Re: Figures don't lie but you can lie with figures...... in http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r17603155 en Sun, 06 Dec 2009 10:02:15 EDT Sun, 06 Dec 2009 10:02:15 EDT Re: Figures don't lie but you can lie with figures...... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17695181 anon : Anybody remember when cable 1st came out it was ad free- that was the reason for the monthly charge.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17695181 Tue, 23 Jan 2007 10:36:31 EDT Re: Figures don't lie but you can lie with figures...... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17624943 moonpuppy :
said by crischen See Profile :

Give me a la carte. I probably only watch 15 channels.

It's funny. Some of the same people who yell "let the market decide" are the same people who don't want ala carte pricing.

I'd venture to say that a good portion of the channels out there would not survive if they weren't packaged wth other channels. Maybe they need to charge more for ads and pay their way onto a cable system.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17624943 Thu, 11 Jan 2007 20:36:01 EDT Re: Figures don't lie but you can lie with figures...... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17619236 crischen : Give me a la carte. I probably only watch 15 channels.

Local NBC/ABC/CBS/FOX Affiliates (Don't watch CW and actually only watch Boston Legal on ABC.)
Sci-Fi
Food Network
Discovery
USA
Cartoon Network
TBS/TNT
A&E
History
Comedy Central
SpikeTV (For Star Trek)

My Cable Company (Insight) used to offer three packages for their digital boxes at $5 each, but recently (Nov.) combined them into one $12 pack and added about a dozen new channels nobody will watch. I called and cancelled it and told them I wasn't going to pay it til they added Boomerang.

I mean, yes, you can argue the per channel cost is lower (because of must carries that cost nothing getting averaged in), but 90% of the channels are garbage.

Someone mentioned ESPN costing $2.50... to be honest, if the channels I watch (that aren't free must carries) were that much, I'd still save money.
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-Kinsey
Geeky chix0r]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17619236 Wed, 10 Jan 2007 23:12:35 EDT Re: Figures don't lie but you can lie with figures...... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17608453 Maxo :
said by Mchart See Profile :

selling me new nose hair trimmers!
Speaking of which. *cough*]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17608453 Tue, 09 Jan 2007 12:49:06 EDT Re: Figures don't lie but you can lie with figures...... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17607039 moonpuppy : 500 channels and nothing to watch.

:D]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17607039 Tue, 09 Jan 2007 07:41:58 EDT Re: Figures don't lie but you can lie with figures...... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17603007 RadioDoc :
said by N3OGH See Profile :

I'm paying those bums $100/mo
And there's the problem. Until you stop paying those bums $100 a month they'll keep treating you like one.
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Toolmaster of La Grange.
Save the Pacific Northwest Tree Octopus!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17603007 Mon, 08 Jan 2007 21:00:54 EDT Re: Figures don't lie but you can lie with figures...... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17604200 donaldk : oh I love watching american cable companies advertise cause its stupid. Wow get triple play Comcast for $33/month each (so $99/month at the end of it).

In a very faded almost overscanned bottom of the commerical it says only for the first year and it does not say full price. f*** that I keep my dish thank you very much (which is full of this nonsense cable co ads btw). I seriously wonder what the regular price is (which I bet is what the FCC uses... no I am not glorifying the FCC either, it has its own problems... you could always have the rogue style CRTC which needs a bitch slap in parlament... ).]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17604200 Mon, 08 Jan 2007 19:21:39 EDT Re: Figures don't lie but you can lie with figures...... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17603792 RadioDoc : Yep, and that's why the usual excuse of "higher program costs" is a shill.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17603792 Mon, 08 Jan 2007 18:54:58 EDT Re: Figures don't lie but you can lie with figures...... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17603479 roamer1 :
said by RadioDoc See Profile :

The NCTA is the cable industry equivalent of the RIAA. They represent both the MSOs and the program suppliers.
That, of course, is largely because the MSOs have their hands in networks... (This is most obvious with Time Warner, but Comcast and most of the other big MSOs have their hands in programming, too.)

-SC
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said to me: "it seems like all you ever buy is Abercrombie and cell phones" :p]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17603479 Mon, 08 Jan 2007 17:36:47 EDT Re: Figures don't lie but you can lie with figures...... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17603468 ke4pym :
said by viperlmw See Profile :

Now you're gonna need Sci-Fi channel for Enterprise re-runs starting tonight!
Actually, you REALLY want HDNet so you can see said re-runs in High Def ;)]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17603468 Mon, 08 Jan 2007 17:35:22 EDT Re: Figures don't lie but you can lie with figures...... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17603336 RadioDoc : That all works in a macro sense that there are more channels available being subsidized by lots of eyeballs that never ever see them.

However...

You can't take that and turn it backwards to say that because there are 500 channels now the cost is lower. If you only watch 10 of them and only have watched 10 of them since 1996 and your bill has increased 193% in the last 10 years, your cost per channel watched has certainly not gone down.

Otherwise the NCTA could use 950 throw-away channels to claim that even with a 100% rate increase cable TV rates are now only 10% of that when there were only 50 channels.

Even Enron would have balked at that math.
--
Toolmaster of La Grange.
Save the Pacific Northwest Tree Octopus!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17603336 Mon, 08 Jan 2007 17:33:12 EDT Re: Figures don't lie but you can lie with figures...... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17603453 roamer1 :
said by TKJunkMail See Profile :

Yes, I am paying for all those Spanish language channels; non-stop commercials channels; 50 music channels; 5 versions of PBS channels(all showing the same programs)
The Spanish channels are probably must-carries, and the PBS stations certainly are...which means the cable company a) is not paying for them and b) has to devote capacity to them whether they want to or not. :huh:

-SC
--
said to me: "it seems like all you ever buy is Abercrombie and cell phones" :p]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17603453 Mon, 08 Jan 2007 17:32:46 EDT Re: Figures don't lie but you can lie with figures...... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17603419 JTRockville :
said by moonpuppy See Profile :

nuff said.

The cable companies are partially correct in that you get more channels but you don't have a choice whether or not to accept tham as part of your package.
More channels? Yes.
More programming? No.

What used to be 1 channel is now 5. Big deal. The same shows are broadcast over and over so you have more chances to view them than before. But you don't get more programming.

Not really worth the enormou$ price increa$e.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17603419 Mon, 08 Jan 2007 17:27:57 EDT Re: Figures don't lie but you can lie with figures...... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17603278 RadioDoc : If you get 15 premium channels for $84 you're stealing the service...or know someone at Time Warner.

The only bang any cable customer is getting is the one from behind, as they are bent over.

The NCTA is the cable industry equivalent of the RIAA. They represent both the MSOs and the program suppliers. There is no incentive for them to ever even consider lowering the costs and (*gasp*) the rates charged. So, they just artificially jack up the "costs" while winking in the general direction of Congress.
--
Toolmaster of La Grange.
Save the Pacific Northwest Tree Octopus!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17603278 Mon, 08 Jan 2007 17:09:28 EDT Re: Figures don't lie but you can lie with figures...... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17603288 manfmmd : This is an assumption on my part, but an educated assumption:

Let's imagine for a moment and use fake numbers:
The cost that the cable/sat provider pays to say, ABC for example, is based on blocks of subscribers, not per subscriber so say the cable company is paying:

$100 per month for 0-1000 subscribers
$200 per month for 1001-2000 subscribers
$300 per month for 2001-3000 subscribers
etc.

If you have the channels bundled up and there are 1000 people "paying" the monthly cost even though they don't watch the channel, it is being spread across the group of subscribers versus if only 500 people are "paying" the monthly cost. The cost to the cable/cat provider just doubled (and the cost is passed on to other subscribers that are not paying for those channels..you expect the cable/sat company to pay the difference ;)). The cost that the cable/sat provider is paying versus the cost that the subscriber base is paying is not linear.

I realize that the above numbers are not correct, but it gives a good idea of how broad based bundled cable/sat tv offerings benefit every subscriber. The same goes for obscure channels that you may watch that others do not. They help pay for you to be able to watch that channel.

Clear as mud?
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huh? | AIM | Speaker Pelosi?!?...OH THE HUMANITY!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17603288 Mon, 08 Jan 2007 17:07:44 EDT Re: Figures don't lie but you can lie with figures...... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17603231 N3OGH :
said by viperlmw See Profile :

said by N3OGH See Profile :

Problem is, I don't watch %99 of those channels to start with.

Let's see..

Discovery
History
G4 (for Star Trek TNG reruns)
FX
FNC
CNN Headline
The Weather Channel
Local networks.
Now you're gonna need Sci-Fi channel for Enterprise re-runs starting tonight!
For real? I saw G4 was going to start running that "Trek 2.0" thing with the TNG re runs, and I have no interest in that.

Guess I'll have to change my DVR settings...
--
Never ask what sort of a computer a guy drives. If he's a Mac user, he'll tell you. If not, why embarrass him? -Tom Clancy]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17603231 Mon, 08 Jan 2007 16:59:04 EDT Re: Figures don't lie but you can lie with figures...... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17603155 viperlmw :
said by N3OGH See Profile :

Problem is, I don't watch %99 of those channels to start with.

Let's see..

Discovery
History
G4 (for Star Trek TNG reruns)
FX
FNC
CNN Headline
The Weather Channel
Local networks.
Now you're gonna need Sci-Fi channel for Enterprise re-runs starting tonight!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17603155 Mon, 08 Jan 2007 16:47:18 EDT Re: Figures don't lie but you can lie with figures...... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17603126 N3OGH : Ahh, but..

"If PBS wouldn't do it, who would?"

No one you lunkheads, no one watches it!

The local PBS station here in Philly is "WHYY".

I say exactly: Why?????
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Never ask what sort of a computer a guy drives. If he's a Mac user, he'll tell you. If not, why embarrass him? -Tom Clancy]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17603126 Mon, 08 Jan 2007 16:44:07 EDT Re: Figures don't lie but you can lie with figures...... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17603114 compton : Actually prices may have gone down when you compare quantity and quality of channels. Back in the nineties, I used to pay $84 dollars for my Time Warner analog cable service. For that price, I had a 3 TV hook up, Basic Plus, 2 premium channels (HBO and Showtime) and 2 PPV channels. In all I had about 80 channels, but quite a few of those channels were community access channels, C-Span, shopping network and other public access networks. All in all, out of 80 channels about 60 of them had the type of programming that the average person and family watched. Now for that $84 (more or less) I can get 180 digital channels with about 15 premium channels, 10 PPV channels, video on demand plus many music radio channels. Today you are getting more bang for your buck; so, it is essentially a price decrease. ]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17603114 Mon, 08 Jan 2007 16:42:05 EDT Re: Figures don't lie but you can lie with figures...... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17603046 TKJunkMail :
said by moonpuppy See Profile :

nuff said.

The cable companies are partially correct in that you get more channels but you don't have a choice whether or not to accept tham as part of your package.
Yes, I am paying for all those Spanish language channels; non-stop commercials channels; 50 music channels; 5 versions of PBS channels(all showing the same programs); music video channels; the Soap Opera channels; and 15 kids channels. None of which I ever watch. So maybe the price per channel is down, but so are the number of worthless channels that only 1% of the viewers ever look at.
--
--
My BLOG
My Web Page]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17603046 Mon, 08 Jan 2007 16:33:07 EDT Re: Figures don't lie but you can lie with figures...... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17602977 SD6 : It sounds like you are assuming that the cable/sat company pays a fixed price for the channel. That is not correct in my experience the price paid is calculated based on the number of subscribers.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17602977 Mon, 08 Jan 2007 16:23:58 EDT Re: Figures don't lie but you can lie with figures...... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17602891 N3OGH :
said by Mchart See Profile :

said by moonpuppy See Profile :

nuff said.

The cable companies are partially correct in that you get more channels but you don't have a choice whether or not to accept tham as part of your package.
I get more channels? Thats a new one. Every year my digital cable package through comcrap gets more and more channels PULLED from the basic lineup, and inserts more advertising channels! WOO! Now I have 30+ channels selling me new nose hair trimmers!
And don't forget the ad in the channel guide!

I'm paying those bums $100/mo and I'm stuck looking at ads in the channel guide :uhh:
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Never ask what sort of a computer a guy drives. If he's a Mac user, he'll tell you. If not, why embarrass him? -Tom Clancy]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17602891 Mon, 08 Jan 2007 16:13:53 EDT Re: Figures don't lie but you can lie with figures...... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17602884 manfmmd : If you were to be allowed to go ala carte, pricing would be higher, and your channel selection would go down the tubes. Content delivery may change this a bit, but for cable and satellite, you are stuck for now.

I'm not going to re-type it, so here is my last response to "ala carte channels": »Re: That Didn't Take Long!

For instance..on DISH Network, the Baby Channel is an ala carte subscription channel that is $9.99 a month, if bundled with other ala carte subscription channels that are more widely desired then it would drive the price down as there would be more subscribers to cover the cost that the cable/sat provider is paying.

Dang it, I said that I wasn't going to re-type it again.. At least it's worded a bit differently.
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huh? | AIM | Speaker Pelosi?!?...OH THE HUMANITY!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17602884 Mon, 08 Jan 2007 16:13:23 EDT Re: Figures don't lie but you can lie with figures...... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17602867 N3OGH : Good point..

Problem is, I don't watch %99 of those channels to start with.

Let's see..

Discovery
History
G4 (for Star Trek TNG reruns)
FX
FNC
CNN Headline
The Weather Channel
Local networks.

That's it. Why should I have to pay for channels that charge the cable co's a mint like ESPN, when I don't watch them?

I'm no fan of my cable co (Comcast), but I do have to admit, one of the reasons rates go up is that "must carry" channels like ESPN charge more year after year.

Of course, that all goes back to my royal pet peeve, the salaries of professional athletes. But that's so incredibly off topic, I'll just creep away from it...
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Never ask what sort of a computer a guy drives. If he's a Mac user, he'll tell you. If not, why embarrass him? -Tom Clancy]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17602867 Mon, 08 Jan 2007 16:11:18 EDT Re: Figures don't lie but you can lie with figures...... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17602839 Mchart :
said by moonpuppy See Profile :

nuff said.

The cable companies are partially correct in that you get more channels but you don't have a choice whether or not to accept tham as part of your package.
I get more channels? Thats a new one. Every year my digital cable package through comcrap gets more and more channels PULLED from the basic lineup, and inserts more advertising channels! WOO! Now I have 30+ channels selling me new nose hair trimmers!]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17602839 Mon, 08 Jan 2007 16:07:20 EDT Re: Figures don't lie but you can lie with figures...... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17602825 hopeflicker :
said by moonpuppy See Profile :

nuff said.

The cable companies are partially correct in that you get more channels CRAP but you don't have a choice whether or not to accept tham as part of your package.
I fix4 U ;)
--
An Atheist believes that a hospital should be built instead of a church.
An Atheist believes that a deed must be done instead of a prayer said.
An Atheist strives for involvement in life and not escape into death.
--Madalyn Murray O'Hair]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17602825 Mon, 08 Jan 2007 16:05:05 EDT Figures don't lie but you can lie with figures...... http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17602797 moonpuppy : nuff said.

The cable companies are partially correct in that you get more channels but you don't have a choice whether or not to accept them as part of your package.]]> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,17602797 Mon, 08 Jan 2007 16:01:20 EDT