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jig

join:2001-01-05
Hacienda Heights, CA

reply to Blackbird

Re: Microsoft will wipe Sony's 'rootkit' and more

agreed. maybe i misread your post a bit, but it seemed like you were inferring that there was a stipulated right, somehow enumerated in the dmca, that gave content owners the permission to install content protection schemes... and my point was only that the dmca or copyright law doesn't do that, only contract law covers whether or not you allow the drm schemes to be pervasive, though i'm sure the mpaa and riaa would love for everyone to believe that it's an inevitability.

of course, they DO want it built into all a2d and d2a chips (supposedly).

anyway, final point being that contract law is a much better attack vector than mistakenly trying to fight the dmca or copyright head on.

Mele20
Premium
join:2001-06-05
Hilo, HI
kudos:4

reply to jig

said by jig:

part of the problem is that the contract terms are so horrible that no eu would knowingly agree to them (the eff complaint).
eu? eff?


jig

join:2001-01-05
Hacienda Heights, CA

End User. part of the EULA.


Bobby_Peru
Premium
join:2003-06-16

reply to Blackbird

said by Blackbird SR :

Damage to 3rd-party-owned computers and product liability is yet another legal battleground.
Great points!
--
How to Secure (and Keep Secure) My (New) Computer(s): A Layered Approach

dave
Premium,MVM
join:2000-05-04
not in ohio
kudos:7

reply to Mele20
EFF = Electronic Frontier Foundation.

www.eff.org



EGeezer
Summertime
Premium
join:2002-08-04
Midwest
kudos:7
Reviews:
·Callcentric

3 edits

reply to Bobby_Peru
I've already spoken with administrators who have a problem with labor-intensive audit and repair of systems and networks where a rootkit opens holes in their perimeter and, where the kit was installed, having to take systems out of service, scrubbed and rebuilt.

With CERT-US, DHS, SANS and other universally recognised entities identifying and establishing the characteristics of the product(s) involved and recommending scratch/reload as recovery from rootkit-based programs, it should be easier for legal action to be brought and compensation for damages obtained that go beyond media replacement/refund and partial removal programs.

I'd suspect that it can be shown that the vendor knew of the characteristics and intentionally omitted notice. If so, wilful intent to go beyond protecting copyrighted material to compromising systems can be established. In that case, other civil or criminal laws may be applied and the vendor prosecuted under those laws.

For my take on vendor selection, see »On untrusted vendors
--
In Memoriam -

NRK 1 FEB 1918 - 6 NOV 2005
B-17 pilot -
50 missions over Europe and North Africa -
347th Squadron, 99th Bomb Group -

Husband, Father, Grandfather, Great Grandfather, friend ---

A knight and gentleman gone to peace



Dude111
An Awesome Dude
Premium
join:2003-08-04
USA
kudos:10

reply to K McAleavey
I think its amazing that MS would do anything!!!



Maggs
Premium
join:2002-11-29
Woodside, NY

reply to Maggs
My Morning Jacket..... NEVER BUY THEIR CD!!!!!!!!



La Luna
Survived Ashraful
Premium
join:2001-07-12
Warwick, NY
kudos:3
Reviews:
·Vonage
·Optimum Online

reply to K McAleavey
So what is the dang bottom line here? Can we now buy and play CD's safely on our computers or not? And if not, what's the point of buying them? I guess they'd make nice frisbees....oy.
--
~~~...and I miss you, like the deserts miss the rain...~~~



cacroll
Eventually, Prozac becomes normal
Premium
join:2002-07-25
Martinez, CA

1 edit

said by La Luna:

So what is the dang bottom line here? Can we now buy and play CD's safely on our computers or not? And if not, what's the point of buying them? I guess they'd make nice frisbees....oy.
As long as the music industry wants to treat its customers with disrespect, I'd say buy carefully.

If it comes from Sony, or says something about "CDExtra", or "extra content", I'd leave it in the store. And if I went to play it on my computer, and a EULA popped up, I'd take it back to the store, demand to talk to the manager, explain the situation, and request my money back.
--
Cheers,


Chuck


MS-MVP [Windows - Networking]


PChuck's Network


La Luna
Survived Ashraful
Premium
join:2001-07-12
Warwick, NY
kudos:3
Reviews:
·Vonage
·Optimum Online

This is great....I just get an awesome new computer with awesome sound/speakers...and I can't buy and play CD's on it. I am not a happy camper.


--
~~~...and I miss you, like the deserts miss the rain...~~~



antiserious
The Future ain't what it used to be
Premium
join:2001-12-12
Scranton, PA


... look for that logo - it's the kiss of death, unless you run as limited user, disable auto-play, and refuse any install from any cd/dvd ... still, most cd's are safe to play (and rip) including the 'My Morning Jacket - Z' cd that other posted was cryin' about (which is a pretty good cd, once you get past the crap-ola) ... you're pretty smart, you've been warned, you should be okay ...

... surprised this thread got revived - guess it's all the Xmas gifts gettin' hosed, ain't that a shame ...

--
... "Do You Know Where Your Towel Is ?" ...


dadkins
Can you do Blu?
Premium,MVM
join:2003-09-26
Hercules, CA
kudos:18

reply to La Luna

said by La Luna:

This is great....I just get an awesome new computer with awesome sound/speakers...and I can't buy and play CD's on it. I am not a happy camper.


Sure you can, just get and have running at all times - AnyDVD! Kills the BMG rootkit(and virtualy all other copy protection), so no worries!

»www.slysoft.com/en/anydvd.html
--
Think outside the Fox... Opera


La Luna
Survived Ashraful
Premium
join:2001-07-12
Warwick, NY
kudos:3
Reviews:
·Vonage
·Optimum Online

1 edit

reply to K McAleavey
oooh, cool beans, thanks guys!! You've answered my question, the thread got so long and convoluted, I kind of lost track at where we were at with this.

Oh, and yes, I know about that kiss of death logo, lol...
--
~~~...and I miss you, like the deserts miss the rain...~~~


Bobby_Peru
Premium
join:2003-06-16

reply to K McAleavey

"Bah... PC Bug" It could have been worse ;)

Well, since it's revived:

Sam Chennault's take on Sony's Other Other Operation from the 2005-12-22 issue of (at least) the Broward Palm Beach New Times ( »music.newtimesbpb.com/Issues/200···int.html )

said by Sam Chennault in "Bah... PC Bug" :

Last month, it was revealed that Sony Music BMG had been covertly installing spyware on their new CDs to combat music piracy. Sony used a program called XCP, created by U.K. firm First 4 Internet, that employed a cloaking system to hide the proprietary media player that consumers were forced to download in order to play Sony Music CDs. Software included with that media player "remains hidden and active" after installation. According to the attorney general of Texas — who, along with the State of California, launched a class action lawsuit against Sony — this anti-piracy scheme makes users vulnerable to security risks and identity theft.

While critics and lawmakers balked, a computer virus pales in comparison to some of the other ideas tossed around by Sony executives to combat music piracy this holiday season. Here is a partial list of the strategies that were, fortunately, rejected.

Ebola. Feeling that the viral approach had been successful though not fully exploited, Sony executives decided to leave traces of the Ebola virus in CDs marketed to "high risk" customers — i.e., indie-rock, hip-hop, and Latin markets. In an internal memo leaked to Internet muckrakers RawStory.com (really!), Sony CEO Andrew Lack remarked to board members that while this audience constitutes only 40 percent of their market, it is responsible for 90 percent of downloads. "Once we weed out a few hundred thousand bad apples," Lack said, "we'll be able to sell directly and without interference to our loyal customers."

The Reintroduction of the 8-Track Format. Realizing that profit margins had been higher before they began to endlessly tinker with their music formats, Sony briefly considered once again tinkering with their music formats. The long-forsaken 8-track was a leading contender for re-introduction since it was a predigital format that held an ironic allure for hipster consumers and a nostalgic appeal for older consumers — both of whom are target markets for Sony's hopeful holiday breakout CD, Neil Diamond's 12 Songs. The idea was nixed when Sony executives concluded that they would personally find it difficult to snort cocaine off 8-track cases.

Continuing Stream of Shit Music. Understanding that piracy is essentially a byproduct of music fandom, Sony decided that the less excited their customers were about the music they were purchasing, the slighter the chance they would want to swap and share files via the Internet. While this move would appear to be self-defeating, Sony Music execs felt that there was a large-enough market for compulsory purchases, sales based on marketing/ packaging, and quickly disposable novelty hits (see aforementioned Neil Diamond album) to sustain a multibillion-dollar market of completely worthless music. And the best thing about this strategy was that neither Sony nor any other major label had to dramatically shift the way it does business. — Sam Chennault

--
How to Secure (and Keep Secure) My (New) Computer(s): A Layered Approach


Dude111
An Awesome Dude
Premium
join:2003-08-04
USA
kudos:10

reply to K McAleavey

Re: Microsoft will wipe Sony's 'rootkit' and more

If you did get one of sonys CRAP cd's,why not just load the directory of whats on the disk and copy ONLY THE KNOWN TRACKS to your own drive????
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