Re: Get Modem Stats while Hooked Up to Router? in Verizon Online DSL http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r16850457 en Fri, 27 Nov 2009 20:29:17 EDT Fri, 27 Nov 2009 20:29:17 EDT Re: Get Modem Stats while Hooked Up to Router? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,16860790 imric : I've seen MAC reservation on a NetGear router I set up for my wife's employer. It's a nice feature (and I had to use it so she could connect via pcAnywhere, which required static IP and port reservations). But I can't find that capability in the WRT set up. But, the WRT DHCP server allows the address range to be set up. So, I think I can keep the PCs set up to not transact DHCP as a client and then set the lowest address of the WRT DHCP server to be higher than the PC static addresses. That should yield the same net effect.

The only other thing that might cause a problem is that I use MAC cloning in the WRT so the Verizon assignment of the IP via DHCP on the WAN side works (again, being ex-GTE, I don't log on via PPPoE). Guess I'll just have to give it a whirl sometime and see if it works.

Thanks for the idea and the help.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,16860790 Thu, 07 Sep 2006 21:30:36 EDT Re: Get Modem Stats while Hooked Up to Router? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,16855274 NormanS :
said by imric See Profile :

Can this work if DHCP is disconnected on the LAN?

I have a Linksys WRT54GS router and a Linksys WPS54GU2 print server. When I installed the print server it wouldn't work until I disabled DHCP on the LAN and went to static addresses for all LAN members (the print server and two PCs, currently).

Actually, when I first connected the print server, I had a Linksys BEFW11S4. That router fried a year or more ago and when I installed the WRT, I never tried re-enabling the DHCP server on the router. Since the problem initially was with the print server, I suspect I need to keep the static IP addresses on the LAN.
For static IP addresses on the LAN, I find it convenient to use a router with MAC address reservation. Within the DHCP range of IP addresses, I configure the MAC address of the device I want to have a static IP address along with the IP address I want that device to have. That tells the DHCP server to always assign the same IP address to the device with that MAC address. I am not sure that Linksys routers have that feature.
I'm not sure I understand the discussion about the two subnets, but the solution you described seemed to revolve around DHCP being enabled.
Typically, a router keeps any IP address request on the same side of the NAT boundary if the IP address is within the scope of the subnet on that side of the boundary. So if your modem is on the far side of the NAT, but its IP address is within the scope of the LAN IP address subnet, the router will not pass the packets across the NAT boundary. So you would configure the LAN IP address range on a different subnet. That way, the router does not keep the packets within the router subnet, but passes them through the NAT boundary.
Additionally, I'm in an ex-GTE service area and don't use PPPoE to connect. Verizon uses DHCP to provide the "external world" IP address to my modem. That is, I don't have the WRT router (or anything else, for that matter) log on to my account. I just have the the Internet Connection Type (in the WRT setup) set to "Automatic Configuration - DHCP". Does that make a difference to the technique you described?
I am not sure. If I were to connect my SS4100 to a Verizon DHCP loop, I would have to bridge it. The only other modem options are PPPoE, PPPoA, and "PPP is on the computer". Since DHCP isn't using PPP, none of those options would work.

In theory, it probably should work, but my understanding of the Layer 2 operations it too fuzzy for me to say for certain.
Anyway, I have the 2200 set to Bridge mode (its default was PPPoE) and its DHCP server disabled (per posts in the Verizon Forum FAQ, if I recall correctly) (plus VPI/VCI set to 0/35); otherwise all of its settings are at the defaults.

So, it'd be nice if I could view the stats on my LAN from behind the router and even better if I could do that with the 2200 (but suppose I could go back to the 2100 if that were the only way it could work).
If you can reach the modem through its IP address with a computer, while you have the DHCP connection to the Verizon network, I can't see why you couldn't reach it with a router. But there is Layer 2 activity involved, and I am not sure what will actually happen.

With a PPPoE connection, PPPoE on the router, and the modem bridged, the TCP/IP packet requests are normally encapsulated within the PPP packets (or whatever they are called), so they are not seen for what they are on the WAN side of the router.

But with DHCP, any IP addresses outside of the scope of the LAN subnet mask should be passed to the WAN side of the router. If the packets are within the subnet mask scope of the modem, then they would be kept on that network. So with the router at 192.168.2.1/255.255.255.0, and the modem at 192.168.1.1/255.255.255.0, any packet addressed to the modem should reach the modem.
I doubt it makes a difference, but just in case... the 2200s are not Verizon ISP modems. Mine are model B90-220030-04; the "30" equates to a Bellsouth version of the modem. Verizon editions use "15" in the model number of the Westell modems, from what I learned elsewhere on the BBR. (In case anyone else reading ever gets a hold of a BellSouth modem, you access it at 192.168.1.254 instead of the familiar Verizon modem IP address of 192.168.1.1. It took me a while to figure that out.)
As far as DSL modems go, AT&T, Bellsouth, and Verizon apparently all use G.Dmt modulation, with AT&T and Verizon using VPI/VCI of 0/35, while Bellsouth uses VPI/VCI of 8/35. So they should all be interchangeable. Well, almost. In Verizon regions using DHCP, you need to bridge the modem, as well; if that isn't an option, your stuck with a PPP modem.

--
Norman
~Oh Lord, why have you come
~To Konnyu, with the Lion and the Drum]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,16855274 Thu, 07 Sep 2006 00:47:46 EDT Re: Get Modem Stats while Hooked Up to Router? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,16854060 imric : Can this work if DHCP is disconnected on the LAN?

I have a Linksys WRT54GS router and a Linksys WPS54GU2 print server. When I installed the print server it wouldn't work until I disabled DHCP on the LAN and went to static addresses for all LAN members (the print server and two PCs, currently).

Actually, when I first connected the print server, I had a Linksys BEFW11S4. That router fried a year or more ago and when I installed the WRT, I never tried re-enabling the DHCP server on the router. Since the problem initially was with the print server, I suspect I need to keep the static IP addresses on the LAN.

I'm not sure I understand the discussion about the two subnets, but the solution you described seemed to revolve around DHCP being enabled.

Additionally, I'm in an ex-GTE service area and don't use PPPoE to connect. Verizon uses DHCP to provide the "external world" IP address to my modem. That is, I don't have the WRT router (or anything else, for that matter) log on to my account. I just have the the Internet Connection Type (in the WRT setup) set to "Automatic Configuration - DHCP". Does that make a difference to the technique you described?

As for the modem, I have two. One is a Westell 2100 originally supplied by Verizon when I signed up for service several years ago. That modem is bridge only/non-routing.

However, I'm currently using a Westell 2200 that I bought on eBay. I got two (for cheap) in a Dutch Auction, having wanted a spare in case the 2100 ever burned out, once VOL stopped giving free replacements. I also wanted the 2200 because it gives more upstream/downstream stat info than the 2100.

I doubt it makes a difference, but just in case... the 2200s are not Verizon ISP modems. Mine are model B90-220030-04; the "30" equates to a Bellsouth version of the modem. Verizon editions use "15" in the model number of the Westell modems, from what I learned elsewhere on the BBR. (In case anyone else reading ever gets a hold of a BellSouth modem, you access it at 192.168.1.254 instead of the familiar Verizon modem IP address of 192.168.1.1. It took me a while to figure that out.)

Anyway, I have the 2200 set to Bridge mode (its default was PPPoE) and its DHCP server disabled (per posts in the Verizon Forum FAQ, if I recall correctly) (plus VPI/VCI set to 0/35); otherwise all of its settings are at the defaults.

So, it'd be nice if I could view the stats on my LAN from behind the router and even better if I could do that with the 2200 (but suppose I could go back to the 2100 if that were the only way it could work).

There's even one final wrinkle. I don't have two spare ports on the WRT. But if the basic technique could work with static IP addressing, perhaps I could get an Ethernet switch to hook up the two PCs to the router. (We rarely use them both simultaneously.) Alternatively, one of the PCs is a laptop that could make a wireless connection to the router that would then free up one of the cabled ports on the WRT.

Sorry for the long post, but now that it's here, any thoughts on if I can get the technique to work?

Thanks.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,16854060 Wed, 06 Sep 2006 21:32:53 EDT Re: Get Modem Stats while Hooked Up to Router? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,16850879 Frankm : Jodokast96 and NormanS thanks for your quick replies. I tried the the setup that I posted in my question first and it worked. I maintained my internet connection and could access the router using 192.168.1.2 and accessed the modem using .1.1.

Thanks again for your replies I appreciate it.

Frank]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,16850879 Wed, 06 Sep 2006 12:47:07 EDT Re: Get Modem Stats while Hooked Up to Router? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,16850457 NormanS :
said by Frankm See Profile :

A kind of dumb question, But I am not that familiar with messing around with these settings. Would it be possible to change the routers IP address to 192.168.1.2 and leave the 6100 as .1.1? Of course I would change default gateway to .1.2.
If you mean a router attached to the modem, you need to set the router to a different subnet. I use a SpeedStream 4100, but the principle is similar. SS4100 is accessed at 192.168.0.1, so any router in the 192.168.0.0/24 subnet won't see the SS4100. I changed my router to the 192.168.102.0 subnet (router is 192.168.102.1 with a subnet mask of 255.255.255.0), and can reach the SS4100 across the NAT just fine.

For your case, I would suggest setting the router LAN IP address range to 192.168.2.0/24, which is to put the router IP address as 192.168.2.1, with the subnet mask at 255.255.255.0.
--
Norman
~Oh Lord, why have you come
~To Konnyu, with the Lion and the Drum]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,16850457 Wed, 06 Sep 2006 11:43:22 EDT Re: Get Modem Stats while Hooked Up to Router? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,16850413 Jodokast96 : Sure, but as mentioned above, make sure the router's DHCP addresses to not include 192.168.1.1.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,16850413 Wed, 06 Sep 2006 11:36:11 EDT Re: Get Modem Stats while Hooked Up to Router? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,16850380 Frankm : A kind of dumb question, But I am not that familiar with messing around with these settings. Would it be possible to change the routers IP address to 192.168.1.2 and leave the 6100 as .1.1? Of course I would change default gateway to .1.2.

Thanks

Frank ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,16850380 Wed, 06 Sep 2006 11:31:08 EDT Re: Get Modem Stats while Hooked Up to Router? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,16839281 NormanS : Once you get a handle on what subnet masking is for, and what settings you need to establish on the NICs (only a handful, everything else should be default; so, in theory, you can reset the settings and start over), it isn't so bad.

Well, when I say "default", I mean for a single computer connected to a router with a normal NetBIOS and TCP/IP configuration. Stuff like WINS and NetBEUI can add confusion.
--
Norman
~Oh Lord, why have you come
~To Konnyu, with the Lion and the Drum]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,16839281 Mon, 04 Sep 2006 15:47:59 EDT Re: Get Modem Stats while Hooked Up to Router? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,16838729 onoma_ : Thanks for the detailed reply! I *think* I can handle this configuration. For some reason, I'm entirely comfortable rummaging around in the guts of my PC and tweaking the heck out of it, but this LAN set-up stuff scares me. Off to give it a shot...]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,16838729 Mon, 04 Sep 2006 14:06:31 EDT Re: Get Modem Stats while Hooked Up to Router? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,16837447 ChrisDAT : It seems that way, but with DSL, you are using PPPoE which is a tunnelling protpcol similar to a VPN, so the connection between the LinkSYS WAN and the 6100 is exclusive to the two -- the LinkSys NAT and and firewalling is not bypassed.

One extra feature that this setup adds is that you can also use the XP PPPoE to establish an internet connection from a single PC -- so be careful that none of your LAN PCs automatically try to make this connection because wierd things happen if more than one box makes a PPPoE conection through the same modem.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,16837447 Mon, 04 Sep 2006 09:36:30 EDT Re: Get Modem Stats while Hooked Up to Router? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,16837264 pende_tim : Deleted.. posted twice for some reason??
--
The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,16837264 Mon, 04 Sep 2006 08:36:12 EDT Re: Get Modem Stats while Hooked Up to Router? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,16837263 pende_tim : Will the connection from the WAN port to the LAN port bypass the NAT and Firewall protection built into the WRT?
It would seem that plugging the modem into the LAN port puts the modem on the LAN. Yes, the modem and the LAN are on different sub-nets but the modem still on the LAN side of the router.
--
The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,16837263 Mon, 04 Sep 2006 08:36:08 EDT Re: Get Modem Stats while Hooked Up to Router? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,16836812 NormanS : I was too slow, nor was my solution as elegant as the other one just offered.

--
Norman
~Oh Lord, why have you come
~To Konnyu, with the Lion and the Drum]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,16836812 Mon, 04 Sep 2006 03:20:08 EDT Re: Get Modem Stats while Hooked Up to Router? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,16836805 ChrisDAT : The 6100 has only one Ethernet port, and like you noticed, when it's conected to the WAN side of the LinkSys you can't "see" it, so...

You want to put the 6100 on your LAN, but you have to make some changes to avoid conflicts:

The physical connection requires an additional Ethernet cable, and two free Ethernet ports on the LinkSys WRT...

First, the 6100 should have an IP address on its LAN port that is not the same as the WRT, and not in the DHCP range of the WRT's DHCP server -- 192.168.1.2 perhaps?

Second you must disable the DHCP server in the 6100 even if you intend to use it in bridge mode,

The first Ethernet connection is from the 6100 Ethernet port to one of the WRT's free Ethernet ports -- you can just swap the cable that was in the WRT WAN port to an ethernet port.

The second Ethernet connection is from the WRT WAN port to one of the other free WRT Ethernet ports.

You don't have to take the 6100 out of bridge mode, you just have to access it with its new LAN IP.

Now, you can access both boxes without swapping cables ever again :)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,16836805 Mon, 04 Sep 2006 03:14:37 EDT Get Modem Stats while Hooked Up to Router? http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,16836713 onoma_ : Hi all,

Is there a way to pull modem stats while hooked up to a router? Verizon keeps switching me back to interleave from fastpath, and I think they've done it again. My connection goes to pot each time this happens.

I'm on a a Westell 6100, hooked up to a Linksys WRT54G. However, every time I want to check my modem stats, I have to reset the modem, check the stats, and then set everything back up into bridge mode so I can hook up my wireless router. This is a bit of a pain. Is there a way around this process that I should know about?

Thanks! ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,16836713 Mon, 04 Sep 2006 02:34:33 EDT