Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter in Security http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r17517429 en Sun, 06 Dec 2009 01:33:24 EDT Sun, 06 Dec 2009 01:33:24 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17543092 DevilFrank :
said by NetFixer See Profile :

said by DevilFrank See Profile :

In Germany many thinks are going wrong today...
:(

Deutschland Über Alles :D
Yes Sir!
;)
--
Regards from Germany. Please excuse my stumbling English]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17543092 Fri, 29 Dec 2006 15:49:15 EDT Re: Hold you horses! http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17539357 Name Game :
said by jansson_mark See Profile :

quote:
You can have a situation where you don't have to allow paedophiles, terrorists, and organized crime to run rampant, while maintaining individual freedoms.

Oh really? How. You tell me that.
Forcing people to give out their encryption keys might catch (in theory, Im still waiting for proof about even a single incident where it has actually helped) couple paedophiles or terrorists, but at the very same time it will seriously violate individual freedom and western legal system.
Meet me at the Border..
»www.interesting-people.org/archi···163.html

more on Can you be compelled to give a password?

»www.interesting-people.org/archi···186.html

»www.interesting-people.org/archi···180.html
»www.interesting-people.org/archi···177.html
»www.interesting-people.org/archi···179.html
»www.interesting-people.org/archi···175.html

Here is some case law for you
»www.panix.com/~eck/5th-amdt.html
--
Gladiator Security Forum »www.gladiator-antivirus.com/ Missing Kids »www.missingkids.com/]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17539357 Thu, 28 Dec 2006 22:32:43 EDT Re: Hold you horses! http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17538782 jansson_mark :
quote:
You can have a situation where you don't have to allow paedophiles, terrorists, and organized crime to run rampant, while maintaining individual freedoms.

Oh really? How. You tell me that.
Forcing people to give out their encryption keys might catch (in theory, Im still waiting for proof about even a single incident where it has actually helped) couple paedophiles or terrorists, but at the very same time it will seriously violate individual freedom and western legal system.
--
My computer security & privacy related homepage »www.markusjansson.net Use HushTools or GnuPG/PGP to encrypt any email before sending it to me to protect our privacy.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17538782 Thu, 28 Dec 2006 20:54:29 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17538118 Cudni : i did answer your question but for some reason you didn't understand it :)

Cudni]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17538118 Thu, 28 Dec 2006 18:52:56 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17538106 anon : Cudni you did not answer my question. And you should edit your post. In it's present form it suggests that you favor less freedom of speech in the United States than exists in the Republic of Iran. Furthermore, I will let the reader judge whether the contents of my decrypted data is in any way as you have described it.

For the record, also encrypted are my geneology records. From them I am able trace my Ashkenazi ancestry. The "Hate Crimes Prevention Act" will benefit neither of us, and achieve the exact opposite of it's stated purpose. It will create scores of martyrs, and trumpet the very issue that you and many others are so desperate to conceal. For obvious reasons I would rather be counted on the winning team. Wouldn't you?

Join me in opposing the Orwellian "anti-hate" bill: »www.truthtellers.org/alerts/demo···ill.html]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17538106 Thu, 28 Dec 2006 18:50:38 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17537977 NetFixer :
said by DevilFrank See Profile :

In Germany many thinks are going wrong today...
:(

Deutschland Über Alles :D
--
Outsourcing is not the same as Offshoring!
Test your firewall. | Smell the flowers.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17537977 Thu, 28 Dec 2006 18:27:02 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17535173 Cudni :
said by crypt911 :

For the sake of discussion
You wouldn't be travelling back from that seat of tolerance and democracy Tehran?
»news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle···7695.stm

So at the engagement you will talk about what? Bird seed? Of course not so you would welcome any publicity just like the others that push that equally obscene and fictitious alternative view of events on 9/11.

Cudni
--
Some are born to failure, others achieve it, all deserve it.
Help yourself so God can help you.
MVP, Microsoft Windows Security 2006]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17535173 Thu, 28 Dec 2006 09:54:55 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17534462 81399672 : update on the log, now when you got to the log it says this "This blog is open to invited readers only "]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17534462 Thu, 28 Dec 2006 03:26:18 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17534384 DevilFrank : In Germany many thinks are going wrong today...
:(]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17534384 Thu, 28 Dec 2006 02:43:11 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17532618 NetFixer :
said by crypt911 :

In your opinion, should the aggregate data on my laptop and my intent to make such material freely available make me a "hate criminal"?
In the US, no. In Germany, you are toast. :hmm:
--
Outsourcing is not the same as Offshoring!
Test your firewall. | Smell the flowers.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17532618 Wed, 27 Dec 2006 19:40:52 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17532590 anon : Cudni

For the sake of discussion lets say I am taken aside by US airport security because I am an Israeli-American with mideastern appearance. Upon examination of my laptop it is discovered that it contains encrypted files, and a request is made for the key. Since I've "nothing to hide" I surrender the key, and the contents are made known. The authorities soon learn the data consists of an extensive library in the form of declassified documents and eyewitness testimony concerning internment camps located in Poland during WW2, all of which paint a different picture of historical events than is generally accepted. An examination of the printer logs reveal that my laptop was used to print many of the documents multiple times. The security personnel find no reason to detain me, and thank me for my cooperation. We exchange pleasantries, and I am soon on my way to a speaking engagement in another major US city. In your opinion, should the aggregate data on my laptop and my intent to make such material freely available make me a "hate criminal"?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17532590 Wed, 27 Dec 2006 19:35:55 EDT Re: Hold you horses! http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17532188 Kaeliri :
said by jansson_mark See Profile :

I rather have all pedofiles, terrorists and organised crime people running in the streets than having a country that forces people to give out evidence against them or prove that they are not guilty.
Were it an either-or situation -- but it isn't. Every society tries to strike a compromise between individual freedoms versus totalitarian control. On one hand you have anarcy, where paedophiles and terrorists and organized crime rule the roost, and on the other you have a tyranny where you are guilty until you prove your innocense. Both extremes are wonderful tools to use in an abstract argument, but fortunately the reality is always somewhere in between.

You can have a situation where you don't have to allow paedophiles, terrorists, and organized crime to run rampant, while maintaining individual freedoms.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17532188 Wed, 27 Dec 2006 18:08:08 EDT Re: Hold you horses! http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17532163 Cudni : See, I made you laugh and you didn't have to encrypt anything :)

Cudni]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17532163 Wed, 27 Dec 2006 18:02:32 EDT Re: Hold you horses! http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17532144 jansson_mark :
quote:
In this tolerant and democratic society, I live in,

LOL.

quote:
cryptography does not enhance privacy. It helps with many other things but not that.

Oh really. So you are saying that the fact that goverment or hackers cannot eavesdrop your communications because of heavy crypto - doesnt have any impact on your privacy?. LOL.

quote:
If whoever is accused of child porn, of inciting racist hatred, of hiding the accounts that detail criminal activity, of planning attacks and is subsequently caught and is on trial with encrypted file(s) as part of evidence are you saying the society should just accept that because of his/her right to privacy it should not insist on finding out what is in them?

It should try to findout what is in them, but it should not force the person to tell them whats in them.

BTW. how do you define "racist hatred" and why should saying things like "I hate niggers" or "ship all niggers back to africa" be punished somehow? Have you ever heard of freedom of speech? Concidering the american newspeak and political correctiness BS, you can easily label anyone as "racist" etc.

quote:
Some thing are not acceptable and never will be.

In my opinion, one thing that is not acceptable now and never is, that person has to give out evidence against themselfes - or has to proof that hes not guilty of crime hes charged with. I rather have all pedofiles, terrorists and organised crime people running in the streets than having a country that forces people to give out evidence against them or prove that they are not guilty.
--
My computer security & privacy related homepage »www.markusjansson.net

Use HushTools or GnuPG/PGP to encrypt any email before sending it to me to protect our privacy.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17532144 Wed, 27 Dec 2006 17:59:10 EDT Re: Hold you horses! http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17532140 Cudni : No, it isn't kinda like that at all :)
Of course when you encrypt your files to keep the bad guys out by definition you keep the government out should they happen to be snooping about. Did you encrypt your data specifically to keep government out or the bad guys? Would bad guys follow the same guidelines as goverment in asking for those keys?

Cudni
--
Some are born to failure, others achieve it, all deserve it.
Help yourself so God can help you.
MVP, Microsoft Windows Security 2006]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17532140 Wed, 27 Dec 2006 17:58:02 EDT Re: Hold you horses! http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17532139 Kaeliri :
said by Cudni See Profile :

If some government agency decides to investigate me the encrypted file are the least of my worries and giving them the key or not will not help me get them of my back.
Y'know, this here is a beautiful, ringing endorsement of old-fashioned police work against paedophiles, terrorists, and general ne'er-do-wells. Not wholesale automated eavesdropping of all communication in the world, but actually getting down in the dirt and doing some investigative work.

And it's great because it works by and large without compromising privacy or individual freedoms.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17532139 Wed, 27 Dec 2006 17:57:49 EDT Re: Hold you horses! http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17532100 rawwhide :
said by Cudni See Profile :

Encryption does not protect my privacy from the government, at least not where i live, it protects it from other people. If some government agency decides to investigate me the encrypted file are the least of my worries and giving them the key or not will not help me get them of my back. Society that will not tolerate such behaviour and not allow in government capable of it will.

edit: and this is not say that encryption should be illegal or that anybody should be prosecuted just because of using it.

Cudni
Wow. That is kinda of like saying you should not lock up your house with locks. Just leave the doors open for everyone to see, government as well as bad guys. I have very sensitive information dealing with bank accounts and other on line things that are not illegal. I DO NOT want that information out in the wrong hands if my laptop is stolen. As a result I use encryption technologies. I also have clients over at my office and they have access to my network and sometimes have access to my computers. I sometimes have to leave them alone with my equipment. Should I not have any safe guards?

edit: I deal with a good deal of used computer equipment. I always have at least 200 hard drives around or more. If one of them has encrypted information on them. Should I then be held liable/prosecuted or be put in jail for failing to provide a working key?

--
HUH!!! Sekurecom]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17532100 Wed, 27 Dec 2006 17:50:03 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17532032 rawwhide :
said by dodgetech2 See Profile :

said by LF3Mem See Profile :

thnx to Prez Bush cops can do what ever they want to do now warrent or not.. thnx to the patriot act
Oh boy....you cant even spell warrant....How would we expect you to understand the patriot act...
I see a few other words spelled incorrectly. :D
--
HUH!!! Sekurecom]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17532032 Wed, 27 Dec 2006 17:36:25 EDT Re: Hold you horses! http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17531930 Cudni : Encryption does not protect my privacy from the government, at least not where i live, it protects it from other people. If some government agency decides to investigate me the encrypted file are the least of my worries and giving them the key or not will not help me get them of my back. Society that will not tolerate such behaviour and not allow in government capable of it will.

edit: and this is not say that encryption should be illegal or that anybody should be prosecuted just because of using it.

Cudni
--
Some are born to failure, others achieve it, all deserve it.
Help yourself so God can help you.
MVP, Microsoft Windows Security 2006]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17531930 Wed, 27 Dec 2006 17:18:08 EDT Re: Hold you horses! http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17531790 Kaeliri : While normally I wouldn't reply to a thread like this, I feel compelled to reply to a few things Cudni has said here.

said by Cudni See Profile :

How does being able to encrypt the communications in everyday life help to protect privacy and free speech in countries that you qualify as humane?
That question is irrelevant. The question is whether I have the freedom of choice to excercise my speech in a manner I feel is private.

said by Cudni See Profile :

What is there that needs to be hidden in the tolerant and democratic society? What kind of activities?
This question is nothing but a "what are you doing wrong that you have to hide?" in disguise. More able people than I have addressed that question countless times, so I won't bore you by giving my own rebuttal. Instead, I feel this rebuttal by Bruce Schneier is one of the more eloquent ones and will serve this thread superbly.

said by Cudni See Profile :

In this tolerant and democratic society, I live in, cryptography does not enhance privacy. It helps with many other things but not that. You can encrypt as much or as little you want but it is not necessary because the only way to keep the society tolerant and democratic is to keep talking and talk loud and involve and engage as many people as possible. Not to hide it in code only chosen can understand. In the bleak world you paint cryptography would only be survival but with no hope of making it better.
In your tolerant and democratic society, do you have collateral damage from political posturing? Recent history is rife with examples of innocent people being made to suffer because politicians decided that they needed to put up a show of doing something. How many innocent people are being first prevented from flying, and then subjected to interrogation, just because they shared the "John Smith" name a suspected terrorist used once?

I live in a tolerant, democratic society, and yet I've no faith in the politicians to do the right thing. I refuse to be victim to collateral damage from their political posturing. And make no mistake, one of the things that make a tolerant and democratic society different from a tyranny is my ability to choose to not trust the rulers with all of the intimate details of my life.

said by Cudni See Profile :

If whoever is accused of child porn, of inciting racist hatred, of hiding the accounts that detail criminal activity, of planning attacks and is subsequently caught and is on trial with encrypted file(s) as part of evidence are you saying the society should just accept that because of his/her right to privacy it should not insist on finding out what is in them? Some thing are not acceptable and never will be.
Are you saying that if the government has no proof whatsoever that I have done something wrong, but feels that it's possible that I may have done something wrong, I should roll over and stick my tail between my legs? If there is malicious intent, there will be proof other the hypothetical contents of an encrypted file. Wholesale trawling of private data for a reason, any reason to apprehend a person, is tyranny.

Privacy and rule of law are tools against tyranny. Cryptography is a tool of privacy, against tyranny. Cryptography is no more a magic cure-all for hiding all evidence of wrongdoing than trawling all private communications is a magic cure-all for preventing crime.

said by Cudni See Profile :

As with security, privacy needs to be protected using layers and encrypting data is just one them and more useful in some places (societies) and very much less so in other.
What does it take for a society to slide from the rule of law to rule of men? You are quite right that privacy needs to be protected by layers, and encryption is but one of them. And yet, if you forego that layer, and the powers-that-be strip away the legal protections either by changing the law, or by ignoring the law altogether as has been the recent trend, what do you have to fall back to? Will you then start to use encryption? But then you must have something to hide, and using encryption is tantamount to announcing your guilt of something, anything.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17531790 Wed, 27 Dec 2006 16:53:53 EDT Re: Hold you horses! http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17530831 NormanS :
said by fatness See Profile :

What makes you believe that governments only seek information on crimes the public believes are terrible (child porn, race hate, etc.)?
Government is only interested in knowing whether you are "politically correct", or not; according to the light of whomever is in charge.

Got a gun? Got religion? You may be outside of whatever government is in charge thinks is proper and fitting.
--
Norman
~Oh Lord, why have you come
~To Konnyu, with the Lion and the Drum]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17530831 Wed, 27 Dec 2006 13:46:56 EDT Re: Hold you horses! http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17530650 Cudni : Various government agencies are probably interested in all sort of information according to their remit and not just those that I listed or that public finds repugnant or think it needs protection from.
Is the government interested in the encrypted folder protecting my personal information or would it automatically investigate any of my encrypted emails just because they are encrypted? I don't think so. If i was wrongfully accused and while they think my encrypted file contains incriminating evidence when i know it doesn't i wouldn't hesitate to reveal that code and then sue them after the case collapses.

I doubt a case will collapse or that somebody will be acquitted or sentenced just on the basis of refusal to give a pass code to an encrypted file.

Cudni
--
Some are born to failure, others achieve it, all deserve it.
Help yourself so God can help you.
MVP, Microsoft Windows Security 2006]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17530650 Wed, 27 Dec 2006 13:09:20 EDT Re: Hold you horses! http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17530498 fatness :
said by Cudni See Profile :
What or whose government? Yours, mine, his or hers?
Yours. Mine. Any generic government.

quote:
What are terrible crimes?
The things you listed above as examples: "...child porn, of inciting racist hatred, of hiding the accounts that detail criminal activity, of planning attacks"
--
Me, I want a hula hoop..]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17530498 Wed, 27 Dec 2006 12:39:08 EDT Re: Hold you horses! http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17529601 Cudni : What or whose government? Yours, mine, his or hers? What are terrible crimes? Some crimes are terrible universally but some like race hate will be tolerated more in some societies and less in others. It is difficult to cover all possibilities without writing an essay on the subject and even then it will be short.

If I'm active in Green Peace and some government would like to find out, who the members and or donors are, in the database that is encrypted and I'm custodian of and using some pretext to force me to give them access to it should i give it them of face some penalty or punishment. The answer is no they shouldn't have that key and most likely the government would lose in court. There are other covert ways that information can be had as we know but if the society does not tolerate such behaviour then such practice will be unmasked by a whistle-blower or anonymous email etc.

As with security, privacy needs to be protected using layers and encrypting data is just one them and more useful in some places (societies) and very much less so in other.

Cudni
--
Some are born to failure, others achieve it, all deserve it.
Help yourself so God can help you.
MVP, Microsoft Windows Security 2006]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17529601 Wed, 27 Dec 2006 09:05:55 EDT Re: Hold you horses! http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17529491 fatness : What makes you believe that governments only seek information on crimes the public believes are terrible (child porn, race hate, etc.)?
--
Me, I want a hula hoop..]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17529491 Wed, 27 Dec 2006 08:30:41 EDT Re: Hold you horses! http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17529295 Cudni : In this tolerant and democratic society, I live in, cryptography does not enhance privacy. It helps with many other things but not that. You can encrypt as much or as little you want but it is not necessary because the only way to keep the society tolerant and democratic is to keep talking and talk loud and involve and engage as many people as possible. Not to hide it in code only chosen can understand. In the bleak world you paint cryptography would only be survival but with no hope of making it better.

For good reason/idea people didn't talk on pain of death and would rather go to prison then divulge any information encrypted or not. Somewhere in the world they probably still do.

If whoever is accused of child porn, of inciting racist hatred, of hiding the accounts that detail criminal activity, of planning attacks and is subsequently caught and is on trial with encrypted file(s) as part of evidence are you saying the society should just accept that because of his/her right to privacy it should not insist on finding out what is in them? Some thing are not acceptable and never will be.

Cudni
--
Some are born to failure, others achieve it, all deserve it.
Help yourself so God can help you.
MVP, Microsoft Windows Security 2006]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17529295 Wed, 27 Dec 2006 06:52:18 EDT Re: Hold you horses! http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17529201 serenity1 : Oh, LOL I guess this did split.

This whole thing is about what this person did or did not do?? This reminds me of the Salem Witch Hunts that went on. This guy is already fried to a crisp at the stake!! LOL...!!!

I certainly hope if I ever get into some kind of trouble with the police and have to go to trial, please do not be on the jury!! I am worried about how a security issue turned into this whole crazy ordeal.

It goes round and round..I am getting dizzy miss lizzy! :o

Ahhhh, cheeeeeeer up people, it's a new year coming very soon!!! Weeeeee!!!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17529201 Wed, 27 Dec 2006 05:30:37 EDT Re: Hold you horses! http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17527344 jansson_mark :
quote:
How does being able to encrypt the communications in everyday life help to protect privacy and free speech in countries that you qualify as humane?

Today - By preventing goverment spying on people and sometimes putting them on trial for expressing their opinions in public (so called "hate speech", or in Germany for example revisionism, etc. etc.).
Tomorrow maybe - By preventing goverment pursue on people who dont agree with them (even more than today).

quote:
By definition, and most certainly in the countries you mention, we should all be able to practice the freedom of speech and have the right to privacy. Are you saying that in your country you need to resort to cryptography to ensure that somebody does not intercept your....thoughts?

Your strawman argument is pathetic. You maybe against civil liberties, but Im not. Read above. If you think that goverments here dont spy on people and put them on trial (even on prison) because of what they say and think, think again. Tomorrow they might simply just kill everyone who does not agree - or, what is even more terrible - who HAVE NOT agreed in the past their politics.

quote:
What is there that needs to be hidden in the tolerant and democratic society? What kind of activities?

Go to Germany or Austria and say that 6 million jews did not die. They will lock you in prison. Or say that "muslims are murdereds and islam is intolerant religion" and they will put on trial and fine you on "hate speech". Or wear a swastika in several countries. How many people have been killed or are in danger of being killed just because they say "Mohammed was wanker pedofile and there is no Allah" in Europe? You think that they too should not have anonymity and protection of privacy? Yeah, right. etc. etc. etc. You call "tolerant" and "democracy"? Think again. Those are nothing but Orwellian newspeak words that have really no meaning what so ever.

Encryption and privacy protects everyones rights of free speech, anonymity and against persecution. Both against todays facists and facists that may come to power tomorrow (and grap old records of you and anyone else and start haunting them).

As I sayed before, Id like you to clarify to me: As our society was "able to handle" the fact that people could talk freely couple hundred years ago, why the heck it couldnt handle it today? What so frightening about people being able to protect themselfes and their property against goverment and other villans?

--
My computer security & privacy related homepage »www.markusjansson.net

Use HushTools or GnuPG/PGP to encrypt any email before sending it to me to protect our privacy.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17527344 Tue, 26 Dec 2006 20:16:14 EDT Re: Hold you horses! http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17526097 Cudni :
said by jansson_mark See Profile :

quote:
I think his point was that cryptography and anonymity are generally good ways to protect yourself from intrusion, even though they can be used nefariously. You can probably make the same argument with guns.

Yes. The problem with civil liberties, privacy and free speech is, that they can easily be subverted but its very difficult to get them back after you have lost them. Thats why this is something where NO COMPROMISES should never be made.
How does being able to encrypt the communications in everyday life help to protect privacy and free speech in countries that you qualify as humane?
said by jansson_mark See Profile :

Only in UK (and other non-humane countries) you have to give out the passphrase/decryption key (or they put high charges against you for not doing that). Not in US, not in Finland, not in Sweden, etc. etc.
By definition, and most certainly in the countries you mention, we should all be able to practice the freedom of speech and have the right to privacy. Are you saying that in your country you need to resort to cryptography to ensure that somebody does not intercept your....thoughts?

What is there that needs to be hidden in the tolerant and democratic society? What kind of activities?

Cudni
--
Some are born to failure, others achieve it, all deserve it.
Help yourself so God can help you.
MVP, Microsoft Windows Security 2006]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17526097 Tue, 26 Dec 2006 15:56:31 EDT Re: Hold you horses! http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17525929 jansson_mark :
quote:
To even suggest that cryptography and anonymity should be used to protect the free speech and privacy of those involved in such despicable practices is not far from justifying their actions.

They should be used to protect everyone in every situation as good as possible, since there is "no other way around it". There is no way to allow everyone use crypto etc. but not anyone who commits crimes etc. Its simply not possible.

quote:
However, there are those who would use the existence of child porn or other criminal enterprises (currently Terroristm) as a reason to ban cryptography. Many people believe that this is wrong, and that no criminal use justifies banning such a vital instrument of communication and free speech.

Exactly.

quote:
I think his point was that cryptography and anonymity are generally good ways to protect yourself from intrusion, even though they can be used nefariously. You can probably make the same argument with guns.

Yes. The problem with civil liberties, privacy and free speech is, that they can easily be subverted but its very difficult to get them back after you have lost them. Thats why this is something where NO COMPROMISES should never be made.
--
My computer security & privacy related homepage »www.markusjansson.net Use HushTools or GnuPG/PGP to encrypt any email before sending it to me to protect our privacy.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17525929 Tue, 26 Dec 2006 15:21:02 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17525703 Cudni : I see even pro police site have a similar level of mistrust of the public ;)

Cudni]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17525703 Tue, 26 Dec 2006 14:35:18 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17525652 AnonProxy : Here's how far this one went on another forum

»www.masscops.com/forums/showthre···?t=21998]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17525652 Tue, 26 Dec 2006 14:26:30 EDT Re: Hold you horses! http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17525318 Cudni : if there was a choice between eradicating child pornography if it meant cryptography had to go then it would have my vote and to hell with both. Life doesn't offer such choices, however, and cryptography will be used to hide whatever criminal activity but i dislike the idea of it being promoted that is because of higher goals such as privacy.

The only reason i would not release my passcode would be because whatever is hidden would cause me more damage if revealed.

Cudni
--
Some are born to failure, others achieve it, all deserve it.
Help yourself so God can help you.
MVP, Microsoft Windows Security 2006]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17525318 Tue, 26 Dec 2006 13:23:27 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17525060 NormanS : Three recent computers with two HDDs each. Three ancient computers with five HDDs between them. Two HDDs out of the computers. Thirteen total, of which eleven are accessible. I really need to recycle some of this equipment.
--
Norman
~Oh Lord, why have you come
~To Konnyu, with the Lion and the Drum]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17525060 Tue, 26 Dec 2006 12:29:06 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17525053 bluezanetti :
said by 81399672 See Profile :

well keep believing that. Googled for about 30 sec, this article seem to be disagreeing with you.
»www.daviddfriedman.com/CCP_97/CC···dmt.html
My own understanding is that both of you are correct, but under different circumstances.

For the purposes of this thread, being compelled to provide to decrypt an encrypted volume so that it can be used as evidence against you does fall under a self-incrimination protection. You therefore cannot be forced to provide this information.

However, if you have been offered immunity from prosecution, you can be compelled to provide the decryption, with penalities if it is not provided, since self incrimination is no longer an issue. This strategy is used in pursuing additional parties to a crime.

Blue]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17525053 Tue, 26 Dec 2006 12:28:01 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17524956 trparky : Well then, I vote for this thread to be split into two threads and the original topic to be sent to the Internet equivalent of /dev/null.
--
WedgeAntilles250

Tom's Rant]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17524956 Tue, 26 Dec 2006 12:11:05 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17524919 Crypto : I read it on the internets, it must be true!

I dont care about the original poster now, I'm having a discussion about constitutional law with worldvision.
--
I may not agree with what you say, but I'll defend your right to encrypt it.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17524919 Tue, 26 Dec 2006 12:02:16 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17524913 trparky : I'm surprised guys, I would have thought you would've known by now that this guy is just a troll.

Must Not Feed The... Troll!
]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17524913 Tue, 26 Dec 2006 11:59:39 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17524884 81399672 : well keep believing that. Googled for about 30 sec, this article seem to be disagreeing with you.
»www.daviddfriedman.com/CCP_97/CC···dmt.html]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17524884 Tue, 26 Dec 2006 11:54:10 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17524861 Crypto :
said by 81399672 See Profile :

you're totally wrong. If evidence that you're force to provide is going to be used against you in criminal case you can legally refuse to provide it. You can also refuse to provide combination to lock cabinet, cop have legal right to break it open which is same thing with encryption. If cops can crack it then they can use it, otherwise they can't. In no way, shape or form can you be force to provide any evidence to police that can be used against you in criminal case.

edit:basically they can take evidence from me that court said they can if they can find it, but police force me to give it to them which is what i would be doing if i gave my encryption key. Maybe you're thinking about UK, were what you said is true
I really, really hope that you consult a real actual lawyer before you trust your freedom to a passphrase. I'm not going to do legal research for you here, but I can assure you that established case law as well as many state statues disagree with you. Your password and the data it protects can be subpoenaed, and you can be compelled (and jailed for contempt) to produce it. The passphrase itself has not been ruled to be entitled to 5th amendment protection.

Like I said, talk to a lawyer if you're guarding illegal activity with a password, or you'll be in for a rude surprise one day.
--
I may not agree with what you say, but I'll defend your right to encrypt it.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17524861 Tue, 26 Dec 2006 11:46:37 EDT Re: Hold you horses! http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17524842 BIGHUSKER :
said by Cudni See Profile :

said by jansson_mark See Profile :

Cryptography and anonymity are two things that GIVE more to people in terms of free speech and privacy, than what they TAKE AWAY from (some people) in terms of warez & kiddyporn & etc.
There is nothing that can justify child pornography. To even suggest that cryptography and anonymity should be used to protect the free speech and privacy of those involved in such despicable practices is not far from justifying their actions.

Cudni
I think that's a gross misrepresentation of what he said. I think his point was that cryptography and anonymity are generally good ways to protect yourself from intrusion, even though they can be used nefariously. You can probably make the same argument with guns.

In other words, don't throw the baby out with the bathwater. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17524842 Tue, 26 Dec 2006 11:42:43 EDT Re: Hold you horses! http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17524835 Crypto :
said by Cudni See Profile :

There is nothing that can justify child pornography. To even suggest that cryptography and anonymity should be used to protect the free speech and privacy of those involved in such despicable practices is not far from justifying their actions.

Cudni
You're right about that, child porn is entirely indefensible.

However, there are those who would use the existence of child porn or other criminal enterprises (currently Terroristm) as a reason to ban cryptography. Many people believe that this is wrong, and that no criminal use justifies banning such a vital instrument of communication and free speech.
--
I may not agree with what you say, but I'll defend your right to encrypt it.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17524835 Tue, 26 Dec 2006 11:41:31 EDT Re: Hold you horses! http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17524739 Cudni :
said by jansson_mark See Profile :

Cryptography and anonymity are two things that GIVE more to people in terms of free speech and privacy, than what they TAKE AWAY from (some people) in terms of warez & kiddyporn & etc.
There is nothing that can justify child pornography. To even suggest that cryptography and anonymity should be used to protect the free speech and privacy of those involved in such despicable practices is not far from justifying their actions.

Cudni
--
Some are born to failure, others achieve it, all deserve it.
Help yourself so God can help you.
MVP, Microsoft Windows Security 2006]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17524739 Tue, 26 Dec 2006 11:22:37 EDT Re: Hold you horses! http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17524604 81399672 :
said by Bill See Profile :

For now, no forensics program will be able to crack a TC volume unless the password is very easy to brute force. The best any examiner will be able to do is determine the suspect has an encrypted volume on their drive. Give it time and TC will be cracked just like most of the other encryption tools. People in the forensic community are working very hard on this because, obviously, it does cause problems for them.
tc use dod and other encryption algorithm, by the time they find a way to crack, new ones will be developed]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17524604 Tue, 26 Dec 2006 10:50:38 EDT Re: Hold you horses! http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17524591 Bill : For now, no forensics program will be able to crack a TC volume unless the password is very easy to brute force. The best any examiner will be able to do is determine the suspect has an encrypted volume on their drive. Give it time and TC will be cracked just like most of the other encryption tools. People in the forensic community are working very hard on this because, obviously, it does cause problems for them.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17524591 Tue, 26 Dec 2006 10:47:57 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17524336 JIGA : DONT

FEED

THE

TROLLS]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17524336 Tue, 26 Dec 2006 09:32:04 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17524202 treetop1000 : Not buying into it. Police don't usually swarm you when you're NOT dealing crack or trading kiddy porn.
I agree with the other posters here, this is a fishing expedition looking for trollage. goodbye.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17524202 Tue, 26 Dec 2006 08:46:26 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17524172 Trinijoy : The easiest way to not get caught is... NOT DO IT.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17524172 Tue, 26 Dec 2006 08:31:50 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17523993 LBadvance : BBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS.

I bet this is just a kid thinking up a worse case scenerio that his/her sibblings might find their porn stash when they use the computer and report it to their parents.

If you did pay $5G for a laywer, as many as said before why not get what you paid for and let the lawyer do his or her job?
--
Keeping up with technology is like trying to find the pot of gold at the end of a rainbow...]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17523993 Tue, 26 Dec 2006 05:18:21 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17523989 cork1958 :
said by BIGHUSKER See Profile :

I'm calling bullshit on this right now. Please don't feed the trolls.

#1: This type of copyright infringement is generally a civil matter, so there's no reason the police would be involved if you've given us all the relevant details (downloading some mp3s and videos off BearShare). Unless you were running some huge underground piracy ring that you actually profited from, the worst you'll ever see is a nasty letter from your ISP and/or the RIAA/MPAA that may eventually turn into a lawsuit.

#2: Nobody can "scan your hard drive" remotely unless you went out of your way to share it with everyone, or you had absolutely zero security on your network (not even so much as a NAT router or a software firewall). This isn't some crappy Hollywood movie where you can break into anybody's system with some magical program.

#3: If you acutally had a lawyer, he'd tell you to keep your mouth shut and not to talk to *anyone* about this. The fact is that you admitted (or came very close to admitting) in your post that you downloaded music, videos and some porn.

The only way this would be even remotely believable is if you were suspected of distributing kiddie porn. Methinks this is some bored kiddie on Christmas break. I hope nobody else falls for this.
Not about to read all 6 pages of this stuff, but I have to agree with this post from the first page.
--
Do the walk
Zenwalk Linux 4.0]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17523989 Tue, 26 Dec 2006 05:10:09 EDT Re: Hold you horses! http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17523809 81399672 :
said by Trel See Profile :

said by fatness See Profile :

said by Trel See Profile :

Also, this story is bull. It is almost exactly the same as this proven bogus story: »operationsuccess.blogspot.com/20···use.html
Thanks for that link. I read that blog page and the followup. Where was it proven false? All I see is several blog comments expressing doubt for various reasons. Thanks.
It was posted to digg, someone there said they contacted a few people from the school in question, and they were informed that this never happened.

Also, as far as revealing your password, why not just hide the truecrypt file with various large files and deny that it even IS an encrypted partition. You can't give a password to something that doesn't take one.
that's what i done, plus if you use a partion, when it's unmounted windows will prompt you to format]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17523809 Tue, 26 Dec 2006 02:18:51 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17523807 Corehhi : In order for SWAT to be involved they must suspect child pornography or sales and distribution of copywritten materials. Either fit the situation?
-----------------------------------------------------------
This guy isn't tell the whole story. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17523807 Tue, 26 Dec 2006 02:17:12 EDT Re: Hold you horses! http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17523793 Trel :
said by fatness See Profile :

said by Trel See Profile :

Also, this story is bull. It is almost exactly the same as this proven bogus story: »operationsuccess.blogspot.com/20···use.html
Thanks for that link. I read that blog page and the followup. Where was it proven false? All I see is several blog comments expressing doubt for various reasons. Thanks.
It was posted to digg, someone there said they contacted a few people from the school in question, and they were informed that this never happened.

Also, as far as revealing your password, why not just hide the truecrypt file with various large files and deny that it even IS an encrypted partition. You can't give a password to something that doesn't take one.
--
/chown -R us:us /yourbase]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17523793 Tue, 26 Dec 2006 02:09:26 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17523709 Rifleman : Just to show how vulnerable some are using P2P>
  
]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17523709 Tue, 26 Dec 2006 01:21:55 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17523469 81399672 :
said by bettywont See Profile :

I personally dint know anyone who has 8 hard drives.I'm
not saying it's imposable -just sounds like B.S.
I'm not an expert in passwords,but are their not programs
like NirSoft to reveal them?Aside from that I'm sure the police labs are able to crack whatever they need to.
regular password file, sure it's pretty easy. Encryption password is pretty hard unless the person was stupid and did dictionary password. If password have letter, numbers and characters cracking password will take really long time. I personally use aes encryption, it's approve for dod encryption up to top secret document, so i feel pretty safe. There are also other encryption such triple des, blowfish etc]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17523469 Mon, 25 Dec 2006 23:52:25 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17523464 monski : Such an interesting topic you started here! I'm learning how gullible most people are. LOL!!!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17523464 Mon, 25 Dec 2006 23:52:03 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17523442 bettywont : I personally dint know anyone who has 8 hard drives.I'm
not saying it's imposable -just sounds like B.S.
I'm not an expert in passwords,but are their not programs
like NirSoft to reveal them?Aside from that I'm sure the police labs are able to crack whatever they need to.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17523442 Mon, 25 Dec 2006 23:47:04 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17523101 81399672 : you're totally wrong. If evidence that you're force to provide is going to be used against you in criminal case you can legally refuse to provide it. You can also refuse to provide combination to lock cabinet, cop have legal right to break it open which is same thing with encryption. If cops can crack it then they can use it, otherwise they can't. In no way, shape or form can you be force to provide any evidence to police that can be used against you in criminal case.

edit:basically they can take evidence from me that court said they can if they can find it, but police force me to give it to them which is what i would be doing if i gave my encryption key. Maybe you're thinking about UK, were what you said is true]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17523101 Mon, 25 Dec 2006 22:10:52 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17523090 Crypto :
said by 81399672 See Profile :

how can you say encryption key is not protected under 5th amendment? Giving cops encryption key=self incrimination and under 5th amendment a suspect can't be forced to incriminate him self
Because thats not how self-incrimination works. Self-incrimination is testifying in court against yourself. A password is just a mechanism preventing police access to something the court has ruled they get to access for investigative purposes. Failure to comply with the court is contempt, and is jailable indefinitely until you comply with the court order.

The case law on this is quite well-established, and has been for decades. Its the same thing as a lock combination. you cant just refuse to give a lock combination under the 5th amendment because whats behind the lock has specifically been determined to be within the scope of the warrant.

re: SWAT budgets:
budgets are not unlimited, which is why they get used too often nowadays. Police forces need to show the city/county paying for them that they're being used, so they get deployed even in situations where swat isnt really appropriate.
--
I may not agree with what you say, but I'll defend your right to encrypt it.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17523090 Mon, 25 Dec 2006 22:05:16 EDT Re: Hold you horses! http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17522750 jansson_mark :
quote:
Marcus even if you are right (and you probably are) and TC never writes decrypted data back to a TC volume then there is still the possibility that the amount of data decrypted into ram will exceed the amount of available ram then some of that decrypted data is going to be paged to disk unencrypted.

...unless you buy 1Gb of RAM (or more) and turn of Windows swapfile. Period.

quote:
Don't be so sure cryptography is going to save you from your day of justice.

I hope it will. Cryptography and anonymity are two things that GIVE more to people in terms of free speech and privacy, than what they TAKE AWAY from (some people) in terms of warez & kiddyporn & etc.

Also remember that goverments change overnight, but software and hardware remain. We cant be sure what kind of idiotic goverment that limits our freedoms (even) more will be here tomorrow and what will happen then. Thats why its better to play it safe anyway.

As Zimmermann sayed: Couple hundreds years ago two people could simply go behind a house and talk with privacy, since nobody was able to eavesdrop on them. Our society could handle that then. Why it couldnt handle the same thing happening today?
--
My computer security & privacy related homepage »www.markusjansson.net
Use HushTools or GnuPG/PGP to encrypt any email before sending it to me to protect our privacy.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17522750 Mon, 25 Dec 2006 20:23:50 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17522652 cacroll :
said by Crypto See Profile :

Local police departments can use SWAT teams any time they want to service a warrant. This business about "hey there must be kiddie porn involved" is total BS. Many smaller jurisdictions established SWAT teams after 9/11 and now find they have to call them out all the time just to justify their existence. They get used all the time for search warrants, the justification question for SWAT callout is "will the suspect destroy the evidence before it can be secured?"


How many police departments have unlimited budgets? Eight police vehicles and a SWAT car would not be a trivial amount of money.
--
Cheers,
Chuck
MS-MVP [Windows - Networking]
PChuck's Network]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17522652 Mon, 25 Dec 2006 19:59:54 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17522651 81399672 : how can you say encryption key is not protected under 5th amendment? Giving cops encryption key=self incrimination and under 5th amendment a suspect can't be forced to incriminate him self]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17522651 Mon, 25 Dec 2006 19:59:45 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17522627 Crypto : You will be compelled to provide your encryption password or be jailed indefinitely on contempt charges until you produce the password.

Crypto isnt a get out of jail free card, and passwords are not entitled to 5th Amendment protection.

Also, some points of legal clarification:

* Both the DMCA and The NET Act make copyright infringement a CRIMINAL matter, not just a matter of tort law. I dont know what the sections of the USC are, but check the beginning of any DVD for the copyright notice, it references the relevant parts.

* Local police departments can use SWAT teams any time they want to service a warrant. This business about "hey there must be kiddie porn involved" is total BS. Many smaller jurisdictions established SWAT teams after 9/11 and now find they have to call them out all the time just to justify their existence. They get used all the time for search warrants, the justification question for SWAT callout is "will the suspect destroy the evidence before it can be secured?" I think all of you will agree that computer evidence is pretty easy to at least begin to destroy (even if it cant thoroughly be done) data, so the cops get swat for computer raids whenever they want.
--
I may not agree with what you say, but I'll defend your right to encrypt it.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17522627 Mon, 25 Dec 2006 19:48:51 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17522527 81399672 :
said by bettywont See Profile :

At this time of the year it would take ever so so long for forensic to go thru 8 hard drives.I can't believe this
hoax.8 Hard Drives and no copy of the warrant? and he is released-no bail hearing and now he is posting here as if nothing happened?? One of his conditions would be that he can not use a computer-but he has no conditions!!
forget about condition not using comp. Better question, why did he have so many hd's , if they took his computers from is he posting. Why is this story not covered by any news media, local ones usually cover this type of story]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17522527 Mon, 25 Dec 2006 19:15:28 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17522519 bettywont : At this time of the year it would take ever so so long for forensic to go thru 8 hard drives.I can't believe this
hoax.8 Hard Drives and no copy of the warrant? and he is released-no bail hearing and now he is posting here as if nothing happened?? One of his conditions would be that he can not use a computer-but he has no conditions!!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17522519 Mon, 25 Dec 2006 19:13:20 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17522339 Cheese :
= TwistedLefty See Profile]BQUOTE= Cheese See Profile]I still call BS on the whole story.
signed,

wouldn't he have a copy of the warrant?
that might be easy to fabricate also , but it would have added credence.
He says he does and he will post it, but the thing is, he says "isn't it ironic that a day after I post this on digg.com that the cops call and say they are dropping charges". I don't buy that one bit. If anything, him posting would have made the situation worse IMO. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17522339 Mon, 25 Dec 2006 18:17:56 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17522337 Anonymous_ : the only way to quickly destroy data is to put it in the microwave for 10 secs

with 1250 watts of cookning power it dose one hell of a job to cd's and dvds

--
Your Thread Is worth less With out Pictures :D]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17522337 Mon, 25 Dec 2006 18:17:05 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17522281 TwistedLefty : BQUOTE= Cheese See Profile]I still call BS on the whole story.
signed,

wouldn't he have a copy of the warrant?
that might be easy to fabricate also , but it would have added credence.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17522281 Mon, 25 Dec 2006 17:54:15 EDT Re: Hold you horses! http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17522005 hpguru :
said by jansson_mark See Profile :

I dont really understand why you cannot understand simple thing like this. All files inside TC container are encrypted all the time time, and when appX needs them, it decrypts them on memory. When something is written into TC container, it gets encrypted.

In short: Its safe. Without TC passphrase (or computer being open, meaning that container X is mounted with the passphrase already) nobody can access any files inside that container. If container is open (like when P2P app is writing/reading from it and you have opened that particular container with passphrase), computer can still be locked like with Windows+L so it cannot be opened unless Windows passphrase of the current user is typed in. If anyone cuts power on the computer, reboots it, anything else, contents of the RAM will be wiped off and files inside container will remain encrypted and unaccesible.

Get it?

There is NO ****ING WAY AROUND IT. Its safe. Period.
Marcus even if you are right (and you probably are) and TC never writes decrypted data back to a TC volume then there is still the possibility that the amount of data decrypted into ram will exceed the amount of available ram then some of that decrypted data is going to be paged to disk unencrypted. When the power is cut it will still be there in the page file, unencrypted and and subject to forensic examination.

Truecrypt and other crypto applications are for the protection of legitimate (legal) data which must be kept private, but if you run afoul of the law and get busted for it don't be so sure cryptography is going to save you from your day of justice.

Get it?
--
Where's Jesus?
Dear Jesus!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17522005 Mon, 25 Dec 2006 16:24:39 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17522003 plk : Please!!!!!

Go to the courthouse and have them give you a copy of the "Application for search warrant" Scan it in and post it. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17522003 Mon, 25 Dec 2006 16:22:57 EDT Re: Hold you horses! http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17521795 jansson_mark :
quote:
hatever application you are using for downloading, viewing, or whatever, might well write temporary copies of the files to unencrypted partitions.

True, but very few applications do that. Ofcourse, if you are using Windows with swap file on, then ANYTHING can get written onto it (=plaintext on harddrive). So, buy 1Gb RAM and turn it off anyway (and you computer will work much faster too!).
--
My computer security & privacy related homepage »www.markusjansson.net

Use HushTools or GnuPG/PGP to encrypt any email before sending it to me to protect our privacy.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17521795 Mon, 25 Dec 2006 15:14:31 EDT Re: Hold you horses! http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17521780 jansson_mark :
quote:
But if they are knowledgable and careful to preserve forensic evidence, they will pull the plug.

Irrelevant. All data in RAM will then be wiped off and data on Truecrypt encrypted apartition will remain encrypted.

quote:
So if your filesharing app is currently uploading a total of let's say - 10GB of files which may not be complete and which may also be opened for write access then TC opens them all up in RAM???

I dont really understand why you cannot understand simple thing like this. All files inside TC container are encrypted all the time time, and when appX needs them, it decrypts them on memory. When something is written into TC container, it gets encrypted.

In short: Its safe. Without TC passphrase (or computer being open, meaning that container X is mounted with the passphrase already) nobody can access any files inside that container. If container is open (like when P2P app is writing/reading from it and you have opened that particular container with passphrase), computer can still be locked like with Windows+L so it cannot be opened unless Windows passphrase of the current user is typed in. If anyone cuts power on the computer, reboots it, anything else, contents of the RAM will be wiped off and files inside container will remain encrypted and unaccesible.

Get it?

There is NO ****ING WAY AROUND IT. Its safe. Period.
--
My computer security & privacy related homepage »www.markusjansson.net Use HushTools or GnuPG/PGP to encrypt any email before sending it to me to protect our privacy.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17521780 Mon, 25 Dec 2006 15:10:26 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17521725 Cheese :
said by MarkAW See Profile :

said by Cheese See Profile :

said by GDSComp See Profile :

I agree... hey I thought they took all his computers. Was this one hidden ?
Great point!
He'll come back and say he is using a library computer or something like that. :D
Yea :D]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17521725 Mon, 25 Dec 2006 14:51:53 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17521723 MarkAW :
said by Cheese See Profile :

said by GDSComp See Profile :

I agree... hey I thought they took all his computers. Was this one hidden ?
Great point!
He'll come back and say he is using a library computer or something like that. :D
--
"I have come to the conclusion that politics are too serious a matter to be left to the politicians." - Charles De Gaulle
]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17521723 Mon, 25 Dec 2006 14:51:11 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17521664 Cheese :
said by GDSComp See Profile :

I agree... hey I thought they took all his computers. Was this one hidden ?
Great point! ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17521664 Mon, 25 Dec 2006 14:29:34 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17521645 Cheese : I still call BS on the whole story. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17521645 Mon, 25 Dec 2006 14:24:34 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17521614 GDSComp : I agree... hey I thought they took all his computers. Was this one hidden ?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17521614 Mon, 25 Dec 2006 14:14:39 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17521572 81399672 :
said by djhopkinson See Profile :

They needed a warrant that listed by type and number what they intended to search for. Second if the just took the drives it is agaunst the law for them to use a crack or trojan to violate your space.
illegal to use crack or trojan? Ever hear of wiretap warrant? ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17521572 Mon, 25 Dec 2006 13:57:47 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17521535 djhopkinson : They needed a warrant that listed by type and number what they intended to search for. Second if the just took the drives it is agaunst the law for them to use a crack or trojan to violate your space.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17521535 Mon, 25 Dec 2006 13:44:45 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17521182 Greg_Z : Oh well, their charges have been dropped, so no more drama. Looks like Tweaker is exactly that, just too many drugs to not think about reality.

»operationsuccess.blogspot.com/20···ped.html
Friday, December 22, 2006
Charges have been dropped.
I find this to be somewhat ironic that the day after I post a link to my blog on Digg.com I receive a call from the Police. Turns out that my High School is not going to follow through with any charges now that they know who did it and they wanted to be sure to let my family know before Christmas. Could it be that my blog making it to the front page of Digg made an impact...? Who knows.

Anyways, they dropped the two felony charges against me and I can pickup ALMOST all of my stuff from the police station. They decided to keep all the CDs and DVDs they took to make sure I don't have any pirated software.

As for you non-believers that think I just completely fabricated this entire story... In two weeks when I can pick up my family's stuff and the case is closed, I will post some pictures of whatever I can. In fact, I have a piece of paper stating exactly what happened the day of the intrusion. I don't want to go and start posting things like that on the internet until the case is completely closed.
--
I threw out the map a long time ago. Now I follow my own direction!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17521182 Mon, 25 Dec 2006 12:08:25 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17521166 TwistedLefty : Geez people wake up, this is total BS. Cops that "look like"
"S.W.A.T." assigned to some kids file sharing case?
yea, they have nothing else better to do.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17521166 Mon, 25 Dec 2006 12:03:22 EDT Re: Hold you horses! http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17521141 cacroll :
said by 81399672 See Profile :

what makes it more false in my view, is cops waiting for mom to come home to open the door. SWAT is used when there is serious danger to an officer safety, if cops believed that then door would be swinging open 10 sec after swat got there


True too.

This whole thread smells of a high school or college prank. It's the holidays, and students everywhere are out of school, with nothing to do.
--
Cheers,
Chuck
MS-MVP [Windows - Networking]
PChuck's Network]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17521141 Mon, 25 Dec 2006 11:56:38 EDT Re: Hold you horses! http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17521112 81399672 : what makes it more false in my view, is cops waiting for mom to come home to open the door. SWAT is used when there is serious danger to an officer safety, if cops believed that then door would be swinging open 10 sec after swat got there]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17521112 Mon, 25 Dec 2006 11:46:08 EDT Re: Hold you horses! http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17521101 cacroll :
said by fatness See Profile :

said by Trel See Profile :

Also, this story is bull. It is almost exactly the same as this proven bogus story: »operationsuccess.blogspot.com/20···use.html
Thanks for that link. I read that blog page and the followup. Where was it proven false? All I see is several blog comments expressing doubt for various reasons. Thanks.


Well, we will know in a couple weeks whether that story is bogus.

In two weeks when I can pick up my family's stuff and the case is closed, I will post some pictures of whatever I can. In fact, I have a piece of paper stating exactly what happened the day of the intrusion. I don't want to go and start posting things like that on the internet until the case is completely closed.

But I have to say, it sounds like a massive amount of waste of taxpayer money.
•Story from the offender's mother:
I came home as soon as possible only to find eight police vehicles and a swat car in front of the house. Dozens of armed police officers were surrounding the house.

•Then 2 weeks later, the case is dropped?
Anyways, they dropped the two felony charges against me and I can pickup ALMOST all of my stuff from the police station.

--
Cheers,
Chuck
MS-MVP [Windows - Networking]
PChuck's Network]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17521101 Mon, 25 Dec 2006 11:41:17 EDT Re: Hold you horses! http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17520858 fatness :
said by Trel See Profile :

Also, this story is bull. It is almost exactly the same as this proven bogus story: »operationsuccess.blogspot.com/20···use.html
Thanks for that link. I read that blog page and the followup. Where was it proven false? All I see is several blog comments expressing doubt for various reasons. Thanks.
--
Me, I want a hula hoop..]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17520858 Mon, 25 Dec 2006 10:19:19 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17520813 Rifleman : I have been reading this with interest and while no security expert----I did play around with shareaza. Shareaza connects to the Gnutella Networks, Edonkey, bearshare , limewireand a few others. When I was bored I would punch in the search term "tax return". I was shocked to see the number of hits I got. I would then "browse" the files available at any one address in the hits.
Many people had their personal photos, all documents, bank info, credit card info, resumes, lawsuit papers etc.
I actually called one fellow who turned out to be a lawyer. His kid installed limewire and had access wide open to well over 10000 documents concerning his clients.
He thought I was lying when I expained how I got his number----downloaded one of his papers----so I told him to go home and check his "shared" folder for limewire and told him to call me back. He called that night scared to death. The wrong person getting a hold of certain clients files could have ruined his practice.
I have found nude pictures of wives, child porn, etc etc. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17520813 Mon, 25 Dec 2006 09:54:43 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17520588 anon : I guess that makes you feel all warm and fuzzy for doing that. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17520588 Mon, 25 Dec 2006 07:41:09 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17520433 NormanS :
said by 81399672 See Profile :

see my edit, also at least in usa we don't have that problem you do not have to provide evidence against your self, under 5th amendment
Actually, that is not quite what the fifth amendment to the U.S. Constitution says. More like:
quote:
...nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself...


See: »www.usconstitution.net/const.html#Am5

Surrendering evidence on warrant or subpoena is not "giving witness". Giving incriminating information under interrogation, or testifying at trial is "giving witness".
--
Norman
~Oh Lord, why have you come
~To Konnyu, with the Lion and the Drum]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17520433 Mon, 25 Dec 2006 05:11:56 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17520419 RR Conductor : He's got a check now, I was so excited to see our Democrats take control of both houses! King George has been put down a step :)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17520419 Mon, 25 Dec 2006 04:57:24 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17520417 NormanS :
said by 81399672 See Profile :

said by no__1__here See Profile :

[OT but I must]

said by LF3Mem See Profile :

thnx to Prez Bush cops can do what ever they want to do now warrent or not.. thnx to the patriot act
Hmm. Last I checked it passed both houses and then President Bush signed it. Why blame him solely? :uhh:
he's the president
Doesn't change the fact that the Congress sent him the bill for his signature. If the Congress had not sent him a bill to sign into law, there would be no law.
--
Norman
~Oh Lord, why have you come
~To Konnyu, with the Lion and the Drum]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17520417 Mon, 25 Dec 2006 04:54:18 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17520413 NormanS : Not quite. The police still need warrants for crimes unrelated to "homeland security", or "terrorism".
--
Norman
~Oh Lord, why have you come
~To Konnyu, with the Lion and the Drum]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17520413 Mon, 25 Dec 2006 04:53:09 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17520404 NormanS : You are paying your attorney for advice. Leave it at that.

They don't have to install a Trojan to track the files you are trading. When you use a filesharing application, you are publicly announcing that you have files to share. There is an implicit invitation for any passing member of the public, including police officers, to examine the files you have put up for trade.
--
Norman
~Oh Lord, why have you come
~To Konnyu, with the Lion and the Drum]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17520404 Mon, 25 Dec 2006 04:46:36 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17520402 RR Conductor : I think you have a poor, biased view of our Mormon faith.

That said, I think putting your case up on a public forum is asking for trouble.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17520402 Mon, 25 Dec 2006 04:45:43 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17520329 Curiosity :
said by Tweekr See Profile :

Maybe they do think I was distributing the software, who knows since no charges have been formally filed as of yet.

My main question is what programs will trace the high threat type port attempts. What program will totally block access to cracking? I want privacy just as much as you guys do other wise you would not be here.
You mentioned Bear Share. I understand that it is peer-to-peer software. Nobody would need any trickery to see what you are sharing. They would need Bear Share, and just look to see what is there. To avoid this kind of hassle, stop using peer-to-peer software. It leaves you vulnerable to viruses and trojans as well, since you have a big hole in your firewall to allow the sharing.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17520329 Mon, 25 Dec 2006 03:34:32 EDT Re: Hold you horses! http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17520307 81399672 :
said by badjoe See Profile :

said by Trel See Profile :

Also, this story is bull. It is almost exactly the same as this proven bogus story: »operationsuccess.blogspot.com/20···use.html

Ha ha! I think you are correct. It's just a big pile of bovine scat.
ye the blog is fake, swat come out for that, even more cops do not wait for house owner to come home to ope the door they just break down the door.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17520307 Mon, 25 Dec 2006 03:22:44 EDT Re: Hold you horses! http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17520288 badjoe :
said by Trel See Profile :

Also, this story is bull. It is almost exactly the same as this proven bogus story: »operationsuccess.blogspot.com/20···use.html

Ha ha! I think you are correct. It's just a big pile of bovine scat.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17520288 Mon, 25 Dec 2006 03:13:56 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17520229 public :
said by 81399672 See Profile :

the only way you can change an amendment is with an amendment. Any supreme court ruling you can change only with a new amendment.
You have been living in a tree!!!!!!
The Neo Nazi crooks in the present administration do not need no stinking amendment. It does not apply to them.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17520229 Mon, 25 Dec 2006 02:32:18 EDT Re: Hold you horses! http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17520159 jays2345 : 1st rule of thumb when dealing with police whether u are guilty or innocent (keep the trap shut)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17520159 Mon, 25 Dec 2006 01:59:41 EDT Re: Hold you horses! http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17520127 haertig :
said by jansson_mark See Profile :

This is prettymuch "foolproof", since nobody can break Truecrypt encryption
But remember, whatever application you are using for downloading, viewing, or whatever, might well write temporary copies of the files to unencrypted partitions. For example, a web browser may cache something that you later save to an encrypted container. That cached piece may be in cleartext. The app may or may not erase these temporary files, but even if they're erased they may still be retrievable to the knowledgeable. And if your box is owned by a trojan or what-have-you, all bets are off. All files have to be decrypted to be used. Typically these would be decrypted into ram rather than harddisk, but a trojan could just read the data directly from ram. Sophisticated cloak and dagger stuff for sure, but certainly possible (probably not practical though - except for really really bad guys they police want to catch).]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17520127 Mon, 25 Dec 2006 01:47:22 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17520046 Taget : If the police are investigating you the most important thing is not how you can secure your computer but keeping your mouth shut and not doing or saying anything stupid that will put yourself in jeopardy.

You you should re-read your message above and edit anything that can be construed as an admission of a copyright violation or the use of a product that could be used for such a violation. If you've said anything that you wouldnt want read back to a jury during trial then for goodness sakes don't say it or type it. In fact I'd be willing to bet if you asked your lawyers (which you should since this is the type of advice you are paying them to give you) they'd advice you to delete everything you just said and avoid any further comment in this thread.

I have no idea why (or even if) you are under investigation. But if you were placed under arrest chances are you are STILL under investigation and will be at least until charges against you are adjudicated. That means you should assume all your activities are still ruthlessly monitored.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17520046 Mon, 25 Dec 2006 01:13:35 EDT Re: Hold you horses! http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17520044 Trel :
said by hpguru See Profile :

So if your filesharing app is currently uploading a total of let's say - 10GB of files which may not be complete and which may also be opened for write access then TC opens them all up in RAM???

Dream on buddy. :uhh:
Nope, filesharing programs write the files to disk as it downloads, these writes would be encrypted so encrypted data hits the disk, the encryption is done in RAM though.

Also, this story is bull. It is almost exactly the same as this proven bogus story: »operationsuccess.blogspot.com/20···use.html
--
/chown -R us:us /yourbase]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17520044 Mon, 25 Dec 2006 01:12:22 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17520003 NetFixer :
said by PolarBear See Profile :

Like he said, Utah. I believe him.
It has been quite a few years since I had an encounter with Utah law enforcement, but my experience was that they were rather relaxed and laid back.

I was going "pedal to the metal" on a long lonely strech of rural Utah highway (I am not sure exactly how fast I was going but the speedometer was pegged past the 120 mph mark). Suddenly a Utah highway patrol car raced up behind me (seemingly from nowhere) like the proverbial bat out of hell. As the officer passed me, he slowed down to pace me for a fraction of a second, and mouthed what looked like "slow down, drive safely", then he smiled, waved and accelerated off into the horizon. He was so courteous, that I did slow down to around 100 mph until I got near the next town where I slowed down to a normal "east coast" speed.
--
Outsourcing is not the same as Offshoring!
Test your firewall. | Smell the flowers.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17520003 Mon, 25 Dec 2006 01:01:10 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17519979 TwistedLefty : i want the time i waisted reading this stupid thread back.
on second thought , nevermind it's christmas.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17519979 Mon, 25 Dec 2006 00:55:15 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17519934 PolarBear : Like he said, Utah. I believe him. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17519934 Mon, 25 Dec 2006 00:37:43 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17519722 81399672 :
said by public See Profile :

said by 81399672 See Profile :

see my edit, also at least in usa we don't have that problem you do not have to provide evidence against your self, under 5th amendment
Gee have you been living in a tree during the past couple of years????
Of course the next version of the Patriot Act to be passed in the middle of the night without anybody allowed to read any of it will include the preemptive prosecution provision which makes any previous amendments or laws irrelevant.
the only way you can change an amendment is with an amendment. Any supreme court ruling you can change only with a new amendment.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17519722 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 23:39:09 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17519704 public :
said by 81399672 See Profile :

see my edit, also at least in usa we don't have that problem you do not have to provide evidence against your self, under 5th amendment
Gee have you been living in a tree during the past couple of years????
Of course the next version of the Patriot Act to be passed in the middle of the night without anybody allowed to read any of it will include the preemptive prosecution provision which makes any previous amendments or laws irrelevant.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17519704 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 23:34:23 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17519688 public :
said by Hmmmmmmmmm :

I will give $5 to someone who can actully tell me what the PatriotAct actully does/says (without looking it up).
Better yet, can you name a single congressman who voted for the act who actually read any part of the act?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17519688 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 23:28:39 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17519623 BloodRoses : ...No. Just, no. I'm saying that a lot lately. But, no.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17519623 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 23:05:20 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17519619 Greg_Z :
said by sharpy merc See Profile :

Not just fishy, smells alot like it just fell out of a bull.

and its still steaming
And the sad thing is, the OP has been registered here since 2001, and is just now posting.

Of course, this is of interest »www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-cha···07/posts
»www.sltrib.com/search/ci_4794301
Boys at Monticello High School have allegedly been pressuring girls to pose nude and then were sharing the photographs with others.

More than 30 girls may have been victims in what San Juan County Sheriff Mike Lacy is calling a child pornography case.

Lacy said his office has completed its probe and referred its findings to the Utah Attorney General's Office for possible criminal charges.

As many as eight boys are believed to be involved, though four appear to have been the biggest culprits, Lacy said.
--
I threw out the map a long time ago. Now I follow my own direction!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17519619 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 23:04:10 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17519290 81399672 :
said by hpguru See Profile :

said by insomniac84 See Profile :

Say the key was random and written on a postit note on your desk. Say they must have taken it during the execution of the warrant because it is no longer there. That creates the situation where the police took the password and lost it. Then they can't even try to hold you in contempt of court as the police screwed up.
Unless they find it and then you are screwed.
that's why you just tell them that eve though it's a lie, they got no way of knowing that.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17519290 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 21:43:42 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17519224 Prhamil : You are giving a lawyer $5K and coming on here asking for advise?? I bet you are laughing your ass off at the riduculous thread you started. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17519224 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 21:25:43 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17519086 hpguru :
said by insomniac84 See Profile :

Say the key was random and written on a postit note on your desk. Say they must have taken it during the execution of the warrant because it is no longer there. That creates the situation where the police took the password and lost it. Then they can't even try to hold you in contempt of court as the police screwed up.
Unless they find it and then you are screwed.
--
Where's Jesus?
Dear Jesus!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17519086 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 20:52:50 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17519049 insomniac84 :
said by steve19726 See Profile :

Even if you encrypt it, can't they subpoena you for the key?
Say the key was random and written on a postit note on your desk. Say they must have taken it during the execution of the warrant because it is no longer there. That creates the situation where the police took the password and lost it. Then they can't even try to hold you in contempt of court as the police screwed up.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17519049 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 20:40:55 EDT Re: Hold you horses! http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17519041 hpguru :
said by jansson_mark See Profile :


They either are encrypted as they are inside that partition or they exist in RAM which will be wiped off when computer is "shutdown".


But if they are knowledgable and careful to preserve forensic evidence, they will pull the plug. Shutting it down would be a big mistake since it may trigger processes which would destroy evidence. Even in the absence of such processes, valuable data may be destroyed by rebooting or shutting down the system.

said by jansson_mark See Profile :

quote:
but I would think files would have to be opened in order to write to them and that means decrypting them.

TC does this only in RAM.


So if your filesharing app is currently uploading a total of let's say - 10GB of files which may not be complete and which may also be opened for write access then TC opens them all up in RAM???

Dream on buddy. :uhh:
--
Where's Jesus?
Dear Jesus!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17519041 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 20:40:03 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518940 Cudni :
said by 81399672 See Profile :

law don't have a choice.
True, so no choice in penalty :)

edit: and intersting read
»osaka.law.miami.edu/~froomkin/se···per.html

Cudni]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518940 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 20:17:07 EDT Re: Hold you horses! http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518938 jansson_mark :
quote:
The police won't reboot the PC. They'll just pull the power plug. Will files which are opened and being written to on the encrypted partition at that moment be encrypted?

They either are encrypted as they are inside that partition or they exist in RAM which will be wiped off when computer is "shutdown".

quote:
It might be if TC encrypts the data stream prior to writing it to disk

It does exactly that.

quote:
but I would think files would have to be opened in order to write to them and that means decrypting them.

TC does this only in RAM.
--
My computer security & privacy related homepage »www.markusjansson.net Use HushTools or GnuPG/PGP to encrypt any email before sending it to me to protect our privacy.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518938 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 20:16:11 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518929 BurntCricket :
said by HFB1217 See Profile :

What ever This person has done or not what is being asked is helping to circumvent the law by us and not knowing who or what he is and has plans to do or use that information to avoid detection of.

So I say sorry but no thanks use your Lawyer and leave us out of this potential legal bomb or trap as the case maybe.
I tend to agree, either this is a bunch of chicken stuff or we are not hearing "The rest of the story" > for the law to come to your house for Copyright Infringement you need to be a doing a tad more than "my music and some software activity" > wholesale production of CDs and DVDs maybe ??

He thinks the Law is "monitoring his computer activity" and comes to a public and very popular Website asking what do to ? :uhh:

One of the many things a Lawyer would tell him "Do not discuss this with anyone without me present".
--
There is nothing more valuable than a man whos loyalty can be purchased with cold hard cash.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518929 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 20:13:23 EDT Re: Hold you horses! http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518927 BIGHUSKER :
said by jansson_mark See Profile :

Second, no, its not a civil issue, it is a police issue and they can and will get search warrents to grap the actual computers.
Unless the guy was running a sizable underground piracy ring (which I already added as a qualifier to my original post), then the police are not going to raid somebody's house because they caught him downloading a few mp3s off BearShare. Police would not be monitoring general traffic on BearShare in the first place.

Either the OP is full of shit (most likely), or he left out plenty of details.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518927 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 20:12:38 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518915 81399672 :
said by Cudni See Profile :

i'm sure the law will be lenient :)

Cudni
law don't have a choice. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518915 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 20:10:22 EDT Re: Hold you horses! http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518905 81399672 : I could be wrong on this as i am just starting to use truecrypt but being that drive would unmounted when computer is restarted the files will be encrypted. The best thing i could think cops can do is put system in to hybernate mode and that may keep it open (if it was open when cops came)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518905 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 20:06:03 EDT Re: Hold you horses! http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518887 hpguru :
said by jansson_mark See Profile :

Best protection is to use Truecrypt or similiar to encrypt entire partitions. When you login, open that partition up and download onto it. Then lock the screen (Windowskey+L) so that nobody can get access to it without rebooting the computer...


The police won't reboot the PC. They'll just pull the power plug. Will files which are opened and being written to on the encrypted partition at that moment be encrypted?

said by jansson_mark See Profile :

This is prettymuch "foolproof"...


Perhaps, perhaps not. It might be if TC encrypts the data stream prior to writing it to disk but I would think files would have to be opened in order to write to them and that means decrypting them. They would certainly need to be opened in order for your piracy filesharing app to read and upload the files.
--
Where's Jesus?
Dear Jesus!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518887 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 20:01:12 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518878 Cudni : i'm sure the law will be lenient :)

Cudni]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518878 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 19:59:58 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518868 81399672 :
said by Cudni See Profile :

said by 81399672 See Profile :

said by steve19726 See Profile :

Even if you encrypt it, can't they subpoena you for the key?
sure but you don't have give it to them. Look at it this way, cops force you to give them key to the safe, they break in but they can't force you to give it to them. Same with this, they can try to crack the encryption but can't force you to give them key
they can and they will as for the key, otherwise ...the law is an ass...
and although in civilised countries they don't usually force the handing of the keys matters can be inferred when they are not handed :)

Cudni
see my edit, also at least in usa we don't have that problem you do not have to provide evidence against your self, under 5th amendment]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518868 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 19:57:44 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518860 Cudni :
said by 81399672 See Profile :

said by steve19726 See Profile :

Even if you encrypt it, can't they subpoena you for the key?
sure but you don't have give it to them. Look at it this way, cops force you to give them key to the safe, they break in but they can't force you to give it to them. Same with this, they can try to crack the encryption but can't force you to give them key
they can and they will as for the key, otherwise ...the law is an ass...
and although in civilised countries they don't usually force the handing of the keys matters can be inferred when they are not handed :)

Cudni
--
Some are born to failure, others achieve it, all deserve it.
Help yourself so God can help you.
MVP, Microsoft Windows Security 2006]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518860 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 19:56:16 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518830 81399672 :
said by steve19726 See Profile :

Even if you encrypt it, can't they subpoena you for the key?
sure but you don't have give it to them. Look at it this way, cops force you to give them key to the safe, they break in but they can't force you to give it to them. Same with this, they can try to crack the encryption but can't force you to give them key

you set up hidden and unhidden value, so if you want to give them key you can but all they will see only want them to see]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518830 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 19:48:43 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518795 steve19726 : Even if you encrypt it, can't they subpoena you for the key?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518795 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 19:37:33 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518792 La Luna : A few possibilities:

A) OP is a troll, entire story is BS.

B) Just because some "she" police person said they were in his computer, doesn't mean they really were.

C) If the police showed up in said fashion, they had good reason to do so....OP is not telling entire story.

D) OP looking to get the crippled paranoid among us foaming at the mouth (and has succeeded).

I'm leaning towards A and D.

Another candidate for the "Dumbest Thread Ever" competition. :uhh:
--
~~Well, I think you're crazy, I think you're crazy, I think you're crazy, just like me...~~

]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518792 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 19:36:15 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518765 Hutch :
said by norwegian See Profile :

Maybe that is how you see it, in Oz, they have to act on rumours/complaints of a certain nature. We have a policy here "dob in a neighbour".

I won't voice my opinion on that. It's what we live with in this "day n age"
Been a victim of the dob in a neighbour policy myself. Thank God the Police saw straight through it, and took out an AVO on my part to stop that person from making false allegations against me ever again. Oh by the way, that person was my wifes ex-husband.
--
Who Gives A.......Don't Ask Me....Cos I Don't Give A ****]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518765 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 19:29:44 EDT Re: Hold you horses! http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518586 81399672 : thanks for that program name, i learn something new everyday.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518586 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 18:33:00 EDT Re: Hold you horses! http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518452 Cudni : Lol, so you recommend Truecrypt to thwart the efforts of meddling police?

Cudni]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518452 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 18:04:12 EDT Hold you horses! http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518408 jansson_mark : First of all, its perfectly possible that police simply browsed the files he was SHARING with bearshare or whatever. This is what they do when they try to nail people from copyright violations.

Second, no, its not a civil issue, it is a police issue and they can and will get search warrents to grap the actual computers.

Best protection is to use Truecrypt or similiar to encrypt entire partitions. When you login, open that partition up and download onto it. Then lock the screen (Windowskey+L) so that nobody can get access to it without rebooting the computer...and keep that computer on! This is prettymuch "foolproof", since nobody can break Truecrypt encryption (and since it encrypts downloads and filenames etc. etc.). And if someone tryes to install trojan to the system, they need to reboot the computer because desktop is locked (when they do that you can easily tell it, because they cant reboot it back and get access to Truecrypt container, so when you open it up and see that TC container is no opened - bingo). Then, in order to get access to the files protected by TC they would need to install hardware keyloggers and cameras to catch your Windows&TC passphrases and keyfiles used. Thats not very likely scenario if you pay any attention to the physical security of the computer.
--
My computer security & privacy related homepage »www.markusjansson.net Use HushTools or GnuPG/PGP to encrypt any email before sending it to me to protect our privacy.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518408 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 17:53:21 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518388 anon :
said by dodgetech2 See Profile :

said by LF3Mem See Profile :

thnx to Prez Bush cops can do what ever they want to do now warrent or not.. thnx to the patriot act
Oh boy....you cant even spell warrant....How would we expect you to understand the patriot act...
Hehe, score! :D]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518388 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 17:48:36 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518370 anon : I will give $5 to someone who can actully tell me what the PatriotAct actully does/says (without looking it up). Even Lef3Mem can participate. : )

Tinfoil hats for the ones who get it wrong.

Send me a PM to claim your prize. :D]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518370 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 17:45:13 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518349 NetFixer :
said by norwegian See Profile :

We have a policy here "dob in a neighbour".
I had to look that one up.
said by wikipedia :

Dob (to dob in) is an Australian English language colloquialism meaning "to inform (on someone)"
You need to provide translation links for some of us mate. :D
--
Outsourcing is not the same as Offshoring!
Test your firewall. | Smell the flowers.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518349 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 17:38:48 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518337 dodgetech2 :
said by LF3Mem See Profile :

thnx to Prez Bush cops can do what ever they want to do now warrent or not.. thnx to the patriot act
Oh boy....you cant even spell warrant....How would we expect you to understand the patriot act...]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518337 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 17:36:55 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518314 81399672 :
said by no__1__here See Profile :

said by 81399672 See Profile :

said by no__1__here See Profile :

And? Your congress(wo)man is a bump on a log??

ETA: Last I checked Bush is in the executive branch, which doesn't make laws. The legislative branch does that... Did Bush have a hand in the bill creation and push it? Sure, no argument there. Still had to pass both houses before it got to his desk. I'm not saying he is not a part of the law's creation, only that it is quite silly to blame him alone when you don't like it.
When something goes wrong in the country ex, people don't like laws people blame the president, if something goes right in the country people give credit to the president.
Well now, that just shows how silly and uneducated people are, no? :p Presidents do not make laws. If our joke of a public education system wasn't so bad folks might still learn that in junior high. ;)
yes presidents don't make laws but that's how public sees it. If economy is great it's because of president, economy is bad is because of president. If we get attacked because of president, security etc..]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518314 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 17:28:39 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518288 norwegian :
said by 81399672 See Profile :

In order for police to take all of the computers etc they had to have probable cause, just a rumor is not enough for police to get a warrant
Maybe that is how you see it, in Oz, they have to act on rumours/complaints of a certain nature. We have a policy here "dob in a neighbour".

I won't voice my opinion on that. It's what we live with in this "day n age"


--
The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518288 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 17:20:33 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518276 no__1__here :
said by 81399672 See Profile :

said by no__1__here See Profile :

And? Your congress(wo)man is a bump on a log??

ETA: Last I checked Bush is in the executive branch, which doesn't make laws. The legislative branch does that... Did Bush have a hand in the bill creation and push it? Sure, no argument there. Still had to pass both houses before it got to his desk. I'm not saying he is not a part of the law's creation, only that it is quite silly to blame him alone when you don't like it.
When something goes wrong in the country ex, people don't like laws people blame the president, if something goes right in the country people give credit to the president.
Well now, that just shows how silly and uneducated people are, no? :p Presidents do not make laws. If our joke of a public education system wasn't so bad folks might still learn that in junior high. ;)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518276 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 17:16:07 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518268 81399672 : In order for police to take all of the computers etc they had to have probable cause, just a rumor is not enough for police to get a warrant]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518268 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 17:13:35 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518261 norwegian : I will not elaborate on any of this story, let's just say it was true.

A rumour started up, a man was charged, he owned a computer business; all was taken in for inspection, he was left with near on nothing to continue he daily running of his business, until he and his lawyers proved the story wrong.

He ordered all further conversations on the topic held liable. So this is all you get.

Feel for Tweekr if it is true, but not being active in the forums, and helping others has left him/her on the backfoot, now wanting member's help.
--
The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing - Edmund Burke]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518261 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 17:11:17 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518256 81399672 :
said by no__1__here See Profile :

And? Your congress(wo)man is a bump on a log??

ETA: Last I checked Bush is in the executive branch, which doesn't make laws. The legislative branch does that... Did Bush have a hand in the bill creation and push it? Sure, no argument there. Still had to pass both houses before it got to his desk. I'm not saying he is not a part of the law's creation, only that it is quite silly to blame him alone when you don't like it.
When something goes wrong in the country ex, people don't like laws people blame the president, if something goes right in the country people give credit to the president. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518256 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 17:10:21 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518243 no__1__here :
said by 81399672 See Profile :

said by no__1__here See Profile :

[OT but I must]

said by LF3Mem See Profile :

thnx to Prez Bush cops can do what ever they want to do now warrent or not.. thnx to the patriot act
Hmm. Last I checked it passed both houses and then President Bush signed it. Why blame him solely? :uhh:
he's the president
And? Your congress(wo)man is a bump on a log??

ETA: Last I checked Bush is in the executive branch, which doesn't make laws. The legislative branch does that... Did Bush have a hand in the bill creation and push it? Sure, no argument there. Still had to pass both houses before it got to his desk. I'm not saying he is not a part of the law's creation, only that it is quite silly to blame him alone when you don't like it.

EDIT 2: Let's see... both of the good senators from California voted in the affirmative to extend it:

»www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/r···29#state]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518243 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 17:06:08 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518182 81399672 :
said by BodyBumper See Profile :

I have sent a direct link of this post and a zip copy to the Salt Lake City Police (slcpd@slcgov.com) and the Salt Lake City District Attorney (districtatty@co.slc.ut.us).

Also thank you Sir for providing the exact Date and Time of your arrest.
:D i can't stop laughing]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518182 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 16:50:41 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518174 BodyBumper : I have sent a direct link of this post and a zip copy to the Salt Lake City Police (slcpd@slcgov.com) and the Salt Lake City District Attorney (districtatty@co.slc.ut.us).

Also thank you Sir for providing the exact Date and Time of your arrest.
--
"War is peace. Freedom is slavery. Ignorance is strength."]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518174 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 16:49:02 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518157 81399672 :
said by no__1__here See Profile :

[OT but I must]

said by LF3Mem See Profile :

thnx to Prez Bush cops can do what ever they want to do now warrent or not.. thnx to the patriot act
Hmm. Last I checked it passed both houses and then President Bush signed it. Why blame him solely? :uhh:
he's the president]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518157 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 16:44:55 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518151 no__1__here : [OT but I must]

said by LF3Mem See Profile :

thnx to Prez Bush cops can do what ever they want to do now warrent or not.. thnx to the patriot act
Hmm. Last I checked it passed both houses and then President Bush signed it. Why blame him solely? :uhh:]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518151 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 16:44:15 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518131 insomniac84 : I would request copies of the drives from the police. Since it's evidence, I think they need to allow you to be able to check it out.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518131 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 16:39:30 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518124 LF3Mem : thnx to Prez Bush cops can do what ever they want to do now warrent or not.. thnx to the patriot act]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518124 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 16:38:31 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518098 hpguru :
said by Tweekr See Profile :

Any thoughts on these programs as far as security goes?
I think they are clearly vulnerable to the search warrant exploit.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518098 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 16:31:26 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518095 AnonProxy : Replace "copyright infringement" with "child pornography" and I think we will be closer to the truth.

Troll points: 22 out of 200]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518095 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 16:31:17 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518090 rexbinary : I'm not a big P2Per, but most of them will allow you to browse the source, so they wouldn't need any kind of hacks or Trojans.

Say someone runs a search for a file and they find it on your machine. They then have the option to browse the source of that file, which would be your computer. They can browse through what you have offered to share in the P2P application.

Sounds like you had files shared that were copyrighted.

Sharing is not anonymous.
--
Verizon FiOS 15/2 subscriber since 8/1/05 | Mac owner since 1990 | FreeBSD user since 2005 | Anyone who is unwilling to learn is entitled to absolutely nothing. | sudo sandwich | EDIT: I seldom post without an edit.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518090 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 16:30:38 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518073 amysheehan :
said by Cudni See Profile :

said by Tweekr See Profile :

..I had to give my lawyer approx. 5K$ u.s. to deal with this case.
Let the lawyer continue deal with it

Cudni
Agreed !

:)
--
DSLR Phishtracker]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518073 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 16:26:19 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518064 BIGHUSKER : I'm calling bullshit on this right now. Please don't feed the trolls.

#1: This type of copyright infringement is generally a civil matter, so there's no reason the police would be involved if you've given us all the relevant details (downloading some mp3s and videos off BearShare). Unless you were running some huge underground piracy ring that you actually profited from, the worst you'll ever see is a nasty letter from your ISP and/or the RIAA/MPAA that may eventually turn into a lawsuit.

#2: Nobody can "scan your hard drive" remotely unless you went out of your way to share it with everyone, or you had absolutely zero security on your network (not even so much as a NAT router or a software firewall). This isn't some crappy Hollywood movie where you can break into anybody's system with some magical program.

#3: If you acutally had a lawyer, he'd tell you to keep your mouth shut and not to talk to *anyone* about this. The fact is that you admitted (or came very close to admitting) in your post that you downloaded music, videos and some porn.

The only way this would be even remotely believable is if you were suspected of distributing kiddie porn. Methinks this is some bored kiddie on Christmas break. I hope nobody else falls for this.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518064 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 16:24:56 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518060 onDvine :
said by Tweekr See Profile :

... If I could get some ideas as to what to do other than be a nervous wreck that would be appreciated. Thanks.
Consider it a wake up call. You won't be "stupid or careless and really never imagine ..." again. Losing that unrealistic complacency now may save you from worse legal problems in the future.

With "2 counts of copyright infringement over the internet or something to that effect," the best idea I an offer is that you accept you got caught for [whatever] and get over it so you can project your best calm, confident and friendly attitude while your lawyer speaks.

Life's important lessons suck while they're being learned. You'll survive this one.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518060 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 16:23:52 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518030 81399672 :
said by HFB1217 See Profile :

So I say sorry but no thanks use your Lawyer and leave us out of this potential legal bomb or trap as the case maybe.
what potential legal bomb, he is just asking how to secure his computer. See nothing wrong with that questions]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518030 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 16:17:10 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518024 HFB1217 : What ever This person has done or not what is being asked is helping to circumvent the law by us and not knowing who or what he is and has plans to do or use that information to avoid detection of.

So I say sorry but no thanks use your Lawyer and leave us out of this potential legal bomb or trap as the case maybe.
--
****aka The WIZARD **** A Founding member Seti BBR Team Starfire****]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518024 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 16:16:01 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518014 EGeezer :
said by OP :

Due to my downloads from bear share of my music and some software activity. Well, ok there were those occasional porns to that were in the bunch bunch but they are more concerned with the music and programs.
My recommendation is to avoid those illegal activities that expose you to charges, and continue to use legasl guidance. If the porn you shared is CP or violence against women, I hope you burn.
--
6EQUJ5]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17518014 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 16:13:32 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17517984 Kubaton : I agree. Cops cannot break into your house, legally, to install or retrieve anything without a search warrant. You're protected under the 4th amendment, which protects against illegal search and seizure. My initial thought, which may be wrong, is that something is not quite right about the story. I know if all of my computer equipment was seized and knowing that I will be financially devastated, I wouldn't be quite as calm about it.

Just my $.02.

Regards,
Kubaton
--
Welcome to the Internet, where the men are men, the women are men, and the 12 year old girls are FBI agents.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17517984 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 16:07:13 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17517951 Cheese :
said by sharpy merc See Profile :

Not just fishy, smells alot like it just fell out of a bull.

and its still steaming
Word....]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17517951 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 16:00:36 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17517942 MarkAW :

said by Tweekr See Profile :

Yes they had a search warrant, but the detective said that she had browsed my files, folders and that is what led her to monitor my activity on bear share.
You say they had a warrant to search did you even read the said warrant to see if it covered your computer in said search.
Click for full size
Click for full size
]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17517942 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 15:58:38 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17517916 sharpy merc : Not just fishy, smells alot like it just fell out of a bull.

and its still steaming]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17517916 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 15:53:01 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17517880 Cheese : I smell something fishy with this story.... :hmm:]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17517880 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 15:46:07 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17517868 81399672 : in the future encrypt your hard drives, make sure to keep anything you feel illegal encrypted at all times that you're not using, also keep this stuff on computer that's not connected to the internet. Install surveillance around your house to monitor if cops ever break in to your house to install trojan in to your computer. Did you open any files that you didn't recognize? your firewall is fine and chances are they didn't hack your computer]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17517868 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 15:42:44 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17517790 Tweekr : Oh, and I am using zone alarm pro and also proxy way. Any thoughts on these programs as far as security goes?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17517790 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 15:28:08 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17517780 Tweekr : Ok guys, NO SWAT Team was there. No distributing software or Kiddie Porn. They were dressed like SWAT people dress, that is what it reminded me of. Thats all.

Maybe they do think I was distributing the software, who knows since no charges have been formally filed as of yet.

My main question is what programs will trace the high threat type port attempts. What program will totally block access to cracking? I want privacy just as much as you guys do other wise you would not be here.

I appreciate your comments. Thanks and Merry Ho Ho.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17517780 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 15:25:00 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17517511 dadkins :
said by RXDOC See Profile :

In order for SWAT to be involved they must suspect child pornography or sales and distribution of copywritten materials. Either fit the situation?
I agree!
Some seriously BAD stuff happening for SWAT to be involved!

Simple copyright infringement gets you a summons, not SWAT!
--
Think outside the Fox... Opera]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17517511 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 14:31:28 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17517429 Kayrac : listen to your lawyer man

your paying him good money, it's in his hands now mate

chances are they just have ISP logs of your activity, not trojan horse or anything btw

your isp is federally required to give it up if they get a warrent]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17517429 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 14:15:55 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17517416 RXDOC : In order for SWAT to be involved they must suspect child pornography or sales and distribution of copywritten materials. Either fit the situation?]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17517416 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 14:13:39 EDT Re: Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17517410 Cudni :
said by Tweekr See Profile :

..I had to give my lawyer approx. 5K$ u.s. to deal with this case.
Let the lawyer continue deal with it

Cudni
--
Some are born to failure, others achieve it, all deserve it.
Help yourself so God can help you.
MVP, Microsoft Windows Security 2006]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17517410 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 14:12:15 EDT Law Enforcement and cracking my puter http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17517387 Tweekr : Hello people,
I have never really posted here before but I have used the services and advice many times for about 5 years or so.

I have a story to tell and then within the story a question or questions about security, prevention or if it is really possible to prevent your computer to be cracked then hacked.

Well on around Dec. 6 2006 approx. 7:20 pm I was working out in my garage on a boat I am restoring. I was standing up and turning towards the entry door when all the sudden it swings open and and I see a guy dressed in S.W.A.T. type uniform scream freeze, search warrant!!.... ya, it wasn't Santa clause.

Seems they been watching my activity and scanning or browsing my hard drive and are nailing me for copyright infringement type charges. Due to my downloads from bear share of my music and some software activity. Well, ok there were those occasional porns to that were in the bunch bunch but they are more concerned with the music and programs.

Well, they took 8 hard drives, two desktop computers with hard drives, vid cards tons of expensive memory and then whisked me off to jail with some crazy charge of 2 counts of copyright infringement over the internet or something to that effect. Now there are no charges as of yet filed per my lawyer and I guess they are searching my gigabytes of info on my hard drives they took.

Yes they had a search warrant, but the detective said that she had browsed my files, folders and that is what led her to monitor my activity on bear share.

What a night and what a hunk of change I had to give my lawyer approx. 5K$ u.s. to deal with this case.

First he's looking into civil right violations, I really think or know they cracked my computer and put in a trojan horse or sub7 virus or something to gain access and information. Problem being they have the hard drives and the information that would show it on the security log.

So, I believe they need a warrant to be able to get into any ones computer to get information to be used to obtain a search warrant of a home. I need to know what I need to do to be able to show my machines were cracked if there is any way possible to do that.

Next, what can I do to prevent law enforcement in the future from obtaining access to my machines when they have probably to the general public illegal software to crack anyone computer. I know the best thing is to not have anything such as mp3's and such on the hard drives if they were not obtained with a license etc....

Any ideas?, I am sure there will be some comments...don't blame ya for that. I got stupid or careless and really never imagined getting slammed with a search warrant but let me tell ya, if you live in a Mormon community such as Orem, Utah where the cops are self righteous holier than thou types as well as the state government be careful because if you sin your going down brother! ; (

Anyways....it's a mess. If I could get some ideas as to what to do other than be a nervous wreck that would be appreciated. Thanks.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17517387 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 14:07:04 EDT