Read this before copying and pasting in Security http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r11455660 en Sun, 29 Nov 2009 18:59:04 EDT Sun, 29 Nov 2009 18:59:04 EDT Re: Read this before copying and pasting http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,11498947 Musicscom : The wording is backwards and Tim won't allow me to edit it!

Eckert and Mauchley are the progenitors.

I was just really angry about ASCAP stealing a hundred grand and forgot to check my context.

:D

The DCMA is mostly Amendments to the Copyright Act of 1976 (and Amendments Thereof), which is not obsolete and still stands as law. They don't just throw old laws out, they make new laws to amend the old laws and the new amendments have to conform to the older grandfathered law, unless specifically rescinded or amended by paragraph and section.

Wait til someone steals a hundred grand from you and leaves you shirtless!
:p
Waiting for people to send email so I can get the mailserver fulling working. Right now, Outlook will not send email, nor Internet Explorer, but ole Netscape 4.7 has no problem!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,11498947 Mon, 04 Oct 2004 15:13:23 EDT Re: Read this before copying and pasting http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,11498864 NetFixer :
said by Musicscom See Profile:
Just quickly, why'd you post the ad thing from the page? Is there something wrong with it? If so, send email to:

abuse@Musics.com

There was no flaming intended, in fact neither your name nor your web site was explicitly mentioned by me in regard to the updated.com advertisement/link. It was intended as a heads up to the progenitor of your Internet* and a Security Professional that perhaps he should take a closer look at the person/company with whom he was doing business.

BTW: I am glad to see that you finally seem to have your smtp server running.

said by Musicscom See Profile:

One was about who founded the Internet. A lot of people did. I worked for two of them, co-authors of various RFC's including RFC 6 from Rand Org. I never said I invented it,

No you did not explicitly claim to have invented the internet, I believe that Al Gore is the person who allegedly claimed to have invented the internet. It seems that you did however claim to be the progenitor of your Internet*.

* See web post dated 2004-01-18 15:15:15 at »www.oreillynet.com/cs/user/view/wlg/2425

(EDIT: spelling correction)
Words of wisdom: If you do not wish to to have your public statements quoted, do not make public statements.
--
I never found the companion that was so companionable as solitude.
The man who goes alone can start today; but he who travels with another must wait till that other is ready, and it may be a long time before they get off.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,11498864 Mon, 04 Oct 2004 15:02:45 EDT Re: Read this before copying and pasting http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,11497445 DrStrange : Anything related to copyright and dated 1995 is obsolete. Copyright laws were revised around the time the infamous DMCA came into being.

IANAL [I am a librarian [MLS], however], but I think most, if not all, of what I've seen in this forum is clearly Fair Use.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,11497445 Mon, 04 Oct 2004 11:51:21 EDT Re: Read this before copying and pasting http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,11497147 Name Game : Posted by Musicscom:
"In plain terms, it's just not right to attack someone or their work with lies about their work or them."

What is all that ??

I am not interested in hey mod any of your posts..but why all that self promoting in your above post ??

I would think if all that stuff you just wrote is that important to you..start a public diary here at DSLR rather than sprinkled in this copyright problem you seem to have going posted in this Security Forum.
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Gladiator Security Forum »www.gladiator-antivirus.com/ Missing Kids »www.missingkids.com/]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,11497147 Mon, 04 Oct 2004 11:08:12 EDT Re: Read this before copying and pasting http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,11496714 Musicscom : Just quickly, why'd you post the ad thing from the page? Is there something wrong with it? If so, send email to:

abuse@Musics.com

Just put that in while testing the mailserver.

The excerpt is entirely mine. You have to educate the public. Someone once posted the entire web page, now that ticked me off because I do these things right off of the top of my head to avoid any copyright challenges. And what got me was that they posted it in a completely nasty, flaming, derogatory, and defaming manner. No one deserves to be baited here, but a lot of that goes on and that's the beginning of every flame. Often people try to place the blame elsewhere by hitting the "heymods" button after they've been called on their flame. I don't use that button because I've been able to take the worst criticisms over the years. The person that posted the flaming copy of my website couldn't take honest criticism, so they resorted to namecalling and defamation. I couldn't even answer because it got locked. Which left me at the mercy of his lies.

One was about who founded the Internet. A lot of people did. I worked for two of them, co-authors of various RFC's including RFC 6 from Rand Org. I never said I invented it, I said I was part of the development of the PC, and I was, working under two well known professors. While everyone claims invention of the PC, including Steven Jobs and others, Dr. Wirth at Intel stated uncategorically that they had done nothing more than copy the actual architecture of Mainframes in Time Magazine, December 1996, as I recall, the date is from memory. In essence, all microprocessors were copies of mainframes, that is what he said. He said that when asked about the design of the 64-bit microprocessors Intel was working on at the time. Professors Eckert and Mauchley, and their colleagues, and students actually founded the Internet. Quite literally tens of thousands of people working at tens, maybe hundreds, of companies. It was all of those people that founded the Internet, not one guy, not one memo, not one RFC, but hardworking Americans from many walks of life and many different jobs. To credit the Internet to one person or one group would be like saying the the Space program is the result of one person's efforts; it just ain't so. I only remember the names of the professors I worked for, J. Presper Eckert and John Mauchley. But I also worked with various teams and engineers from IBM, Xerox, AT&T, Honeywell, Sperry, Rand, and others. And there were an aweful lot of military personnel around! Unix has a similar history involving a consortium, and not just Berkeley, or as we called it "Berzerkeley." BSD may take the credit, but they did nothing alone and are not responsible for the full Unix or Linux.

I had 2,000 employees under me as Assistant to the Senior Project Design Engineer. It's not a fairy tale, it's a fact. So, just as Eric Howes gets a little ticked when someone tells him he doesn't know what he's talking about, so do I. I witnessed at least one post where the same set of networking and security groupies did the same thing to him and was not surprised that he didn't like it.

Networking and Security are toys that I play with on my servers. These servers serve a music publishing company and assorted music industry interests, such as recording artists, bands, etc. What I do and did in computers is just a job taken on to support the music, no more. Music is first for me in everything I do. Computers and the industry are not as important to me. That is to say, I'd rather buy a Les Paul than an IBM Server anyday. Because my first business is music, but that doesn't mean I'm not an expert in computers and engineering. Sometimes, life just happens that way.

All of my content is original, with the exceptions of links and their content.

I do the same with music, sit down and let it flow. I don't copy others, I don't look at their content for my content, and I've come up with some very creative ways to do graphics and dress things up. So that, in the end, I know that it is all my copyrighted work. Then, I register it with the Library of Congress.

I'm in a major copyright infringement case right now with the likes of RIAA, NMPA, MPAA, ASCAP. I'm the Plaintiff, they are the copyright infringers. I don't support picking on high shoolers and collegians for downloading a few, or more, songs, just like Janis Ian and a few others in the music business, because we all know that the real thieves are the RIAA, NMPA, MPAA, and ASCAP. As a member, trying to make them do the right thing is not as easy as it looks.

I looked up Nicholas Papadopoulos, to find a professor, and a domain owner, and a cartographer, among others. The one that doesn't pay at updated.com is no matter, he'll just get the boot. I had some nice pay from a Las Vegas outfit some years back, but dropped them. I'd like to drop it all, owing as all advertising seems to be nothing but the same old scam that advertising always is.

And the other guy's right, I was thinking of Pappagiorgio.

Fair Use is applied with something judges call being "reasonable." Quotes are fine, if they're credited, for analysis whole paragraphs seem okay. But even as little as seven notes from "Alone Again" can cause a lawsuit and criminal prosecution, as was one case listed at Columbia's law site [Three Brothers Music, if I remember correctly]. Mostly Fair Use depends on the actual usage. Criticism of the piece itself in a regular publishing medium is okay, most of the time, but it's always up to the orginal Author to decide that because he owns all of the rights, by both law and by judicial precedence. While outright attacks and full repdroduction for no other purpose than to hurt the Author or his works, company, etc., are not okay.

The reason he owns all of the rights and can prevent publication is just for that reason to protect himself and his works from malicious and unfounded attacks. Such attacks can defame the character of the Author and the work. That doesn't mean valid criticism, it means malicious criticism designed to impune the reputation of the Author. The equivalent of flaming, and recognised as flaming long before the term was coined on the Internet.

In plain terms, it's just not right to attack someone or their work with lies about their work or them.

:)

(C)2004 CyberSongs
ALL RIGHTS RESERVED
Permission granted to publish on DSL Reports.com
by the Author and Copyright Owner.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,11496714 Mon, 04 Oct 2004 10:01:03 EDT Re: Read this before copying and pasting http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,11466751 novaflare : Personaly i always thought web master were stupid for not allowing people to copy paste news items etc off their site with or with out a link. Lets say you post some minor news item off my site »spellbound.valshea.com the forum or site gets 10k views and you dont post a link to my site whats going to end up happening is soe one will ask you where you found the news items you posted and youll give a link to it or they will simply select a portion of the text post it in to google with " and come up with my link. The end result is i just got a few hits to my site do to you posting that snipit. I dont make nothign off the one banner i have on my site but i still enjoy getting hits to my site. So in the end what i gt is some free advertiseing for my site. I sure as heck wont complain.

Now linking a image off my site is a diffrent story all togather thats just wrong it will suck up my band width and i have in the past blocked web sites from linking my images. Well not blocked them i just put a new image in its place with a nice "this image is not hosted on the site your viewing it on. They hae remotly linked to one hosted on my site."

Linking to images on another site is just wrong posting a news snippet isnt esp if you provide a link back to the original host.
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new 3d chat comunity at »planetvirtuel.com my site »spellbound.valshea.com/news.php]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,11466751 Thu, 30 Sep 2004 12:38:40 EDT Re: Read this before copying and pasting http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,11463464 raw :
said by Musicscom See Profile:
Nicholas Papadopoulas, from my knowledge, was a 17 year old kid that was a fictional character in a National Lampoon movie, one of the "Vacation" series of movies.
You're thinking of Nick Pappagiorgio, from Yuma, Arizona, who was Russell's (the son, who was about 17) alter ego that was of legal gambling age in Vegas Vacation. :)
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[BBR]raw
America's Army
BBR Enemy Territory clan founder]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,11463464 Wed, 29 Sep 2004 23:50:29 EDT Re: Read this before copying and pasting http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,11463354 siggyx : "If I make up my own stories, but base them on another work, my new work belongs to me."
False. U.S. Copyright law is quite explicit that the making of what are called "derivative works" -- works based or derived from another copyrighted work -- is the exclusive province of the owner of the original work. This is true even though the making of these new works is a highly creative process. If you write a story using settings or characters from somebody else's work, you need that author's permission.

LOL like i said but in plain old english. ;)
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The next best thing to being smart is being able to quote someone who is.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,11463354 Wed, 29 Sep 2004 23:37:32 EDT Re: Read this before copying and pasting http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,11463252 Name Game :
said by Musicscom See Profile:
For those who think Security is immune from Copyright Infringement actions:

»www.virtualschool.edu/mon/Electr···rightFAQ


Well might be a good idea is you are going to read Brad's stuff and/or post it..at least get into his current thoughts and I like him as a comedian too ;)

10 Big Myths about copyright explained

»www.templetons.com/brad/copymyths.html

Brief Intro to Copyright, a companion to the above
Solutions to the Copyright Crisis - an examination of the proposed answers from all camps to the crisis in Copyright.

»www.templetons.com/brad/

Oh the good old days ;)

Brad Templeton, publisher, ClariNet Communications Corp. info@clari.net
The net's #1 E-Newspaper (1,400,000 paid sbscrbrs.) »www.clari.net/brad/
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Gladiator Security Forum »www.gladiator-antivirus.com/ Missing Kids »www.missingkids.com/]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,11463252 Wed, 29 Sep 2004 23:26:23 EDT Re: Read this before copying and pasting http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,11463206 Name Game : :uhh:]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,11463206 Wed, 29 Sep 2004 23:21:05 EDT Re: Read this before copying and pasting http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,11462786 siggyx : Copyright, the lilltle magic "c" is not as powerful as people believe.

If the content of the site is not the product of the author "thier intellectaul property" they have not right to copyright it. This means that they cant cut and paste build a web page and then copyright the page. They can control the look or layout if it is original and new but the content would be deemed as public property or still belong to the origianl copyright holder if there was one.

In addition you have the right to use copyrighted material as long as you give credit to the copyright holder. Heres a great example. Do you think that Coke gave Pepsi permission to use there logo and product in thier commercials? No way, but Coke does insure that that recognize the holder of the copyright.
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The next best thing to being smart is being able to quote someone who is.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,11462786 Wed, 29 Sep 2004 22:31:16 EDT Re: Read this before copying and pasting http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,11461957 NetFixer :
said by Musicscom See Profile:
Nicholas Papadopoulas, from my knowledge, was a 17 year old kid that was a fictional character in a National Lampoon movie, one of the "Vacation" series of movies.

I don't know anything about the National Lampoon movie you mentioned. My reference to Nicholas Papadopoulos and updated.com had to do with a reference to the excerpt below taken from a web site. Perhaps the web site owner does not actually know with whom he is doing business. If that person is reading this forum post perhaps he might wish to search Google or Yahoo for "Nicholas Papadopoulos" and "updated.com". Since that person has previously laid claim to being the progenitor of your Internet, I had assumed that he knew with whom he was dealing.

Website Owners:Start making real money on a pay per click basis.10 cents!

said by Musicscom See Profile:
Infecting the computers of others with malware is a felony. Period.

A good question would be "Can you copyright malware?" There's the rub. Maybe you can, maybe you can't, but you can't use it.

You apparently misunderstood my purely hypothetical reference to exposing a web site attempting to automatically download malware to the PCs of unsuspecting visitors. I was referring to exposing the questionable practice, and showing the hidden (but nonetheless copyrighted) code which was causing the malicious downloads. I was certainly not referring to redistributing the actual malware or publishing it's source code.

said by Musicscom See Profile:

While you can post excerpts, you cannot paste and copy an entire web page as it is an act of Copyright Infringement. You can place a link to the site instead. I believe the article clearly stated that.

I can certainly agree with that common sense interpretation of the fair use exemption.

said by Musicscom See Profile:

I offered the advice out of professional courtesy to other Security Professionals.

I am glad to hear that. Perhaps I owe you an apology because I had assumed that your post was to bolster the excerpted statement below which seemed to be attributed to you, and which seems to contradict your statement above regarding posting excerpts from a web site under the auspices of the fair use exemption.

YOU DO NOT HAVE THE RIGHT TO COPY AND REPRODUCE THIS PAGE! PERIOD.
Every lawyer, every lawschool, and every court will stand behind this statement. A simply search of "Copyright" will make this clear. What is created by the Author, remains the sole property of the Author, and cannot be reproduced and/or published on any other website without the Express Written Permission of the Author. There is no debate about this, this is the law straight from the Copyright Office and the Copyright Acts of the United States. You may not reproduce this page, or any other page on this website, in whole or in part, for any purpose whatsoever. You may keep one copy on your computer, but you may not thereafter make further copies and you may not distribute any copies. In short, neither you nor your lawyer has any right, whatsoever, imagined or otherwise thought of, to steal any content from this website.
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A well-regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,11461957 Wed, 29 Sep 2004 21:02:03 EDT Re: Read this before copying and pasting http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,11460223 Name Game : Your orginal post from the 1995 "reprint" has a history from these days..Brad Templeton Mar 28, 1995

This is a draft FAQ, proposed for inclusion in news.announce.newusers. -It has not yet been sent to news.answers for approval, so the Archive-name -above is just a proposal. After a few rounds of posting this as a draft, -it'll be added to news.answers. Corrections or improvements to the FAQ -should be sent to the author; please Cc: me on comments about the -appropriateness of the newsgroups that this is posted to. -- -netannounce@deshaw.com]

»groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&l···rame=off

To get similar one in 2004 is conjecture...but that one is posted quite regularly at the DSLR Security forum about every 6 months by various members.

»10 Big Myths about copyright explained

--
Gladiator Security Forum »www.gladiator-antivirus.com/
Missing Kids
»www.missingkids.com/]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,11460223 Wed, 29 Sep 2004 17:46:58 EDT Re: Read this before copying and pasting http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,11459641 Musicscom : I didn't say any of it. I believe a lawyer working in the field of Intellectual Property and/or a Law Professor said all of that.

Nicholas Papadopoulas, from my knowledge, was a 17 year old kid that was a fictional character in a National Lampoon movie, one of the "Vacation" series of movies. Expose's are just that, exposes. But what the lawyers say is that you cannot reproduce for defaming purposes. Telling the truth is not defaming, but making up stories that are not the truth, and using their copyrighted material, even if publicly available, and causing harm thereby, is defaming. The entirety of libel law rests on truth, while the entirety of copyright law rests on the Constitutional and absolute right of the Author to license, limit, and in all circumstances control the use of his creative work.

Infecting the computers of others with malware is a felony. Period.

A good question would be "Can you copyright malware?" There's the rub. Maybe you can, maybe you can't, but you can't use it.

Your quote was addressed by the article, in that you only considered one paragraph. The author of the article pretty much stated that you have to apply additional tests to the Fair Use doctrine to see if it is actually Fair Use or not. One example is a teacher emailing all of her students complete copies of a copyrighted poem, a clear violation of copyright.

One famous case involves the anti-scientology people and the church of scientology [which I will not recognise as legitimate with capitalization, just as I will not recognise tiny tin gods].

But Security has no merit if it does not obey Copyright Law because anyone with a valid copyright can subpoena everything on any alleged Security outfit's entire network, including not only electronic information, but also paper, memos, and any and all other information, including their source codes for things like antiviruses. The post is an admonishment to anyone who would claim to be a security expert without knowledge of various laws. For example, if you disagree with someone, you cannot then retalliate by stalking them, electronically or otherwise, denigrate their copyrighted works by copying and pasting them, conspire not to remove unlicensed material when requested to do so by the Copyright Owner, and in general act in a manner inconsistent with real Security Professionals. A Security Professional is supposed to be above such behavior.

While you can post excerpts, you cannot paste and copy an entire web page as it is an act of Copyright Infringement. You can place a link to the site instead. I believe the article clearly stated that.

As a former employee of the United States Secret Service, a full-fledged Security Professional, I was required to swear an oath to uphold the Constitution of the United States of America against all enemies foreign and domestic. I had to know at least the fundamentals of Copyright Law, and a lot of other law.

I offered the advice out of professional courtesy to other Security Professionals.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,11459641 Wed, 29 Sep 2004 16:33:15 EDT Re: Read this before copying and pasting http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,11455719 NetFixer : Are you saying that if someone wished to expose that a certain web site and/or it's owner was affiliated with the infamous Nicholas Papadopoulos and updated.com, or perhaps expose a web site which attempted to download malware to the PCs of unsuspecting visitors, they could not disseminate the information from the web site in question which verified that claim without committing copyright infringement?

I think that the excerpt reproduced below from the hyperlink you supplied tends to disagree with that conclusion (and also justifies my reproducing that very excerpt for publication in this forum.


The "fair use" exemption to copyright law was created to allow things such as commentary, parody, news reporting, research and education about copyrighted works without the permission of the author.

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A well-regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,11455719 Wed, 29 Sep 2004 06:38:18 EDT Read this before copying and pasting http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,11455660 Musicscom : For those who think Security is immune from Copyright Infringement actions:

»www.virtualschool.edu/mon/Electr···rightFAQ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,11455660 Wed, 29 Sep 2004 06:00:58 EDT