[net] 60/5? in Verizon Fiber Optics

said by 99664227

You can do that right now. Comcast 8 Mbps/768 kbps. :uhh:

*Yawn* You can do it on even a slower connection. :uhh:

So what's your point exactly?

U_S]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15744760 Thu, 23 Mar 2006 13:37:39 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15739849 Sharps97 : Any ideas on the costs of deploying this type of backbone infrastructure? What costs what and what other types of maint. fees might be involved?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15739849 Wed, 22 Mar 2006 19:12:54 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15739232 SuperG03 : I read that OC-768 is just too expensive, in comparison to just bundleing multiple OC-192s together.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15739232 Wed, 22 Mar 2006 17:43:22 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15736590 TheOtherPete :

said by SuperG03

:

This is a very recent map of the North American Internet backbone, including 134,855 routers, colored by telecom company (Verizon, AT&T, Qwest, Level 3, Sprint Nextel, cable companies, smaller players).

See Attachment.

Interesting but unless I'm missing something I don't see any link speeds on this diagram which is where I thought this thread tangent had gone (how fast are the internet backbone links).

I did some googling around and for long-haul links I couldn't find anything faster than OC-192 as being used although current information on the big player's networks seems to be hard to come by.

This article: »www.qwest.com/about/media/pressr···,00.html from June 2000 says they did a 400 mile OC-768 test and "Qwest expects to begin widespread deployment of OC-768 technology in the first quarter of 2001" but from their latest network map it doesn't appear to have happened.

Does anyone know if there is a technical limitation that keeps existing long-haul fiber links from being upgraded to OC-768 or is just an issue with the cost of upgrading the hardware can't be justified yet?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15736590 Wed, 22 Mar 2006 11:11:39 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15736224 99664227 :

said by chrispix

:

Many people (adults) with the high speed could probably use it to (as some one else posted) connect to their work VPN's just as fast as being in the office. Immagine being able to work from home just as if you were in the office. It might make telecommuting more plausable. Anyway, some other people certainly host websites/VOIP etc on there. Playing games, downloading patches (i.e. windows service packs!)

Think how big the Service packs will be for Vista!

You can do that right now. Comcast 8 Mbps/768 kbps. :uhh:
--
Market go up. Market go down.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15736224 Wed, 22 Mar 2006 10:18:16 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15734024 SuperG03 : This is a very recent map of the North American Internet backbone, including 134,855 routers, colored by telecom company (Verizon, AT&T, Qwest, Level 3, Sprint Nextel, cable companies, smaller players).

See Attachment.

SuperG03

Internet_map···bels.zip 1,119,218 bytes
Internet Backbone Map
(Internet_map_labels.pdf)

]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15734024 Tue, 21 Mar 2006 22:54:53 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15731782 retsam :
»www.cisco.com/en/US/products/ps5···p1026246

if you look at the oc768 interface its a short reach..]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15731782 Tue, 21 Mar 2006 17:44:25 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15731769 retsam : i know there are "other" OC standards but do yourself a favor and try to go and find an OC 256 line card or transceiver...IM not trying to bash you...but i just haven't seen an OC 256 in action for long haul fiber deployed in a WAN environment but i could be wrong.. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15731769 Tue, 21 Mar 2006 17:42:13 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15730899 GeekNJ : So when am I getting all this additional bandwidth for the same price?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15730899 Tue, 21 Mar 2006 15:44:03 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15730611 TheOtherPete : Qwest map from Oct 2005
»www.qwest.com/about/qwest/network/]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15730611 Tue, 21 Mar 2006 15:03:07 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15730092 loeakaodas :

said by retsam

:

ummm last time i checked there really isnt much faster then oc 192. unless you mean they are agregating between multiple oc192's.

I don't know if this is what you meant, but there are faster things then OC-192, but I'm not sure if they are deployed or not.

»en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Optical_Carrier]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15730092 Tue, 21 Mar 2006 13:47:33 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15717792 Sharps97 : Good catch on the date. I wonder if there are any updates available. I'm curious to see what various companies are capable of providing, although given competition, I wonder if they even release these any more (might give the competition a little too much insight into deployment capabilities).]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15717792 Sun, 19 Mar 2006 17:32:16 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15716148 chrispix : As far as Fiber goes, there usually is little to rewire. Typically they have lots of strands running along their backbone that are unlit, its just a matter of adding equipment on either end. If they don't have any unlit, its a matter of just replacing some hard ware on either end. And that map is from 2000 :P]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15716148 Sun, 19 Mar 2006 11:46:41 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15711700 retsam : you guys need to start reading or comprehending...that map is from June of 2000...6 years old...]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15711700 Sat, 18 Mar 2006 16:12:14 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15710426 Sharps97 : Wow, I can't believe how little bandwidth there is behind MCI's backbone. I mean, a small handful of Verizon FIOS users could saturate the entire backbone through most parts of the country with very little problem using either the 15 Mb or the 30 Mb packages. It would be absolutely frightening to think of what would happen if Verizon actually had faster tiers available!

I can only imagine how much it will cost Verizon to rewire most of its backbone to handle just their own group of FIOS users. Eventually Verizon could have one of the largest, most powerful backbones in the world. I wonder if they will need some type of proxy system in place to actually provide the bandwidth the rest of the internet will not be able to, LOL.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15710426 Sat, 18 Mar 2006 12:22:04 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15710253 chrispix : Many people (adults) with the high speed could probably use it to (as some one else posted) connect to their work VPN's just as fast as being in the office. Immagine being able to work from home just as if you were in the office. It might make telecommuting more plausable. Anyway, some other people certainly host websites/VOIP etc on there. Playing games, downloading patches (i.e. windows service packs!)

Think how big the Service packs will be for Vista!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15710253 Sat, 18 Mar 2006 11:50:23 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15710213 mbadur : 1)I attached the mci backbone of the internet. I'm not sure if it could even support 100/100 for alot of people. You can argue over that.
2)I dont know if there is alot of legal use for a 100/100 unless you are sharing the connection. You could argue p2p but how much of it is there that is legal and worth downloading. What they should do is partner with google or make there own equivalent of google base that could actually use the speed. Im not sure, so if im really wrong you can just tell me

Im not sure how to attach but heres the link
»www.nthelp.com/images/uunet.pdf]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15710213 Sat, 18 Mar 2006 11:43:51 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15709248 majortom1981 : why would they raise speeds when they don't even have the networ rolled out everywhere yet. Shouldn't you wait and see what your networ could do before raising the speeds? ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15709248 Sat, 18 Mar 2006 07:29:00 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15708094 grandpinaple : Because Sweden is clearly all of Europe.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15708094 Fri, 17 Mar 2006 23:07:43 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15708053 kday : look up Sweden]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15708053 Fri, 17 Mar 2006 23:02:21 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15707955 Insder : 1gbps shared, read up on it man. And most of Europe DOES NOT have 100/100, it's all ADSL2 over there.
--
The one, the only, the Insder. :: Verizon Online DSL (2793/719) and Deer Alpha Firefox!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15707955 Fri, 17 Mar 2006 22:47:26 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15707946 kday : Setting 100/100 for the same price as the current 15/2 might actually be a good business move for verizon. Hell, half of Europe now has 100/100 as standard internet service. China and Japan now have 1 gbps internet for less than $40 a month. It would take cable companies years to catch up, and verizon will become dominant and set a new standard for the internet. There is no reason that we should be stuck at such low speeds here in the U.S.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15707946 Fri, 17 Mar 2006 22:46:06 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15707914 kday : All raising speeds is a Verizon tech sitting at a server terminal and manipulating a few numbers. In my opinion, Verizon has Plenty of bandwidth to offer even 100mbps/100mbps if they wanted to. Upping speeds will not slow down deployment as the the infrastructure is already prepared for the future.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15707914 Fri, 17 Mar 2006 22:39:40 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15707469 grandpinaple : Some people are a little self indulged if they think Verizon would raise speeds for them at the risk of slowing down deployment.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15707469 Fri, 17 Mar 2006 21:23:42 EDT 60/5 is moot. Think 100/100 http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15702818 anon : Look, just keep the kiddie pron off the net, and everything will work itself out...
More speed to the home is necessary for VZ to keep their "nuclear" option on the table with cable-companies. Which is to say, if you increase bandwidth so high (aka 100megabits+) then you can virutally make cable-tv irrelevant in just a few short years.

If telecommincations have a conflict of interest with copyright holders'... too bad, get over it, you lost way back in betamax days (late 70's) and BLUE RAY DVD will be as microwaved, sauteed and deep fried away from copy protection as those vhs tapes even through macrovision, etc. Gigabit-capable Optical Network upgrades are a fact for Verizon. These are already in the pipeline, and any debate on this pre-order is moot, just a question of when origial BPON's get swapped for GPON's (655/155, to 2.5+/1.25+). Verizon can't be too concerned what customers do with their broadband.. especially if they can't get marketshare from cable-tv. Turabout is fair play because startups and cable companies are eating away at phone revenue with voip. If phone revenue comes back via 100 megabit data pipes to the home via fiber (relatively untaxed at this ponit).. all the better. Don't forget, there's a cable company (in the heart of VZ land) working to migrate to 100/100 megabits at this point. In about 12 weeks this is the new reality for a Verizon competitor (google, or bbr search: Cablevision and Narad Networks).

P.S. The great myth about copyrighted works: most people won't pay for REALLY GOOD content, if they can get it for free. Wrong. Otherwise, you'd see entertainment companies filing for bankrupcy like the airlines, simple fact-- you don't. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15702818 Fri, 17 Mar 2006 08:17:33 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15702746 MagScribe : More bandwidth is crucial — at some point, the Internet will replace radio and TV — and offer much more choice.

I'm delighted with my 15/2 service — but to be honest, would be happier with more upload speed, as I tend to FTP some very large (60-70 MB files), nothing illegal, things that are my own creations, and that used to take forever when I had a cable modem.
--
First, slow DSL. Second, often useless, messed up satellite. Third, cable modem...so this is what broadband is like.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15702746 Fri, 17 Mar 2006 08:01:10 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15702623 TheOtherPete :

said by majortom1981

:

I think verizon would be stupid to upgrade people to such high speeds before their network is done.

Why not use that money to get your service out to your whole network and work on getting tv to your whole network first.

What money?
What does it cost Verizon to reprovision existing FIOS connections for faster speeds? Nothing as there are no hardware changes required.

At best you may be able to argue that they would have to upgrade their backbone network to accommodate the increased customer traffic (if customer traffic actually increases substantially overall as a result of faster speed offerings - a conclusion that has not been established) but without knowing how much excess capacity they have in their existing backbone infrastructure or their incremental costs of adding additional backbone capacity, you are just speculating.

One thing is for sure, offering unmatched speeds certainly gives VZ a marketing advantage over their competitors and will probably lure more customers over to FIOS which does translate into more money for them.

So before you get all worried that VZ is "wasting" money by offering even faster speeds when they should be spending that money on additional FIOS deployments perhaps you should leave it to the people who have all the facts to make the decision.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15702623 Fri, 17 Mar 2006 07:20:21 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15702295 kday : If Verizon makes the speeds faster, it will force the competitors to up their speeds, and we will once again see an evolution in useful bandwidth hungry web applications.

Just think.... on-demand streaming hi-def video straight to your PC. VPN as fast and convenient as being at the office.

These are just some examples off the top of my head, and I truly don't know what's going to come next, but the internet still has huge potential for innovation in web services. Recently, we have seen bandwidth hungry services such as Flickr, YouTube, MySpace, Gmail, Podcasts, Personal Video Podcasts, and too many others to name. If the ISP's don't up the bandwidth, the internet slows down and comes to a standstill. In other words, providing more bandwidth aids in the evolution of the internet. Believe it or not, you and I will someday be utilizing 30 mbps on a daily basis. Probably even within the next couple years.

-Kyle]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15702295 Fri, 17 Mar 2006 04:01:26 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15701814 anon : whats stupid, is people complaining about maxing out 30/2. i'm still on 3/384 dsl because verizon won't move into my area even though they are just 200miles from me. I don't complain about maxing my connection, sure i max it. but its not slow. i would love a 15/2 connection and would kill somebody for a 30/2 connection, if anybody is complaining about it they need to get their head caught in a blender.

Dont confuse this with a "technology should not advance" post. i love the technological race, but people who complain are just fricken retarded.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15701814 Fri, 17 Mar 2006 00:50:57 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15701682 majortom1981 : Hmm So they cannot afford to over sell. Just look at cablevision.

People are complaining that they max out there 30/2 conenctions on boost.

I think verizon would be stupid to upgrade people to such high speeds before their network is done.

Why not use that money to get your service out to your whole network and work on getting tv to your whole network first.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15701682 Fri, 17 Mar 2006 00:23:03 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15701552 grandpinaple : Not if it goes to 55 dollars a month. You are correct in saying that most people who buy the package won't be maxing it out and they can afford to oversell.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15701552 Thu, 16 Mar 2006 23:55:28 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15699869 eco :

said by majortom1981

:

the problem with a 60/5 package is the fact that those download speeds will take away the total bandiwdth of a node faster . Why would they increase there speeds when they don't even have any where near the traffic to see if there current configuration can handle the setup that they have now.

I doubt you're going to see very many 60/5 customers in residential developments paying $200 a month.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15699869 Thu, 16 Mar 2006 19:55:38 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15699849 eco :

said by Insder

:

I'm not trolling. Who the hell said I was trolling?

Your actions said you were trolling. All your posts in this thread have been about why Verizon doesn't need to or should not raise their speeds, or offer speeds as fast as they do now, for FiOS. That was not the topic of this thread. Why does it matter to you whether or not they offer tens of megabits worth of speed? If you don't have anything of value to contribute and you continually post off topic, that is trolling. We would prefer that you go troll somewhere else so we can get back to the orginal topic of the thread.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15699849 Thu, 16 Mar 2006 19:53:12 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15694499 anon : The MCI merger went through, they now own a major part of the internet backbone. So backbone is no longer an issue. The BPON split is X32, but that's as designed, not installed base. From the looks of things, there's at least a x2 overdesign or better in most places, if not all, places. So realistically, the 655/155 is split amongst maybe 16 users max.

All of that points to they could offer 60/5 or even better with little risk of customers seeing slow downs, so long as the link from the CO can support the traffic.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15694499 Thu, 16 Mar 2006 01:36:55 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15693907 majortom1981 : the problem with a 60/5 package is the fact that those download speeds will take away the total bandiwdth of a node faster . Why would they increase there speeds when they don't even have any where near the traffic to see if there current configuration can handle the setup that they have now.

They don't even have their whole network wired for fios yet.

Shouldn't they worry about rolling out fiber to their whole network before spending money on bringing even higher speeds?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15693907 Wed, 15 Mar 2006 23:29:40 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15693857 use_ssh :

said by Insder

:

Large pictures as in 3 megabytes? That's the max for a consumer level camera. Now, honestly, my 90 kb/sec upload takes care of that perfectly. And I state P2P in the obvious illegal sense. Not everyone in the world leaves linux/bsd torrents uploading all day (some do, good for you! More to you!), and you know this. Don't come back at me telling me P2P is legal, because a good chunk of it is illegal materials.

Haha.. That's so funny. Using your logic, 300 baud modems will take care of uploading, so why even bother with 90KB/sec uploads?

It's called progress.

Regarding your P2P not being legal... Using your logic, since networks, and the Internet on a larger scale, can be used for illegal activities, they must be illegal.

But why stop at P2P? There's FTP, SMTP, POP3, IMAP, NNTP, HTTP, HTTPS, the list goes on and on... Those too can be used to facilitate illegal activities. Are you going to go after them as well?

Do you also consider VHS recorders, DVD recorders, CD recorders, telephones, cell phones, encryption, etc, etc. illegal? They too can be used for illegal purposes.

I normally wouldn't respond to threads such as this, but I mean, come on. Sorry for the rant.

Absurdity++

U_S]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15693857 Wed, 15 Mar 2006 23:21:38 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15693579 chrispix : You know some people like to use the verizon business package. This is my setup.

5 Static IPs
Sunrocket VOIP
3 Desktop PC's
2 Servers (Mail/DNS/SQL/WEB)
2 Tivos w/ Internet connectivity
1 XBOX
1 XBOX 360

Wow. I think I know why my electric bill is so high :P

I also need access to my office via VPN.

I personally don't use the bandwidth all the time. But it sure makes my customers happy when they can download from me at 2mbps. I would love a faster connection. I just had to download a Veritas file 500 meg. I wish it was 2x as fast, or even 4x as fast. Otherwise I am just sitting around waiting for things to happen.

As I said, I am not averaging anywhere near the 15mbps/2mbps, but when I need to use it I am glad it is there.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15693579 Wed, 15 Mar 2006 22:37:49 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15691228 Insder : I'm not trolling. Who the hell said I was trolling?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15691228 Wed, 15 Mar 2006 17:47:53 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15691207 TheOtherPete :

said by Insder

:

I'm sure Verizon cares when they get sued to get the names of people illegally trading files. Downloading, correct, is legal, but when you're on bittorrent, you easily upload everything. Same goes for all but newsgroups.

Your arguments don't make sense. As grandpinaple said, it isnt VZ's job to police your traffic. FTP, HTTP or any other udp or tcp port can be used for illegal downloading (or uploading). Unless you are saying that bitorrent can only be used for illegal activity (obviously not true) then VZ has no interest in playing net cop nor should they, it is not their role.

Why don't you let VZ worry about being "sued" to compel them to release customer info and you stick to trolling?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15691207 Wed, 15 Mar 2006 17:45:48 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15691152 Jackie_Chan : Thats right folks... You dont need speed. Please go back to using 300baud modems. You really do not need anything faster than 300baud, unless your a pirate!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I hate people who hang on technology forums who have the mindset that technology should not be advanced...

Why NOT go 100MB/100MB if possible?

WHY THE HELL NOT?

Money? Not your dam problem. If a company can do it, and wants to break ground... They're advancing civilization FASTER than the other greedy corperate types that would HOLD BACK the technology and roll it out slower to profit.

I would rather see a company advance civilization by bringing us the best possible, because you and I will DIE at some point and we're just not going to see how this puppy turns out.

So lets make with the "advancing the world" so we can enjoy it more.

Stick with your 56k... I'll enjoy my 30/5 and I want 60/60... and I want 500/500... I want 1GIG/1GIG

And there is not a dam thing in this world that would make me feel other wise. You cant be too fast.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15691152 Wed, 15 Mar 2006 17:36:45 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15691137 Insder : I'm sure Verizon cares when they get sued to get the names of people illegally trading files. Downloading, correct, is legal, but when you're on bittorrent, you easily upload everything. Same goes for all but newsgroups.
--
The one, the only, the Insder. :: Verizon Online DSL (2793/719) and Deer Alpha Firefox!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15691137 Wed, 15 Mar 2006 17:33:56 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15691099 grandpinaple : First off downloading is legal. Second of all why does Verizon give a shit what you do with the pipes you pay for. It is not their job to enforce copyright law nor is it their place. Third why should progress be stunted because of a few individuals who control the entertainment industry, the same argument applies to all those breaking copyright laws. 3MB / 90kB/s = 33 seconds versus 6 seconds for 5Mb/s and if you upload alot of pictures and movies you made then it gets worse. 3MB is not average for a picture, try 20 MB. If we can get bigger pipes that means less compression as well so the only thing not giving us high speeds causes is a stop in progress. Giving people larger pipes only speeds up the exchange of copyrighted materials, but it doesn't necessarily increase the amount being taken as people only have so much time to view content. It is nice when your broadband speeds are no longer a limiting factor in your productivity and you have more time for other things like the outdoors.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15691099 Wed, 15 Mar 2006 17:28:10 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15691094 eco : Maybe you missed the news story yesterday about iTunes offering their first full movie. It was $1.99 to purchase and totaled almost 500 megabytes. Seems likee a perfectly legit use to me, and at that price, I'm sure people would have no problem buying lots independent movies. If you don't have a fast, efficient delivery system a market is not going to be created around it. You need the speed first, and the market will be there to put it to use. That is the key. A market is not going to develop unless that speed is already in place.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15691094 Wed, 15 Mar 2006 17:27:45 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15690354 Insder : And I'm sure Verizon sees the need for people to download illegally, and say "hey, we'll give them these high speeds, because obviously it's legal usage". I'm saying it's not probable.
--
The one, the only, the Insder. :: Verizon Online DSL (2793/719) and Deer Alpha Firefox!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15690354 Wed, 15 Mar 2006 15:44:54 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15690344 TheOtherPete :

said by Insder

Why do you care so much what other people are doing with their net connections? If you don't want 30/5 then don't get it. No one is forcing you.

Just because you personally don't see the need doesn't mean that others don't have legitimate reasons for wanting those speeds. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15690344 Wed, 15 Mar 2006 15:43:38 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15689926 Insder : Large pictures as in 3 megabytes? That's the max for a consumer level camera. Now, honestly, my 90 kb/sec upload takes care of that perfectly. And I state P2P in the obvious illegal sense. Not everyone in the world leaves linux/bsd torrents uploading all day (some do, good for you! More to you!), and you know this. Don't come back at me telling me P2P is legal, because a good chunk of it is illegal materials.
--
The one, the only, the Insder. :: Verizon Online DSL (2793/719) and Deer Alpha Firefox!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15689926 Wed, 15 Mar 2006 14:32:44 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15687751 use_ssh :

said by Insder

:

Legally is a better way of putting it. As I say many times, there are not many ways for single individuals to use 30/5 legally. There are some ways (VOIP, multiple servers, etc), and definitely for corporations, but the average user has P2P and..what?

Here's a way to use the 30/5 connection: any time you want to send or receive a large file. File sizes are only growing.

Anyone who has played the dial-up waiting game while trying to send large pictures to grandma and grandpa can appreciate a shorter upload time.

U_S]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15687751 Wed, 15 Mar 2006 08:27:21 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15686885 Trevorm7 :

said by Insder

Um, thats not true. P2P does not have to be ilegal, ethical people shouldn't be punished with slow speed because people are always using P2P for ilegal crap.

Plus slow speeds will not stop or help ilegal downloading.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15686885 Wed, 15 Mar 2006 01:25:59 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15685848 grandpinaple : Seems like the legality issue is just another reason innovation is stifled to some extent in this country.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15685848 Tue, 14 Mar 2006 22:18:46 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15684339 PGHammer :

said by retsam

:

ummm last time i checked there really isnt much faster then oc 192. unless you mean they are agregating between multiple oc192's.

That is indeed what I was referring to for the inter-CO trunking (usually SONET over fiber-based ATM as the aggregating technology, because it's CENTREX-friendly, because VZ *still* sells a lot of business CENTREX). Even with fiber, CENTREX isn't going away.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15684339 Tue, 14 Mar 2006 18:51:50 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15682597 Insder : Legally is a better way of putting it. As I say many times, there are not many ways for single individuals to use 30/5 legally. There are some ways (VOIP, multiple servers, etc), and definitely for corporations, but the average user has P2P and..what?
--
The one, the only, the Insder. :: Verizon Online DSL (2793/719) and Deer Alpha Firefox!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15682597 Tue, 14 Mar 2006 14:45:16 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15680319 druber : are you running some kind of QoS router? if so, it's very common for them to prioritize ACK packets, so the behavior you describe makes sense...]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15680319 Tue, 14 Mar 2006 07:43:18 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15679731 Jackie_Chan : 30Mb is far from useless :) I use all 30Mb of it quite easily.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15679731 Tue, 14 Mar 2006 02:28:43 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15678659 grandpinaple : Thing is when I use half my upload on regular uploading (like 20 KB/sec everything is fine anything higher fluctuates my ping) I don't get the ping issue, but when I download and use the upload half as ack packets I start to see pings rise.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15678659 Mon, 13 Mar 2006 22:24:14 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15678214 Vamp : Well with adequate upload speed, the pings shouldn't start going up when downloading, unless you are really consuming it like crazy.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15678214 Mon, 13 Mar 2006 21:20:41 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15676748 grandpinaple : Yey another car analogy... To the poster who said 30 mbit is useless: If you have multiple people in your home it is very useful. Whenever I download at 5/6 my max speed my ping shoots up in multiplayer games online. I don't think it is the ack packets either. My speed is 5/384. Usenet can certainly accomodate such a large pipe. You can also be downloading alot of things simultaeniously at high speeds all around.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15676748 Mon, 13 Mar 2006 17:31:06 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15675474 eco :

said by Vamp

:

that would be dumb and useless, it's probably really hard to find servers to even max 30mbit.

Yet Ferrari still makes a killing selling 200MPH cars here in the US even though there are no roads with speed limits higher than 80MPH.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15675474 Mon, 13 Mar 2006 14:16:40 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15674131 retsam : ummm last time i checked there really isnt much faster then oc 192. unless you mean they are agregating between multiple oc192's.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15674131 Mon, 13 Mar 2006 10:33:11 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15673068 PGHammer : The problem isn't (and never has been) the intra-network bandwidth. Besides, as part of the FTTP upgrade, VZ is also upgrading the inter-CO trunking to, *at minimum*, OC-192 (over fiber, of course), and going *much higher* (in places like NYC or Washington, DC). Intra-VZ bandwidth isn't the issue. The problem is bandwidth *not under VZ control*.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15673068 Mon, 13 Mar 2006 04:37:00 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15672681 anon : What they are doing in Japan is EPON, yeah it's Gig-E, but it's shared, the odds of ever seeing the max speed are slim. That's the fact many overlook when they claim places like Japan are far ahead in offering "higher" speeds.

To apply the same logic here, DOCSIS 1 cable systems here offer 30/5(?) and FiOS offers 622/155.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15672681 Mon, 13 Mar 2006 01:38:46 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15672640 mumixam : 1000/8 is 125MB/sec most raid 0's have around 180MB/sec brust 100 avg]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15672640 Mon, 13 Mar 2006 01:27:26 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15672102 grandpinaple : What is the point of Gigabit in Japan anyway if hard drives in raid arrays in most home users pcs can't even reach those speeds.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15672102 Sun, 12 Mar 2006 23:24:19 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15670281 Cjaiceman : It will be interesting to see if FISION will be able to support their 100/100 connections...

Base speed internet for FISION is 10/10, then move to 25/25, then 50/50, then 75/57 and 100/100...

Website:
»www.4fiber.tv

People in Houston are very lucky if they can get those kinds of speeds... ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15670281 Sun, 12 Mar 2006 18:44:33 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15670231 patcat88 : Your gigabit bandwidth doesnt leave japan, do a speed test to a US or Euro speed tester. Your gigabit only works to other japan gigabit users, P2P as fast as your HD can write and remote internet file storage or whole computer backup.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15670231 Sun, 12 Mar 2006 18:36:50 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15670106 Edrick : It's possible for the network medium to support it being the fiber but the equiptment on each end is another thing although it can support what like 622 Mbps or something like that? But then the issue is the Internet Backend and filling that up. How ever it would be possible as aren't they doing that in like Japan?
--
Ricky Smith Verizon FIOS User 15 Mbit Down 2 Mbit Up]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15670106 Sun, 12 Mar 2006 18:13:21 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15669600 anon : Seems like that kind of bandwidth would congest the rest of the net seeing as how some universities and big businesses don't even have 100/100. All of a sudden millions of people have those kinds of speeds and the net has been completely redifined in terms of load. 100/100 would be good if we could get it within Verizon's own network to facilitate fast transfers between Verizon-Verizon customers. 100/100 is pretty useless for now though. I think a 20 megabit upload would be more than enough for even the most intense users around.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15669600 Sun, 12 Mar 2006 16:43:02 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15669152 Vamp : 100mbit, I dont see upload speeds going anywhere near that anytime soon, We just don't have the technology to support it, it wouldn't take many people to completely consume all the network bandwidth. Unless Verizon plans to run on multiple OC48's or OC192 and put caps and limitations on how long someone can use the upload.

]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15669152 Sun, 12 Mar 2006 15:16:58 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15668973 anon : Yes, Verizon must be floating ideas about new speed packages. To compete with OOL's offerings. There have been rumblings from customers about triple-play and how 15/2 from VZ just isn't as good a bargain anymore.

Personally, I'd like to see a 15(or 20?)/5 package be the "entry level" for $15 with speeds going up to 100/100 or as close to that number as possible. If the speeds do top off at 60 megabits, then why not multiples? 20, 40, 60?
Depending on the speed/price point, I and others would probably opt of the 'middle package' this year, as it fits in our current budget for internet ($45 when bundled with phone). So a *boost* to 20, 40 or 60 megabits sometime around June (my birthday month) would do nicely to coincide with the completed Cablevision network upgrades. Don't forget they are supposed to be ramping out those 50 megabit plans with proprietary modems.

Now that Verizon kicked the ball down the road a bit (maximizing subscriber growth with return on investment), this can only get a company so far. People need to have a reason to demand those speeds. As far back as 6-7 years ago, anything above 10 megabits on the internet was only affordable by large corporate wan/lans and carried a HUGE pricetag (most links were on dedicated copper/fiber and I won't even get into how much it cost to deploy infrastructure--making Mr. Ka-Ching RBOCS a fortune). As we approach 100/100 megabits (or anything over 50/50) someone better start capitalizing on the *content* people will demand, or the already teeming underworld will take over at the expense of cable-tv (testicles of the entertainment industry). Applications and content are good reasons, but thats just the beginning.

Verizon needs mold a "VISION" of why bandwidth is important to customers and more is better. My guess is ISPS will have to come to the conclusion that they will be in the "content-distribution business" very soon.. or mpaa lawyer types will drag them along kicking and screaming (hint-hint AT&T/BELLSOUTH). It's quite possible that the more megabits per dollar will amount to the "internet mutitasker's wet-dream" much in the same way computer processors get marketed to you as the: be more productive, for every purpose-there is a solution, etc.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15668973 Sun, 12 Mar 2006 14:47:12 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15668949 trey_w : Your correct. They do this with all tiers.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15668949 Sun, 12 Mar 2006 14:44:14 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15668439 Insder : They give you an extra burst of speed dedicated to TV service when using VOD and PPV, I believe.
--
The one, the only, the Insder. :: Verizon Online DSL (2793/719) and Deer Alpha Firefox!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15668439 Sun, 12 Mar 2006 13:13:30 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15667776 patcat88 : Use a download accelerator something like GetRight. Puts flame shield up.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15667776 Sun, 12 Mar 2006 11:04:48 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15667653 johnsp : The 5/2 package is probably a problem for their VOD and PPV downloads while you're using the internet. Probably cheaper to just give you the bandwidth then provide a real router with better QoS functionality. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15667653 Sun, 12 Mar 2006 10:40:01 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15666892 GeekNJ : I agree, as noted previously, it's all rumors right now.

Verizon has lowered FIOS in parts of NY (and I think in parts of another state) offering their 30/5 package for $55.

Also, there are other ISPs that Verizon needs to compete against such as Cablevision which offers 15/2 for the same cost as Verizon does and 30/2 for $10 more/mo.

Maybe Verizon will go with regional pricing to compete as appropriate or maybe they will try and stay with a common cost across all their markets. We'll have to see how it pans out.
--
Tweaked your connection? | Mail Parse | Speed Converter]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15666892 Sun, 12 Mar 2006 06:05:36 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15666788 acrufox : After all the contacts I have made in resolving my issues. Please stop the rumor mill, there will be no package changes in 2006. Comcast can barely keep up as it is, especially on their upstream.

Verizon will only introduce such rumors when they choose to quash Comcast. As of right now they are more focused of getting new cities lit up and TV franchising. Anything Verizon offers to date will equal that of Comcast or slightly surpass it.

All these new tiers are RUMOR and SPECULATION. Verizon isn't going to implement new tiers when they haven't even established themselves in some states.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15666788 Sun, 12 Mar 2006 04:24:08 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15666003 Trevorm7 : "most streaming videos are not even over 1000kbps, and most games barely use any bandwidth at all."

The only reason why it's like that is because alot of people don't have much bandwidth, so at first there may not be many reasons but when alot of people have the bandwidth there will be applications to use it.

Meanwhile have fun downloading alot simultaneously without slowing down.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15666003 Sun, 12 Mar 2006 00:03:59 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15665744 grandpinaple : For those institutions they have their business level tiers. Those places need dedicated connections.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15665744 Sat, 11 Mar 2006 23:12:39 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15665222 Vamp :

said by GeekNJ

:

First off, I think this is all rumors.

As for a single server maxing out 30mb, I think that's not really the reason for more bandwidth now. It has to do with multiple simultaneous users and multiple applications. Browsing the internet is hardly differentiated between a 1.5mb DSL and a 30mb FIOS connection. Same for email. Add in streaming video, music, browsing, uploading, etc and that's where the higher caps make sense.

even multiple users, 30mbps is more than enough for everyone to stream videos and play games simultaneously. Even 15mbps is enough for 3 or 4 people to stream videos and play games at the same time, most streaming videos are not even over 1000kbps, and most games barely use any bandwidth at all. Edit: and if 3 or 4 people in your home are playing online at the same time frequently then you should kick their ass and make them go outside for awhile.. lol

Now it might make sense if this type of service were to goto businesses and schools (if Verizon would install FIOS to such places).

]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15665222 Sat, 11 Mar 2006 21:42:45 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15665177 Trevorm7 : I can tell a big difference with 1.5mb dsl and 5mb cable, especially while I'm, downloading a file and surfing at the same time. I remember when I was downloading with dsl it was a pain to surf at the same time. Then I got 5mb cable and it was better than got 10mb cable and was uber better and then went back to 5mb and it was horrible because someone else in the house was gobbling all the upload speed and then they upgraded us to 7mb and I use that now.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15665177 Sat, 11 Mar 2006 21:35:37 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15664974 GeekNJ : First off, I think this is all rumors.

As for a single server maxing out 30mb, I think that's not really the reason for more bandwidth now. It has to do with multiple simultaneous users and multiple applications. Browsing the internet is hardly differentiated between a 1.5mb DSL and a 30mb FIOS connection. Same for email. Add in streaming video, music, browsing, uploading, etc and that's where the higher caps make sense.
--
Tweaked your connection? | Mail Parse | Speed Converter]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15664974 Sat, 11 Mar 2006 21:05:39 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15664920 Vamp : that would be dumb and useless, it's probably really hard to find servers to even max 30mbit.

If they were going to add a faster package it should be like 30/8 or 30/10 or something.

]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15664920 Sat, 11 Mar 2006 20:58:04 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15664669 Trevorm7 : yep, and the people with 5/2 will go to 15/2 and people with 15/2 will get 30/5 :)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15664669 Sat, 11 Mar 2006 20:24:38 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15664280 Jackie_Chan : BTW does this mean that current 30/5 users will get upgraded to 60Mb for no extra charge?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15664280 Sat, 11 Mar 2006 19:26:23 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15664271 Jackie_Chan : When will we get 60/60 ? :) Gotta keep OOL on its toes.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15664271 Sat, 11 Mar 2006 19:25:36 EDT Re: [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15663884 GeekNJ : Or more to add to this rumor..

»VA - Verizon Rumor, can someone confirm?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15663884 Sat, 11 Mar 2006 18:12:21 EDT [net] 60/5? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15663854 Trevorm7 : From what was said here: »www.satelliteguys.us/showthread.php?t=59212

"The Verizon Tech also mentioned that they would be doing away with the 5/2 internet package. The 15/2 will be the entry level package and the price will go down to what the 5/2 is. The 30/5 will be the second package and he believed it would go the current 15/2 price. He said they would be adding a 60/5 package for their high end package."

Can anyone confirm this? Is this true? If it's true than when?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,15663854 Sat, 11 Mar 2006 18:05:36 EDT