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billh491
join:2001-08-09
Portland, CT

billh491

Member

OT Vista are you running it yet?

Well being a cutting edge type I installed it last week. Over all very nice as always with something this new there are few bumps but nothing I can not work around.

I built a new computer New Years weekend to run Vista put XP on for the first month to run it and be sure all was working well.

Was a bit miffed that Vista upgrade disks can not do a clean install any more you must run it from a working Windows install. There is a work around that involves installing Vista twice that comes as close as you can to a clean install which I did.

One of the programs that is missing in action is my beloved NetStatLive from AnalogX with the new IP stack in Vista it craps out. I have found a few programs that will tell you your speed but give it in bytes instead of bits. You know 600 instead of 6000 or what ever that works out to.

Let me know what you think about Vista.

Below is a shameless plug of my new computers awesomeness.

Processor : Intel Core 2 Duo E6700 Conroe 2.66GHz 4M shared L2 Cache LGA 775
Motherboard: MSI P965 Platinum LGA 775 Intel P965 Express ATX Intel
Video card: EVGA GeForce 8800GTX 768MB 384-bit GDDR3 PCI Express x16
Sound Card: Creative Sound Blaster X-Fi XtremeGamer Fatal1ty Professional Series 7.1 Channels 24-bit 192KHz
Memory CORSAIR XMS2 DOMINATOR 2GB (2 x 1GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 800 (PC2 6400) Dual Channel
Floppy Drive: NEC Black 1.44MB 3.5" Internal Floppy Drive Model FD1231H-302
Optical Drives: 2 NEC Black 18X DVD+R 8X DVD+RW 8X DVD+R DL 18X DVD-R 6X DVD-RW 12X DVD-RAM 16X DVD-ROM 48X CD-R 32X CD-RW 48X CD-ROM 2M Cache E-IDE / ATAPI DVD Burner
Hard Drive : Western Digital Raptor WD1500ADFD 150GB 10,000 RPM 16MB Cache Serial ATA150
Case Antec Performance One P180B Black ATX Mid Tower
Power Supply Antec True Power Trio TP3-650 ATX12V 650W
Monitor: Dell UltraSharp 2407WFP Wide-Screen Black Flat Panel
Second Monitor Tyris T901DB 8ms 19” DVI LCD
Speakers: Dell 5650 5.1 Surround sound
Keyboard: Logitech Media Elite
Mouse: Logitech G5 2-Tone 6 Buttons 1 x Wheel USB Wired Laser
Power Surge Protector: APC PF11VNT3 10 feet 11 Outlets 3400 joules
Ready Boost Drive: CORSAIR 2GB Flash Drive Model CMFUSB2.0-2GB
Printer: HP DeskJet 960c
Operating System: Windows Vista Premium


nelamvr6
High-End Headphoniac
Premium Member
join:2000-11-28
New London, CT

1 edit

nelamvr6

Premium Member

Your system specs look awesome! Pretty nice machine.

I wonder how well it would run with a decent OS.

I have plans to avoid Vista until I have absolutely no choice.

The feature set as it was announced a couple of years ago would have been enough to make me think about upgrading. But most of the desirable features were kicked to the curb along the way, so all it's left with is a pretty UI, incredibly arrogant and totally unacceptable licensing requirements, non-existent driver support, security issues and a lot of DRM infection.

No thanks.

But I plan on buying a new notebook this year, I'm certain it will come with Vista pre-loaded. I don't want it, but I will unfortunately not have any choice.
rkrenicki
join:2002-04-10
Quaker Hill, CT

rkrenicki to billh491

Member

to billh491
I have been running vista on my home desktop for a while now. RC1 was the first one that this machine has seen, and I have been running RTM since it was released to MSDN. While, I dont like the licensing that it carries, I must admit that my system is flat out speedier then it was with XP, and I have a hard time going back.

I originally had the 64 bit version installed, which had next to no driver support, but now that I am running the 32 bit version, everything I have is supported (either via WDDM or XDDM)

The only thing I dont like is that I was forced to upgrade to Symantec AV 11, when I personally stick with 9, when they added "malware" detection in 10. (It loves to find my remote administration tools as "hacktools", and deletes them without asking)

I dont have my "Windows Experience Score" handy, but it was high 5s (like 5.7 or something like that). I think thats an awesome idea. When gramma is looking for a game for little Johnys computer, its easier to look for a number, then a long list of specs. That is something that should have been done a LONG time ago.

The only driver issue I had during RC stage was my Creative Audigy4, which is no longer in the system,

My system isnt quite as uber as yours, Bill, but it gets the job done, AMD X2 3800, 2gb Corsair DDR533, ATI xPress 200 motherboard, ATI x1950Pro and x1600Pro video cards, 3Com 1000Base-SX Gigabit card, Samsung 18x DVD-+RW w/Lightscribe, LS120, Dell 2005FPW, Dell 2007WFP, InFocus SP5000 (in a triangle monitor setup)

I did install Vista Business on my laptop, but its built in video card (Radeon 7500 Mobility) was not uber enough to have a vista driver, and I was forced to use standard VGA, or hacked drivers. (This was also with RC, I have not tried it again with RTM)

billh491
join:2001-08-09
Portland, CT

billh491

Member

I knew some one that wanted a new computer and called the weekend before Vista and Dell would not sell them one with XP they lost a 1200.00 sale.

I was lucky the OS came with all the drivers I needed but the video and audio and they are still beta. Again being first is hard.

I had to install I fix computers for a living and don't know when I will get my first service call on it. My main job will not be upgrading soon but when they do I need to be ready. I have my 1100 page Vista inside out book to start reading.

nelamvr6
High-End Headphoniac
Premium Member
join:2000-11-28
New London, CT

nelamvr6 to billh491

Premium Member

to billh491
I already know there is no drivers yet for my sound card (an E-MU 0404) so that's a deal breaker right there, that's my most important application for my computer.

And I LOATH Norton AV, I just hope that Eset will have a working version of NOD32 before I am forced to adopt this new OS.

billh491
join:2001-08-09
Portland, CT

billh491

Member

I had installed the beta back in the spring of 06 but did not do much with it as I was busy all summer selling a coin collection on Ebay. But that was on my "old" August 2004 model Dell XPS Gen 3 computer. The commission from the coins paid for the new computer and my daughter gets the Dell a much needed upgrade to play Sims2 on.

I use the Symantec AV at work it is about as good as it gets but every once in a while I will be at a computer that it just turns its self off or I find it had not been updating.

My Av of choice now is Nod32 and yes they have a Vista version out and it works great. I think it came out in Nov or Dec.

I have been using two monitor since the summer and could not go back but three that would be nice on a flight or racing sim.

That score is a bit annoying I get a 5.9 for video I mean I do have the only Directx 10 card on the planet. But the cpu which is my lowest score is 5.6 There is only one faster core 2 Dou and the Quad core but at over 900 bucks and 1200 each I feel 509.00 for mine was a good deal. I guess the computer that gets a 6 has not been built yet as if I have the best video card but maybe if you set up a 2400.00 quad sli it would hit 6.

nelamvr6
High-End Headphoniac
Premium Member
join:2000-11-28
New London, CT

nelamvr6

Premium Member

said by billh491:

My Av of choice now is Nod32 and yes they have a Vista version out and it works great. I think it came out in Nov or Dec.
Well that's good news. At least I don't have that to worry about.
rkrenicki
join:2002-04-10
Quaker Hill, CT

rkrenicki to billh491

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to billh491
For your Emu card (nice choice, btw) you can run any digitally signed XP driver for your platform. (Vista calls them XDDM drivers) As long as you use the 32bit version of Vista, any signed driver should be ok.

In the beta, this was not true, hence my inability to get my Audigy working, But now that it has been released, it shouldnt have any issues.

nelamvr6
High-End Headphoniac
Premium Member
join:2000-11-28
New London, CT

nelamvr6

Premium Member

said by rkrenicki:

For your Emu card (nice choice, btw) you can run any digitally signed XP driver for your platform. (Vista calls them XDDM drivers) As long as you use the 32bit version of Vista, any signed driver should be ok.

In the beta, this was not true, hence my inability to get my Audigy working, But now that it has been released, it shouldnt have any issues.
Thanks! You should hear my needle drops!

I was hoping to exploit my 64bit CPU, so I was hoping I didn't have to resort to 32bit Vista.

I'm using WinXP X64 right now without issues, I can't help but feel that would be a step backwards.
rkrenicki
join:2002-04-10
Quaker Hill, CT

1 edit

rkrenicki to billh491

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to billh491
If you have a digitally signed driver for Windows XP X64, then it will run on Vista x64 just fine. You just cant use a 32bit signed XP driver on Vista x64.

That was the issue I ran into with my Audigy, and with my 3Com Fiber card.

nelamvr6
High-End Headphoniac
Premium Member
join:2000-11-28
New London, CT

nelamvr6

Premium Member

said by rkrenicki:

If you have a digitally signed driver for Windows XP X64, then it will run on Vista x64 just fine. You just cant use a 32bit signed XP driver on Vista x64.

That was the issue I ran into with my Audigy, and with my 3Com Fiber card.
That sounds a little reassuring, thanks for the info. I'm still not planning on changing (notice I didn't say "upgrading"? ) until at least SP1 though.

billh491
join:2001-08-09
Portland, CT

billh491

Member

Funny thing about SP1 MS has already said it will be out in September. I wonder how much of that is to get people like you and millions of business types to upgrade. They must know the conventional wisdom is to wait for SP1.

My feeling is this is the most tested OS in history. Anyone that wanted could download it and millions did. I don't remember just anyone being able to get XP in beta you had to be in the testing program.

I was wondering other then addressing more then 4 gigs of memory more security as all drivers HAVE to be signed and being able to take full advantage of your cpu. What is the need to run 64 bit today and dealing with all the driver pain?

nelamvr6
High-End Headphoniac
Premium Member
join:2000-11-28
New London, CT

nelamvr6

Premium Member

said by billh491:

Funny thing about SP1 MS has already said it will be out in September. I wonder how much of that is to get people like you and millions of business types to upgrade. They must know the conventional wisdom is to wait for SP1.

My feeling is this is the most tested OS in history. Anyone that wanted could download it and millions did. I don't remember just anyone being able to get XP in beta you had to be in the testing program.

I was wondering other then addressing more then 4 gigs of memory more security as all drivers HAVE to be signed and being able to take full advantage of your cpu. What is the need to run 64 bit today and dealing with all the driver pain?
There is no need, no one needs to install Vista. And I won't until there is no driver pain.

I am more than satisfied with WinXP X64. No driver pain there, at least not for me.
nelamvr6

nelamvr6 to billh491

Premium Member

to billh491
Check this out. Just one more reason to wait.

And this is just one of many. Many many third party products, but software and hardware, will simply not work with Vista.

I bought Windows 95 in August 24th, 1995. I was one of the earliest of adopters for all Windows products.

This is one case where I would recommend waiting to everyone. It's just not worth the headaches.

billh491
join:2001-08-09
Portland, CT

billh491

Member

All I can say is take most of what people are saying about Vista now you can roll the calender back 5 years and insert XP and you will have the same comments.

As far as Itunes goes WTF did Apple not know Vista was coming out. Heck a lot of their sales are from people that are running windows and osx at the same time they should have been ready. Now that they are not a computer company they were spending to much time on phones to get the software right.

BTW Quicktime installed and is working fine for me can't wait till the next Tiki bar TV episode comes out.

Everyone should upgrade when they are ready. I still know people using ME. I was getting bored with XP as I like to get in to the nuts and bolts of the system not just use the computer so it is fun and interesting for me to upgrade.
comp
Premium Member
join:2001-08-16
Evans City, PA

comp

Premium Member

I am still waiting for my copy of Vista Ult. 64. Hoping to have it this week. I tried RC1 and RC2 and enjoyed them.
rkrenicki
join:2002-04-10
Quaker Hill, CT

rkrenicki to nelamvr6

Member

to nelamvr6
While it is unfortunate that Apple was not ready for launch, I can honestly say that it is not MS's fault. MS has had their betas and RCs available for literally years. Heck, even RTM was available to OEMs and Developers at least 2 months before retail release. There is no excuse for Apple to not be ready for the game.

I also seem to remember reading somewhere, that Apple, instead of owning up to their lax behavior around the Vista release, instead decided to take a jab at Microsoft in a press release. Much like what happened when there was that windows virus pre-installed on a bunch of iPods.

I am not saying MS is a perfect company, but its mentality like the one at Apple just makes me sick.

billh491
join:2001-08-09
Portland, CT

billh491

Member

Compnurd I know you have ordered your 64 bit copy and it sounds like it might be an OEM. Just for others that might be thinking about it. NewEgg will sell you the oem ultimate for 199.00 but you must choose between 32 or 64. You can buy the upgrade to ultimate for 259.00 and you get both 32 and 64 bit dvd's in the box.

There are pluses and minuses to both the OEM can do a full install on a clean hard drive but is locked to one computer you can not move it to another computer or sell it after taking off the first computer.

The upgrade can be installed on a clean hard drive if you first install Vista with out putting in your product code you get a 30 day trial then from with in vista run the upgrade and put in the code and it will move all your files to a windows.old folder and do an install delete the folder and you have a clean install with the upgrade disk.

The upgrade if you take it off one computer can be moved to another or sold plus has 90 days of support from MS.
comp
Premium Member
join:2001-08-16
Evans City, PA

comp

Premium Member

It is retail. I am getting 32 and 64 but i am running 64 when it arrives. I got it from a promotion a while back
kkWaterford
join:2006-09-27
Waterford, CT

kkWaterford to rkrenicki

Member

to rkrenicki
said by rkrenicki:

While it is unfortunate that Apple was not ready for launch, I can honestly say that it is not MS's fault.
I wouldn't put it past Microsoft to intentionally not release some piece of info that Apple would need to get iTunes and/or iPods to work with Vista, which would basically force them to reverse engineer part of the OS to figure out what Microsoft was doing. Wouldn't be the first time they've used such tactics.

I'm not saying that's what happened I'm just saying that could be what happened.

I work with (and develop for) Windows, Mac OS, and Linux, so I have no particular axe to grind here.
rkrenicki
join:2002-04-10
Quaker Hill, CT

rkrenicki to billh491

Member

to billh491
You choose during install time. If you buy the 32bit version, you cannot select the 64 bit edition, but if you buy the 64bit version, you can select either one at install time

billh491
join:2001-08-09
Portland, CT

billh491

Member

Are you saying if you have an oem 64 bit dvd you can choose 32 or 64?

I know in the retail upgrade I got both DVDs

tenpin784
I Went To The Dark Side?
join:2001-03-30
Brierfield, AL

1 edit

tenpin784 to billh491

Member

to billh491
ultimate comes with both 32 and 64, not sure about the other versions......

I have not tried it yet, but I have seen it on a friends computer, not to bad.

I like my XP tho...

Uptime: 2wks 2days 23hrs 15mins 30secs
Record: 7wks 17hrs 2mins 47secs Set: Wed Sep 27 18:24:51 2006
Started: Fri Jan 26 20:57:18 2007
rkrenicki
join:2002-04-10
Quaker Hill, CT

rkrenicki

Member

From my experience with the MSDN versions, using the 64bit DVD, and my key, it asks me if I want to install the 32bit version or the 64bit version. I have tested this on Business and Ultimate. The machine I installed Home Premium on, was not a 64 bit system.

This may not hold true for retail or OEM versions, but I wouldn't see why they would have removed it.

tenpin784
I Went To The Dark Side?
join:2001-03-30
Brierfield, AL

1 edit

tenpin784 to billh491

Member

to billh491
Well, I got a laptop with Vista on it.

It does look nice, but....something just is not agreeing with me. I can't put my finger on it.

Needless to say, within 24 hours of getting the laptop, I formatted it to put XP pro on it.

Now shes cruising. Plays HL2 pretty sweetly too.

Maybe I will give it another shot in a couple months or something.

Guess I am one of those guys who doesn't like change, heh.

billh491
join:2001-08-09
Portland, CT

billh491

Member

There is a feel to it that is different. But living with it as my main computer for over a month now I feel right at home. In fact the other day while working on a computer at work I found my self hitting the start button and typing a search. Of course nothing happened as I was an XP box.
rkrenicki
join:2002-04-10
Quaker Hill, CT

rkrenicki to billh491

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to billh491
Well, I reverted to XP on my desktop at home.

I have been coming across too many little fluky problems, where it would randomly forget my monitor placement (I have three displays connected), or my vast Codec issues (where I just could not get h264 to work at all, and other MPEG4's were flaky at best), or other little annoyances.

I am sure these will get worked out with drivers, and codecs, and third party apps, but overall, stability is an issue with me, in the here and now.

Once I hear that the ATI drivers don't wig out anymore, or that some of my common apps are a little more compatible, then I will switch back. Vista was a nice experience for the most part, it made things easier for me to get things done, at least when it let me get things done.

billh491
join:2001-08-09
Portland, CT

billh491

Member

I have had issues with .mov files as well. Of course Apple is the last company I would expect to be ready for Vista.
CoderJ
join:2003-12-10
Oakdale, CT

CoderJ to billh491

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to billh491
Not running it yet because no PeerGuardian2 support (trivial thing, but I want it). I am interested because supposedly for systems with 512 to 2gb of RAM a good performance gain can be gotten using a decent 1gig pen drive. A decent one that meets the Vista standards for this (called ReadyBoost) are cheap off of NewEgg as well (I actually already have one, didn't realize what the ReadyBoost meant until I researched it).

Not sure if I'm ready to shell out a couple hundred for it, yet, though. Maybe after the first major service pack or so.

billh491
join:2001-08-09
Portland, CT

billh491

Member

The ready boost drive should be at least as big as the memory in your computer and like everything Microsoft twice as big is even better.

I grabbed the Corsair Two gig to match the Two gigs of Corsair DOMINATOR ram in my computer. It was only 28 bucks delivered.

»www.newegg.com/Product/P ··· 20233009

PeerGuardian2 runs on Windows 2003 you would think there is not a big jump to Vista as it was based on 03.