Re: He could be right in http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r17184077 en Sat, 05 Dec 2009 15:26:04 EDT Sat, 05 Dec 2009 15:26:04 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17207728 anon : Al Frankin? You mean the guy that Peter Jennings ripped a new asshole through? He should have stayed on SNL..He sucked as a funny man and he sucks even more as a political commentator!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17207728 Fri, 03 Nov 2006 03:00:30 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17205209 broadbander :
said by Karl Bode See Profile :

quote:
There is no reason to show carnage
Absolutely there is. It is the reality of being at war. It is reality. Not showing it is not reporting reality. It's part of the reason that a large portion of this country's populace acts like war is G.I. Joe toys in a sandbox.

I'm not saying go to the lengths of Al Jazeera for political effect, but we see no significant war images on the big-three nightly news.
Even if we disagree about the sentiment and motivation, you're certainly right about the final result.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17205209 Thu, 02 Nov 2006 17:52:31 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17204347 Karl Bode :
quote:
There is no reason to show carnage
Absolutely there is. It is the reality of being at war. It is reality. Not showing it is not reporting reality. It's part of the reason that a large portion of this country's populace acts like war is G.I. Joe toys in a sandbox.

I'm not saying go to the lengths of Al Jazeera for political effect, but we see no significant war images on the big-three nightly news.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17204347 Thu, 02 Nov 2006 15:43:26 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17203958 Maxo : I disagree. When I saw Saddam's kids on TV I thought it was disgusting and added absolutely nothing to the story.
There is no reason to show carnage just like there is no need to show nudity when covering a story about sex. There is a line of decency that does not need to be crossed.
The only time I find such things helpful is when one is collecting data, not for news reporting, but for historical accuracy. Such would be a collection of footage at Auschwitz in a library.
--
"Padre, nobody said war was fun now bowl!" - Sherman T Potter

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»myspace.com/mlsquad]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17203958 Thu, 02 Nov 2006 14:37:48 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17203907 Karl Bode :
quote:
will this add to the newsworthiness of this piece?" It is quite possible that many feel that, in the current climate, showing the bodies of soldiers and others is disrespectful and not for light-stomached, of which there remain plenty in America
Yes, I have friends in newsrooms at local affiliates to take pride in "protecting" us from foul images. You would think there could be a realization that if we are truly concerned with accurate portrayal of reality, worrying about the sensibilities of showing carnage to a largely sheltered populace should not enter into it. Clearly there is no need to show egregious violence, but the fact that we see none seems to me to be too broad, too defining, and too significant to simply be concern over offending the public.

I believe it is more likely a concern of offending the sponsors and/or maintaining good relationships with government authorities and the various scoops the provide on less controversial stories....]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17203907 Thu, 02 Nov 2006 14:29:02 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17201313 broadbander :
I see Matt Drudge, who has been the top rated Internet news website for a decade
It'd be interesting to check his traffic versus NYtimes.com or various other news blogs. Drudge Report is one outlet. Those who read Drudge read a smathering of other blogs. Again, the point is there is plenty of counter-media on the Internet in "new media," ranging from libertarian to communist perspectives, with far more access to the general population than ever before. Unlike cable news and other now co-opted forms of media, there are plenty of options other than Matt Drudge. If he is indeed the most popular site, than it is truly reflective of people's sensibilities, not a limitation or bias of information in the marketplace (which is an upsetting thought in itself).

I think the thing that prevents the showing of bloody war related images is a much darker system of intentional propaganda aimed at limiting outrage over warfare and quelling humanism driven dissent.
You are no more likely to see the desecrated corpse of an enemy than you are a friend. I've worked in and studied journalism for a decade and a half. Before airing a graphic piece of footage, reporters are taught to ask "will this add to the newsworthiness of this piece?" It is quite possible that many feel that, in the current climate, showing the bodies of soldiers and others is disrespectful and not for light-stomached, of which there remain plenty in America. Having worked in the media, I also don't think "intentional" can be described as accurate. Perhaps there is subversive coloring, but I never noticed as much. In my years in the media, from trade press to the wire to daily papers, I have never been asked to "rosey up" a story critical of any administration. But again, I've worked in print media, an inherently less sensational medium.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17201313 Thu, 02 Nov 2006 01:27:17 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17199673 Karl Bode :
quote:
New media revives this fight time and again, and competition between biased media has a similar (though not as deep) effect. First radio, then TV, then the Internet. Eventually the media becomes consolidated, but time and time again, new media outlets seeking to be objective (for the first few years) come to the forefront and certain older outlets find a solid enough consumer base (said to talk in such terms) that they can afford to be objective.
I don't see this evolution. I see Matt Drudge, who has been the top rated Internet news website for a decade, still engaging in political smear attempts, and now a dozen others who mirror him from other viewpoints and ideologies.

quote:
As for bloody images ... I agree entirely. War is brutal and that should be illustrated. Unfortunately, that is a question of "taste" and "sensibility," having more to do with the puritan sensibilities of the Western world than media bias.
I'm not so sure I buy that. We're in love with blood and guts in this country, and the complaints to the FCC over indecency come from a vast minority of christian conservatives motivated to react via Internet "outrage-o-matic" forms. I think people can take the occasional shot of a dead soldier, but we rarely see even that.

I think the thing that prevents the showing of bloody war related images is a much darker system of intentional propaganda aimed at limiting outrage over warfare and quelling humanism driven dissent.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17199673 Wed, 01 Nov 2006 20:07:20 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17199572 broadbander :
I'll agree with that, but corporate advertised income model is a major problem for an objective media, and it's a fight that guys like Edward Murrows lost decades ago.

New media revives this fight time and again, and competition between biased media has a similar (though not as deep) effect. First radio, then TV, then the Internet. Eventually the media becomes consolidated, but time and time again, new media outlets seeking to be objective (for the first few years) come to the forefront and certain older outlets find a solid enough consumer base (said to talk in such terms) that they can afford to be objective.

There's an entire consumerism paradigm that modern media fails to challenge.
Agreed to some extent, but I don't see it as the news medias job to call consumerism as an ideological trend into question, but rather to call into question particular things and events that might be related to that trend. There is also plenty of alternative media that aim all guns at "consumerism" (though often as a front for the promotion of some variant strain of communism). Even the major news outlets occasionally run pieces of consumerism and "the negative spirit of money," though more often than not there is an unfortunate naturalistic or theological spin to such stories.

And there's nationalism. How long did it take for news outlets during the Iraq war to stop cheerleading and stop reporting? And why is this nation at war, yet we see absolutely no bloody images?
This paragraph I believe we are in pretty solid agreement, though I think again, we may be seeing through different lenses. Nationalism is an opaque thing, but it certainly exists in media coverage, perhaps not as nationalism, but as a distinct response to a lack of nationalism on the part of cynical news reporters. It also has a lot to do with access. The government has the ability to bring a reporter onto a big ship with big guns and that is a powerful visual. Also, often times, it is not the members of the media who are biased, but the public they "inform" and yes, the suits on the top.

As for bloody images ... I agree entirely. War is brutal and that should be illustrated. Unfortunately, that is a question of "taste" and "sensibility," having more to do with the puritan sensibilities of the Western world than media bias.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17199572 Wed, 01 Nov 2006 19:54:48 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17199450 Karl Bode :
quote:
I think the problem is far more particular and deep than an overall "corporate bias." There are multi-functional biases and multi-faceted instances of human inability that create the overall "bad vibe" generated by cable news.
I'll agree with that, but corporate advertised income model is a major problem for an objective media, and it's a fight that guys like Edward Murrows lost decades ago. The issue does go deeper than simply corporate bias. There's an entire consumerism paradigm that modern media fails to challenge.

And there's nationalism. How long did it take for news outlets during the Iraq war to stop cheerleading and stop reporting? And why is this nation at war, yet we see absolutely no bloody images?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17199450 Wed, 01 Nov 2006 19:38:10 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17199377 broadbander :
said by Karl Bode See Profile :

Lets focus solely on cable-news then. You would disagree that the massive cable networks as a whole do not primarily espouse views that are primarily pro-corporation? The ever present fear of alienating advertisers has long made this a rather dysfunctional model.
Cable news has particular corporate biases to the particular corporations that fund them and even that is not always the case. There are instances weekly in which any particular cable news networks will go undermine some particular corporation or another. Now, yes, there are elses instances of the converse, when a news network bloats a corporation's profile it is somehow affiliated (or in some cases not affiliated). In most cases, this can be chocked up to the same thing that causes most of the world's problems: human incompetence. However, there indeed some instances of genuine corporate suppression of stories (though generally those stories are picked up by a rival network, i.e. a rival corporation, or the somewhat more diligent print media).

I will not defend network news as fantastic or even worth ingesting. However, I think the problem is far more particular and deep than an overall "corporate bias." There are multi-functional biases and multi-faceted instances of human inability that create the overall "bad vibe" generated by cable news.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17199377 Wed, 01 Nov 2006 19:29:11 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17198890 Karl Bode : Lets focus solely on cable-news then. You would disagree that the massive cable networks as a whole do not primarily espouse views that are primarily pro-corporation? The ever present fear of alienating advertisers has long made this a rather dysfunctional model.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17198890 Wed, 01 Nov 2006 18:14:08 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17198762 broadbander :
said by Karl Bode See Profile :

Again, the media is not "left" or "right", it is pro-corporate, pro-consumption, pro-violence (if it gets ratings), and pro speculation. The entire "bias" debate is so myopic, tired and un-genuine at this point it makes my head hurt.

Both sides think the media espouses the views of the "other" side because they are being played against eachother to distract from the real issues they might otherwise agree upon.
I think that the media is made up of individuals with their own particular views. I think a corporation, any corporation, promotes a particular culture based on the views of said employees at least in some small part. As such, I do not calling the media "pro" anything can be sweepingly true. Particularly parts of the media lean and swing certain ways. The entire media is not biased one way or the other but in a spectrum of ways. Certain media outlets do indeed lean a certain way, just as certain corporations and groups of individuals lean certain ways. Those ways are often not as simple as "left" or "right," true, but I do not think they can be called decidedly "pro" or "anti" anything as a whole.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17198762 Wed, 01 Nov 2006 17:51:15 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17198754 broadbander :
said by KrK See Profile :

Exactly. What's the biggest issue of the day?

Republicans:"Kerry insulted our Military men and women!"
Kerry: "Did not!"
Republicans: "Did too!"
Kerry: "Did not!"

and then the news channels convene panels of talking heads to discuss... Was it/Wasn't... Apologize/No Apologize etc etc blah blah blah crapola crapola crapola
That list should with "Kerry says x" since he provoked his own demise.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17198754 Wed, 01 Nov 2006 17:48:58 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17196102 Karl Bode : Again, the media is not "left" or "right", it is pro-corporate, pro-consumption, pro-violence (if it gets ratings), and pro speculation. The entire "bias" debate is so myopic, tired and un-genuine at this point it makes my head hurt.

Both sides think the media espouses the views of the "other" side because they are being played against eachother to distract from the real issues they might otherwise agree upon. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17196102 Wed, 01 Nov 2006 10:28:06 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17195239 Maxo : I don't trust the media either. As a person who sits on the far left, I also don't find them in line with my political beliefs. So to say they are left (which I also happen to be) is not true. The news media is silly, sloppy, and unprofessional, but it is not left.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17195239 Wed, 01 Nov 2006 07:06:14 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17195129 NormanS :
said by Maxo See Profile :

Anecdotal. Also, if an article is promoting a candidate, it's not a news article, it's an op/ed peice.
IMO any news agency will always be critical of the current administration and everything it does.
An article about the president is not the same as an op-ed piece promoting a politician. But a newspaper which is always promoting the left in the op-ed pieces is hardly a right-wing rag.

Newspapers tend to publish articles which support their left-wing agenda, and omit articles which don't. When they covered the murder of a trans-gendered young man in my area, they always referred to him as "her", despite the biological facts of the case, and they always cast the perpetrators as "homophobes", despite a lack of evidence to support that as a fact.

They covered the matter of a valedictorian speaker having the microphone pulled on her speech, but omitted the fact that the audience demanded that the school administration restore the microphone connection. The speaker's words were squelched by the administration because they didn't approve of her use of religious content in her speech; despite the fact that it was a graduation ceremony, not a class.

I could go on...

I don't trust the media. Even on non-divisive matters they get their facts wrong. Reporting a 120,000 gallon pesticide spill on the upper reaches of the Sacramento river, near the town of Dunsmuir. The car couldn't have held more than 30,000 gallons, or so. The capacity was probably about 120,000lbs GVW, not 120,000 gallons. The caption under a photo of an action in Israel, on the Lebanese border (more than ten years ago) identified an Israeli "tank" firing into Lebanon: It was a 155mm SP Howitzer. The caption under a photo identified a Salvation Army officer with some donated toys at Christmas (more than ten years ago): It was a U.S. Marine Corps NCO.

Did I say that I don't trust the media? They are short on factual accuracy, and long on political spin to the left.
--
Norman
~Oh Lord, why have you come
~To Konnyu, with the Lion and the Drum]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17195129 Wed, 01 Nov 2006 05:50:33 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17193738 Maxo :
said by NormanS See Profile :

Just what is so "right-wing" about news articles blasting Bush, and editorials promoting Phil Angelides for Governor, and Jerry Brown for Attorney General?
Anecdotal. Also, if an article is promoting a candidate, it's not a news article, it's an op/ed peice.
IMO any news agency will always be critical of the current administration and everything it does.
--
"Padre, nobody said war was fun now bowl!" - Sherman T Potter

»www.cafepress.com/maxolasersquad

»maxolasersquad.com/

»maxolasersquad.com/network/ My DSL Network Guide

»myspace.com/mlsquad]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17193738 Tue, 31 Oct 2006 21:50:15 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17193201 NormanS : Just what is so "right-wing" about news articles blasting Bush, and editorials promoting Phil Angelides for Governor, and Jerry Brown for Attorney General?
--
Norman
~Oh Lord, why have you come
~To Konnyu, with the Lion and the Drum]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17193201 Tue, 31 Oct 2006 20:22:06 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17193129 KrK : Exactly. What's the biggest issue of the day?

Republicans:"Kerry insulted our Military men and women!"
Kerry: "Did not!"
Republicans: "Did too!"
Kerry: "Did not!"

and then the news channels convene panels of talking heads to discuss... Was it/Wasn't... Apologize/No Apologize etc etc blah blah blah crapola crapola crapola
--
"Regulatory capitalism is when companies invest in lawyers, lobbyists, and politicians, instead of plant, people, and customer service." - former FCC Chairman William Kennard (A real FCC Chairman, unlike the current Corporate Spokesperson in the job!)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17193129 Tue, 31 Oct 2006 20:09:56 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17193020 Karl Bode : Just look at what's being discussed as we approach our elections.

Who is a bigger war-coward, who diddles kids, is Michael J Fox not taking his Parkinsons meds, etc.

No discussion of corporate control, no real discussion of government intrusion into privacy, no real discussion of the war frankly, either.

Propaganda has people bickering over inane crap when we're really all on the same side (humanism).]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17193020 Tue, 31 Oct 2006 19:55:39 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17192946 KrK : Karl has hit it on the head here. He's phrased it more precisely then I did.

What I see a lot of is the media shunning anything that could cause them to be labeled as "Liberal media". It's like they are afraid to be painted with that brush. They of course WILL throw up controversial or hot button issues, and love to flash graphs of opinion polls or someone outraged over this or that scandal.

But do you see anyone actually addressing some real issues? Hardly ever, if at all.
--
"Regulatory capitalism is when companies invest in lawyers, lobbyists, and politicians, instead of plant, people, and customer service." - former FCC Chairman William Kennard (A real FCC Chairman, unlike the current Corporate Spokesperson in the job!)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17192946 Tue, 31 Oct 2006 19:45:38 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17192326 Maxo :
said by broadbander See Profile :

Rugged individualism is a conservative ideal, currently not being paraded by either party. The right to make money is a big part of what America is about.
I don't view individualism and the right to make money as necessarily the same thing.
I see individualism and the right to make money as two separate products of enlightenmentism.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17192326 Tue, 31 Oct 2006 17:49:57 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17192302 Karl Bode :
quote:
Rugged individualism is a conservative ideal, currently not being paraded by either party. The right to make money is a big part of what America is about.
The right to make money no matter what the repercussions are is also a big part of what America is about. I still contend that these traditional political divisions you hold to at this point are little more than rhetoric and propaganda.

Look at any political debate over what Ann Coulter says for evidence that political discourse in this country is really just a stage-show while we the government works to eliminate your righta and focus on its only real goal: improve corporate revenue.

And the first person to claim I'm "against making money" gets a bonk on the head. :)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17192302 Tue, 31 Oct 2006 17:45:46 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17192165 broadbander :
said by Karl Bode See Profile :

The reality is that via the use of propaganda, both parties pretend to cater to the humanist will of the people, but really serve one master at this point: corporate dollars.

"Right" and "Left" at this point are meaningless tags. Issues like abortion and gay marriage are brought up to play on fears and then dropped so that the real course can be followed.

The right to make money is now a national security issue. It's a paradigm that dominates both parties. Any threat to that (and humanism is a threat to that) is a position you won't see espoused frequently on the nightly news.

I don't understand how Democrats have cornered the market on "rugged individualism"; sounds like more divisive rhetoric.
Rugged individualism is a conservative ideal, currently not being paraded by either party. The right to make money is a big part of what America is about.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17192165 Tue, 31 Oct 2006 17:17:20 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17192122 Karl Bode : The reality is that via the use of propaganda, both parties pretend to cater to the humanist will of the people, but really serve one master at this point: corporate dollars.

"Right" and "Left" at this point are meaningless tags. Issues like abortion and gay marriage are brought up to play on fears and then dropped so that the real course can be followed.

The right to make money is now a national security issue. It's a paradigm that dominates both parties. Any threat to that (and humanism is a threat to that) is a position you won't see espoused frequently on the nightly news.

I don't understand how Democrats have cornered the market on "rugged individualism"; sounds like more divisive rhetoric.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17192122 Tue, 31 Oct 2006 17:09:42 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17191840 broadbander :
As Chomsky notes, it is true that both parties and the corporate controlled media are further right of where the general public stands (humanist). There's simply plenty of noise, lying, and propaganda that makes things appear otherwise.
Humanism is not in opposition to "right-wing." Government control of industry is. Humanism can be reasonably integrated into right-wing ideology and in fact, I would contend is more likely to be found there than on the left when the philosophical particulars have been cleared out (regardless of what seems to be the case based on political pandering and apparent demographics).

EDIT: I should add that the Democratic party is certainly not right of what most people believe in. Most people in America believe in rugged individualism and have for a century plus.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17191840 Tue, 31 Oct 2006 16:23:32 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17191657 Maxo : Karl Bode See Profile, that's the way I see it. Actually, on TV I don't see any intelligent left or right discussion. The only place I can find anything close to this is on NPR. Why NPR can find intelligent liberals and conservative and nobody else is beyond me.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17191657 Tue, 31 Oct 2006 15:54:28 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17191643 Karl Bode :
quote:
So those kind of extremes are typically shunned by the media (though they are relatively embraced in corporate faces, Fox on the fascist side, CNN on the communist side).
I don't believe this is accurate. I don't see political reality as a sliding scale with extremes at each end and the media accurately portraying information from the middle. I believe this is largely an illusion gestated to foster divisions in the populace.

I see Ann Coulter on every channel on my television set. I rarely see intelligent progressive opinion. I occasionally see Democrat positions, but these two are not the same. At least not anymore. When I see Democrats talk, they're generally pandering to social moderates, and only recently decided they don't like war (as the polls switched).

The mainstream media by and large shuns humanist or progressive viewpoints, because they frequently focus on the idiocy of rabid consumerism, the futility and idiocy of un-necessary war, and other concepts.

In fact, humanism positions, which by and large the public supports, are not espoused on cable network news because they run contrary to the concept of trying to sell people vehicles and hemorrhoidal creams.

As Chomsky notes, it is true that both parties and the corporate controlled media are further right of where the general public stands (humanist). There's simply plenty of noise, lying, and propaganda that makes things appear otherwise.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17191643 Tue, 31 Oct 2006 15:51:19 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17191533 broadbander :
said by KrK See Profile :

said by broadbander See Profile :

Explain to me how CNN is "far right."
Spin. Far-right spin. How does a network like CNN contribute to this? Easy. The Administration issues a statement. CNN repeats it back as fact. End of story. No digging into it, no verification, just parrots it back as news. Since the Administration was spinning it in the first place you basically have CNN reporting the spin as fact.

You see examples of this type of "News Reporting" all the time. Corporation XYZ announces a new factory in China, while closing factories here. Corporation XYZ says issues a statement saying they must do this to remain competitive, and the Talking Head just parrots it back as if it was fact. There's not even really any attempt to dig into such statements to find the truth. It's just blindly reported as fact.

When AOL bought Time-Warner CNN went downhill fast.
I believed the same thing in college. I now feel that the parroting of press releases is not as important as it used to be for "right" spin. For example, if a liberal administration is in power, doesn't the media simply parrot them? Or are we proposing that liberal administrations in America aren't really liberal (i.e. not communist).

No one reasonable wants a far-leftist any more than the want a fascist. So those kind of extremes are typically shunned by the media (though they are relatively embraced in corporate faces, Fox on the fascist side, CNN on the communist side).

I truly think that the commentators and the kind of shows a network presents go further to determining political edge than the press releases that get by. CNN reports plenty of stories that contradict the current administration, and indeed seem to lust over dubious polls and numbers that directly contradict our own reports in Iraq.

I don't think that CNN went downhill when they were bought out. Perhaps they've added some more filters to the bias, though certainly not in the coverage I've seen.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17191533 Tue, 31 Oct 2006 15:32:04 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17191465 Maxo : Al Franken did a great job covering this issue in Lies and the Lying Liars who Tell them. The media has a sensationalism bias. CNN is definitely not "progressive" in any means of the word, they are just ridiculous (which to some may be the same thing.)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17191465 Tue, 31 Oct 2006 15:19:13 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17191459 KrK :
said by broadbander See Profile :

Explain to me how CNN is "far right."
Spin. Far-right spin. How does a network like CNN contribute to this? Easy. The Administration issues a statement. CNN repeats it back as fact. End of story. No digging into it, no verification, just parrots it back as news. Since the Administration was spinning it in the first place you basically have CNN reporting the spin as fact.

You see examples of this type of "News Reporting" all the time. Corporation XYZ announces a new factory in China, while closing factories here. Corporation XYZ says issues a statement saying they must do this to remain competitive, and the Talking Head just parrots it back as if it was fact. There's not even really any attempt to dig into such statements to find the truth. It's just blindly reported as fact.

When AOL bought Time-Warner CNN went downhill fast.
--
"Regulatory capitalism is when companies invest in lawyers, lobbyists, and politicians, instead of plant, people, and customer service." - former FCC Chairman William Kennard (A real FCC Chairman, unlike the current Corporate Spokesperson in the job!)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17191459 Tue, 31 Oct 2006 15:18:31 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17191389 KrK :
said by NormanS See Profile :

The media of this country, and the entertainment industry as well, has a very definite leftward slant.
Well, if you expand media to Hollywood, yes, there are a lot of liberal ideas often expressed in entertainment. However, these days, when it comes to the news outlets, I would have to say I disagree that there is any left "bias". I see administration and corporate PR just parroted as if it was fact, with lots of glitz and flash and little substance or investigative reporting. I guess the "News" has moved from "Informative" over to "Entertainment" as well.... You'll see a rush to cover the latest sex scandal or cover-up of a dirty secret and they turn a blind eye to things like fraud, waste, technology beneficial to all mankind, etc. I guess those headlines aren't "sexy" enough.


--
"Regulatory capitalism is when companies invest in lawyers, lobbyists, and politicians, instead of plant, people, and customer service." - former FCC Chairman William Kennard (A real FCC Chairman, unlike the current Corporate Spokesperson in the job!)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17191389 Tue, 31 Oct 2006 15:07:21 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17191340 broadbander :
said by KrK See Profile :

said by john262 See Profile :

Come on, give me a break. I wish that BBR could be non political and just stick to tech issues. This constant left wing drum beat in this forum is getting tiresome.
Joseph Goebbels said "If you tell a lie big enough and keep repeating it, people will eventually come to believe it." It seems common practice these days for right to constantly attack everything as "left-wing" in order to cover up the fact that really there's mostly far right spin on everything. Luckily most postings on BBR news seem pretty fair and balanced; but the replies, oh man. They jam the rudder at hard-to-starboard and increase speed to flank.

No wonder it just goes around in circles.
Explain to me how CNN is "far right."]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17191340 Tue, 31 Oct 2006 14:58:23 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17191330 NormanS : Hillary Clinton is a hard core Liberal. Nobody on the right is going to like anything that she proposes, even when it is a "Good Thing".

The media of this country, and the entertainment industry as well, has a very definite leftward slant. If you can't see it, you are probably too close to it.

Most times the moderators of the technical BBR forums try to keep politics out of the discussions. That is harder to do when discussing policies instead of technical problems.
--
Norman
~Oh Lord, why have you come
~To Konnyu, with the Lion and the Drum]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17191330 Tue, 31 Oct 2006 14:56:49 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17190656 KrK :
said by veloslave See Profile :

YOU have got to be kidding. Most of the Internet leans (far) left and DSLR's is no exception.

I would have to agree that the Guvernator is not out to score like most politicians... and he is WAY MORE wealthy than you average pol to begin with. He has done a good job here in leftyland... not perfect but I will certainly give him my vote again.
Amazing. Perhaps you're confusing some independent and libertarian and Democratic blogs and websites as "Most of the Internet" while leaving out all the corporate media and news sites (at least in the USA) which tend to just repeat right PR statements or swing even further. No matter, at least these "left leaner's" get a chance to express their opinions on the Internet unlike the corporate controlled "content" feed to the masses...

I find these comments interesting that Arnold obviously isn't out to score any political points.... I guess that's because he has an "(R)" behind his name. I note that when a certain other person named "Hillary Clinton" with the "(D)" after her name also proposes broadband inititaves that of course that it's all just politically grandstanding and showboating.... at least according to the people who only vote by looking to see who has the "(R)" anyway.

Yeah. Sure. Uh huh.
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"Regulatory capitalism is when companies invest in lawyers, lobbyists, and politicians, instead of plant, people, and customer service." - former FCC Chairman William Kennard (A real FCC Chairman, unlike the current Corporate Spokesperson in the job!)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17190656 Tue, 31 Oct 2006 13:00:09 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17190589 KrK :
said by john262 See Profile :

Come on, give me a break. I wish that BBR could be non political and just stick to tech issues. This constant left wing drum beat in this forum is getting tiresome.
Joseph Goebbels said "If you tell a lie big enough and keep repeating it, people will eventually come to believe it." It seems common practice these days for right to constantly attack everything as "left-wing" in order to cover up the fact that really there's mostly far right spin on everything. Luckily most postings on BBR news seem pretty fair and balanced; but the replies, oh man. They jam the rudder at hard-to-starboard and increase speed to flank.

No wonder it just goes around in circles.
--
"Regulatory capitalism is when companies invest in lawyers, lobbyists, and politicians, instead of plant, people, and customer service." - former FCC Chairman William Kennard (A real FCC Chairman, unlike the current Corporate Spokesperson in the job!)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17190589 Tue, 31 Oct 2006 12:49:38 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17188719 NormanS : I waive the benefit of the doubt for rich Democrats, too.

Wealth is wealth, Democrat, or Republican.

Bill Clinton always reminded me of the typical TV preacher, and I would trust him about as much.
--
Norman
~Oh Lord, why have you come
~To Konnyu, with the Lion and the Drum]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17188719 Tue, 31 Oct 2006 03:08:03 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17188349 SD6 : I don't follow CA politics closely. But I didn't say he didn't raise a lot of special interest money; I said he didn't owe his job to special interests. He went into office owing a heck of a lot less favors than most politicians - it's up to him whether he allows himself to be bought.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17188349 Tue, 31 Oct 2006 00:22:25 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17188095 SuperJoker :
said by No Limit See Profile :

Unfortunately he all but won the re-election because Angelides is such a poor and weak choice for the Democrats.
Nah, Angelides isn't just such a poor choice, He looks like It too, That tight collar of His make His head look like an eraser on a pencil. I voted for the other guy, No not Hermann Munster. ;)
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(10.02GHz crunchin 4 SETI w/the PC Perspective Killer Frogs)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17188095 Mon, 30 Oct 2006 23:24:48 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17187237 Maxo : I agree. I hate how everything someone does near election time is touted by the other side as being nothing more than election time politics. If you can show a clear correlation of awkward timing then the accusation can be made. If not then don't make stuff up just for the sake of whining.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17187237 Mon, 30 Oct 2006 21:04:09 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17187128 veloslave :
said by ieolus See Profile :

You have got to be joking. Constant left wing drum beat on BBR? LOL

Where have you been surfing???

DSLR ***NOT*** leaning left???

YOU have got to be kidding. Most of the Internet leans (far) left and DSLR's is no exception.

I would have to agree that the Guvernator is not out to score like most politicians... and he is WAY MORE wealthy than you average pol to begin with. He has done a good job here in leftyland... not perfect but I will certainly give him my vote again.
--
Mom was right... I need more FIBER >]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17187128 Mon, 30 Oct 2006 20:47:33 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17187080 Netbum :
said by SD6 See Profile :

There is wealthy and then there is WEALTHY. Schwarzenegger is WEALTHY and famous outside of politics.
It's nice to have someone who doesn't need the job or owe his job to special interests. I think it gives him more discretion to not rely upon special interests the way that many career politicians have to. It's up to him to serve the people of California well.
You must not follow Kalifornia politics very closely.
He has raised more special interest money than Grey Davis ever did.
By far!
Anyone can be bought. :uhh:
But I hope something good comes from this.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17187080 Mon, 30 Oct 2006 20:40:36 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17185598 elsupremo :
said by operagost See Profile :

said by ieolus See Profile :

In fact, him being a Republican, the benefit of the doubt must be waived.
Too bad this wasn't the first line of your post. I could have simply not bothered to read the rest.
+1]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17185598 Mon, 30 Oct 2006 16:33:04 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17185297 ieolus : You have got to be joking. Constant left wing drum beat on BBR? LOL

Unfortunately or fortunately, depending on your point of view, the act of deploying broadband to the masses is a political issue.

Read the OP again...

quote:

After telcos spent nearly $20 million in three months on lobbying state lawmakers, the state passed a statewide video franchise system the telcos believe will expedite next-gen network deployment.

--
"Speak for yourself "Chadmaster" - lesopp]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17185297 Mon, 30 Oct 2006 15:43:47 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17185036 broadbander :
said by SD6 See Profile :

There is wealthy and then there is WEALTHY. Schwarzenegger is WEALTHY and famous outside of politics.
It's nice to have someone who doesn't need the job or owe his job to special interests. I think it gives him more discretion to not rely upon special interests the way that many career politicians have to. It's up to him to serve the people of California well.
Politicians serve "special interests" because, often times, it is those "special interests" who have made a state wealthy and populous. Certainly, as the "special interests" become less special, they lose their political power. You're point still doesn't hit home. If the truly wealthy control this country and as follows, its politicians, it is because the truly wealthy employ this country.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17185036 Mon, 30 Oct 2006 14:54:51 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17184825 john262 : Come on, give me a break. I wish that BBR could be non political and just stick to tech issues. This constant left wing drum beat in this forum is getting tiresome.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17184825 Mon, 30 Oct 2006 14:11:35 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17184822 SD6 : There is wealthy and then there is WEALTHY. Schwarzenegger is WEALTHY and famous outside of politics.
It's nice to have someone who doesn't need the job or owe his job to special interests. I think it gives him more discretion to not rely upon special interests the way that many career politicians have to. It's up to him to serve the people of California well.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17184822 Mon, 30 Oct 2006 14:10:47 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17184760 SD6 : Some politicians talk about broadband policy, but very few actually do something. There is actually some meat-and-potatoes issues at least indicated to be addressed by this Order - streamlining ROW permitting, etc. Government policy making is a complicated thing though, and it remains to be seen how well/fast the policy will be executed.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17184760 Mon, 30 Oct 2006 13:57:10 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17184546 TKJunkMail :
said by Karl Bode See Profile :

And if there's a failure when it comes to these programs it's not in the ambition area, it's ussually in the deploymet promise follow-up and accountability department.
If he can get the bureaucracy to follow thru and speed up the paperwork process for approving fiber installs and wireless towers, etc., then his initiative is well worth it. If no real changes occur, then it is just more bloated state workers on the payroll and higher taxes. Given California's history, I'm betting on more bloat and higher taxes.
--
--
Join Red Room Forum
BLOG tkjunkmail.blogspot.com
My Web Page]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17184546 Mon, 30 Oct 2006 13:21:31 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17184239 justbits : Speaking of Illinois politics, I've been urging people to write in a vote for "None of the above" for the Governor of Illinois election! Hopefully some person won't legally change their name to "None of the Above" though. ;-)

--justbits]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17184239 Mon, 30 Oct 2006 12:29:02 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17184180 gixxerfitz4 : That's rediculous. He's up by 17 points. He could drop off the planet and still win.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17184180 Mon, 30 Oct 2006 12:17:36 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17184109 Nightshade : You know I think you are right. He is the only governor to speak about the broadband issue. Here in Oregon, neither candidate even mentioned broadband. It is all about the illegal aliens, taxes, and schools here. Which don't get me wrong are important issues but there is more than just those.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17184109 Mon, 30 Oct 2006 12:00:52 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17184077 ieolus : No worries. Remember, in PA a vote for Rick Santorum's opponent in the next election is a vote for polygamy and beastiality! And watch out for the Eye of Mordor...
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"Speak for yourself "Chadmaster" - lesopp]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17184077 Mon, 30 Oct 2006 11:53:41 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17184070 operagost :
said by ieolus See Profile :

In fact, him being a Republican, the benefit of the doubt must be waived.
Too bad this wasn't the first line of your post. I could have simply not bothered to read the rest.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17184070 Mon, 30 Oct 2006 11:51:31 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17184064 broadbander :
said by raye See Profile :

Arnold is already independently wealthy. He did not take this job to enrich himself as most other politicians do. That does not mean he is not vulnerable to listening to the wrong people when it comes to broadband or anything else. In this case however I think he is proceeding correctly.
Most politicians are already wealthy. I don't see your point. Politicians are swayed by money, not straight-up "bought" by it. When politicians do take money, it is usually related in some way to an increase in power or influence (more valuable than dollars).]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17184064 Mon, 30 Oct 2006 11:50:49 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17184043 ieolus : You do realize that most politicians are also idependently wealthy right? Doesn't stop any of them from being bought, so I doubt Arnold is any different. In fact, him being a Republican, the benefit of the doubt must be waived.
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"Speak for yourself "Chadmaster" - lesopp]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17184043 Mon, 30 Oct 2006 11:47:45 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17184039 N3OGH : One thing's for sure.

IT'S NOT A TOOM-AHH]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17184039 Mon, 30 Oct 2006 11:47:03 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17184033 XknightHawkX : I don't know if I'm missing it but. Is Arnold the only governor that speaks of broadband? Is he the only one that isn't saying the same thing as the rest. Healthcare and taxes. Here in Illinois I don't think I've heard anything about broadband from our governor. All I hear now cause of elections is smear campaigns and I'll work to keep taxes low and fight for better healthcare. Well that's good but I think they all say that now can we have someone like Arnold to be the Governor in Illinois. OK I'll shut up and let someone else say something.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17184033 Mon, 30 Oct 2006 11:46:43 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17183946 No Limit : Unfortunately he all but won the re-election because Angelides is such a poor and weak choice for the Democrats.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17183946 Mon, 30 Oct 2006 11:28:02 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17183942 raye : Arnold is already independently wealthy. He did not take this job to enrich himself as most other politicians do. That does not mean he is not vulnerable to listening to the wrong people when it comes to broadband or anything else. In this case however I think he is proceeding correctly.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17183942 Mon, 30 Oct 2006 11:27:42 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17183923 ieolus : Why do you say he can't be bought?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17183923 Mon, 30 Oct 2006 11:23:46 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17183898 Bill : He's been ahead in the polls for a long time. I don't see this as an attempt to gain support, because he doesn't need it. He could sit on his ass for the next week and he wouldn't lose his 15 to 17 point lead.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17183898 Mon, 30 Oct 2006 11:18:10 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17183860 en102 : Its election time... Arnie has to do something, or he'll be out.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17183860 Mon, 30 Oct 2006 11:10:09 EDT Re: He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17183848 Karl Bode : And if there's a failure when it comes to these programs it's not in the ambition area, it's ussually in the deploymet promise follow-up and accountability department.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17183848 Mon, 30 Oct 2006 11:08:55 EDT He could be right http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17183837 rachelsfx : Ahnold can't be bought so if he sees it not working maybe he'll kick them gently in the a** to get it flying.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17183837 Mon, 30 Oct 2006 11:06:07 EDT