[BroadVoice] BroadVoice SCAM Unlimited phone call in VOIP Tech Chat http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r14395496 en Sat, 28 Nov 2009 21:16:16 EDT Sat, 28 Nov 2009 21:16:16 EDT Re: [BroadVoice] BroadVoice SCAM Unlimited phone c http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15132559 iSEPIC : BS - if its advertised as unlimited, then you should get that, doesn't matter if they are "banking" on most people will pay for unlimited and only make 200 mins worth of calls, then one customer does indeed go over what they were "banking" on... they need to sell 2500 min plans, and be done with it. Nuff said.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15132559 Fri, 30 Dec 2005 14:01:30 EDT Re: [BroadVoice] BroadVoice Fake "unlimited" http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15132544 iSEPIC : BS - If there is a limit, then don't advertise "unlimited", nuff said.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15132544 Fri, 30 Dec 2005 13:59:27 EDT Re: [BroadVoice] BroadVoice Fake "unlimited" http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15099555 cyberbird : i m a happy user of vonage for last few years,i dont remember vonage had any outage at least for me and no billing errors/problems. i m currently on 14$/500min plan and was thinking to port my number to broadvoice for there 20$ plan. now after going through yours posts i m not sure if i m going to do that but wondering what if one just makes about 2000 minute family calls to US and Canada only, do they still consider it as biz use?

why they got these awards and why no one catch them for misleading people?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15099555 Sun, 25 Dec 2005 11:35:36 EDT Re: [BroadVoice] BroadVoice Fake "unlimited" http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14934988 NENO : BROADVOICE is indeed the sneakiest company I have ever dealt with. They bravely advertise UNLMITED CALLS TO 35 COUNTRIES and it is so untrue. If you exceed their hidden threshold of $25.00 worth in calls they will arbitrarily charge your credit card an exorbitant amount and send you a letter after, which totally contradicts their advertising. I called them in disbelief and they keep telling me I am using the phone for business, which is not true and they know it. What kind of business only calls before 08:30am and after 07:00pm? What kind of business only calls the same 10 or 12 international numbers over and over again? It is obvious that I am calling the same family and friends out of the country when I and my wife are not at work (off business hours). Well, they charged my credit card $162.00 for a single month bill and they did the same to several of my friends. Some were charged in excess of $300.00. I understand that I, and many of my friends, did make many and long international calls, but if you cant deliver what you promise then dont offer it at all. SIMPLY A RIP OFF and a SCANDALOUS CASE OF MISREPRESENTATION!!!!! ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14934988 Fri, 02 Dec 2005 19:33:39 EDT Re: [BroadVoice] BroadVoice Fake "unlimited" http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14934829 NENO : I know what you mean. BROADVOICE is indeed the sneakiest company I have ever delt with. They bravely advertise UNLMITED CALLS TO 35 COUNTRIES and it is so untrue. If you exceed their hidden threshold of $25.00 worth in calls they will arbitrarily charge your credit card an exorbitant amount and send you a letter after, which totally contradicts their advertising. They charged me $162.00 for a single month bill and they did the same to several of my friends. Some were charged in excess of $300.00. I understand that I, and many of my friends, did make an excessive amount of inteernational calls, but if you cant deliver what you promise then dont offer it at all. SIMPLY A RIP OFF and a SCANDALOUS CASE OF MISREPRESENTATION!!!!! ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14934829 Fri, 02 Dec 2005 19:04:11 EDT Re: [BroadVoice] BroadVoice SCAM Unlimited phone c http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14694448 happyvalley : hi, hilsonmota

some news on your case. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14694448 Sun, 30 Oct 2005 19:27:43 EDT Re: BroadVoice SCAM Unlimited phone calls http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14669314 anon : Compare what they say to what they do ...

BV Ad
]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14669314 Thu, 27 Oct 2005 09:32:17 EDT Re: [BroadVoice] BroadVoice SCAM Unlimited phone c http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14668508 joako : CALL YOUR CREDIT CARD COMPANY NOW!!!!!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14668508 Thu, 27 Oct 2005 04:22:29 EDT Re: [BroadVoice] BroadVoice SCAM Unlimited phone call http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14604314 anon : I would just like to state that Broadvoice is screwing me the same way. I use this service to call my girlfriend, only, at the same number in Germany, and I have since March. Then with a day before warning email, I was switched to the Unlimited Business and they were trying to charge me $56. I have canceled and complained and now they are charging me $100. I have tried to reach their customer service and cannot get a hold of them, phone calls and emails. I tried to log into my account so as to see where they think all that money is being charged for, but my user name no longer works. I have already registered a complaint with the Better Business Beruea and filed a complaint to the Attorney General's Office as BBB instructed me to do.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14604314 Tue, 18 Oct 2005 12:26:38 EDT Re: [BroadVoice] BroadVoice SCAM Unlimited phone call http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14591011 JonR800 : This all comes down to one thing: money.

A number of VOIP providers are offering services at prices that they can't maintain. Once a user starts costing them money, most likely in consecutive months, they pull the plug. If they really want to offer unlimited services they need to up the price for everyone in order to cover the heavier users. Otherwise if at the current price they can only offer the user 2000 minutes before taking a loss, then they need to set that as the clearly defined limit!

This whole pseudo unlimited bit just keeps going. I really hope it either dies out or someone puts an end to it.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14591011 Sun, 16 Oct 2005 15:03:35 EDT Re: [BroadVoice] BroadVoice SCAM Unlimited phone c http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14584878 prestonlewis : Pretty much all VOIP providers do have limits on "unlimited" calling, especially to international numbers since they cost so much more than US/CN calling. I've seen complaints about P8 and others also capping "unlimited" calling by home users so your complaint isn't just concerning BV but seems to be a VOIP general problem.

Ignoring the VOIP providers looking for "commercial" use of a VOIP service, I'd say 4,000 minutes is a reasonable number for them to expect a high user to use. My 3 teens and I have used around 4,000 minutes/month for local calling and some long distance calling to US numbers. Usually, it's under 2,000 but it can be over 4,000 sometimes. I also don't like the use of the word "unlimited" but they do usually have an asterisk with some fine print mentioning average home usage as being their definition of unlimited. International calling is expensive and expecting them to offer unlimited minutes is ridiculous although they shouldn't advertise it either, in my opinion.

Also the OP's original assertions of BV having financial problems is bogus. They are owned by a large parent corp and are not "running out of money" as he claims. Also, the OP's quotes of BV's emails to him using words like "scheme" do not ring true. US companies never use the word scheme. British companies do but it has a different meaning for them. These types of problems with the OPs post makes his argument less acceptable to me since I know BV has no financial problems and is very, very unlikely to use the word scheme in any email message to customers. How many other mistakes are in his posts? However, his basic argument about unlimited calls not being unlimited is a sound argument but isn't limited to just BV.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14584878 Sat, 15 Oct 2005 14:05:16 EDT Re: [BroadVoice] BroadVoice SCAM Unlimited phone c http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14582632 WhyADuck : To reprise (and condense) some comments I made in a similar thread many months ago:

The thing to consider is, first, what does a company say in their advertising? If, for example, they have a residential plan and they use the word UNLIMITED in their advertising, then if they are not really offering UNLIMITED service it is false advertising and consumer fraud, and they are lying to potential customers in their advertising. We can always hope that companies that do this will soon be on the receiving end of actions instituted by the Federal Trade Commission and/or the attorney generals of the various states.

The word unlimited has a very specific meaning. If it were an ambiguous word or phrase, like "a real bargain compared to other services", then the company's terms of service could clarify the offer. But when a word with a very specific and clear meaning is used in advertising, then the fine print cannot take away what the large print promises.

As another poster pointed out in an earlier thread, when there is an ambiguity in a legal contract (and in a court, the advertising often IS considered part of the contract, especially in consumer matters), the ambiguity is usually resolved in such a way as to favor the person who did not participate in the creation of the contract (the consumer).

No one disputes that companies have a right to verify that a customer really is using a residential service for residential purposes. But, a provision buried in the Terms of Service may not necessarily override what is boldly proclaimed in advertising. A long time ago in this country, companies used to promise the moon in advertising and then take it all back in the fine print, and that is why various truth-in-advertising and other consumer protection laws were passed. This does NOT give a customer the right to screw the company by signing up for a residential plan and then using it to run a home-based telemarketing operation, but when the calls really are residential in nature then if the company has advertised "unlimited" service and then tries to pull the sort of things that have been described here, my advice would to be to contact your state's Attorney General post haste.

For those that like to skim messages and jump to conclusions, please note that I said "contact your state's Attorney General", NOT "contact an attorney." Realistically, no one is suggesting that an individual file a lawsuit, it simply would not be worth the time and expense, and in most cases you wouldn't need to because you can get the credit card charges reversed. However, STATE attorney generals will often file lawsuits on behalf of all the consumers in a state and these are very often complaint-driven. In other words, if you and 50 or 100 other people contact your state's AG about the same company, he or she may actually go after that company. If it were me, I would personally send my complaint to the AG's office with a copy to the Federal Trade Commission (the FTC complaint can be filed through a web-based complaint form).

On the rare occasion that I have had to contact my state's AG office regarding a consumer dispute, it has always generated some action. Normally the first thing that happens is that a letter is sent to the business in question outlining the complaint, and the business has the opportunity to correct the problem (and respond to the AG's office explaining how they corrected the problem). If they do correct the problem and the customer is happy, it goes into the file associated with that business at the AG's office but otherwise nothing is shouted from the rooftops. As long as the person who brought the complaint is satisfied, that is pretty much the end of it. If there's a serious violation of law and the company admits to it I think there is sometimes a small fine levied, but nothing near what would be levied if the company refuses to acknowledge or correct the problem.

Some folks try to say that a company can't offer truly unlimited service and survive. Well if they can't, then they shouldn't be advertising it, but the point is that they are playing the averages, just like an all-you-can-eat restaurant. My comments from earlier this year expand on those thoughts.

And yes, I did selectively cut and paste a high percentage of the text in this message from several other messages I had previously written a while back. Why re-type when you want to say the same thing you said months ago, particularly at 2:20 in the morning? ;-)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14582632 Sat, 15 Oct 2005 02:29:36 EDT Re: [BroadVoice] BroadVoice SCAM Unlimited phone c http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14579437 mykey2k :
said by markosjal See Profile :

If you dont like it, try using you local telephone service for the same calls and see what that costs you.

Back in my dial-up days, I had unlimited dial-up. The players:

1) My ISP. They marketed it as unlimited.
2) My Telco. I paid 5 cents per call, no matter the duration... 1 second or 2 months.
3) Me. Who was always doing "something" online.

The results:
1) They never complained. I paid them my $25 a month.
2) They never complained. I did indeed have a phone call last 2 months.
3) I never complained. I paid my telco and my ISP.

The point is, whenever you buy something, you weigh the plusses and minusses. Some things I have noticed:

Why do I not lease a car? I put on over 20,000 miles a year on it. By buying, I can say I get unlimited mileage. When you lease a car, they tell you the "limit".

My cell phone has unlimited nights and weekends. Peak minutes are "limited" to 450. I know the limit.

"Free refills" at a restaurant means "more than one" compared to a restaurant that says "Limit 1 refill"

All-U-Can eat restaurants. They have no limit, in theory. I ate at a sushi buffet for 3 hours and no one complained.

In the end, a business needs to weigh the people who will take advantage of the system offered to them implemented; and those that barely use it. For every one of me in all these circumstances, there are those who are on the other side of the spectrum -- outliers in statistical terms.

We as consumers didn't come up with their pricing scheme: They did, and they have a legal obligation to stick by it.

-m]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14579437 Fri, 14 Oct 2005 17:50:39 EDT Re: [BroadVoice] BroadVoice Fake "unlimited" http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14578805 anon : They do scam....

I know several people who used their service with 2500 3000+ minutes and got automatically upgraded to the Business Plan having to play ~300 dollars in retroactive charges...

Be very careful guys!!!!!!!!!

Really scamming people who really use their service a lot, therefore if you are not generating profit for them, you will get upgraded, just a matter of time...

Good luck with your small court claims!!!

Anonymous Joe - Boston]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14578805 Fri, 14 Oct 2005 16:21:10 EDT Re: [BroadVoice] BroadVoice SCAM Unlimited phone call http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14572149 stevech1 : 2500 minutes in "consecutive months" - assuming that means TWO months, comes out to be 41 minutes per day.

My wife does that, on average per month, since we moved away from our home city and all friends/family are there.

So, I guess it's the service provider's right to define and set a limit. They did put in in writing. So you don't have a leg to stand on, I say. Other providers don't define the criteria in specifics.

I don't know about the false advertising. Seems like in the US companies can lie all they want in the marketing and hide behind their contractual fine print, and the courts let them do so.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14572149 Thu, 13 Oct 2005 18:53:09 EDT Re: [BroadVoice] BroadVoice SCAM Unlimited phone c http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14568238 SliderNC : I think a lot of it depends on how you view unlimited residential calling and how they determine it. I'm sure their engineers run some queries to see when, where and how long you are calling. The point of the matter is, it is not that hard to use 2000 minutes these days of phone time, especially with teenagers, calling family and friends, and just general local use. I know last month on Sunrocket, I used close to 1500 minutes. My wife and I are both not home between the hours of 7:30am-6:30pm either. All of our calls happen from 7:00PM until 2:00AM most of the time, except for weekends when we call at various times.

Rizzo has the right idea with his first choice. Prove that he is not a residential customer, dispute the charges, leave Broadvoice and find another company to use. Broadvoice was probably losing money on him due to his family calling Brazil often and for long periods of time, whether during business hours or not.

The fact of the matter is, for those companies who advertise and sell an "Unlimited Residential Plan", and then in the ToS state that you are limited to "so many minutes" per month, it is false advertising and illegal. If it's a limited plan, come out and say it. I bet you no one would really care. If they said you get 2500 minutes for 19.99/month, I'm sure they'd still get people to sign up.
--
I'll believe that when my sh!t turns purple and smells like rainbow sherbet.
My LiveJournal]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14568238 Thu, 13 Oct 2005 09:20:12 EDT Re: [BroadVoice] BroadVoice SCAM Unlimited phone c http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14568236 DracoFelis :
said by markosjal See Profile :

I know if I had a client that was using over 2000 minutes for three months consecutively, I would say that was clearly being used for business use, chatty teenagers or not!
You might say that, but it doesn't mean its true!

said by markosjal See Profile :

What you call Unlimited is UNLIMITED RESIDENTIAL.
Exactly. It is UNLIMITED as long as the calls are RESIDENTIAL in nature!

Chatty teenagers is RESIDENTIAL use. Chatting with your boyfriend/girlfriend every evening for several hours is RESIDENTIAL use. Even being "retired", and thereby having the time to talk to friends/family all day is RESIDENTIAL use!

If a company selling service doesn't actually want to honor the "UNLIMITED" part of their marketing, then they need to change their marketing! For example, there is nothing preventing a business from setting a specific number of minutes, and advertising that fact (for example, selling a plan that allows up to 1500min/month for a fixed price). Cell companies do it all the time, for example.

But it is IMHO "false advertising" to market an "UNLIMITED residential" service, and then determine solely based upon the number of minutes used that the service wasn't used for "residential" purposes! Because there are many LEGITIMATE reasons why a RESIDENTIAL user might use that many minutes (or more)!

Now, if you want to set a "threshold" of of x minutes/month (for example 2000) setting off an internal "investigation" fine. I have no problem with a business cross-checking for "fraud" (in this case, checking for customers that buy residential service, and then use it to run a small business). But as long as the investigation shows that it was likely true "residential use", than the customer should continue to get that service AT THE AGREED UPON PRICE even if/when they are routinely using 5000+ minutes/month!

said by markosjal See Profile :

If you want to use volume, they are right to protect their revenue and charge you for business service.
ONLY IF they are upfront about the fact that residential users don't have UNLIMITED service (subject to the calls really being "residential" in nature).

But when they "protect their revenue" by blindly "back-billing" a customer for "business service" AFTER advertising "UNLIMITED residential" service (which most reasonable people would interpret as service they can use as much as they want, provided the calls are "residential" in nature), then they have stepped "over the line" IMHO.

NOTE: "Protecting your revenue" is not always legally permitted, when you have already made promises of specific service for an agreed upon price. As just one obvious example, an "insurance company" takes "losses" every time a major claim is filed. But if the claim is valid, than the insurance company has to "pay up" (take the loss of money), instead of "protecting their revenue" by denying a valid claim. Yes, the insurance company is allowed to "investigate" what is going on, and they are even allowed to deny the claim if/when there was fraud involved, but they can't just deny the claim to "protect their revenue"!

said by markosjal See Profile :

Let us assiume that they terminate at 1 cent per minute and you pay the, 20 dollars a month. By using 2000 minutes per month, you have taken them to a point of losing money, as they also have costs associated for instance with your incoming number.
Could be.

But if that's a problem, then they need to change their marketing so that they are no longer PROMISING something that is too costly to deliver. But to PROMISE one thing, and then not deliver, is not considered acceptable business behavior!

said by markosjal See Profile :

If you dont like it, try using you local telephone service for the same calls and see what that costs you.
My "unlimited local" service, is truly "unlimited" (as long as I use it in the agreed upon "local" manor). I have NEVER been hassled by my telco for the number of inbound calls I've been on the phone under that plan. If the call is inbound, I have it as part of my "unlimited" service. At the same time, if the call is outbound (within the "local region" that I'm allowed to make "unlimited" calls in), then the call is still free.

For that matter, I keep my "unlimited" DSL line up 24/7 (my router forces the line to stay active). Does that mean that I might be using more internet than someone who uses the "connect when needed" software that came with my BroadBand service? You bet! But I still haven't heard a "peep" out of CentryTel (both my POTS telco, and my ISP) about me using my "unlimited" DSL line as "unlimited". And you know why? Because I'm simply more of a "heavy user" of the service that they agreed to sell me for a specific price!

The point is, if you promise "unlimited", you need to prepare to deliver that. If that means that some users will be "heavy users", you need to factor that into your cost estimates (or change your marketing). But it is NOT OK to market "unlimited" and then harass "heavy users" that are legitimately using your "unlimited" service!

said by markosjal See Profile :

I think you would find similar attitudes with every carrier such as Vonage, Lingo, or Packet 8.
No.

That issue has been discussed in these forums in the past. And with most of the carriers that it came up with, they admitted that they had a specific (private) minute threshold where they would "investigate" (look at the call log pattern, call the customer and ask, etc) if the calls were still "residential" in nature. But as long as the investigation showed that the calls were "residential", they would "eat the loss" (on that specific customer), and continue to offer them their agreed upon "unlimited residential" service.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14568236 Thu, 13 Oct 2005 09:19:19 EDT Re: [BroadVoice] BroadVoice SCAM Unlimited phone call http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14567385 SaladSpoon : Fact remains it is not Unlimited. Don't call it that. Because it's just not Unlimited, it's very limited.

2,000 minutes is only about 4% of an average months total minutes.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14567385 Thu, 13 Oct 2005 03:04:42 EDT Re: [BroadVoice] BroadVoice SCAM Unlimited phone call http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14566949 markosjal : Most VoIP Providers have a limit on unlimited residential whether it is published or not.

Furthermore most evry VoIP providers TOS that I have read through has had a statement to the effect that they reserve the right to change rate plans or deny services to any account the see deem as losing money (and they alone).

I know if I had a client that was using over 2000 minutes for three months consecutively, I would say that was clearly being used for business use, chatty teenagers or not!

What you call Unlimited is UNLIMITED RESIDENTIAL. If you want to use volume, they are right to protect their revenue and charge you for business service.

Let us assiume that they terminate at 1 cent per minute and you pay the, 20 dollars a month. By using 2000 minutes per month, you have taken them to a point of losing money, as they also have costs associated for instance with your incoming number.

If you dont like it, try using you local telephone service for the same calls and see what that costs you.

All you will do by using that kind of volume is increase the costs for all users.

I think you would find similar attitudes with every carrier such as Vonage, Lingo, or Packet 8.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14566949 Thu, 13 Oct 2005 01:04:42 EDT Re: [BroadVoice] BroadVoice SCAM Unlimited phone call http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14563363 rizzo2dial : hilsonmota,

1) Dispute the charges with your credit card issuer. As soon as you demonstrate false advertising, that should be the end of the dispute in your favor.
2) Cancel your BV service.
3) Find another VoIP provider.
THE END.

-or-

Take BV to court and hope to reach a settlement a few years down the road.

Rizzo]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14563363 Wed, 12 Oct 2005 17:25:10 EDT Re: [BroadVoice] BroadVoice SCAM Unlimited phone c http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14563212 Skywise : I assume that the call patterns matter alot. Calls to many different numbers between 9-5 M-F is pretty obvious business. Most residential customers use their phone primarily after 5pm and call a limited amount of numbers.

In regards to the 'scam' - I don't think its a scam, but its false advertisement. You could probably get them in trouble over that, but seriously, is that effort worth the $300 for you? You can probably get them to stop, you won't get a 30k settlement out of a false advertisement claim. Switch providers, but keep in mind that most companies have somekind of limit - some CC companies let you dynamically create virtual credit card numbers on which you can set a specific limit every month, something like that would at least protect you against the random $300 charge. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14563212 Wed, 12 Oct 2005 17:04:09 EDT Re: [BroadVoice] BroadVoice SCAM Unlimited phone call http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14562161 ptrowski : I personally would love to see the "magic formula" some VOIP providers use to determine the difference between residential and business plans...
Sounds like Broadvoice is just out to make their money and run...]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14562161 Wed, 12 Oct 2005 14:56:05 EDT Re: [BroadVoice] BroadVoice Fake "unlimited" http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14562123 DracoFelis :
said by rileyjam514 See Profile :

No, you aren't being ripped off. Business plans are given high rate limits for a reason - because business does not stop at the end of the business day, and during the business day there is a high demand for usage.
That may be the THEORY that a company bases their rates upon. BUT that theory doesn't match every true "residential user". For example, some families have "chatty teenagers".

And if enough true "residential users" don't fit that theory, the company needs to be upfront in changing their rates to something that matches reality. But its not OK to SLAM "residential" users into "business rates", simply because the user believed the advertising that they were buying UNLIMITED residential calling for one monthly fee!!!

said by rileyjam514 See Profile :

As a residential customer, if you were using a regular landline phone in this manner, your provider would see it and do the same thing that Broadvoice is doing - switch you up to a higher rate plan because you are violating the TOS.
What TOS violation?!?

If you are using the phone for a home business, yes you are violating the TOS of a "residential" account. But if/when you just have a "chatty family", you are NOT violating the TOS of an "unlimited" residential account. Instead, you are just a heavy user of the service.

Now I know that any company you do that with, will likely SEE (in their call logs) that you are a "heavy user". And they might even start an "investigation" to see if you are really using your account (fraudulently) to run a business on. But as long as their investigation shows that you are NOT violating their TOS (i.e. your calls are RESIDENTIAL in nature), a reputable business will "suck it up" and eat the costs of you as a "heavy customer"!

In fact, to do anything else is likely "false advertising"...

said by rileyjam514 See Profile :

Residential customers are called residential customers because it is assumed that you will not use more than a certain amount of calls for any given calling period.
It doesn't matter how "chatty" a telco ASSUMES that a "residential customer" will be! If they are using the line for actual "residential use" (i.e. talking to friends, family, etc), they are using the line for "residential use".

And if that means a "residential user" uses enough minutes on their "unlimited phone line" to cause the telco to lose money (on that specific user), than that is just "tuff s@#t". If too many of their customers are "chatty", the business always has the option to raise their rates, or stop advertising "unlimited" (and instead put a specific monthly limit on their service).

BUT, it is NOT OK for a business to advertise "unlimited" service, and then refuse to deliver on that promise!

NOTE: I agree that it is fraudulent of a customer to sign up for a "residential" account, and use it for "business purposes" (such as running a home based business). But it is perfectly proper for a "residential user" to sign up with an "unlimited residential account" and then talk for several hours with family every day! If that means that the telco (or in this case a VoIP company) providing the service loses money on that customer, than that company needs to change their marketing plan (or change their rates). But until/unless they do, that company needs to deliver what the customer bought (i.e. "unlimited residential service").

NOTE: I'm not a lawyer. However, it is my understanding that SLAMMING genuine (albeit "chatty") residential users to expensive "business rates" can be considered FRAUD. And I have heard of state AGs suing companies for "false advertising", when they fail to deliver what they advertised to the customer...

said by rileyjam514 See Profile :

They aren't trying to gyp you. They're trying to help you.
No! They are NOT trying to help the customer!

It sounds to me like they are trying to help their "bottom line", by using practices that are dubious at best, and outright illegal (false advertising) at worst!

I'm just glad I never signed up with this particular VoIP company....]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14562123 Wed, 12 Oct 2005 14:51:30 EDT Re: [BroadVoice] BroadVoice Fake "unlimited" http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14560847 rileyjam514 : No, you aren't being ripped off. Business plans are given high rate limits for a reason - because business does not stop at the end of the business day, and during the business day there is a high demand for usage.

As a residential customer, if you were using a regular landline phone in this manner, your provider would see it and do the same thing that Broadvoice is doing - switch you up to a higher rate plan because you are violating the TOS.

Residential customers are called residential customers because it is assumed that you will not use more than a certain amount of calls for any given calling period. Contrary to popular belief, every phone company has a limit on what its systems can handle without an outage. The bar is higher for some than for others, but there is always a limit.

Business customers are assumed to continuously use the phone at "peak" hours (typically workdays between 9-5) but also allocated system usage at other points during the week. Residential customers are assumed to use the phone sporadically during the 9-5 period and more often during the evenings and weekends.

Phone companies, landline and VoIP alike, set up their usage plans in advance with these criteria in mind. If they see that you're using more than they had anticipated, that means you're draining that portion of their system's resources and making it harder for other customers to use their service. In order to keep you as a customer, instead of simply disconnecting your service, they move you onto a Business plan so that you are not taking up resources they had previously allocated elsewhere.

These plans, as I mentioned before, are based on usage patterns, and also what kind of traffic particular servers can handle. Most providers (again, this cuts across the board, landline and VoIP) have two systems set up to handle the different calls from their customers - one for business customers which is built to handle commercial-grade phone traffic, and one for residential customers, which is solidly built but can only handle a limited amount of traffic. Essentially, when they move you over to a Business plan, they are switching the path your voice traffic takes over to a system designed to handle the pressure you're putting on the system.

They aren't trying to gyp you. They're trying to help you.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14560847 Wed, 12 Oct 2005 12:07:49 EDT Re: [BroadVoice] BroadVoice Fake "unlimited" http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14557390 damianstaro : I had the same problem and I complained in the following websites:

www.ifccfbi.org
www.bbb.org

I suggest you guys do the same.

BroadVoice has to be careful. They are pissing off a lot of people. It wouldn't be a surprise if a handful of hackers started issuing a denial of serice attack against the web sites and voice services.

Also, I would expect them to be fined bigtime for their potentially ilegal "policies"]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14557390 Tue, 11 Oct 2005 22:23:22 EDT Re: [BroadVoice] BroadVoice SCAM Unlimited phone c http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14461979 Gaff : Was linked earlier in this thread: »voxilla.com/PNphpBB2-viewtopic-t-4788.html]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14461979 Wed, 28 Sep 2005 16:12:51 EDT Re: [BroadVoice] BroadVoice SCAM Unlimited phone c http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14459879 iconnor : Got a link to that thread you can post? thanks heaps... would be an interesting thread to read probably.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14459879 Wed, 28 Sep 2005 10:58:40 EDT Re: [BroadVoice] BroadVoice SCAM Unlimited phone c http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14457775 Gaff :
said by iconnor See Profile :

It should be illegal to advertise this service as unlimited and then burry in the fine print all these terms.
It is.

I personally was considering going with BV for my first VoIP experience, but after reading that 14-page thread on Voxilla there is no way in hell I would touch them with a 10-foot pole now.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14457775 Tue, 27 Sep 2005 23:45:48 EDT Re: [BroadVoice] BroadVoice SCAM Unlimited phone c http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14457018 iconnor : It does seem odd to me how they can really give unlimited plans like this. I know some free phone conference solutions make money on the termination charge (so calling the USA does cost something and is not free) and in Australia there is a fee for each phone call (so this is also not free but the length of the call is not charged if local). So it does not make sense that a company could make money on an unlimited plan unless they count on people not using the phone.

It should be illegal to advertise this service as unlimited and then burry in the fine print all these terms. Forbidding non-profit use for instance is an easy violation for me as a volunteer at the local PEG access TV station - if I make one call to the station to check on something that would violate the terms and that doesn't enter into working from home here and there.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14457018 Tue, 27 Sep 2005 22:00:18 EDT Re: [BroadVoice] BroadVoice SCAM Unlimited phone call http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14438846 anon : the same with me!!!
$300,00!!!

Luis]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14438846 Sun, 25 Sep 2005 11:15:49 EDT Re: [BroadVoice] BroadVoice SCAM Unlimited phone c http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14424392 mykey2k : I perused their TOS a couple days ago. This is really the only area that BV could reference. Nothing in there I can see about their unwritten rule... of course I didn't look at the html source. :)

Quoteth from »www.broadvoice.com/terms.html
Last Updated: April 12, 2005

1.3.1 Residential Use of Service
If you have subscribed to BroadVoice's Residential services, the Service is provided to you as a single usage (user) residential plan, for your own personal, residential, non-business and non-professional use. This means that you agree not to use, and may not use, the Service for any commercial activities, governmental activities, profit-making activities, and/or non-profit activities, including but not limited to home office, business, sales, tele-commuting, tele-marketing, auto-dialing, continuous or extensive call forwarding, call relaying, fax broadcast, fax blasting and any other activity that would be inconsistent with normal residential usage patterns. This also means that you agree not to, and may not, sell, resell or transfer the Service to any other person for any purpose, or make any charge for the use of the Service, without the prior express written permission from BroadVoice. You agree that if BroadVoice determines in its sole discretion that you have used the Service, and/or anyone else has used the Service for any activities and purposes prohibited by this section it may immediately charge you BroadVoice's higher rates for its Business service for all periods, including past periods, in which you use, or used, the Service for such prohibited activities together with a US$100.00 administrative fee for same, and that BroadVoice may immediately charge such amounts on your credit card. BroadVoice reserves the right to immediately terminate or modify the Service, if BroadVoice determines, in its sole discretion, that Customer's Service is being used for such prohibited activities or in any other manner prohibited by this Agreement.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14424392 Thu, 22 Sep 2005 23:24:26 EDT Re: [BroadVoice] BroadVoice SCAM Unlimited phone call http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14418422 Big Dawg 23 : I would ask for another copy of the Terms is you can not find it. Many VOIP i looked at stated the consecutive months of XXXX minutes will cause a change from unlimited to limited. The worthless Teleco Qwest does that on Long Distance for 19.95 a month. Also I would comment to them on the Tone of the letter. Evidently they have no customer service skills. Those comments alone would lead me to telling the company to shove there service where the sun don't shine. Taking crap from this company is a joke. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14418422 Thu, 22 Sep 2005 05:44:44 EDT Re: [BroadVoice] BroadVoice SCAM Unlimited phone c http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14415817 joako : Print out this page: »www.broadvoice.com/rateplans_unl···ld+.html

And then call your bank, if they ask you for a written statement, simply send that in with it and your issue should be resolved, assuming you do not have a business account with your bank. Also send them the page with all the plans so they can see that you have been billed in the past for the residential service and nothing more.
--
Am Heimcomputer sitz' ich hier, und programmier' die Zukunft mir]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14415817 Wed, 21 Sep 2005 20:49:48 EDT Re: [BroadVoice] BroadVoice SCAM Unlimited phone c http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14415278 jester121 : ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14415278 Wed, 21 Sep 2005 19:41:15 EDT Re: [BroadVoice] BroadVoice SCAM Unlimited phone c http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14409204 hkvalet :
said by rsa0 See Profile :

Why don't you they galaxyvoice.com ? they have unlimited (not to the mobiles though) and I think Brazil is one of the countries included....
I just checked out the terms and conditions page in galaxyvoice.com, and here is what I found:

"12. USE OF .UNLIMITED. PLANS. Unlimited plans are intended for typical residential or business use. The unlimited business plans are not intended for telemarketing, call centers, resellers, or other end uses that generate excessive call volume. End Users that exceed 2500 minutes per line in consecutive months or on multiple lines in a single month are responsible to pay the standard per minute rates published by Galaxy."
--
**Students are the CUSTOMERS of teachers** »RateMyProfessors.com]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14409204 Tue, 20 Sep 2005 23:46:30 EDT Re: [BroadVoice] BroadVoice SCAM Unlimited phone c http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14401939 DracoFelis : I don't have this particular VoIP provider. But you appear to not be alone in this complaint! Just check out this VERY LONG thread (135 posts, and still growing) in the Voxilla.com forums, that describes the same problem by MULTIPLE customers of theirs:

»voxilla.com/PNphpBB2-viewtopic-t-4788.html]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14401939 Tue, 20 Sep 2005 00:51:49 EDT Re: [BroadVoice] BroadVoice SCAM Unlimited phone c http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14401819 mykey2k : For some history, you can read the woes of SLW from March 2005 (it's 16 pages long):

»[Packet8] P8 switching us to Business2000.unlimited overuse

and the DSLR news page: »VOIP minute caps

She was being switched to the business plan for using 9000 domestic minutes. Eventually it ended up in newspapers nationally and internationally (Canada at least) over the Associated Press wire.

Some ideas that came out of that were:
1. Contacting the Better Business Bureau.
2. Contacting your state's Attorney General
3. Contacting the AG in Massachusetts (where Broadvoice is HQ'ed)

The P8 TOS and Broadvoice's TOS are pretty much the same I imagine, and SLW "won" her fight... although it took a while.

I wish you good luck.

-m]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14401819 Tue, 20 Sep 2005 00:29:17 EDT Re: [BroadVoice] BroadVoice SCAM Unlimited phone c http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14401581 happyvalley : I guess you should be able to get your money back, as they mentioned in the email. no limit, if you use as residential plans. it is pretty clear.
maybe you can go through the phone number you dialed with them to prove all your calls are to family and friends.

good luck.

----------------------------------------------------
>BroadVoice Support wrote:

Vandy,
Don't mix our words. We are not saying that our service is limited in terms of minutes. Our service is, however, limited by type of usage and we require our residential plans to be used as residential plans. Please read what we wrote as well as the excerpt from our terms of service.

Thank you,
BroadVoice Customer Care]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14401581 Mon, 19 Sep 2005 23:45:27 EDT Re: [BroadVoice] BroadVoice Fake "unlimited" http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14401571 Mechano : What a rip off !!!
Why don't you show this to a lawyer...you can ask for some damages here, and this is a clear case of misrepresentation ...what a field day for a lawyer ! Yes man, go for it.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14401571 Mon, 19 Sep 2005 23:44:26 EDT Re: [BroadVoice] BroadVoice SCAM Unlimited phone c http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14401521 GetSet : Go for it and give them hell for not making clear what unlimited means.
You can change to other provider and let everyone you know to do the same.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14401521 Mon, 19 Sep 2005 23:32:18 EDT Re: [BroadVoice] BroadVoice Fake "unlimited" http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14401504 hilsonmota : >From: "BroadVoice Support"
>To: "Vandy" ,,,,
>Subject: RE: Dispute
>Date: Mon, 12 Sep 2005 10:28:02 -0400
>MIME-Version: 1.0
>Received: from bv-master.broadvoice.com ([199.232.74.62]) by mc1-f16.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.211); Mon, 12 Sep 2005 07:29:19 -0700
>X-Message-Info: UZmYcfFpTCed6EhYCpPEWqAXraq/CveOD5yVJ+QN6Xo=
>X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5.6944.0
>Content-class: urn:content-classes:message
>X-MS-Has-Attach:
>X-MS-TNEF-Correlator:
>Thread-Topic: Dispute
>thread-index: AcW2V7FysctFEfL4RVKphrWNMM9IQQBTn1jP
>Return-Path: support@broadvoice.com
>X-OriginalArrivalTime: 12 Sep 2005 14:29:19.0617 (UTC) FILETIME=[5C9CEF10:01C5B7A6]
>
>Vandy,
>We have not changed our argument. Please read what we have written. It was
>you who did not understand correctly what we were telling you.
>This e-mail has a history where you can review the whole thread.
>
>Thank you,
>BroadVoice Customer Care
>
>pcd
>
>________________________________
>
>From: Vandy Rodrigues [mailto:vandyrodrigues@sbcglobal.net]
>Sent: Sat 9/10/2005 6:33 PM
>To: BroadVoice Support; dmauser@hotmail.com; hilson_mota@hotmail.com;
>yuridiogenes@hotmail.com; canevaris@hotmail.com
>Subject: RE: Dispute
>
>
>Support
>
>I see now that just changed your arguments once again saying "limited by
>type of usage and we require our residential plans to be used as
>residential plans". As all of you know friends we use the service to talk
>to our families and also friends of the friends.
>
>As all you can see the company is trying to make more money with their
>customer using different arguments many times. I will not bother you guys
>anymore but is necessary to let you know the quality of service is provided
>to us.
>
>Thanks all,
>
>Vandy
>
>
>BroadVoice Support wrote:
>
> Vandy,
> Don't mix our words. We are not saying that our service is limited
>in terms
> of minutes. Our service is, however, limited by type of usage and
>we
> require our residential plans to be used as residential plans.
>
> Please read what we wrote as well as the excerpt from our terms of
>service.
>
> Thank you,
> BroadVoice Customer Care
>
> pcd
>
> *********************************************
> CRITICAL INFORMATION!
>
> If you have not already done so, please logon to your portal now
>and
> acknowledge your reception and understanding of our information
>about E911.
> This is mandated by the FCC and failure to do so may result in an
> interruption of service or closure. Please keep in mind, this is a
>one time
> acknowledgement.
>
> BroadVoice engineers are working to develop an E911 solution which
>will
> comply with federal regulation. Further information and specifics
>will be
> available as the BroadVoice E911 feature is deployed.
>
> **************************************
>
> ________________________________
>
> From: Vandy Rodrigues [mailto:vandyrodrigues@sbcglobal.net]
> Sent: Sat 9/10/2005 6:20 PM
> To: BroadVoice Support; dmauser@hotmail.com;
>hilson_mota@hotmail.com;
> yuridiogenes@hotmail.com; canevaris@hotmail.com
> Subject: RE: Dispute
>
>
> In another words, what he is saying is your service is not
>unlimited call.
> You have a limit and they measure you according to the limit so
>they can
> move you guys to a business plan.
>
> Let me help the company what unlimited means according to the
>dictionary.
>
> un·lim·it·ed (adj)
>
> 1. Having no restrictions or controls: an unlimited travel ticket.
> 2. Having or seeming to have no boundaries; infinite: an unlimited
> horizon.
> 3. Without qualification or exception; absolute: unlimited
> self-confidence.
>
> BroadVoice ! Support wrote:
>
> Hello all,
> Yes, please do not abuse your service or your account may be
> re-rated to a
> business plan.
>
> If you have any questions regarding the reason that this account
> was
> re-rated, please see the explanation below.
>
> Thank you,
> BroadVoice Customer Care
>
> pcd
>
> *********************************************
> CRITICAL INFORMATION!
>
> If you have not already done so, please logon to your portal now
> and
> acknowledge your reception and understanding of our information
> about E911.
> This is mandated by the FCC and failure to do so may result in an
> interruption of service or closure. Please keep in mind, this is a
> one time
> acknowledgement.
>
> BroadVoice engineers are working to develop an E911 solution which
> will
> comply with federal regulation. Further information and specifics
> will be
> available as the BroadVoice E911 feature! is deployed.
>
> **************************************
>
> ________________________________
>
> From: Vandy Rodrigues [mailto:vandyrodrigues@sbcglobal.net]
> Sent: Sat 9/10/2005 6:05 PM
> To: BroadVoice Support; dmauser@hotmail.com;
> hilson_mota@hotmail.com;
> yuridiogenes@hotmail.com; canevaris@hotmail.com
> Subject: RE: Dispute
>
>
> Hello friends,
>
> As all of you have broadvoice account take a look on this e-mail.
> Check how
> the broadvoice treats their customers.
>
> Vandy
>
>
> Vandy wrote:
>
> You are still trying to find many ways to make more money with your
> customers without reason. Let me refresh your mind with the first
> e-mail
> that you sent me.
>
> " It came to our attention that you are using your residential
> BroadVoice service for
> business purposes, in violation of BroadVoice's published Terms of
> Service."
>
> I will not pay what is undue, by the way, I alre! ady asked to
> can! cel
> my broadvoice account I will not recommend broadvoice at all.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Vandy
>
>
> BroadVoice Support wrote:
>
> Customer,
> We have clearly explained this to you.
>
> The message you received refered to a Terms of Service
> violation for use
> inconsistant with Single Residential service.
>
> Engineering has researched your usage and found you in
> violation of our
> terms of service. As such, we have switched your plan to
> unlimited
> Business. While you will still be able to make unlimited US
> and Canadian
> calling and low international rates, there is no provision
> for unlimited
> usage to international destinations.
>
> We are unable to provide the details of the checks that we
> do because we do
> not want to worry about subscribers coming up with
> loopholes.
>
> You may keep your plan as unlimited business or you may
> cancel your account
>
> As stated in our terms of service:
> "You agree that if BroadVoice determines in its sole
> discretion that you
> have used the Ser! vice, and/or anyone else has used the
> Service for any
> activities and purposes prohibited by this section it may
> immediately
> charge you BroadVoice's higher rates for its Business
> service for all
> periods, including past periods, in which you use, or used,
> the Service for
> such prohibited activities together with a US$100.00
> administrative fee for
> same, and that BroadVoice may immediately charge such
> amounts on your
> credit card."
>
> Thank you,
> BroadVoice Customer Care
>
> pcd
>
> *********************************************
> CRITICAL INFORMATION!
>
> If you have not already done so, please logon to your
> portal now and
> acknowledge your reception and understanding of our
> information about E911.
> This is mandated by the FCC and failure to do so may result
> in an
> interruption of service or closure. Pleas! e keep in mind,
> this is a one time
> acknowledgement.
>
> BroadVoice engineers are working to develop an E911
> solution which will
> compl! y with federal regulation. Further information and
> specifics will be
> available as the BroadVoice E911 feature is deployed.
>
> **************************************
>
> ________________________________
>
> From: Vandy [mailto: customer]
> Sent: Sat 9/10/2005 2:58 PM
> To: BroadVoice Support
> Subject: Dispute
>
>
> I am informing you guys that I will send a dispute
> referencing the last
> charge on my credit card - U$ 251.79. Last set, 07 I
> received an e-mail
> saying that my broadvoice account was moved to a business
> plan because you
> think that I am using for this purpose.
>
> Last set, 08 I called broadvoice's support and explained to
> the agent the
> matter, however he was rude and said that I had either to
> accept to use a
> new business plan or cancel my account.
>
> After tha! t, I sent an e-mail to support@broadvoice.com
> trying to resolved
> the matter and I asked for explanation what motivated you
> guys to move myaccount from residencial to a business plan and
> charge me
> the amount of U$
> 213.31 more.
>
> So far I haven't received any clear explanation and the
> only reason that My
> contract is unlimited call to 35 countries, I believe that
> the word
> unlimited means, 24x7 no limit. I also explained on my last
> e-mail that I
> know the terms in the contract which I did not violate even
> one of them
> since all my calls were to talk to my family and friends,
> mosto of the
> calls are to Brasilia and Petrolina (cities where I have
> familiy).
>
> As I don't accept being moved to a business plan once I
> don't use for this
> purpose so the only option I had was cancel my broadvoice
> account. I asked
> to refund the amount of U$ 213.31 that was the aditional
> that you charged
> me u! nduly.I will ask to my credit ! card company to cancel
> the last charge
> from Broadvoice since its execessive.
>
> I have another friend that use broadvoice service
> experiencing a similar
> issue where you ! charged him saying that he called a cell
> phone in Brazil,
> however the phone number is a land line.
>
> These actions seems to me that Broadvoice company is
> experience some
> difficulties to honor the agreement made with the customers
> and is trying
> to find ways to make more money.
>
> I am respecful person and I honor all my agreements but I
> don't accept to
> pay any bill that is undue.
>
> Thanks,
>
> ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14401504 Mon, 19 Sep 2005 23:29:31 EDT Re: [BroadVoice] BroadVoice SCAM Unlimited phone c http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14401330 happyvalley : I just talked to BV Customer support about the "unlimited minute" policy. he said there is NO LIMIT as long as you don't use it for commerical purpose. they have some algorithm to detect your calling pattern. but he doesn't know how the pattern is defined.

FYI, we usually make a lot of calls at night 7-12pm, morning 9-11am. and not too much call afternoon. I guess they recognize this as a normal residential calling pattern, not a commerical pattern. we have been using around 3000min/month for several months, no trouble so far.

so, in all, BV confirmed that there is no limit as long as you calling behavior is recognized as normal residential calling pattern. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14401330 Mon, 19 Sep 2005 23:04:50 EDT Re: [BroadVoice] BroadVoice SCAM Unlimited phone c http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14400925 mazilo : I am happy with free VoSPs to place P2P calls to talk as long as we wish @ no charge, except paying for Internet. When I saw post like this, I basically :) and consider myself to be lucky not to get into such a problem with paid/commercial VoSP.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14400925 Mon, 19 Sep 2005 22:09:28 EDT Re: [BroadVoice] BroadVoice SCAM Unlimited phone call http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14400792 rsa0 : Dude, BV (in my honest opinion) sucks...big time. In a way they are right, IF and only IF you have signed the new contract, or agreed in any shape or form with it.
If you didn't, then is another story, and you should fight it. I left BV service months ago for less than that S#@&! and I do not regret it a minute. Why don't you they galaxyvoice.com ? they have unlimited (not to the mobiles though) and I think Brazil is one of the countries included....]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14400792 Mon, 19 Sep 2005 21:49:43 EDT Re: [BroadVoice] BroadVoice SCAM Unlimited phone call http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14400663 hilsonmota : My contract used to be unlimited, but now they are saying that I went over the unlimited contract, i can not use more then 2000 minutes as normal residence.

I asked the managers, what means Unlimited phone call, they said unlimited until 2000 :D hahhaahahhahahahaahhaa !

I am sorry for the erros on the english, but they need to go to school and learn what unlimited means!

Account Number : 1085
BroadVoice Phone: xxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Dear Customer:
Starting from March 2005, we have set up an interim charge scheme to collect interim charges from customers before the statement date every time their call and other charges balance exceeds the threshold we defined (currently it is $25). According to your usage of current month, you have exceeded the threshold, therefore, at this time we have charged $192.57 to your credit card.

If you have any concerns, please contact our billing department

Thank you

BroadVoice Billing]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14400663 Mon, 19 Sep 2005 21:32:53 EDT Re: [BroadVoice] BroadVoice SCAM Unlimited phone call http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14400656 anon : Go for it ! I am seriously interested if you can do a dent in their business...this may be a test case ! Good luck any way.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14400656 Mon, 19 Sep 2005 21:32:09 EDT Re: [BroadVoice] BroadVoice SCAM Unlimited phone call http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14400589 hilsonmota : My wife called and her sister where always calling to her mother and family in Brasil using land lines. Average 2000 minutes monthly, base the broadvoice said UNLIMITED, I did not see any problem with that. I never tought the company would be creating new mean to the unlimited contract!

I am calling as SCAM because there is no info on the contract ""fake" Unlimited world Plus 24.95", you never spent one second to send an email saying the company is running out of money or something like that please stop using the service. Now you came with excuse that I went over the limite of unlimited contract!

Do you want to create a new mean to "SCAM" TOO!

I am going to give Broadvoice 12 hours to regret, give details on writing, send me money back, change the unlimited to a reasonable limited and keep my service as 24.95 with minimum 3000 minutes or I am going to spread this all over the world.

PS I work on computer 15 hours everyday, I can spent 2 hours every day to inform everyone on the internet about what is happening to my and other users of BroadVoice.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14400589 Mon, 19 Sep 2005 21:24:50 EDT Re: [BroadVoice] BroadVoice SCAM Unlimited phone c http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14396174 happyvalley : we have used around 2500-3000 minutes each month from Apr., there is no problem so far]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14396174 Mon, 19 Sep 2005 11:26:43 EDT Re: [BroadVoice] BroadVoice SCAM Unlimited phone call http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14395592 voiplover : Contact your Credit Card Company then talk to BV's billing department. It may be just a simple mistake, unless you have been making calls overseas that are chargable or that have backcharges (pay per call/minute) from the receiving #.
You will probably need to show your CC the original TOS at signup that you agreed to.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14395592 Mon, 19 Sep 2005 09:32:41 EDT Re: [BroadVoice] BroadVoice SCAM Unlimited phone call http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14395591 DaSneaky1D : Now, before we make "SCAM" comments, let's examine why you got the notice.

What international call did you make? How may thousands of minutes did you use?
--
:: my trivial ramblings ::]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14395591 Mon, 19 Sep 2005 09:32:29 EDT [BroadVoice] BroadVoice SCAM Unlimited phone call http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14395496 hilsonmota : I would like to inform the SCAM that broadvoice is doing to several customer. Services says UNLIMITED however they might be running out of money and they are doing that to all customer. I adivise you to cancel ASAP before get bills like that.

-----Original Message-----
Account Number : 1085
BroadVoice Phone: xxxxxxxxxxxx

Dear Customer:
Starting from March 2005, we have set up an interim charge scheme to collect interim charges from customers before the statement date every time their call and other charges balance exceeds the threshold we defined (currently it is $25). According to your usage of current month, you have exceeded the threshold, therefore, at this time we have charged $192.57 to your credit card.

If you have any concerns, please contact our billing department

Thank you

BroadVoice Billing]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,14395496 Mon, 19 Sep 2005 09:09:24 EDT