 SteveConIBEW 2222 Boston, MAPremium
join:2004-09-02
Boston, MA | reply to imrf
Re: cant be that expensive said by imrf:I agree. If it takes the idiot installing the IPTV service 8 hours to run a total of 3 outlets he should be fired. It's not rocket science. Sheesh - you remind me of people that started telling me how I could fix/install what they wanted by saying "All you have to do is ..."
Any idiot with a staple gun can install three jacks by stapling along a baseboard in an hour, but a quality installation fishing walls, attics etc. can take all of 8 man/hours and more than likely longer. Its not rocket science, but its not easy and rarely goes as planned, either. That's why an "hourly rate" is often quoted instead of a "price for the whole job". I don't know anyone who can see through walls and can determine every obstacle to be encountered. |
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 imrfPremium
join:2002-06-06
Utica, MI
1 edit | said by SteveCon: but a quality installation fishing walls, attics etc. can take all of 8 man/hours and more than likely longer. Yes, if you don't know what you are doing, sure. I have worked with installation companies for many years. I have seen a 7500sq. ft. homes wired with 6 outlets or more in less than 4 hours fishing 4 stories up, with two guy each working by themselves. Don't tell me 3 outlets in a average run of the mill home will take 8 hours. |
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SteveConIBEW 2222 Boston, MAPremium
join:2004-09-02
Boston, MA | said by imrf:said by SteveCon: but a quality installation fishing walls, attics etc. can take all of 8 man/hours and more than likely longer. Yes, if you don't know what you are doing, sure. I have worked with installation companies for many years. I have seen a 7500sq. ft. homes wired with 6 outlets or more in less than 4 hours fishing 4 stories up, with two guy each working by themselves. Don't tell me 3 outlets in a average run of the mill home will take 8 hours. C'mon now. *1* person.. 4 story pulls.. 3 outlets.. all in 4 hours? I'm a licensed electrician with 30 years experience who has fished more tel, data, catv and power cables than I care remember; I bet a wiring inspector would have a field day citing code violations on *that* job.
Sure, you might get a "bunny" 1st floor install of 3 jacks in 4 hours once in a while - but that certainly is not going to be the rule. Working safely and doing a quality install in a neat and workmanship-like manner is going to take longer. More often, the install will be required in the upper levels of a multi-floor or worse yet, multi-family dwelling.
Sending one person to fish walls and ceilings alone is a waste of time and money for a company - it can be done, but it's not cost effective. 8 man hours is a more realistic expectation. |
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imrfPremium
join:2002-06-06
Utica, MI | said by SteveCon:C'mon now. *1* person.. 4 story pulls.. 3 outlets.. all in 4 hours? I'm a licensed electrician with 30 years experience who has fished more tel, data, catv and power cables than I care remember; I bet a wiring inspector would have a field day citing code violations on *that* job. I bet that you are 100% wrong. There were absolutely no code violations. Why do you find it hard to pull 3 lines in 4 hours. With the proper tools and not constantly taking breaks it can easily be done, and it has been done many times. Telecom workers always claim this can't be done because they just listen to what their union tells them.
Working safely and doing a quality install in a neat and workmanship-like manner is going to take longer. Sure quality work takes time, but not an entire shift. That's just plain laziness.
Sending one person to fish walls and ceilings alone is a waste of time and money for a company - it can be done, but it's not cost effective. No, a waste of money is sending in multiple techs that still complete the job in the same amount of time. I have rarely seen telephone techs work any faster with multiple techs then it would have taken if they were by themselves.
8 man hours is a more realistic expectation. Not really. That's a ridiculous amount of time to do 3 outlets. It's just as sad as the time it takes to do a FIOS install. It shouldn't take 6 hours to do it. It really sounds like Verizon needs better training for their techs if they all think this is reasonable. |
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wow i didnt know any companys still ran wires behinds walls bith comcast and direct tv rather just staple wires along the side of your houe then drill a hole in the wall I dont think i';d mind paying more for a nice clean install |
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SteveConIBEW 2222 Boston, MAPremium
join:2004-09-02
Boston, MA | said by mustang03282:wow i didnt know any companys still ran wires behinds walls bith comcast and direct tv rather just staple wires along the side of your houe then drill a hole in the wall I dont think i';d mind paying more for a nice clean install The FiOS install is just that - fished walls/ceilings from NI to wall plate/jack. The cost? FREE. No installation fee. Is it taking a while for an install - yes, it is. Will install time get shorter - absolutely. The TelCo guys have really never fished walls before, and for years your TelCo CS rep suggested that you call an electrician for tel wiring. Now, the TelCo guys are doing the CAT5e wiring. I still say the average install will be well in excess of 4 man hours, but that's just me. |
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1 edit | Fios install is free for one PC. It's $75 for each additional PC, and extra to install a wireless router, yes?
There's also been some rumbling about charging a $75 install fee for one PC, but I haven't been able to confirm that. Any truth to that? (assuming your avatar means you work for them?) |
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SteveConIBEW 2222 Boston, MAPremium
join:2004-09-02
Boston, MA | said by Karl Bode:Fios install is free for one PC. It's $75 for each additional PC, and extra to install a wireless router, yes? There's also been some rumbling about charging a $75 install fee for one PC, but I haven't been able to confirm that. Any truth to that? (assuming your avatar means you work for them?) Yes, I'm a VZ technician - but not in I&M (installation & maintenance group). When my FiOS was installed, they wired one PC and offered to connect and configure any other PC to the router in the same room for free (I had 2 others there). I suspect that was via patch cable, not a wall jack & fished walls.
A 4 port D-Link wired router is included, however a 4 port wireless "G" (54Mb) version is available for an additional cost (I think about $60 if I remember correctly). They recommend using the D-Link - but you can use any one you like. I heard from the installer that only the D-Link is supported as it has special firmware. I wanted to use my Linksys 8 port router instead, and swapped it out after the install techs left. I was surprised to find that the FiOS tech support reps helped me customize my Linksys router settings in spite of not supporting it.
Lastly, I imagine that if you wanted them to fish from the router to other PCs that there would be additional fees. The wireless route would be the way to go in this case - unless you were paranoid about security. |
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