIP subscribers. Unlike Comcast and the other cable companies, Vonage is not limited to the U.S. market. So the over all growth of Vonage mentioned in this article is inaccurate to say the least. They are not taking into account all of the Canadian and United Kingdom based subscribers that Vonage has overall and have added in the last year.
I am not denying that their growth rate has slowed in the last year here in the United States, but that dont mean they have not made up for it in the Canadian and U.K. markets.
At any rate, we know they have roughly 2.5 million U.S customers. At $20 a month per customer they are still grossing $50 million a month. Between having access to International markets that the cable companies dont, and still seeing growth of 200,000 last year during a recession, I dont think Vonage will be leaving the playing field any time soon unless they are bought out for BIG DOLLARS.
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No man's life, liberty or fortune is safe while our legislature is in session.--- Benjamin Franklin |
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MacLeech
The one and only
Premium
join:2001-07-14
SoCal
2 edits | reply to ftth_freak
Re: YOUR WRONG
said by ftth_freak : Cable Co's like Comcast, Time Warner, Charter, Cox and others use an entirely separate CMTS and separate return and forward signal than their cable modem system. Cable co's COULD do that, but the most don't.
Most setup separate service flows over the same upstream/downstream channels the cable modems use. Phone services are given higher priority and guaranteed bandwidth so general internet use doesn't impact phone service.
If the cable companies were using separate CMTSs or even just separate upstream/downstream channels they couldn't provision eMTAs to allow for both internet access and phone service from the same unit as current DOCSIS 1 and 2 modems can't tune to more than 1 upstream and 1 downstream channel at a time.
Companies that REQUIRE seperate phone and internet modems may be using separate channels or CMTSs but that's pretty rare.
The nice thing about cable co's VOIP implementations is that they DON'T route voice traffic over the internet like 3rd party VOIP providers HAVE to. Cable can keep the traffic on their own private network (on it's own VLAN) until they hand it off to PSTN providers if needed for an off-net call. Some cable providers also have agreements and links with others so they can directly hand off traffic to each other without 3rd party network involvement. If both ends of the call are on cable VOIP, the call traffic may not even leave the cable providers' networks.
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Don't mind me, I'm just trying to help...
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NetAdmin
CCNA
join:2008-05-22
| I'll stick with my small VoIP carrier
I've been with a small, independent VoIP carrier and have been VERY happy with the price, the quality and the reliability of the service I get from them. I could use the VoIP product from the cable company, but unlimited long-distance is $20 more than what I'm paying now. As long as my family is spread out all over the nation, I'll stick with my VoIP carrier.
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Eleven years of carrying The Clue Bat... |
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Cabal
Premium
join:2007-01-21
Boston, MA
| reply to Lenagainster
Re: Not surprising
There's also the fact that Comcast's VoIP offering is technically superior to the 3rd-party vendors because they segregate and ensure the bandwidth for you.
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Interested in open source engine management for your Subaru? |
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baj475
join:2004-11-02
Chico, CA
·Future Nine Corpor..
| reply to Chris 313
Re: what about 911 service having phone when the power goes out.
Chris,
My Magicjacks and Future-Nine lines have 911 or E911 service and since my router, ATA and computers are backed up by a UPS, I have phone service if the electric utility's service goes out.
While I have Comcast HSI, their Digital Voice is not even in the ball park compared to what I pay for my Magicjacks and Future-Nine lines. |
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ptrowski
Got Helix?
Premium
join:2005-03-14
Putnam, CT
clubs: | reply to Dogfather
Re: Not shocked at all
Actually, once I went away from a cable provider and moved to DSL my VoIP quality increased greatly. I got two years of service from Viatalk for $198. Hard to beat that. |
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funchords
Hello
Premium,MVM
join:2001-03-11
Washington, DC
 ·Verizon Online DSL
·Skype
| reply to ftth_freak
Re: YOUR WRONG ... and so are you ... and who cares?
said by ftth_freak :Obviously you are technically lacking in VoIP knowledge. I think the above sentence ought to be banned from DSLReports. We're all here to learn. Otherwise we're just showing off.
said by ftth_freak :Cable Co's like Comcast, Time Warner, Charter, Cox and others use an entirely separate CMTS and separate return and forward signal than their cable modem system. Comcast has elected to use the same return as their High-Speed Internet. But then they use DOCSIS service flows to carve out space (in the already crowded upstream) for it.
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Robb Topolski -= funchords.com =- Hillsboro, Oregon
More fun, more features, Join BroadbandReports.com, it's free...
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SuperCPA
Premium
join:2002-11-28
Dayton, OH | Let's All Forget About The Cable vs. Broadband Connection
It does not matter. It all VoIP.
Amen |
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Scree
In the pipe 5 by 5
join:2001-04-24
Mount Laurel, NJ | heh
Well at least for folks who know what they're doing, Vonage is a LOT CHEAPER than the cable company's offering (which continues to rise no matter how many new subscribers they claim to be adding). |
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tmc8080
join:2004-04-24
Floral Park, NY
| Premium for Cable Voip vs 3rd party Voip.
Let's keep in mind, cable companies have a SMALL advantage due to the nature of how they allocate bandwidth for their voip service, prioritizing it as separate bandwidth (in most cases) than regular internet data. 3rd party carriers have no such luxury, so in that sense Cable voip is closer to a POTS line as you might get with VOIP. Another thing to know is that while there are new players such as skype & magicjack trying to claim a niche with ultra-low yearly unlimited pricing... carriers such as Vonage have repeatedly shot themselves in the foot by advertising head-to-head with big phone & cable companies! This put them in the line of fire with patent lawsuits and poor financial decisions which have forced them to raise prices. They also add account termination fees/unfees to be greedier than the average Voip company making them barely any value compared to other Voip offerings. This coupled with the fact that many of these companies are barely a decade old (most of them) there were bound to be those that got handed their hats for one reason or another. |
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pabster
join:2001-12-09
Waterloo, IA
·Mediacom
| 'Triple Play' VoIP isn't always better
Mediacom, for example, offers voice. And it sucks, big time. I much prefer Vonage, even though it costs a few dollars more.
It makes sense the cable providers would be at an advantage here. For example, I could take their VoIP and pay only about $4 more (as I'm being docked for not taking their television services.) But I still choose to stick with Vonage. Price isn't everything to me.
Naturally most folks like having their tv/phone/internet all on one bill and that $99 deal always sucks them in. |
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benc
Premium
join:2007-06-17
Glen Carbon, IL
·Charter Pipeline
·Future Nine Corpor..
·Callcentric
·AT&T Midwest
| Power of Marketing
Many people have pointed out the simplicity of cable phone, for those who aren't tech savvy. Some have also pointed out the fact that using cable phone meaning combining everything onto a single bill (something I can care less about...I don't happen to bundle anything since I just want the best service).
These smaller VOIP providers have the disadvantage here. Around here, Charter has been aggressively marketing their cable phone. You see many ads on TV about it, and you ever hear ads on the radio. Sometimes I see Vonage ads, but not so much. Although they sell in Best Buy, or at least used to (I haven't been to a Best Buy in awhile...high prices and they often don't carry what I need).
My point is that people often don't know about these VOIP providers.
Ask any regular Joe or Jane what Callcentric or Broadvoice is, and they'll probably say "who's that?" And forget about Future Nine. If it weren't for DSLR I never would've heard about them.
I don't see this changing until the marketing changes. How will people buy if they aren't aware of the product? Me, I will actually seek out a company to see if someone provides something. But I don't know how many others will do the same thing. |
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