 dadkinsCan you do Blu?Premium,MVM
join:2003-09-26
Hercules, CA
kudos:18
2 edits | reply to biggbrother
Re: Wow What OS are you using?
What browser are you using?
How did you get it?
Are you satisfied with it?
Can you remove the OS and install a different OS in it's place?
Will this different OS work for your tasks?
I use XP.
I use Opera and SlimBrowser(IE based).
I used IE to download them.
I am very satisfied with my choices.
I have installed different OSes(Mandrake, Suse, Knoppix(actually installed to HDD)). Removed said OSes, replaced XP to HDD.
No, they didn't play the games/could not find working drivers for my hardware.
I have never eluded to "owing" Microsoft thanks for anything(although, most people today wouldn't be using computers without Microsoft being here). I merely stated, that if an OS(any OS) didn't have a browser, the majority of people that have computers... wouldn't!
"So if IE wasn't preloaded on thes machines then billions of users would be cut off from all types of software downloads from the web (i.e. media players, games, etc)?"
Not "cut off", but greatly hampered. Alot of software *CAN* be found at stores... *ALOT* of other software cannot!
Sure, there are some that can Command Line download "ITEMS", most cannot.
You typed exactly what I was trying to convey...
"...In my opinion, they would be forced by the Justice Department to put some sort of basic web interface into Windows if they did not offer IE."
EXACTLY!
People like to bash Microsoft/IE because it's fashionable...yet most of them will not give up their Microsoft OS and use something different. Same applies to simply not using IE and using whatever browser they wish... but let's bash on IE, because it's fun!
Use whatever floats your boat people, I do! I have an IE based browser as my default, but I also use Opera. BFD!
SIDE NOTE: I have *NEVER* been compromized while using IE or IE based browsers. YMMV. 
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No Firefox here, move along! |
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| reply to UHF
said by UHF: said by SixSpeed: Ive been using IE for what, like 10-12 years now, and never had a problem. IE didn't exist 10-12 years ago. Mosaic wasn't even around until 1993, and before it, there was no graphical WWW. Everything was text based. I remember using Lynx in 1994 to browse the web from a Unix prompt. Ok, so what 8 years? My bad. |
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dadkins 
| reply to dadkins
Um... I found out about FireFox by opening my oven one day, and a Fired Fox jumped out and ran away  |
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| reply to dadkins
Simple fact is if M$ hadnt bundled iExplorer with windows any ISP would provide a choice of browsers on the installation disc, something like what AOL does, but with more choice, or if microsoft wasnt so anti-competition they would have provided a choice during installation of windows letting the user choose which browser they wanted to use. Anyone remember netscape? that was huge and popular before internet explorer arrived... so how did people get that? from purchasing the software and getting it sent to them on disc... much simpler if microsoft internet signup wizard asked what browser you would like to install and then downloaded it, all these alternatives could have happened if microsoft hadn't used its financial might to break the law and bury the competition, now its in a situation where its money cant affect the comptition and all the fanboys like you are pi**ed |
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dadkinsCan you do Blu?Premium,MVM
join:2003-09-26
Hercules, CA
kudos:18
1 edit | Deleted. |
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| reply to Sebastian
I'm one of the 98% I'm posting this using Firefox, but in general I think it sucks.
I can only use it for about 5 min before it freeze's and closes down. I also use IE and Netscape, but they don't freeze on my system. Also with firefox, the text looks really bad on some websites and it doesn't work on a lot of sites.
I am using Dell Lat D600, win XP Pro, 1.4ghz Pentium M, 1mb cache, 512mb, 40gb hd (15 free) |
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| reply to dadkins
Re: Wow Granted, Microsoft shouldn't have burried IE so far into the OS... but, what would *ANY* OS be without a browser to enable people to get online to possibly get something different?
Uh, Win 3.x didn't include a browser. Windows 95 included such a basic browser, it was utterly useless. Back then, Netscape ruled, and you could get it several ways:
1. FTP
2. From your ISP or university
3. From a friend
4. Included in a book
And guess what? All these sources are still available for software distribution, plus there are file transfers via IM apps, USB drives, and CD-R's, which allow you to exchange much more data than in the old days.
You're right when you say that many average users don't know what FTP is, but that doesn't make it any less relevant to the Internet. Without FTP, how do you think Web sites are uploaded to Web servers in the first place? |
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| reply to pike
Well then people would be complaining about that also on a strangle hold. |
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| reply to Unregistered user
said by Unregistered user:Granted, Microsoft shouldn't have burried IE so far into the OS... but, what would *ANY* OS be without a browser to enable people to get online to possibly get something different?
Back then, Netscape ruled Well if IE sucked so bad, Netscape would still rule wouldnt it? Choices of Browsers is still available, fact is to 99% of the Computing public it works just fine, youll never change that. |
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 rjacksonPremium,Mod
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| said by SixSpeed: said by Unregistered user:
Back then, Netscape ruled Well if IE sucked so bad, Netscape would still rule wouldnt it? Choices of Browsers is still available, fact is to 99% of the Computing public it works just fine, youll never change that. No, Netscape was pushed out of the race by Microsoft. They used their monopoly in the desktop market to force manufacturers to only bundle Internet Explorer with their machines and no other competitor. |
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| reply to Sebastian
It's 10% (on the high end, many say less then that) that are "non" IE.... that includes opera, the apple browser, netscape, moz, and firefox (netscape, moz and firefox ae basically all the same though). |
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| reply to rjackson
said by rjackson: said by SixSpeed: said by Unregistered user:
Back then, Netscape ruled Well if IE sucked so bad, Netscape would still rule wouldnt it? Choices of Browsers is still available, fact is to 99% of the Computing public it works just fine, youll never change that. No, Netscape was pushed out of the race by Microsoft. They used their monopoly in the desktop market to force manufacturers to only bundle Internet Explorer with their machines and no other competitor. How do you explain the failure of OS2 Warp? Fact is, if there were a truly better OS/browser, it would succeed. I think 99.999% of the Windows/IE bashing has to do with the hatred of the Microsoft company rather than truly about the OS/Browser. |
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rjacksonPremium,Mod
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1 edit | said by SixSpeed: How do you explain the failure of OS2 Warp? Fact is, if there were a truly better OS/browser, it would succeed. Microsoft is to blame for that too. OS/2 was a joint venture between IBM and MS until Microsoft abandoned the project and left IBM in the dust. In many ways, OS/2 was superior to Windows at the time.
said by SixSpeed:I think 99.999% of the Windows/IE bashing has to do with the hatred of the Microsoft company rather than truly about the OS/Browser. I'm not bashing Microsoft at all, these are the facts. Microsoft was involved in an anti-trust lawsuit and they were found to be guilty of monopolistic business practices. They were almost broken up into separate companies because of this.
I don't use IE not because of some hatred for Microsoft, but because I find it lacking in features, feeble support for CSS2 and web standards, and its broken box model. |
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| reply to dadkins
said by dadkins:If Microsoft didn't include a browser(IE), how would you have downloaded Firefox? Uhm, same way that you would have downloaded IE. Once you had installed your TCP/IP stack, it usually came with an FTP client and a Telnet client, and you would use the FTP client to connect to a server and download a browser. ftp,microsoft,com or ftp,mcom,com. Your choice. (That was back before MS tried to make your choice for you.)
If you didn't even have that, you could use "ftpmail", automated FTP access via e-mail. |
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| reply to dadkins
said by dadkins:Most people today use a browser of some sort. Most people use Microsoft OSes. If Microsoft didn't have a browser included(or the system mfgr. didn't bundle a browser), they would not be able to find out about/download alternatives. Back when there was competition in the market, many ISPs chose to bundle Netscape on a CD and send it to subscribers, because it was the superior browser. Thanks to MS's monopoly, a radically-innovative company like Netscape is no more, and the market is once again stagnant. (The number of truely-innovative features added to IE in the last couple of years, can be counted on one finger. Personally, I'll use my middle one to count.) |
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| reply to whoamIoramI
Re: I'm one of the 98% said by whoamIoramI:I'm posting this using Firefox, but in general I think it sucks. I can only use it for about 5 min before it freeze's and closes down. Obviously you are having some sort of software-installation or other system problems. I leave Firefox open for weeks at a time, sometimes, without crashing. Try that with IE, with literally hundreds of web pages open at once.  |
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 sapoCruising Down Memory LanePremium
join:2002-09-16
Sacramento, CA
kudos:1 | reply to Sebastian
Re: Wow said by Sebastian:o how wonderful.. 11 million downloads and probably only 2% are actually using it i wonder if it even paid off infesting 10,000 sites, with people trying to shove the browser down your throat. if people wanted it, im sure they can find it. What if people don't know a better alternative exists? This ad is for promoting it and many people don't know about it.
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If they won't join you, kill them. |
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| reply to rjackson
You people took that to literally,
Someone new to computers wouldn't know where/or be willing to find how to use ftp just to download a browser to use the web.
You wouldn't know where it was located on the server (unless it was advertised or something)
You wouldn't know how to compile (if you got the source)
You took it to literal, be thankful windows actually came with a browser, I agree its too deeply wielded to it. |
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